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Subject: Re: Aiki Ju-jutsu Author: Corey Minatani [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: 00:15:46 06/10/04 Thu In reply to: Liam Graham 's message, "Aiki Ju-jutsu" on 11:10:05 05/25/04 Tue Liam: The harmonious concern is central to aikido, that is because it is a -do art, not a -jutsu. -do arts add in harmonious concern. Aikijujutsu can have that, its just up to the defender, aikijujutsu makes no claims nor does it demand the level of force to be used, it understands each person is different and will use their aiki in whatever way or the situation presents itself. In short, aikido's concern is for both nage (defender, or tori (in aikijujutsu)) and uke (receiver, or uke (in aikijujutsu)). The uke thing for aikijujutsu was a joke... Aikijujutsu's main concern is for the defender only. IF the aikijujutsuka decides to show mercy, that is up to her. But in either case, the aiki- prefix should denote the way the technique is executed, in that sense, both arts will use the path of least resistance and highest efficiency in that regard. I would argue that aiki- prefix is sometimes confused due to so many translations of aiki into harmonious, blend might be better. We get the same thing in jujutsu, the ju- prefix sometimes translated as soft, which might be better off called pliable or flexible, but flexible in the sense that they can respond to almost anything, not the description of the technique. If you watch jujutsu guys, they break stuff and slam people, hardly soft or pliable techniques!! As to the question of why Daito changed from aikijujutsu, aikijutsu, or jujutsu is probably just on a whim. Some Daito people classify techniques as aiki no jutsu, aikijujutsu, and jujutsu type of techniques. Jujutsu being basic, but easily learned and aiki no jutsu being very esoteric and having few real applications, but containing really cool ideas, and aikijutsu in the middle working a bit of both. Many jujutsu historians note that aikijutsu is just another jujutsu style, nothing more. They may have tacked on aiki, to differentiate themselves from the Jigoro Kano monopoly on jujutsu systems being absorbed into forming judo. No one knows, and Sokaku never told anyone. If we had time to cross reference many of the surviving jujutsu systems, I bet we would find many of the techniques in Daito, based in other ryu of jujutsu styles. Corey Minatani [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

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[> Subject: Re: Aiki Ju-jutsu Author: Tony Annesi [Edit] Date Posted: 07:41:17 06/10/04 Thu Hi Corey & Liam, I normally don't post to a lot of sites (too much to do and too little of interest) but Liam's aiki-ju-jutsu question caught my eye. There were two strains of ju-jutsu in old Japan: an indigenous strain (that developed into aiki arts) and a younger strain that had two origins, one of which was China, the other Japan. The latter strain merged and developed numerous ju-jutsu styles. The former strain, although probably influenced by other styles as most styles are, developed separately among the upper classes. This strain was known at various times by various names: Oshiki-uchi, for example. Its putative orgins were in the royal court aorund 800 AD but that can't be completely verified. Its later development was in the "Great Eastern" style (Daito-ryu) of the Takeda family. Sokaku TAKEDA taught various techniques to various students in various parts of Japan. That is why we now have numerous styles of aiki-ju-jutsu. One of his students was Kotaro YOSHIDA who introduced Morihei UESHIBA to TAKEDA. UESHIBA studied for a condensed time under TAKEDA and then went on to found Ueshiba-ha Aiki-ju-jutsu, later changed to Ueshiba Aikidbudo, later changed to Aikido. Aikido is therefore a cousin art to various styles of Aiki-ju-jutsu. The term "aiki" was used, in passing, in a technical document (I assume from the Daito-ryu) and, I suppose, because it was unique, became identified with the Daito-ryu strain. Nowadays Daito divides its techniques into Ju-jutsu, Aiki-ju-jutsu and Aiki-no-jutsu. Daito is a ju-jutsu but from a totally different strain than the Kito-ryu and Tenshin Shin'yo ryu ju-jutsu that spawned Judo. Hope that helps. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]