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• When I posted this, I had not yet listened to the podcast -- I have since and must warn of a SPOILER from Echo in the Bone. (NT) -- Merrymags, 08:19:59 10/07/08 Tue

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• I always thought Roger's relationship with Claire is very sweet. In many ways, she becomes the mother he didn't have for so many years. (NT) -- LizT, 20:35:04 10/06/08 Mon
  • My sentiment exactly. I'm always amazed at how quickly Roger could gain insight into Claire-Jamie-Brianna's situation! (NT) -- MariaM, 20:43:22 10/06/08 Mon
    • The time-travelers all recognize each other even if they don't know why at first. (NT) -- tlk2vws, 04:45:58 10/07/08 Tue
• I always thought Roger had sort of a platonic crush on Claire, and that he truly appreciated what a strong woman she was! No M-I-L jokes for him! (NT) -- Bedelia, 05:13:06 10/07/08 Tue
  • I agree - I think there were no lecherous type feelings on his part - only a deep appreciation and respect for what an amazing woman Claire was - I think this is one of the most beautiful thoughts in all of the books - one person recognizing how truly special someone else is - just lovely. (NT) -- lori v, 05:33:13 10/07/08 Tue
    • I agree. He certainly had a crush on her, but it was friendly. I love this part of the series! (NT) -- ladyphantom, 06:39:42 10/07/08 Tue
      • I agree - but not as someone says above - that he looks upon her as a MOTHER. He justs likes to look upon her as a woman to be admired as a woman. Much like all the other men in the BOOKS. (NT) -- GiGi, 07:11:33 10/07/08 Tue
        • IMO, men either see Claire as a PERSON to be admired or as a WOMAN to be lusted over or resented because of her incredible charisma, strength of personality, her physical beauty, or her intelligence. So, men see her depending on who they are, their own frames of reference regarding women. Roger's mother, in her heroic act of saving his life, set the standard high, so he sees Claire, all her accomplishments and traits, as something to be admired. Does that make sense? (NT) -- Merrymags, 10:03:04 10/07/08 Tue
  • I agree! This is kind of out there, and I am basing this on my personal relationship with my FIL, but I think maybe Roger is further drawn to Claire because she experienced history first hand as a time traveller, and a piece of history close to his heart, too. He *is* a historian. Tangent, but my FIL is one of the most amazing people I have ever met. He's met with and befriended influential famous people and testified in front of the UN. I lost my father just over three years ago, and while he will never replace my dad (and would never want to), I consider him a father, too, and never have doubts that he loves me as his own. I think Roger may feel something like that for Claire. And, I think he's grateful that she was able to uncover some truly fascinating family history of his own. (NT) -- Woogie, 10:34:41 10/07/08 Tue
    • I think you're right about the historian in Roger being drawn to Claire's experiences. And not just history from 200 years ago, but since he lost both parents in WWII, perhaps he feels this is a part of his life that Claire can closely relate too also. You're lucky to have such a close relationship with your FIL - I bet he appreciates it too. (NT) -- HollyC, 12:30:50 10/07/08 Tue
  • i always felt Roger had an innocent crush on Claire, he admired her for the person she really was> (NT) -- Sara V, 13:36:08 10/07/08 Tue
• I found this time and the relationship they had such a contrast with what happens to Roger when he travels back and how he fares then. His trials he suffers and his relationship with Jamie, etc. Things seem to have come full circle for Roger, but geeze! (NT) -- Lady JenF :), 05:14:49 10/07/08 Tue
• This was an "Awwww" moment for me. Of course we knew he held her high. I love all the tender moments that transpire between them over the years. (NT) -- Niseold, 05:51:54 10/07/08 Tue
• I agree with PPs that Roger has a cruch on Claire for various reasons--she is an attractive woman and I believe she had a very powerful personality that he was drawn to. I like Roger--not to bad for a 20th century character :) (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 14:36:16 10/07/08 Tue
  • I think it's true that he's drawn to her, and is, on a certain level, attracted, I never found anything offputting about Roger's relationship with his future MIL. There was always respect there, both ways. (NT) -- Lynn H., 15:06:51 10/07/08 Tue

• i've done quite a few over the yrs tho i only 'found' LOL in 2005 but alas i know there's more that are wayyyyy ahead of me (NT) -- oorjanie, 16:16:19 10/06/08 Mon
• I found the Books in 1999 and LOL a couple years later. I actively posted for several years but had to step back when my autistic son required more intense intervention (and my mom was in a serious accident). I lurked off and on but became active again earlier this year or at the end of last year. I have reread the Books several times but have no exact count. The only one I haven't is DIA -- because it's so painful. But, I have made a promise to do so, to suck it up and knuckle down, and not give in to my emotions. (NT) -- Merrymags, 16:43:11 10/06/08 Mon
• I read Outland three times successively before moving on to DIA. I was mesmerized by the book. (NT) -- SusiQ, 17:10:25 10/06/08 Mon
  • Good word, "mesmerized". That describes my feelings exactly. I think we're reading a future classic. So in 200 years, people will be reading Jane Austen and Diana Gabaldon. (NT) -- Lisa L, 17:37:55 10/06/08 Mon
• I have read Outlander 17 times. I kept tic marks in the back of the book. When Herself signed it for me this summer she wrote that she hoped I'd find something new on read 18! Of course, I've been reading The Books since 1992, when Outlander was the only one published. It was just so good that there were so many times I chose to pick it back up than try something new that might be a disappointment. (NT) -- Sorcha, 18:32:04 10/06/08 Mon
• I have re-read the series a few times and listened to them all on CD (unabridged) - such a great way to experience the books! I keep them by my bed for when I am not reading any other books and also just to flip through when I want to relax and get a quick dose! I have definitely reread Outlander the most. (NT) -- Lady JenF, 05:18:27 10/07/08 Tue
• Good Gravy, Marie! I've lost count. Full re-reads, who knows? Scattered bits? Hundreds. Maybe thousands. I found Outlander in 1995 (I think), found Lallybroch shortly after its inception, posted actively for quite a while, stepped back when life forced changes but always lurked, and started posting again a couple of years ago when life changed yet again. Like a true relationship, the Books and I dance about and change our steps as the Music allows. (NT) -- Betsy Barefootspinner, 05:51:38 10/07/08 Tue
• rereads -- Sara V, 10:28:27 10/07/08 Tue
  • Thanks, everyone! Especially Sara V who came out of hiding to answer! (NT) -- Lisa J., 18:24:16 10/07/08 Tue

