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Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: 16:33:49 06/02/03 Mon In reply to: Robin Bradford 's message, "Volunteer Arms Co." on 21:12:25 05/18/03 Sun Volunteer Arms Co. was a trade name of Belknap Hardware and Manufacturing, a large wholesale/retail in Louisville, KY. It operated under that name from 1907 until 1986. The Volunteer Arms Co single barrel shotguns were actually the Iver Johnson Champion model. The Champion was manufactured from c. 1909 until the mid 1970's. [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Sheryl C [Edit] Date Posted: 20:47:27 07/11/03 Fri My son bought a 12 gauge shotgun by Volunteer Arms Company, a few years ago and has been looking everywhere to find out more about it. Could you please tell me how he can find out more about his gun? Thanks, Sheryl C [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 17:28:24 07/15/03 Tue He can look in the library for "Standard Catalog of Firearms", "Price Guide for Antique and Modern Firearms", and all the other books on that shelf. An internet search may turn up something on Belknap Hardware. B. Goforth is working on a book about Iver Johnson Arms, but I don't think it will be published for a few years. There may be some information in "Shotgun Markings" by Joe Vorisek. I doubt if you can find any more information than I gave Robin. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Jim [Edit] Date Posted: 16:45:11 12/12/03 Fri I was curious about a gun by this same manufacturer. This one is a .45ACP, and made in the style of the Thompson .45 machine gun of the WWII era. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 17:48:08 12/17/03 Wed This is not the same manufacturer. Over the past century or two, several gun makers have used "Volunteer" in either their company name or product name. Your "Tommy Gun" is a modern weapon and you should be able to find information in any of the current firearms reference books: Gun Trader's Guide, The Blue Book of Gun Values, The Standard Catalog of Firearms, and others. Your local library should have at least one of these. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Gil [Edit] Date Posted: 10:08:20 03/15/04 Mon >I was curious about a gun by this same manufacturer. >This one is a .45ACP, and made in the style of the >Thompson .45 machine gun of the WWII era. I Had one afew years back and loved it they also made one in 9m/m they were made in the 70's and wasnt very expensive i bought mine new at my local shop for $175.00 if its in good shape and your interested in selling or tradeing get in touch with me my only complant was they were expensive to shoot as with any semi auto of this type [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: walpsr [Edit] Date Posted: 17:53:37 08/06/04 Fri >I was curious about a gun by this same manufacturer. >This one is a .45ACP, and made in the style of the >Thompson .45 machine gun of the WWII era. thats kind or funny i have the same weapon and was wondering what it was worth mine is the elliot ness style if you have any info please share it with me thanks [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: W. Rhodus [Edit] Date Posted: 19:17:10 03/03/04 Wed >I have a 1910 12 gauge shotgun by Volunteer Arms >Company. It has a damacus steel barrel and I am trying to find the value of this gun. > >Thanks, >W.Rhodus [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 21:10:59 03/03/04 Wed W. - Although the damascus barrel was fine for the ammunition available in the early 20th century, it makes the gun a wallhanger now. If this is a single shot with a side hammer, it might bring $75 as a mantle decoration. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: William [Edit] Date Posted: 15:15:09 07/30/04 Fri I'm not sure what ammunition you refer to when talking about damascus barrels, plenty of people in England still shoot on a regular basis with them, myself included. The cartridges I use in mine are the same as the ones I use in my Berrata 686, just 2.5inches not 2.75, and no more expensive. Constant use on big driven days present no problem at all. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 16:40:24 07/30/04 Fri William - There are also Americans who use damascus and twist barrel shotguns. The prudent ones have their guns checked out and use 2.5" shells with black-powder equivalent loads. The fools find a gun at a yard sale, shove in a 3" magnum shell and use it once! You have proof laws in England. No such thing here in the US, and most damascus barrels were made before nitro powder was invented so were intended for a much lower peak pressure than is generated by smokeless. These old shotguns are often found after hanging in barns or stuck up in the rafters with no care for a couple of generations and there can be internal rust even if the surface looks good after it is scrubbed with