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Date Posted: 12:00:04 07/26/05 Tue
Author: Eurydice
Author Host/IP: 141.154.25.236
Subject: Oh, and let's not forget Hawaiian shirts and demon eggs
In reply to: Eurydice 's message, "Well, dumb decisions make people look dumb." on 11:18:43 07/26/05 Tue

Those don't spell Brain of the Century, either. Not only did Buffy think Spike was too stupid to be an international mastermind, but his fans used that excuse, too. And we can all howl "But that was the writers!! Spike isn't really like that!!!" Except that he's a product of the writers.

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[> [> [> Intelligence and Stupidity -- Rosie, 12:49:58 07/26/05 Tue [1] (170.97.67.115)

Even intelligent people have committed their share of stupid decisions and acts. Wesley Wyndham-Price, anyone? Or even Tara in "Family"? And I'm talking about characters who are considered as more intelligent than others. I have also seen plenty of examples of Spike's sharp intelligence during his post-chip era. Perhaps your fondness for S2-early S4 Spike has made you forget this.


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[> [> [> [> I never forget anything -- Eurydice, 20:14:07 07/26/05 Tue [1] (151.203.54.109)

I don't have a particular fondness for Early Spike, I much prefer the later version, and I haven't forgotten that Spike is a fictional character whose development is at the hands of a group of writers trying to write a story that's not predominantly about him. I've especially not forgotten my points in this whole thread, which is the writers chose to portray Spike in a way that was not super-intelligent, specifically when compared with JM's upcoming role as Brainiac, who really is a super-intelligent, criminal mastermind - and that in BtVs and AtS Spike showed a different kind of intelligence than traditional kind we associate with "smart."

The fact is that Spike didn't just have occasional lapses of judgement as did some of the other characters you've mentioned did - the writers had him making mistakes all the time, the same way they put Xander in embarassing situations all the time - they had fun doing it. It may not have been the true heart of the character, but repetition creates the reputation, just as Xander became labelled as "demon magnet" and hopeless with women.

So I guess I don't see what the big fat furry deal is. We Spike fans complained all through BtVS seasons 6 & 7 and all though AtS season 5 about how the writers were making Spike look stupid (as if Spike actually existed apart from what the writers choose to say) - if we could see it, why wouldn't some guy writing an article for zap2it see it?


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