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• Wow, I just read that part in Spanish, not twenty minutes ago! Love the the gift- Jamie couldn't have found anything more thoughtful if he'd searched for a year. (NT) -- SueW, 20:48:34 10/05/08 Sun
  • wow SueW, reading the books in Spanish is an impressive feat. (NT) -- Margy, 02:43:29 10/06/08 Mon
    • I keep the English version open underneath, in my lap. By far my favorite way of learning- and I'm getting vocabulary lessons not included in any Spanish textbooks! ;) (NT) -- SueW, 06:59:11 10/06/08 Mon
• My heart fluttered at this... so thoughtful and so romantic *swoon* (NT) -- MariaM, 21:26:49 10/05/08 Sun
• I'm re-reading DoA right now, and I love this. I just hate the next part, with the pirates, and it's held me back for ages on re-reading this book. I'm past it now, and they are safely at River Run, about to meet a skunk. (NT) -- Margy, 02:42:50 10/06/08 Mon
• I just love this scene! I think it's soooo sweet that Jamie not only remembers their anniversary, but counts the years of their marriage as though the 20-year separation had not occurred. (I have a picture on my blog of a medicine chest very much like the one Jamie gives Claire here...link inside>>>>>>>>>) -- Karen Henry, 03:17:56 10/06/08 Mon
  • That apothecary shop in Colonail Williamsburg was a delight for us LOLers to behold. I must have taken 12 photos there. I annoyed the crap outta the apothacist (sp?). He was a good sport though and stayed in character! (NT) -- Niseold, 05:52:01 10/06/08 Mon
    • Definitely! While I was there, the apothecary (female) was showing people a little vial filled with a liquid she called cinchona bark. I wanted to blurt out, "I know exactly what *that* is!" :-) But I kept my mouth shut and instead poked my head in the little room in the back...and was stunned at what I found there. My parents were giving me very weird looks, until we got outside and I explained what had made me so excited. :-) I had a great time in Williamsburg, noticing all the million tiny details I'd read about in the books. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 06:23:26 10/06/08 Mon
  • Thanks for that! (NT) -- M&M, 06:07:35 10/06/08 Mon
  • oh thanks for sharing! so neat to see (NT) -- oorjanie, 07:49:21 10/06/08 Mon
  • Karen, I agree about the separation...so sweet and so sentimental how he counts the years. He makes my heart melt when he does things like this. And he just *does* them like it's nothing, just part of who he is. Which, I guess, is really the case. (NT) -- Woogie, 09:09:43 10/06/08 Mon
• The perfect anniversary gift - practical, yet romantic. Now if only my DH could get the romantic part . . . (NT) -- Bedelia, 06:07:45 10/06/08 Mon
• I think it was easier to give "special" gifts back then, since you didnt really buy for every birthday and Christmas, so you had some time to think about it. *g* Even my dh could prolly pick out a good one if I gave him a few years. :-) (NT) -- M&M, 06:35:15 10/06/08 Mon
  • Plus, Jamie had all those years in prison, I can just hear him. ....Och, oh I should of gave her this or that. :-) (NT) -- M&M, 06:36:22 10/06/08 Mon
    • LOL! That was pretty funny, M&M. (NT) -- Conmama, 10:34:36 10/06/08 Mon
• Awww, what a lovely quote, janie. Jamie is so sentimental... more so than Claire, IMO. I guess I would attribute that to her upbringing. (NT) -- ladyphantom, 06:39:01 10/06/08 Mon
• One of my favorite scenes from DOA. Great choice! (NT) -- Terri C, 07:22:43 10/06/08 Mon
• Awwwww..... He is so lovely, is he not?!? I have midterms this week. The QOTD will help me make it through! Thanks. (NT) -- Lady JenF :), 07:29:02 10/06/08 Mon
• I loved this Quote but I have to say that I get a little ticked that Claire never seems to remember these things -- I know they love each other deeply; I just wish Claire also took notice. (NT) -- Merrymags, 07:46:57 10/06/08 Mon
  • I hear you, Merrymags! I can just imagine Jamie thinking about Claire every year on their anniversary, which is so lovely and so sweet, and yet she seems oblivious to the date. (NT) -- Terri C, 08:21:46 10/06/08 Mon
  • me, too, Merrymags! It irks me that she still wears Frank's ring sometimes, too. I dunno...I *get* it kind of, but if I were in Claire's shoes, I probably would have given it to Bree before going back. But, then, it would not have been such an integral part of the Bonnet story, so that can't happen! Jamie is amazingly understanding about the ring, IMO. My H would not be so understanding if I were to keep a hold of something my ex gave me. *g* (NT) -- Woogie, 09:50:08 10/06/08 Mon
    • Yep, I totally agree with you on that one. There was a discussion a couple months ago. It always bothered me that she wore Frank's ring, pretty much without regard for Jamie's feelings. I better not go there again! (NT) -- Conmama, 10:36:17 10/06/08 Mon
      • Uh-oh! I hope I didn't stir the pot! *cringes* (NT) -- Woogie, 10:56:48 10/06/08 Mon
      • Dang that irks me. I remember in FC when Jamie played cards with Philip and took Claire's rings... was hoping that he would have lost Frank's during the game. But Jamie, being the sweetheart that he is... he wouldna had let that happen. (NT) -- ladyphantom, 11:53:25 10/06/08 Mon
      • At the end of the book, though, she doesn't *ask* Jamie for Frank's ring. He offers it to her and puts it on her finger himself. He knows and respects her relationship with Frank, and clearly she knows that. Why would she be worrying about what Jamie thinks? She certainly knows him well enough to know that if something troubled him, he'd say so. (NT) -- maddiej, 16:10:52 10/07/08 Tue
• THANK YOU for this quote. 24 years TODAY, also, I married my Jamie! (NT) -- Conmama, 09:52:35 10/06/08 Mon
  • No way, that's awesome! Happy Anniversary! Shall we get you a box, too? *G* (NT) -- Woogie, 09:57:07 10/06/08 Mon
    • As we were walking home with the kids from the neighborhhood pizza joint (that was our anniversary dinner *S*), we were holding hands and he raised mine up to kiss it. That was my "present". (NT) -- Conmama, 10:08:08 10/06/08 Mon
      • Awwww....you do indeed have a Jamie in more than name! (NT) -- Woogie, 10:19:49 10/06/08 Mon
  • That's an amazing coincidence. Congratulations! (NT) -- Karen Henry, 10:22:19 10/06/08 Mon
  • Happy Anniversary, Con!!!!!!!!!! (NT) -- ladyphantom, 11:54:01 10/06/08 Mon
  • And tomorrow is my 19th! Nothing planned at this time (too much homework/school night), but we'll figure something out. I got a pre-anniversary kiss this a.m. (NT) -- Merrymags, 14:09:30 10/06/08 Mon
• You know, I am just grateful EVERY DAY for this wonderful group that shares my absolute passion for Jamie and Claire. I LOVE this quote! Great job!! (NT) -- Lisa, 15:15:57 10/06/08 Mon
• Great quote! It bugs me as well that Claire NEVER remembers these things! Jamie is soooooo dreamy *swoon* (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 15:17:37 10/06/08 Mon

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• Oooh, Janie, this is a good one! I felt so sad for Claire when she was telling about this. She did the "right" thing, IMHO, with her experience of Dougal doing what a Chief has to do, and she knew exactly the mindset of her Scottish patient...there was really nothing else she could do...Good Start, Janie! (NT) -- JudithONH, 21:21:46 10/04/08 Sat
  • I've always loved this passage, Judith. I wish we could have some more enlightened laws now about physician-assisted death, provided the patient is competent to make the decision. (NT) -- Lemora - going through it, 22:06:06 10/04/08 Sat
• I found this passage very odd. From a practical point of view, the hospital wouldn't offer Claire a promotion in order to get her away from patients. Also, Claire said at the end of this passage that she may not have gone to Scotland with Bree had this not happened and the hospital not given her a break. So does that mean that at the time her work was more important to her than telling Bree her true paternity and finding Jamie? (NT) -- Chrissylass, 22:45:46 10/04/08 Sat
  • In real life, Claire would never be kicked upstairs under these circumstances, and she would never be made head of surgery in so short a time. This is compression for the sake of narrative time frame, with author's license. Remember, she didn't yet know Jamie had survived Culloden, and that it was possible to travel back and find him. She was only thinking of revealing Bree's true origins on the first (after Frank's death) Scotland trip. I think being deprived of being able to use her surgeon's skills gave Claire the impetus to go. She may have been ambivalent, even apprehensive of the old emotions and wounds such a trip would awaken, and this career stasis gave her the needed initiative. (NT) -- Lemora, 23:12:43 10/04/08 Sat
    • I agree about author's license - I'm okay with that. She was dreading telling Brianna the truth and felt that circumstances had conspired to give her the push. Dealing with his wish for an honaorable death and the sparing of his family from the ordeal and expense of a lengthy process she was reminded of the sense of honor among the McKenzies. Having her work taken away from her cleared the rest of the path. It's as if the universe were telling her "It's time." Jamie's circumstances were also a bit more settled, he was no longer imprisonned or indentured and life as a smuggler and printer was about as much of a lull in activity as he was going to get. (NT) -- kgp, 04:37:02 10/05/08 Sun
• LoL -- after 26 years in healthcare, I can't say I share your conviction that she wouldn't have been promoted to a safe administrative leadership position -- especially as they had no proof of any wrongdoing on her part. But I agree on the author's license.....and as always, it worked beautifully to weave the next set of events. (NT) -- Katieh, 08:46:05 10/05/08 Sun
  • Actually, I know what you mean. After 27 years in public education, I am all too familiar with people being promoted to lofty administrative positions to get them away from the classroom, because firing them for being bad teachers would be too costly, lengthy, and maybe impossible! Makes sense that the same thing could be done to lousy doctors. Of course, the irony here is that Claire is an excellent doctor who is following the dictates of her conscience --and possibly feeling her heartstrings plucked by a crusty old Scot! (NT) -- Lemora, 09:29:03 10/05/08 Sun
• Oh yes, good one Janie! The symbolic 'letting go' of her surgical duties tied in with the memory of Dougal doing his duty as laird....it sets Claire up very tidily for the next stage. Good start! (And can't believe you're doing QOTD and COTD on the same week!! Good on ya!) (NT) -- Lee, 10:50:34 10/05/08 Sun
  • hey stranger........... thanks:) glad you approve my choice! (NT) -- oorjanie, 18:59:16 10/05/08 Sun
• Another "artistic license" thing is that she says she never removes her rings--a surgeon would never wear rings under gloves. One of the vets I used to work for said you couldn't even wear nail polish. But it makes a better story that she has never removed Jamie's ring. (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 15:16:44 10/06/08 Mon