steel wool. There's no way to tell if the barrel is still sound without some very expensive tests. We Americans also have the idea that "bigger is better", so it's easier to find 3.5" shells than 2.5" and they will usually go into the short-chambered guns. W's Volunteer was a cheap gun when it was made. I'd feel much safer with a damascus LeFever, Colt, or Winchester from the 1880's than with ANY store-brand from the early 1900's, even if it had fluid steel barrels. With a 1910 (patent?) date, I doubt if his really has damascus barrels, but it's possible and he says it does. I compare using modern ammunition in these old guns to driving an automoble from the early 1900's at freeway speeds - It may work for a while, but sooner or later it will fly apart. Roy [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Neumann Brothers Shotguns Author: Emmett Sheets [Edit] Date Posted: 16:21:09 08/05/03 Tue Are Neumann Bros shotguns still safe to use with low brass ammunition? [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Neumann Brothers Shotguns Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 19:24:53 08/05/03 Tue I'm not going to tell you that on the internet. And don't believe anyone who will. Neumann Freres made shotguns over a long period of time. Some were only proofed for black powder and NO smokeless powder ammunition should be used in them. Many will have short chambers, in which case the length of the shell is as important as the size of the load. And the care the gun has received over the past century is critical. If it spent a few of those years unoiled in a damp basement, there may be rust pockets below the surface if it has damascus or twist barrels. If you want to shoot it, have it examined by a competent gunsmith and if he gives it the OK, use only the type of ammunition he recommends. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Neumann Brothers Shotguns Author: matt [Edit] Date Posted: 23:38:15 10/19/03 Sun >I'm not going to tell you that on the internet. And >don't believe anyone who will. Neumann Freres made >shotguns over a long period of time. Some were only >proofed for black powder and NO smokeless powder >ammunition should be used in them. Many will have >short chambers, in which case the length of the shell >is as important as the size of the load. And the care >the gun has received over the past century is >critical. If it spent a few of those years unoiled in >a damp basement, there may be rust pockets below the >surface if it has damascus or twist barrels. If you >want to shoot it, have it examined by a competent >gunsmith and if he gives it the OK, use only the type >of ammunition he recommends. Roy, Do you know where I can learn more about these shotguns? I own a Neumann, 16 ga., boxlock, ejector , sideclips, with "T.W.STAKE" on the left side of the action and engraving of a lighthouse on the rear of the rib. Thanks Matt [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Neumann Brothers Shotguns Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 21:32:38 11/13/03 Thu Neumann Bros. shotguns were made by Neumann Freres, a Belgium gun making company from 1863 to 1957. "T.W.STAKE" is a trade name that I have not encountered before. In the 1890-1915 period, many firearms manufacturers would mark any name requested on their guns. It seems that by ordering a dozen guns and paying a few dollars extra to make the roll stamp a hardware store could sell guns "custom made" for them. If you have an idea where this gun may have been originally purchased, you might research this name. The "lighthouse" is probably the mark of the Leige Proof house. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Neumann Brothers Shotguns Author: Gaffney [Edit] Date Posted: 17:18:30 11/13/03 Thu >I'm not going to tell you that on the internet. And >don't believe anyone who will. Neumann Freres made >shotguns over a long period of time. Some were only >proofed for black powder and NO smokeless powder >ammunition should be used in them. Many will have >I did not see a response to your request for informaton on your neumann 16ga boxlock with J W Stake I also have a neuman 20ga. with the same markings (it also has a crossbolt). if you got a response please forward to me thank you. I would also like to know what the lighthouse indicates.short chambers, in which case the length of the shell >is as important as the size of the load. And the care >the gun has received over the past century is >critical. If it spent a few of those years unoiled in >a damp basement, there may be rust pockets below the >surface if it has damascus or twist barrels. If you >want to shoot it, have it examined by a competent >gunsmith and if he gives it the OK, use only the type >of ammunition he recommends. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Neumann Brothers Shotguns Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 21:34:58 11/13/03 Thu Gaffney - see my reply to Matt. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: FREDERIC MORRIS [Edit] Date Posted: 03:58:54 05/14/04 Fri i found a very old rifle that has this name on it. and thats about all it has on it. very plain cocks open from the bottom, and a little rusty. any information is great, thanks. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 21:28:38 05/14/04 Fri Volunteer Arms was a trade name distributed by Belknap Hardware of Louisville, KY, in the early 1900's. I'm not sure what you mean by 'cocks open from the bottom'. Can only guess that you are trying to describe a normal break-action, where the hinge (and possibly a release lever) is on the bottom. I also suspect that you have a shotgun instead of a rifle. If you want more information, email a full description and/or some photos. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Wade Leonard [Edit] Date Posted: 16:35:43 05/26/04 Wed My grandpa had a 16 gauge single barrell shotgun. The only thing on it was Volunteer Arms Co. It was the first gun thatI ever fired when I was about 10 years old, as well I bagged my first squirrell with it. My Dad came in pocession of it when grandpa passed on and now I have it. I don't know how old it is but I'm 52 and grandpa had it as far back as I can remember. Do you have any ideal on its age and do you think it could be one of these Iver Johnsons??? >Volunteer Arms Co. was a trade name of Belknap >Hardware and Manufacturing, a large wholesale/retail >in Louisville, KY. It operated under that name from >1907 until 1986. The Volunteer Arms Co single barrel >shotguns were actually the Iver Johnson Champion >model. The Champion was manufactured from c. 1909 >until the mid 1970's. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Roy [Edit] Date Posted: 19:17:55 05/26/04 Wed That would be a pretty good guess. By estimating 27-28 years between generations, your grandpa would have been born in the mid 1890's and could have bought a shotgun around 1910-1920. You might search online auctions for IJ single shots and compare yours to the pictures. Other possibilities are Crescent, Davis, and Stevens. They all made trade-name guns for hardware and general mercantile stores. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: Mike Healy [Edit] Date Posted: 05:09:27 11/14/04 Sun >Volunteer Arms Co. was a trade name of Belknap >Hardware and Manufacturing, a large wholesale/retail >in Louisville, KY. It operated under that name from >1907 until 1986. The Volunteer Arms Co single barrel >shotguns were actually the Iver Johnson Champion >model. The Champion was manufactured from c. 1909 >until the mid 1970's. A few days ago a friend of mine brought me a single barrel 12 gauge shotgun with a side hammer. After some cleaning I was able to discern the name "Hunter" inscribed on the barrel. A little research suggested this was a trade name used by the Belknap Hardware Company. I'm now at a dead end, can't seem to find anything with a picture or a listing of guns sold by them that relates to the one I have. Suggestions? ( I'm out in southwestern Oregon) [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: A Damascus double/break barrel shotgun Author: Joshua Thompson [Edit] Date Posted: 20:57:25 11/30/04 Tue First off, i don't know much about the workings(except loading shoot and minor cleaning) of guns.. or ammunitions... So im curious if i got screwed over by a "trusted senior neighbor of mine" I paid $90 for this gun. everything is intact .. but trigger guard(if it ever had one) and a couple of screws are missing from underneath where the stock supports the barrels... I recently bought a Shotgun from a older neighbor of mine. When I Acquired this shotgun the man told me it was a "Winchester King Nitro" ... It says King Nitro of the side plating .. but i can find no evidence of Winchester anywhere.. It is a Double-Barrel ... Breakbarrel I was also told that this gun was a Twist Barrel or Damascus Steel barrel, by a local gun shop... although he wasnt topo sure about the manufacturer... any hints.. this gun has what looks like to pins at the end of each barrel. It also has a four digit number on the barrel and plate that the barrel rests on ... Is this the Registration #?... [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Volunteer Arms Co. Author: michael [Edit] Date Posted: 19:21:14 12/27/04 Mon >Volunteer Arms Co. was a trade name of Belknap >Hardware and Manufacturing, a large wholesale/retail >in Louisville, KY. It operated under that name from >1907 until 1986. The Volunteer Arms Co single barrel >shotguns were actually the Iver Johnson Champion >model. The Champion was manufactured from c. 1909 >until the mid 1970's. I have a volunteer .410 that is very old and wish I knew how to find out when it was manufactured. I have the serial number. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]