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Date Posted: 08:22:58 08/02/05 Tue
Author: spiritus
Author Host/IP: 4.252.146.57
Subject: season 6 was brilliant, and just what i wanted
In reply to: justmytwocents 's message, "Prinze says no SMG in Buffy role" on 19:17:55 07/28/05 Thu

sorry but there ARE people who liked season 6 and(somewhat) 7 so the fact that you get upset that someone is defending them is a little much. i don't like b/a but you don't find me complaining...well not vocally..on this board ,at least.
imo season 6 was brilliant---dark, but brilliant. some people like dark and others don't. aint it grand we all have different brains to think with?
i don't really think that he can f-up WW too much, even if he tried. there must be some form of checks and balances going on there. that being said --one or two seasons of (to some) not so up to par programing among 12 is nothing to me. i've SEEN t.v....it sucks.
and speaking as a star trek fan...we all got f-ed up the ass on THAT finale! i've never been so insulted in my life. there was absolutely NO redeeming quality to that pile of stench they tried to pass off as an episode. yeah...if joss ever did something like THAT, then i'd not watch anything by him again.. but since it would be virtually impossible for something that craptacular to occur naturally in life twice, then i think i'm safe with joss. always safe with joss. *relieved sigh*

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Replies:

[> [> Well phfew!! Feel all better? ;-) -- Eurydice, 09:23:00 08/02/05 Tue [1] (141.154.24.35)

Soooooo agree about the Enterprise finale - ek, pftew, we shall speak of it no more.

And I agree about the rest - what, you say?!! Ok, I agree about WW and I agree about season 6 up until the last handful of episodes. I think Dead Things is one of the best episodes ever written and I think the way the all the characters were brought to a crisis point was brilliant (addiction metaphor notwithstanding and ok, they ignored the resolution of Xander's crisis) - but (ah, you knew this was coming) I don't think the writers took things far enough or fast enough. They let things sit in the middle of the depresso-road for a hair too long (they admit that) and they cheated Buffy out of a true epiphany by bringing her back to being the eternal victim.

The point of her epiphany should not have been that she wanted to live despite what others had done to her, but that she wanted to live despite her darker self - I know, they saved those revelations and the battle with her darker self for season 7, but by not addressing it in season 6, they left a cloud of delusion and hypocrisy over Buffy because the audience knew that many of Buffy's problems over the season were self-inflicted. It's funny how one or two choices can change the way we look at an entire story.

Season 7, I agree on the "somewhat" - there were some great episodes and some terrible ones, and it's a shame that the storyline was so disjointed.


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[> [> Not Disjointed -- Rosie, 18:15:02 08/02/05 Tue [1] (170.97.167.60)

"Season 7, I agree on the "somewhat" - there were some great episodes and some terrible ones, and it's a shame that the storyline was so disjointed."

Frankly, I thought that Season 2 was disjointed, not Season 7. Season 2 had the potential to be great, but it was too disjointed to me, and the only characters that really seemed to hold it together were Drusilla . . . and especially Spike. And some of the moments in the Angelus arc seemed anti-climatic . . . especially when he first lost his soul.

I'm not that crazy about mid-Season 7 - from "Bring on the Night" to "The Killer in Me", but I enjoyed that season a little more than I did Season 2.


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[> [> [> Well, I wasn't comparing it to other seasons -- Eurydice, 21:07:05 08/02/05 Tue [1] (141.154.25.163)

I just felt that the beginning, middle and ends of the season were all going in different directions. Characters and plot lines and various ideas kept being floated and then abandoned - and everytime they introduced something which made me thingk "ah, this is interesting, I wonder where they'll go with it," I was disappointed to find that they went nowhere with it. That's why I found the individual episodes to be more interesting than the season as a whole.


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[> [> I think there's a difference between "Dark" and "Depressing" -- Christian, 10:08:58 08/03/05 Wed [1] (209.240.205.62)

And while "some" fans enjoyed it the vast majority didn't. As I had stated in my above post the ratings reflected on how the mass audience couldn't connect with the show anymore.


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[> [> [> vast majority-schmority. how do you know? -- spiritus, 13:42:59 08/03/05 Wed [1] (4.252.151.45)

i mean really, did you poll EVERY one of the fans who bought the dvd's in EVERY country and the one's who saw it on network t.v.? even the ones that have no internet access? what about the percentage of americans who couldn't get upn? we just got it here in '99. pretty much just in time for season 6 and i was in milwaukee. sweeping generalizations are nobody's friend. vast majority? THAT was an extreme assumption on your part, i believe.
and yes, one person's "depressing" can, as well, be another's "dark". it depends wholly on where you are coming from in life, state of mind, life experience, etc. again, that was another assumption from you.(that everyone is coming from where you are)
i take from things what i can, when i can. sometimes one can't handle it; not in a certain frame of mind. i don't always feel the need to watch that season, sometimes feel i can't handle it, emotionally. but that is based on similarities that i find to my own life, that are still painful. i have honestly learned a lot about myself from watching, slowly registering ALL that that season meant.--- but it doesn't prohibit me from believing it was one of the best. i like a little pain in my programming. i understand pain. therefore it is one of the best, in my opinion.
and frankly, the "majority" can go stuff themselves. i certainly never wanted to be considered as that, or under those terms. never gave me any sense of security in my OWN beliefs. is it about the power in numbers? more people like it one way, so therefore it must be CORRECT way? outrageous.