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• Congratulations! I got my DH to read them, too, and he regularly asks about when the next book is coming out. How lucky to be sharing this at the beginning of your marriage. (NT) -- MairiS, 09:16:57 10/04/08 Sat
• Congratulations on both counts! My DH also likes the books. I always find it interesting to see the books through a guy's perspective. Next week DH and I celebrate 19 blessed and wonderful years. Many blessings to your and your DH for many wonderful years to come! (NT) -- Lady JenF, 12:29:16 10/04/08 Sat
  • I should be more accurate - 19 years on the 19th! (Not next week...) (NT) -- Lady JenF, 14:45:59 10/04/08 Sat

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• Lovely picks this week--so unique. (NT) -- MairiS, 09:19:01 10/04/08 Sat
• great week!!! enjoyed your choices and it is so great that every page had something. just goes to show how excellent the writing is (NT) -- oorjanie, 09:32:19 10/04/08 Sat
• Excellent! Thanks! (NT) -- Lady JenF, 12:31:14 10/04/08 Sat
• Great week, thank you! (NT) -- Jay-Lee, 13:15:57 10/04/08 Sat

• Time will tell - interesting thought. To get to meet more Murrays, Frasers and family would be fun. (NT) -- Lady JenF, 12:32:33 10/04/08 Sat
• If I remember right, that letter from Ian was quite awhile before the War really got started…so I think it would be possible for Paul to be sent to the Colonies with other Scot/English troops…But I sure hope not, because he would be fighting against Jamie and Ian, and that would not be a good thing. (NT) -- Mitzi, 19:33:34 10/04/08 Sat

Head on over to Broch Talk and take the nail biting Ocotber Poll!

• Hijack: Does anyone know off the bat what year Bree was born? (NT) -- M&M, 12:02:23 10/03/08 Fri
  • Bree was born in 1948! Same as me! November, I think. Don't know the actual date. (NT) -- CathyS, 12:12:41 10/03/08 Fri
    • Thanks!!!!!!! (NT) -- M&M, 20:28:01 10/03/08 Fri

• Carrie, post this also on the Reading Rec Board and they'll be able to help you. Lots of BH fans over there and discussions you will enjoy. (NT) -- Lemora, 08:33:59 10/03/08 Fri
• The Book Depository will have them -- go to www.bookdepository.co.uk. Free shipping and the price is right! -- ladyphantom, 08:44:34 10/03/08 Fri
  • You weren't looking for something online, sorry. But I bought my books at the Book Depository and it was a very good experience. (NT) -- ladyphantom, 08:45:53 10/03/08 Fri
    • free shipping even to N. America........i presume UK site?? that's good:) (NT) -- oorjanie, 14:18:50 10/03/08 Fri
      • Yep, Janie -- it's free! (NT) -- ladyphantom, 14:24:40 10/03/08 Fri
• Check with M&M over on the Social Board.. she may be able to help you out. (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 09:00:18 10/03/08 Fri
• bookcloseouts.com usually have them. Go to the site and see if they have any in stock and maybe you can phone in an order. (NT) -- M&M, 09:11:35 10/03/08 Fri
• I found mine at a second-hand bookstore. Did you check those? (NT) -- Lisa L, 09:20:37 10/03/08 Fri
  • I have with no luck (NT) -- CarrieH, 09:21:51 10/03/08 Fri
  • Thanks so much, they do have the 3rd book but not #2, I shall keep looking (NT) -- CarrieH, 09:27:30 10/03/08 Fri
    • Ask your library about inter-branch loan or your book store to order it for you (NT) -- Cherie, 09:37:28 10/03/08 Fri
• the Literary Guild has them but you have to join. Upside is you get 6? books free. (NT) -- Happiapple, 10:22:27 10/03/08 Fri
• I got #2 Tatriana & Alexander from the Library, but I got Book # 3 from bookcloseouts.com. I had very good luck - had the book in 1 wek and the price was very reasonable. BTW, I LOVED these books. They are my favorites after DG's. (NT) -- BrendaW, 11:11:36 10/03/08 Fri
  • Thank you all so much, I just got off the phone with my local library and they are willing to track these down and have them shipped to my branch, again thank you all so much for your suggestions (NT) -- CarrieH, 12:15:16 10/03/08 Fri
    • That's great, Carrie. Happy reading!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! btw, I found my Alexander. Inside >>>>>> -- ladyphantom, 13:17:36 10/03/08 Fri

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• What a fascinating site! Thanks for posting! (NT) -- FirstJane, 04:11:37 10/04/08 Sat
• I remember a passage (in Fiery Cross??) where Claire has a craftsman make surgical tools for her (based, of course, on her 20th century knowledge and experience). I wonder if these perished in the fire in ABOSAA? I can't remember where I read about those tools. I also am reminded of the operating theatre scene in "Young Frankenstein", going from the sublime to the ridiculous. (Personally, given a choice, I'd choose morphine.) (NT) -- Lemora, 22:16:36 10/04/08 Sat

