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Date Posted: 14:03:58 07/17/09 Fri
Author: Esther
Subject: A little late but, I made it >>>
In reply to: Page 's message, "In here >>>>>" on 17:19:15 07/04/09 Sat

A tiny bit of backstory. This part is further along in the book, and one of the things I've had to change since Jay made me realize the beginning wasn't true to form. So to speak. In a nutshell, I saw that Katie had more feelings for Adam than I'd let her have. After all, there was no reason for her to continue staying with him, even if she couldn't find her own flat in Ladbroke Grove. If she didn't care for him, she'd have moved elsewhere, especially knowing that he was falling in love with her. In this excerpt, Jay has already made an appearance, and that raging, tearing attraction between him and Katie has been ignited. The morning after they met, he's come to Ladbroke Grove, ostensibly looking for Adam, and has found Katie doing laundry in the little laundrette near Adam's flat. In the course of the afternoon, they've gone back to Jay's house, he's shown her around, and they're now sitting in the kitchen, having eaten lunch.

Hey didn’t they go to some market where Maureen was and he bought her some candles???

What I'm wondering if what Katie is feeling and thinking feels "real," or if it's coming across as contrived. Any opinions, comments and questions are most gratefully welcomed! (And on a purely personal note, Thomaston Castle, mentioned here, once belonged to my ancestors, the McIlvaine family, so it's near and dear to my heart! There are photos on my genealogy website, if you're interested. *G*)

That’s cool!

Okay opinions, comments and questions leave me a lot of room to manoeuvre in. So, please forgive my transgressions. I might be totally off base and my memory failing, in which case, remember to ignore me, but I recollect her trying to break things off with Adam but for whatever reason, didn’t. I remember a distinct hallway scene, where Jay gave her an ultimatum to end it because he wasn’t going to wait for her much longer. Or something to that effect. So if she feels this fatal attraction to Jay, what’s stopping her from doing what she wants? From packing her bags and leaving Adam’s flat and heading straight to Jay’s bed? And again relying on my poor memory, but I have the impression Adam wasn’t much of a pleasure man in the sack, unless it was his pleasure. So if you want me to believe Katie cared for Adam enough to feel guilt, you have to do more than just have her stay with him for however long she has. And it’s possible you have done that, and I just haven’t read it yet. *G*

Okay lets say I perceive that she has feelings for Adam, and can understand that is part of why she stayed with him but…she knew here (the right thing to do) that Adam wasn’t for her. What else I don’t get is how long her and Adam have been together where they both think of themselves as an exclusive couple. And if I recall something else correctly, Adam wasn’t too upset when they broke up, he was more upset over the fact that he ‘lost’ her to Jay. Guilt is a powerful motivator, not doubt about it, but I don’t get the point of the guilt here. I guess what I’m trying to say is this. Katie has so far in my opinion come across as strong, decisive, and the kind of woman that would go after what she wants. Her coming from the Haught proves that. It’s an era where free love rules and attitudes about sex are quite liberal, so the guilt does seem a bit false to me. What is the guilt in response to? Her acting on her attraction to his best friend or her not feeling the same thing toward Adam that he does for her? And yes, I get the kiss between Jay and Katie wasn’t like something she ever experienced before. But still, I imagine that any instant attraction that feels this right isn’t stoppable. Both Jay and Katie made a conscious decision to have that second kiss and for Katie all it took was a look at Jay for the guilt to be swept away. If she has feelings that are strong enough for Adam to make her stay with him despite what she feels for Jay, the guilt seems a mockery when she asks Jay to kiss her again. Maybe if the guilt came afterward, but not during the kiss, because she did recognize it as something special, because it was the turning point in her feelings toward Adam, because she wasn’t ready to forget how Jay made her feel and because she didn’t want to hurt Adam. If that makes sense. And if this tearing attraction between them is to be interpreted as powerful, doesn’t her indecision to leave Adam make it less so? Of course, this is assuming that I recall things correctly, and that that part of the story is the same. So a round about way to say I know nothing and I’m going to shut up now. *G*

Hugs

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Replies:

[> [> [> Re: Not that late -- I'm still working my way up the board! >>>> -- Page, 23:00:19 07/17/09 Fri

>
>Hey didn’t they go to some market where Maureen was
>and he bought her some candles???