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[> [> [> [> adding on... -- spiritus, 14:58:58 08/03/05 Wed [1] (4.252.147.87)

i really feel that 'dark' can be depressing, but does not have to be. just as 'depressing' can be dark, but it isn't always. actually, imo 'darkness' encompasses a whole wealth of things that may or may not include depression/depressing. it's just a differing opinion on the nature of the word.


and really, don't underestimate the numbers of 'fans' that couldn't get upn and couldn't afford cable. as it was i had the crapiest reception on both the wb and upn, but those really were the only shows i watched and i was poor. i loaned my tapes out muchly...those on the first floor sometimes can't get the reception. maybe they work and have no vcr or no tv. and who's to say that a 'fan' has to watch every episode and be "counted". like that means anything anyway (see angel, the show). so if my friends watched it later and DID connect with seasons 6-7, i guess they're not in that vast majority so they don't "count" as the "audience"? B.S.


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[> [> [> [> [> Re: adding on...Besides the way you put it.... -- Christian, 18:09:08 08/03/05 Wed [1] (209.240.205.62)

Think of it this way, how many people DO carry UPN but don't have the internet and instead wrote letters to Joss and complained about season 6? SMG didn't quite like it herself.


You may like watching "people suffer" in your programming as for me? I don't get my kicks by watching people go through pain. It's kind of disturbing. But that's just me.

Let's just agree to disagree.


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[> [> [> [> [> [> never said i liked watching people suffer -- spiritus, 03:16:58 08/04/05 Thu [1] (4.252.150.142)

i said that i learned about myself from watching that...way different thing, man. open your peepers. it informed me about life--an imperfect life at that; one that resembles in some fashion, my own. so, seriously, don't try to make me into a bad person by implying something like i'm sadistic (like to watch people suffer) and then say 'well let's just agree to disagre'.i just don't downshift that fast.
but yeah, thanks for the insult and run. that was cool.


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[> [> [> [> Um Joss Whedon EVEN made season 7 lighter because of many fans complaints. -- Christian, 18:01:52 08/03/05 Wed [1] (209.240.205.62)

Take the time go to different boards BESIDES this one and you'll see that majority of the fans wasn't fond of season 6. And season 7 started out with promise just to stumble to the end.

Anyway as long as YOU enjoyed that's all that should matter. Right?


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[> [> [> [> [> have "taken the time" -- spiritus, 03:37:28 08/04/05 Thu [1] (4.252.150.142)

everything you say is based on opinion ,not fact, as well as me. i'm adressing the all or nothing attitude you have. you speak in sweeping generalizations and that's not the truth--it is the truth as you know it. everything is subjective. again "majority"-- i don't really care what the majority thinks. yeah, pretty much it only matters what i think. as it only matters what you think when you are thinking. i don't claim to know what the vast majority wants, ever. i don't pretend to speak for others, only myself. i can't begin to even get inside other people's heads to speak on a large percentages behalf. THAT was what i was originally adressing. using words like all , majority, most etc. because really, no one knows that--you'd have to be omnipotent or really arrogant. but see i'm really okay with that because i connected with it so yeah--- all about me=my opinion=may not mean squat to anyone else=i don't really care. by saying that "the audience didn't connect", and being that i did connect, that says that i am not the audience.


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[> [> [> [> I don't know about vast majority -- Eurydice, 21:00:29 08/03/05 Wed [1] (141.154.23.82)

But there were a lot of people who were unhappy with the season. I was part of a large group who would either get together to watch Buffy or call each other during the show, and by the end of season 6, I was the only one left watching. These aren't people who post on message boards or send letters to the writers, they're just ordinary viewers who decided to change the channel.

And their reason for changing the channel wasn't that the show dealt with dark and/or adult themes, it's that the show got boring. Every week Buffy was depressed, every week she was miserable about something - life sucked, wha, wha, wha. And they got tired of the weekly Buffy/Spike "Punch and Judy Show," which became so predictable you could see the train wreck coming from a mile away. Even this wouldn't have been a problem if there'd been another plot to break up the monotony, but when the real Big Bad of the season was Buffy's depression, it was hard to find a distraction.

I know that depression can't be cured over night (if at all), but on TV there's a reason why you don't see a driver circling the block for an hour, looking for a parking place - it might be real life, but it's not interesting.


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[> [> [> [> [> I hate you Eurydice..... -- Christian, 22:15:18 08/03/05 Wed [1] (209.240.205.62)

Always coming in, making a point driving it home without being nasty, snarky but by just being nice and intelligent about it. DAMN IT!!!


;) HUGS!


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[> [> [> [> [> [> Love! Hate! Love! Hate! It's almost like Spuffy!! ;-) -- Eurydice (hugs and smoochies), 00:35:27 08/04/05 Thu [1] (141.154.23.82)


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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> But at least we don't go "smacking each other up" LoL! -- Christian, 08:11:41 08/04/05 Thu [1] (209.240.205.62)

And at least I have the balls to admit you are WAY smarter than me!


And love you!!


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