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• Major MacDonald turned into a pivotal character in a very quiet way. Someone a wile ago dennonced him as a villain becaue everytime he shows up Jamie ends up doing something he doesn't really want to do. (NT) -- kgp, 02:18:24 10/03/08 Fri
  • For most of the book, Major MacDonald seems like a plot device; whenever he shows up, the plot moves forward. Until the very end, when Jamie is forced to shoot him in battle. And at that point, even if you didn't really care for him as a character, you have to view him as a human being, at least, someone we've come to know and care a little about. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 02:56:48 10/03/08 Fri
    • With my first read, Major MacDonald bored me. I kept pushing him aside as an annoying secondary character that I wasn't the least bit interested in. However, with my reread, I paid attention more to everything as I wasn't it a hurry. The scene where he was shot by Jamie actually brought tears to my eyes with that reread. She did a beautiful job writing it. I felt like I was there, watching, praying, feeling his agony and all the pain. Enjoyed him more the 2nd time around. (NT) -- Conmama, 05:11:53 10/03/08 Fri
      • He was always a very important character to me. I viewed him at first as a friend, messenger, and then as an agitator, then foe. The scence where he was shot by Jamie was very emotional for me as well.....I choked up. (NT) -- Niseold, 08:53:48 10/03/08 Fri
• I thought Major McDonald was just a kitty chew toy - hee!hee! I think Major McDonald was an okay sort of guy who was loyal to what he thought was the right cause. We just have the advantage of knowing he was on the wrong side. I saw him as more of a fly in the ointment than a bad person. (NT) -- Lady JenF, 05:03:06 10/03/08 Fri
  • Lol Lady JenF, you do have a way with words. "kitty chew toy" indeed. (NT) -- Carol P, 10:09:15 10/03/08 Fri
• Here's MY take on MacDonald. He came to manipulate Jamie. Now I hate it when people try to manipulate me because it usually means that they think that they are smarter than I. But Jamie uses him, too - MacDonald just not smart enough to realize it. (NT) -- GiGi, 05:38:29 10/03/08 Fri
  • I think Jamie genuinely likes the man even though he knows he's going to be tapped for something. He brings news and conversation along with his requests. Claire is the first to register annoyance at his arrivals. Adso and the white sow have him pegged from the start. I liked him, too, as a character and as a plot propellant. (NT) -- kgp, 05:57:23 10/03/08 Fri
    • Claire certainly did not like MacDonald's talk about the girl, more or less forced into prostitution, as still being "fresh" when he "had" her. WHY would a man talk about his sexual conquests in front of Claire like that?? And why did Jamie stand for it??? (NT) -- GiGi, 06:36:59 10/03/08 Fri
      • MacDonald hesitated with his story (the girl prostitute was part of that story), but Jamie told him to continue because there was nothing Claire hadn't heard before. (NT) -- Chriss, 06:49:15 10/03/08 Fri
        • Well - MacDonald could have told his story without referring to whether or not the girl was "fresh". Why did MacDonald think THAT had any bearing on the story. He could have just said she had recently came to the brothel??? (NT) -- GiGi, 08:43:14 10/03/08 Fri
          • It was attesting to how unpractised she was at gaming her customers thereby adding validity to her story. (NT) -- kgp, 08:46:37 10/03/08 Fri
    • I agree with you, kpg. MacDonald was a real historic person. In the time leading up to the Revolution he furthered the British cause by seeking men like Jamie for leadership roles. Jamie was an obvious choice because of the experience, respect and influence he carried with him. No doubt he irritated Jamie (mostly Claire) sometimes but Jamie understood his position. I think that is clear by the events that unfold at Moore's Creek. He took no pleasure in shooting MacDonald or the other men. Jamie was as solemn in victory as he was in defeat. That is one of the things I appreciate about these books. War is a cruel and bloody reality. Never glorious. (NT) -- Chriss, 06:42:41 10/03/08 Fri
• It's very definitely an older and wiser Ian here that picks up on the Major's wish for details that would fit his agenda. He's looking for evidence that the native people are untrustworthy. (NT) -- kgp, 10:24:09 10/03/08 Fri
• This time the Major shows up and Jamie leaves and Claire gets taken. (NT) -- Frances, 06:50:16 10/04/08 Sat

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• Claire means that Jamie has an insight into her soul that Frank never did have. There is a deeper connection between them, even at this early stage of their relationship. (NT) -- Lemora, 19:05:37 10/02/08 Thu
  • Okay... -- Danielle, 19:11:02 10/02/08 Thu
    • The phrase 'too quick by half' is used quite a lot over here - although mostly by the older generation. It simply means very quick at something, usually said to someone who is quick on the uptake, someone who can be too sharp for their own good at times. I hope that makes sense. As to the meaning of the whole passage, I agree with what Lemora has said about their developing relationship. (NT) -- Kirsten, 02:41:37 10/03/08 Fri
      • P.S. Is the phrase used in the USA at all? I was presuming it was one of ours!! (NT) -- Kirsten, 03:21:04 10/03/08 Fri
        • We don't use that phrase in the US I wasn't sure what it meant either (NT) -- CarrieH, 05:51:48 10/03/08 Fri
        • FWIW, I've never heard it in Canada either -- I've only encountered it in British fiction. (NT) -- CatherineM., 06:37:23 10/03/08 Fri
        • It may not be widely used, but I have heard it before. (NT) -- Lady_Jane, 16:11:35 10/03/08 Fri
          • Whoops - here in the STATES I've heard it. It may be an old-fashioned phrase that I heard from grandparents? (NT) -- Lady_Jane, 16:12:20 10/03/08 Fri
      • Ah okay! -- Danielle, 07:34:36 10/03/08 Fri
        • I cinfused DH once by referring to something as half again as large as something else. He couldn't quite get that it wasn't twice as large but only 1.5 as large. Therefore, too quick by a half might be not twice as smart but certainly 1.5 times as smart. (NT) -- kgp, 08:51:12 10/03/08 Fri
          • I just came across that expression one of the Sara Donati books and was wondering the same thing. I'm Canadian and don't know the expression but presumed it was just that, 1.5 times smarter than most. (NT) -- Lisa L, 09:24:42 10/03/08 Fri
            • It doesn't have a literal meaning, it's just one of those old sayings. (NT) -- Kirsten, 09:30:30 10/03/08 Fri
              • The word 'half' seems to crop up a lot. For instance....'It isn't half hot' ....meaing it's very hot. (NT) -- Kirsten, 09:34:31 10/03/08 Fri
• I haven't heard the phrase used in the US either. I think it is similar to the idea behind the phrase "cheap at twice the price". With "quick by half", I believe she means that even if he would still be very sharp (or smart or quick), even if he were only half as sharp. That's how I understand it, but I am no expert. Hyperbole might be an accurate description... (NT) -- Lady JenF, 10:42:16 10/03/08 Fri
  • Oops - a few extra words in there (strike the first "even if"), but I think you can still make sense of it. (NT) -- Lady JenF ;), 10:44:07 10/03/08 Fri
• Danielle - I answered your question (about Frank - sorry, ladies!!) in the next post -- I thought I'd tell you here in case you don't go back through that post/thread. Thanks! (NT) -- ScarlettO, 11:07:24 10/03/08 Fri
• I think what this shows is that DG has done her research very well and has Claire using words and phrases common only to the UK, particularly people of that generation. (NT) -- Kirsten, 12:27:08 10/03/08 Fri
• I live in the US and I am familiar iwth the phrase. Have used it myself and agree it is just a way to say someone is smart or catches on quickly or is very perceptive. . (NT) -- Lady Beth, 12:38:47 10/03/08 Fri
• I think it is a British expression as well--if you are familiar with it, maybe you lived in the UK or watch a lot of Masterpiece Theatre! (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 17:14:22 10/03/08 Fri
• Jamie is so intune with Claire. He knows how her body reacts, even keeps track of her courses. Frank never knew anything how Claire's mind or body worked. (NT) -- Frances, 06:53:55 10/04/08 Sat

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Replies:

• See below... the QOTD for Sept. 30th has a lot of opinions! : ) Welcome!!! (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 11:11:41 10/02/08 Thu
  • Ditto...I think you will find the answer to all of your questions down below! After the other day, most of us are Franked-out!!! Welcome to LOL! (NT) -- Rollaine, 11:17:47 10/02/08 Thu
    • Oh Jeez, I have to get something off my chest: Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn!" With apologies to Margaret Mitchell and all the others who are sick of this topic. Please read posts on this subject below. (NT) -- Lemora, 19:02:41 10/02/08 Thu
• First, I'll say--Danielle--Welcome!!! I hope to see you on the boards often. I don't want to give you spoilers, but I will strongly encourage you to keep reading. When those 2 decades are referenced, it's usually in a Claire flashback/memory/backstory sort of thing, so it really isn't an overwhelming part of the story line--I don't want to give away anymore plot to you. As to what others feel, you might just want to refer to down to the QOTD for 9/30. Frank certainly brings on some *Strong* opinions on both sides of the Frank Fan or NFF--Not a Frank Fan issue. (NT) -- Cathryn_L, 11:22:06 10/02/08 Thu
  • Oops, we were both typing about the QOTD at the same time, but you guys were faster! (NT) -- Cathryn_L, 11:23:16 10/02/08 Thu
• Also, to add my two cents - you may want to stay away from this particular Board until you've read the rest of the books in the series. Other than spoilers (concerning any future books), anything is fair game for discussion, and if you don't like to know ahead of time what's going to happen in the books, you should probably steer clear. If, on the other hand, you don't mind getting glimpses ahead, you're in the right place. (As as for Frank - wow - let's just not go there right now! *g*) (NT) -- ScarlettO, 11:27:05 10/02/08 Thu
  • Hijack for a moment--Scar, I hope things are going a bit better for you? (NT) -- Cathryn_L, 11:33:39 10/02/08 Thu
    • Well, nothing has broken, melted, exploded, or died in the last week, so that's good! Beyond that, I almost hesitate to say "yea" or "nay!" *g* (NT) -- ScarlettO, 13:51:40 10/02/08 Thu
      • Well, it sounds like a things are looking up this week, then. Glad to hear it! Toodles! (NT) -- Cathryn_L, 20:15:09 10/02/08 Thu
  • I hope your day goes better... -- Danielle, 17:40:35 10/02/08 Thu
    • Danielle, I don't really have strong "Frank-opinion" either way - I can see both sides of the argument. One thing I do say is that Claire stayed with Frank when she went back through the stones because it was just easier than leaving - there was at least a shared history, and she was so despondent over losing Jamie, she couldn't put any effort even into leaving Frank. JMHO, of course. BTW - just a techincal detail about your posts - it's easier for us to read if you type your answer right in the top line of the "reply" field. If it's VERY long, voy will tell you that it's too long to post that way, but otherwise, just say it all in this top line. That's what we do, and that's why you see the "NT" at the end of our posts. Just makes it easier to read rather than having to continually click on your posts to read the rest "inside." I hope that makes sense. (NT) -- ScarlettO, 08:45:53 10/03/08 Fri
      • Thank you for that hint. I was wondering why my posts were showing like that. And thank you for your response as well. I think I'm a very opinionated person, so that's why I'm so passionate about the Claire/Frank issue -- but I'm finding my ways of dealing with it. =) I just hope she returns to Jamie quickly in the third book. I even remember being confused when I started reading Outlander. I was wondering why the heck was I reading so much about Frank and Claire lol. (NT) -- Danielle, 16:24:31 10/03/08 Fri
• Welcome, Danielle! The others have pointed you in the right direction, but I want to also forewarn you of the spoilers. I started coming here when I was partway through Voyager, and started posting while reading TFC. While I was able to avoid spoilers for the most part, I did get a few sneaks...not enough to ruin the experience, and it was my choice anyway! The last few days I had to refrain from coming over because I was on the final 150 pages of ABOSAA and did not want to have that spoiled. Thankfully (or regrettably), I finished last night, so I feel I can really get involved on the boards now. This has been a great place for me to get my Outlander fix daily, and everyone has been really kind and inviting. (NT) -- Woogie, 11:39:27 10/02/08 Thu
• Welcome to you, Danielle. I have to echo all the other voices here -- keep reading! How could you stop and not want to know what happens? I suggest you do stay away until you get further along..... not that you wouldn't be welcomed, it's just that we don't want anything spoiled. It only keeps getting better. Trust us. (NT) -- Merrymags, 12:41:56 10/02/08 Thu
• Thank you all... -- Danielle, 12:51:52 10/02/08 Thu
  • I think there is alot of mutal respect in their marriage. I you will find as you continue to read that your comment of "Frank never fulfilled her, that he never allowed her to become who she was meant to be" is incorrect. later you will find that Frank has alot to do with the woman she ended up being when she returned to Jamie. And I don't think their marriage was completely loveless. I'm not a big Frank fan at all, but I do appreciate the things he did do. And I just KNOW he knew alot more then he ever let on. Everytime we "hear" about Frank it gets more and more interesting. Welcome to LOL and keep reading it's going to get really good (NT) -- Cherie, 13:29:03 10/02/08 Thu
    • But.. -- Daniele, 14:06:12 10/02/08 Thu
      • Daniele, I do agree with Cherie that Claire and Frank had a lot of mutual respect in their marriage. They may not have loved each other when Claire came back but they did at one time love each other and they were married. I'm not a huge Frank fan but I do admire some of the things he did and one of them was being a very good father to Bree. He did help raise her and IMHO loved her very dearly. To Bree Frank is her daddy. It seemed so unfair to me at first that Jamie was not able to raise Bree with Claire but under the circumstances Bree was fortunate to have Frank as her father. (NT) -- Jay-Lee, 16:27:06 10/02/08 Thu
• Oh and.. -- Danielle, 12:57:41 10/02/08 Thu
  • How old are you Danielle? You seem very caught up with the "only Jamie" thing. That's just not reality. And neither Jamie or Claire wanted the other one to not be happy with someone else because they couldn't be together. And your "he never allowed her to become who she was meant to be" about Frank I honestly believe is untrue. When you read further you will find that it was Frank that made sure Claire became a doctor. Honestly, in that time & age, if it wasn't for Frank I don't think Claire would ever had been able to achive what she did. And they may not have had the hot money sex love that her & Jamie had. But I don't think it was a "loveless" marriage by any means. The mutal respect for each other and the love for their daughter held their marriage for a long time. I'm not saying Frank was't a dog, cause he was. Just because he was an asshole doesn't mean he wasn't a good man (NT) -- Cherie, 10:07:53 10/03/08 Fri
    • I am 19... and call me young if you want, but there are certain areas in my life that I hold very highly and one of those is love. If I were in Claire's situation where the love of my life died, I wouldn't seek another man. I would make it on my own. I just think... it's betraying the person that I loved... plus I couldn't even imagine sleeping with another man let alone living with him. Anyway, so that type of love is my "reality" but clearly it's not Claire's. I just don't like Frank and the fact that Claire returns to him. And I just don't see how she could ever love another man again. Yes, maybe she cared for Frank... but still loved him? I don't know, I'm sure I'll get by. =) Anyway, I have a lot more to read and am looking forward to it. (NT) -- Danielle, 16:29:47 10/03/08 Fri
      • It has nothing to do with youth :-)! I'm 45 & totally agree with you. If you read down below, you would see my posts, Lemora's & Chriss' as well. Enjoy the rest of your reading! (NT) -- Rollaine, 16:03:44 10/04/08 Sat
• Goodness gracious! I think it has taken me the better part of the afternoon to catch up on the last couple of days of comments. Danielle, your kidding me right? :0) (NT) -- Phelisha, 13:31:05 10/02/08 Thu
  • ? -- Danielle, 14:00:19 10/02/08 Thu
• I am just teasing Danielle! After reading all the posts from the last three days, most of it concerning your very questions, I just found it quite amusing if not ironic that you would enter the book board with those very questions!! I had just had a brain full and that was the first thing that come to my mind when I read your comments! I too am new to the boards. I will say that everyone here is quit amazing and welcoming! I am still in awe at the depth of knowledge, insight and familiarity with "everything Outlandish" these fans are! As the recently obsessed go in search of the already obsessed as I did, you found a heck of a wateringhole sister!! (NT) -- Phelisha, 14:20:21 10/02/08 Thu
  • Ah I see! -- Danielle, 17:08:16 10/02/08 Thu
    • Good question. I hadn't really gauged it now that you mention it. It probably a little further into the 3rd book. But of course its all good reading. I sat home on my day off and read for 7 hours straight. Only stopped because my kids came home from school. I actually peaked at the last page of Outlander to see that they were ok. I was not going to go on if it had a sad ending! I couldn't have taken it. You are welcome to email me if you would like to talk off topic of the boards. They move really fast and as none of my immediate friends are yet reading the story, I would like to discuss further details and questions. (NT) -- Phelisha, 14:08:08 10/03/08 Fri
      • Definitely! I'm almost finished with the first -- it's hard to read and go to college at the same time lol. But I would love to discuss Outlander further. I'm such a thinker and it's hard for me to let things go that I am bothered by. How far have you gotten into the series? (NT) -- Danielle, 16:25:43 10/03/08 Fri
• To answer one of your questions, the 3rd bk brings Jamie and Claire back together delightfully soon and rather seamless. The reader is given just enough about their 20 years apart to be celebrating their reunion!! I am about 2/3rds through Voyager but have intensified my obsession with all the spoilers found here. (NT) -- Phelisha, 14:46:17 10/02/08 Thu
  • Just wait til you get thru them all! I was lucky... I found the books when Fiery Cross came out. It was recommended to me by Amazon. Well, I read the description and thought "Wow! That's right up my alley with our re-enacting! If I am going to read them, I will start with the first one." So... I could read them back-to-back until I had to wait for ABOSAA. (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 16:44:35 10/02/08 Thu
• Danielle, I think you will like the surprise of where the book takes you and Diana is a greeat writer and she will take you where you have never been before. Trust me. I was fairly new myself here. I read the series twice within one year and I am going for a third reading soon. There is always you missed or for just pleasure. Enjoy!! (NT) -- Frances, 06:57:31 10/04/08 Sat
• Hi Danielle, message inside sorry couldn't fit it all....... -- Jenn, 00:14:55 10/06/08 Mon