Holy crap, your memory is astounding! Yep, he bought candles, but he bought them for himself after Maureen's not-too-subtle hint that they were Katie's favorite. I can't believe you remembered that! *G*
>

>That’s cool!
>
>Okay opinions, comments and questions leave me a lot
>of room to manoeuvre in. So, please forgive my
>transgressions. I might be totally off base and my
>memory failing,

Not bloody likely. See above. *G*

in which case, remember to ignore me,
>but I recollect her trying to break things off with
>Adam but for whatever reason, didn’t.

She was all prepared to break up with Adam, but decided to wait until the first rehearsal of the new band, since Adam was nervous as a cat about it. And before she could, he brings out the L-word, and asks her to be his girlfriend again. (She's moved out of his flat by the time all of that took place.)

I remember a
>distinct hallway scene, where Jay gave her an
>ultimatum to end it because he wasn’t going to wait
>for her much longer. Or something to that effect. So
>if she feels this fatal attraction to Jay, what’s
>stopping her from doing what she wants? From packing
>her bags and leaving Adam’s flat and heading straight
>to Jay’s bed? And again relying on my poor memory,
>but I have the impression Adam wasn’t much of a
>pleasure man in the sack, unless it was his pleasure.
>So if you want me to believe Katie cared for Adam
>enough to feel guilt, you have to do more than just
>have her stay with him for however long she has. And
>it’s possible you have done that, and I just haven’t
>read it yet. *G*

Still doing renovations to that part, so I've not posted it yet. But she did move out after this interlude with Jay, telling Adam she wasn't comfortable with the whole exclusive relationship. She needed her space. (Very 60s explanation. *G*) He seemed to take it well, said it was cool, and asked if they could still see each other, the way they would see other people. She said yes, thinking he'd find someone else. Plus, she genuinely liked him, and wanted to be his friend. (I know, how lame.) Jay, meanwhile, was out of the country, wrapping up the last tours his old band was contracted to do.
>
>Okay lets say I perceive that she has feelings for
>Adam, and can understand that is part of why she
>stayed with him but…she knew here (the right thing to
>do) that Adam wasn’t for her. What else I don’t get
>is how long her and Adam have been together where they
>both think of themselves as an exclusive couple. And
>if I recall something else correctly, Adam wasn’t too
>upset when they broke up, he was more upset over the
>fact that he ‘lost’ her to Jay. Guilt is a powerful
>motivator, not doubt about it, but I don’t get the
>point of the guilt here. I guess what I’m trying to
>say is this. Katie has so far in my opinion come
>across as strong, decisive, and the kind of woman that
>would go after what she wants. Her coming from the
>Haught proves that. It’s an era where free love rules
>and attitudes about sex are quite liberal, so the
>guilt does seem a bit false to me. What is the guilt
>in response to? Her acting on her attraction to his
>best friend or her not feeling the same thing toward
>Adam that he does for her? And yes, I get the kiss
>between Jay and Katie wasn’t like something she ever
>experienced before. But still, I imagine that any
>instant attraction that feels this right isn’t
>stoppable. Both Jay and Katie made a conscious
>decision to have that second kiss and for Katie all it
>took was a look at Jay for the guilt to be swept away.
> If she has feelings that are strong enough for Adam
>to make her stay with him despite what she feels for
>Jay, the guilt seems a mockery when she asks Jay to
>kiss her again. Maybe if the guilt came afterward,
>but not during the kiss, because she did recognize it
>as something special, because it was the turning point
>in her feelings toward Adam, because she wasn’t ready
>to forget how Jay made her feel and because she didn’t
>want to hurt Adam. If that makes sense.

This makes perfect sense. I think perhaps that's what's been worrying me about this bit. I liked it, but there was always this niggling little feeling that something wasn't quite right about it. I think you've found it. The guilt should come after. And it ties in very well with her decision to move out of Adam's flat. Yes!!

Thank you, thank you, thank you! That's it!!

Tons o' hugs!

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