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• Do you have a link??? I have no idea how to find it! (NT) -- Rollaine, 10:25:56 10/02/08 Thu
• Try this one (inside)>>>> -- Cathryn_L, 10:45:56 10/02/08 Thu
  • Thanks, I had to run off to a meeting before and now it doesn't seem to be working for me!!! (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 10:47:08 10/02/08 Thu
• Please don't discuss the contents of excerpts on this board, OK? Vicki is trying very hard to keep those discussions limited to the Excerpt Board, and some of us really do not want any hints of what may be coming in ECHO. Whatever's in that excerpt, I would just rather not know until the book comes out. Thanks. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 13:27:03 10/02/08 Thu
  • I read it and I does not appear to be an excerpt from the next book at all. It's just DG explaining something that has already taken place-Jamie's marraige to Laoghaire. It's not written in "book form" like we see other excerpts. I think she may have been answering a question. (NT) -- Rollaine, 13:38:07 10/02/08 Thu
    • Read it again, just to be sure :-)...there is actually no new info in what I read. Just an explanation of things you already know about. (NT) -- Rollaine, 13:43:27 10/02/08 Thu
      • OK. Thanks. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 13:45:06 10/02/08 Thu
        • Hi, Karen. I did double ck before posting that link to make sure, & it seemed excerpt free...However, there may be spoilers farther down that thread; so tread carefully there. BTW, congrats on successfully hosing your sister! *G* (NT) -- Cathryn_L, 20:10:53 10/02/08 Thu
          • Thanks! She's thoroughly addicted now, and that's only since July. It's fun to watch her discover the books. I've never hosed anybody before and I'm glad my sister and I can share this. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 02:59:59 10/03/08 Fri
    • That's why I referred them over to that instead of telling it here. (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 16:46:05 10/02/08 Thu
  • My apologies, everybody, I read the post way too fast and jumped to conclusions. Yes, indeed, I understand what thread you are talking about now and I agree, it was just speculation. (FWIW, I misread the original comment here to be "Diana explains how Laoghaire could time travel"(!) And freaked out a bit at the prospect. Sorry folks. That's what I get for trying to read the boards while I'm at work and supposed to be concentrating on other stuff. It's doubly embarrassing for me because my sister Alice was the one who started that particular thread (she's a new addict, just introduced to the books this summer). I should know better than to post without thinking like that. Sorry. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 13:56:05 10/02/08 Thu
    • You're forgiven! (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 16:47:04 10/02/08 Thu
• OMG! Thanks for the link Cathryn and to Piper Mom for the heads up! Did you read post #35 too? Nice little excerpt there!! I understand why Jamie wed L. What I don't understand is his continued loyalty to her and her daughters. They were married for two years? Lived together for only one of those two years. That does not seem enought time to me for the girls to be calling him "daddy". I just don't get his loyalty to her. Especially since their marriage, now that Claire is back, is not even valid yet he does not even fight to reduce what she is asking of him by way of support. She did shoot him after all. UGH! This just drives me crazy!! (NT) -- Phelisha, 13:27:05 10/02/08 Thu
  • Hi Phelisha, POST #35 DOES HAVE NEW INFO!!! We are not allowed to discuss new info here (I know you didn't, but all discussion should go to the excerpt board). The link in the post above does not have anything new-just clairifications. (NT) -- Rollaine, 13:48:41 10/02/08 Thu
    • BTW, I only used capital letters so people would know that the post contains new info! It was not meant to be rude! (NT) -- Rollaine, 13:51:04 10/02/08 Thu
  • Ya! -- DJ, 17:29:35 10/02/08 Thu
• Oh, I will be carefull not to mention anything from the excerpts here. I should have made a new post about my comment on Jamie and L. Been wanting to get that off my chest!! (NT) -- P., 15:00:16 10/02/08 Thu

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• Claire is definetly more comfortable around men. There are so many things about her that make her that way. Some women are just like that and I kinda admire that about them. Thanks Judith for the quotes this week, I am off to Betsy's house for the Gathering in Maine. I'm so excited to meet everyone there. See you next week! :) (NT) -- LisaW, 21:28:17 10/01/08 Wed
  • I can relate to Claire in some ways ( her need to be more than just wife & mother), her passion about her medicine (I am passionate about being an environmental scientist & my bird studies), and like her, I find myself more comfortable around men. Don't know why that is, but most of my friends are men. Can't really hold my liquor though-I get much too silly! And I totally agree about the Raiders scene-Karen Allen was the best of the women in that series and that scene was great. (NT) -- Rollaine, 07:29:27 10/02/08 Thu
• Judith, I also love that scene in "Raiders of the Lost Ark", my fave of the Indy movies. Did you know that Karen Allen runs a yoga studio and textiles shop in a small town in the Berkshires? She's all but retired from acting. She's always been one of my favorites. (NT) -- Lemora, 22:09:53 10/01/08 Wed
  • Interesting, Lemora! But she _was_ in the newest Indy movie, which I've yet to see - I gotta get out more! That's prolly why she could keep up with Indy in the new movie - all that yoga! (NT) -- JudithONH, 09:34:28 10/02/08 Thu
    • I loved her in the newest Indy movie! She has salt and pepper grey hair and has not done anything to her face. How refreshing! I wish she was in more movies. Back in 1987, she was dining in Manhattan at the table next to mine in a Japanese restaurant. I've always remembered how fresh she looked. (NT) -- Lemora, 21:19:32 10/02/08 Thu
• I’ll never forget Roger’s admiration for her love of whiskey…unlike her daughter’s. That seem to start him thinking that there was more to her than met the eye??? (NT) -- Mitzi, 22:52:33 10/01/08 Wed
• I too am more comfortable around men than woman. I find them less "catty" lol and more accepting. I worked for a construction co for 20 years (ran office) one gal 30 men. My kind of odds. (NT) -- Lady Elizabeth, 04:42:19 10/02/08 Thu
• .........and a smaller bladder. I love that line! (NT) -- M&M, 05:21:30 10/02/08 Thu
• I love that scene in ROLTA too (I love Indiana Jones). Maybe Claire feels more comfortable around men because she was brought up by her uncle on dig sites--not many women there. (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 06:46:32 10/02/08 Thu
  • She does seem more comfortable around men. I know she does in the 20th c, too, and that's likely a product of her upbringing like you say (although she was also a precocious and strong-willed child). But, do you maybe think it might also be partially that women were treated as weak and were often uneducated in the 18th c, too? She can't relate to women, doesn't have much in common with them, and naturally gravitates to men because she can hold her own, and often outwit them? This is one of my favorite characteristics of Claire. (NT) -- Woogie, 08:41:32 10/02/08 Thu
    • I think that's a big part of it. I, too, am more comfortable around men and I can't for the life of me figure out why! My parents divorced, my father had an affair-you would think it would be the oppposite. I was, however (and still am), pretty much a loner and it takes time for me to make friends & trust people. When I do though, as an adult, I have gravitated towards men, Maybe it's my interests & the field I'm in. Same with Claire-medicine was very much a white, male dominated field back. I think that's why she became so close to Joe Abernathy. (NT) -- Rollaine, 10:14:32 10/02/08 Thu
      • I'm also somewhat of a loner. I don't have more male friends than female, although I will say that practically every singe female friend I have is very strong willed and self sufficient. But men do relate to me well (I don't mean to sound arrogant in the least). I think it's because of how I raised. My parents did stay together until my father passed away (and he was a fighter at that), but he and I were very close, and I was like him more than my mother. He grew up fatherless, never knowing the man at all. Because of this, he instilled independence (he basically taught himself English when he moved to the US) and always encouraged me to develop my own beliefs and outlook on life, and to not shy away from creativity and being different. I also play sports, soccer and golf, which were still pretty much male dominated until recent years. I think my love for sports, as a participant and ardent spectator, makes me easy to relate with guys. (NT) -- Woogie, 11:33:48 10/02/08 Thu
• I am the youngest of 4 girls. I do usually get along with men better. I went to college starting in Wildlife Management and switched to Forest Management. Most jobs I worked in State Parks, State Forest, National Forest and US Army Corps of Engineers, I was usually the only woman. I told the DH when we first started dating that I worked with men, if he were the jealous type, he just better forget me and find someone else. Now in the horticulture department in the university, I work with both and do fine. (NT) -- Piper-Mom, 09:47:39 10/02/08 Thu

• wasn't it implied by where they were found & the wound that killed her? (NT) -- Ruthlass, 20:55:40 10/01/08 Wed
• It is my understanding that the bones Claire looks at in his office are Gellis’s bones…Not sure if it is ever mentioned as “fact” but it is definitely implied that they are one and the same. (NT) -- Mitzi, 22:31:43 10/01/08 Wed
  • Yes. If you look closely at the hurricane scene near the end of VOYAGER, there is a point where Claire actually makes the connection for herself, thinking of Joe Abernathy singing about the bones, then suddenly realizing who the bones belonged to. It's extremely subtle, but the reference is there if you know what to look for. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 00:41:01 10/02/08 Thu
• It's weird, because when she is looking at the bones (of Geillis) she hasn't gone back in time and killed her yet. Ahhhh, the mysteries of Time Travel... (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 06:44:48 10/02/08 Thu
  • even weirder would be that Geillie hadn't gone back yet but she was already dead. ????? (NT) -- susiej, 08:16:37 10/02/08 Thu
    • Yeah, this is the part of Diana's time travel theory that I just don't get, and when I try to think it through logically, I get more mixed up. (NT) -- Bedelia, 08:58:27 10/02/08 Thu
    • It is so hard to wrap my head around some of this - it seems almost impossible, but I'd bet that DG will somehow have a good explanation for everything in the end. I suppose that means that we will have to wait until the end of the last book though! (NT) -- BrendaW, 09:12:00 10/02/08 Thu
      • As our Eva in Italy used to say in the TT discussions, Bring out the Aspirin! LOL! (NT) -- JudithONH, 09:32:51 10/02/08 Thu

• Donner was Native American. (NT) -- LizT, 20:19:59 10/01/08 Wed
• At some point in ABOSAA doesn't Claire talk about Donner having a lion's mane of hair, which I sorta pictured as a kind of Afro. I especially though this was weird because Doner is said to be Native America and their hair is typically stick straight, so I thought he must be of mixed race ancestry. (NT) -- RisaB, 20:24:25 10/01/08 Wed
• My recollection is that Claire remembers Donner as looking like an Indian (not black, but tan) and he didn’t talk like an Indian and she thought he was of mixed blood. She said he had the hair of a lion….I took that to mean that his hair was very thick, long, straight but that it stuck out from his head in all directions like a lion’s mane. (NT) -- Mitzi, 22:46:36 10/01/08 Wed
• A lot of slaves ran away to native reservations so it is possible he was part black. (NT) -- Annabel, 04:21:27 10/02/08 Thu
• Hey gals - how would Donner "talk like an Indian"?? And how would Donner be a slave who ran away to an Indian Reservation??? Donner was from the 20th century - some kind of hippie activist. So - what was he??? What made that rfesponder under the BIG "Frank" posting think he was Black?? (NT) -- GiGi, 07:04:52 10/02/08 Thu
  • Even today, Indians that grow up on reservations have a distinct accent. I live near several reservations and have many Indian friends. (NT) -- CrystalLyn, 07:46:24 10/02/08 Thu
  • well, that's the thing- the posters were saying claire noticed these thinks and they were clues that he was not an Indian of the times. She could tell he was different. I never had the impression he was black. When he talked to claire he sounded very much like a hippie. But yea, now that I think of it the lion mane doesn't fit with typical NA hair, so he must have been of mixed blood. BTW Gigi, thanks for posting this question. I noted that post too and thought it odd. But it goes along with the whole Frank issue- amazing to me that we can all read the same book and get such different perceptions. The reader truly is a partner in the experience of the story. (NT) -- susiej, 08:14:25 10/02/08 Thu
    • I also missed the physical description completely on Donner. I pictured him as a Kato Kaelin-type California-esque surfer stoner with dirty blonde hair and blue eyes, who had smoked too much and been thru too much in the brutal past. (NT) -- Lemora, 08:24:05 10/02/08 Thu
      • That's a blast from the past - whatever happened to Kato Kaelin?!? (NT) -- Bedelia, 08:59:59 10/02/08 Thu
        • Kato K. turned down all sorts of lucrative deals, refusing to cash in on his O.J. fame-by-association. He began a career doing something --I forget what-- and deliberately avoided any tabloid fame, and started a whole new life. Personally, I think there are secrets he'll take to his grave, but that's between him and his conscience. I do think there's a scrap of decency in him. (NT) -- Lemora, 10:36:01 10/02/08 Thu
• I read an interview with an old blues musician, Doc Cheatham, about 20 years ago. He had been raised "Black", but found out much later in life that he was actually American Indian (I forget which tribe). His father (who may have been of mixed heritage --don't remember) thought his children would face less prejudice in life if they went through it as Negro, rather than as Indians! He only found out his true heritage later in life. This would've all been in the 20th century. Interesting! Don't know if Doc Cheatham is still alive. (NT) -- Lemora, 22:24:25 10/04/08 Sat

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• *happy sigh* Aaaaahhh... Roger... so thoughtful, so romantic, so sweet....... And Bree.... in that one little sentence she said so much by not saying anything at all (if that makes sense). (NT) -- MariaM, 20:56:13 09/30/08 Tue
• That last line Bree says reminds me of something Jamie said in Outlander. They are married and have to travel by dark. He was telling Claire a story about how he was beaten by his uncle or something, but it made Claire laugh and that's when it slips "Oh Jamie, I do love you! And he says some things, but the last is something like "you don't make much sense, but I like ye fine, too". I guess the 2 lines just struck me at that moment and show how alike they are-Father & Daughter. (NT) -- Rollaine, 21:14:35 09/30/08 Tue
  • That was my first thought also. Like father like daughter. I like them fine. (NT) -- LadyGrace, 08:20:20 10/01/08 Wed
• Oh yeah, Bree loves Roger and I think always has….and now she knows that it is forever!!! Got to love these small intimate moments they share!!! So true, that her wedding day is not like she/or her mother thought might be, but to Bree??? It was perfect!! (NT) -- Mitzi, 21:16:54 09/30/08 Tue
• Brianna and Roger are really made for each other. They are figuring this whole marriage thing out, but I think they will do just fine. (NT) -- LisaW, 21:48:40 09/30/08 Tue
  • I totally agree!!! (NT) -- Mitzi, 21:58:26 09/30/08 Tue
• So many ups and downs for this lovely couple. My favorite scene during their second wedding was when Roger played "Yesterday" on his guitar. DG got that perfect! I have a Beatles' compilation CD and listened to that song quite a bit after that. Roger and Bree are special to us since I am American and my husband is a Brit. (NT) -- Lady JenF, 05:09:06 10/01/08 Wed
  • That scene "struck a cord" with me too *g* (NT) -- Niseold, 05:41:32 10/01/08 Wed
  • yes, I love Roger with his guitar. It was such a heart ripper when he lost his voice. We better meet Geillie's son in the next book and get some recompense! You know, there's been mention several times that Roger is the only one of the family that hasn't been raped and I don't mean to belittle rape in any way but the loss of his voice may have been nearly as traumatic. It was such a big part of who he was. (NT) -- susiej, 06:16:43 10/01/08 Wed
  • That was lovely, touching & so appropiate for the moment-I totally agree. I love the guitar & love when a man plays it! My DH bought me one for my 40th birthday & I'm still working on learning how to play. I have friend who is trying to teach me-he is sooo good and all self-taught. (NT) -- Rollaine, 07:39:54 10/01/08 Wed
    • "... he is sooo good.."--at the GUITAR, right?! *snort* (NT) -- LindaMc, 16:23:08 10/01/08 Wed
      • No, he's just a really good friend (he's married & so am I)! And he's very talented. He's on of those of people who can hear a song and duplicate it in like a week. I'm still trying to learn, but I wish I had more time to play. (NT) -- Rollaine, 18:32:59 10/01/08 Wed
        • My DS picked up the guitar a couple of years ago and just started playing around with it. Now he's really quite good. So keep practicing! And I was just teasing about your friend! :-) (NT) -- LindaMc, 01:00:55 10/02/08 Thu
          • I know :-)! I am jealous of his natural ability to just pick up songs like that. But, you are right, it is pratice and I have to get myself organized to fit everything in! (NT) -- Rollaine, 07:24:15 10/02/08 Thu
• I was just so pleased they were finally getting married, what a roller coaster ride between wedding 1 and wedding 2 - and it still wasn't without it's hiccups! DH and I had to have another minister fill in last minute, as our original minister got sick ;) (NT) -- Janelle N, 06:44:08 10/01/08 Wed
• I just finished reading that chapter this week. I know that it takes forever in this book for them to get married, but they're a cute couple and Roger tries so hard for her. (NT) -- Laura, 10:35:58 10/01/08 Wed
• I know both Jamie and I think Duncan quote this saying, "Happy is the bride the sun shines on . . .", but do we ever get an explanation of where it comes from? Is it just an old Scottish saying? I know I've heard it somewhere else, but can't remember. (NT) -- Bedelia, 14:09:32 10/01/08 Wed
  • I googled it and one site attributed it to Robert Herrick who died in 1674, I think, I didn't write the date down. The second half of the proverb is "happy is the corpse the rain rains on" and I think that is mentioned somewhere later in TFC. Anyhow, I think it's just an old saying. (NT) -- JudithONH, 20:51:51 10/01/08 Wed
    • Thanks, Judith! (NT) -- Bedelia, 04:33:54 10/02/08 Thu
• I like Roger quite a bit, but I've never been able to warm up to Bree. /ducking to avoid being hit by angry Hosers (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 17:07:13 10/01/08 Wed
  • Me neither. There are quite a few of us here who have never taken wholeheartedly to her. I've liked Roger more and more, as he begins to "find himself" and adjust to life in the past. I'm very interested to see how he settles back into the 20th century in the upcoming "Echo". (NT) -- Lemora, 07:05:45 10/03/08 Fri
  • It took me a long time to warm up to her. Finally did in ABOSAA, (NT) -- susiej, 08:24:37 10/03/08 Fri
• So sweet, the hand-fast was the first time and then the lovemaking right after. Yeah, I'd remember too. These two are the typical young couple who really love each other and want to please each other. Find out through Jamie and Claire how to really make it work. (NT) -- Frances, 17:32:38 10/01/08 Wed

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Replies:

• Thank you, Mr Crook! (NT) -- kgp, 03:38:51 09/28/08 Sun
  • Yeah, no kidding! Incredible to think how much hinges on Claire's impromptu decision to go investigate the plants on that particular hill [vbg]. (NT) -- Karen Henry, 06:17:36 09/28/08 Sun
• oh- good one! I got chills. (NT) -- MB, 06:45:26 09/28/08 Sun
• Judith!! Glad to see you fulfilling your role as Quote goddess! (NT) -- wee, 07:02:14 09/28/08 Sun
  • Thanks, Wee! I gotta stop going to the computer late at night after I've had a few glasses of wine! Something in my brain seemed to say that I had signed up, but I never looked all the way to the bottom of page 1 to see the schedule...luckily Judie sent a reminder yesterday, and luckily I looked at the computer last night, and LUCKILY still, I already had a rough plan, so I didn't wake up to an email this morning saying, hey! it's YOUR week! LOL. (NT) -- JudithONH, 08:53:22 09/28/08 Sun
• "Is there something special about it?” I'd say so! (NT) -- Wee Welsh Lass, 07:19:48 09/28/08 Sun
• So it begins is it, the beginning of adventure & Jamie Fraser, OOFF!!!! (NT) -- Frances, 08:17:01 09/28/08 Sun
• I'm so glad that Claire has always had a curiosity for plants. If not... well, it does begin here, at the henge. (NT) -- LisaW, 09:23:26 09/28/08 Sun
• Little did she know! Litttle did I know!!! (NT) -- P., 11:12:27 09/28/08 Sun
• wow i remember first reading this manyyyy years ago.......... little did we know what would come of this! looking forward to your week:) (NT) -- oorjanie, 12:12:14 09/28/08 Sun
• I just downloaded Outlander from Audible.com and am just about at this part. (NT) -- LissC, 14:37:13 09/28/08 Sun
• You know, I do wish there was a way to go back through time. Into the past. If I knew there was a stone circle and knew of it's origins and knew that you could travel backwards, I would be very curious and take the plunge. Of course, I would wanna be in Scotland like Claire and do that. Call me a nut but well, That's what I'd do. (NT) -- Darlene W, 15:30:14 09/28/08 Sun
  • Somehow I think I wouldn't find a Jamie. I'd end up with an edentulous, dirty, uneducated, impoverished pig farmer who would work me to death, starve me and want sex 3 times a day. Now, the sex part would be fine if it was Jamie . . . but . . . the pig farmer . . .not so much. LOL (NT) -- CathyS, 15:48:43 09/28/08 Sun
    • LOL Cathy!!!! Well, you know, I def wouldn't want a pig farmer. Unless he was a red head and was as gorgeous as Jamie and the sex was hot. Well, the working me like a dog part. Well, that's where I draw the line. He'll have to hire a couple of stable lads. (NT) -- Darlene W, 15:52:19 09/28/08 Sun
    • i'm going to have to go look up what edentulous means, but i'm guessing it aint good. And I agree, that would be my luck too. (NT) --