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Date Posted: 00:22:10 09/08/02 Sun
Author: andrewsfan/OBB
Subject: Saturday September 7, 2002


Am I under the influence you ask?

Well, I don't drink or do banned substances but an attractive woman who expresses a secret desire...well, what can I say except...


The board is open!

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Replies:

[> Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- musette, 02:53:23 09/08/02 Sun

What can I say?
Except...YOU ARE A GODDESS OBB!!!!!!

Now, down to business. So what did you think of Gina's latest?

I think I actually liked this post "Endgame" story better than the one she wrote directly after the series ended ("Timeless Passages").

This story, "Adrift," if you haven't read it yet, allows for Seven to explore her relationship with Chuckles and come to her own conclusion about its viability. I can't help but think that Gina "likes" Seven more than she likes the Captain, but it all makes sense based on the inconsistant picture we got of Kathryn over the years from the PTB.

Kathryn has to suffer (a kind of deteriorization) before she comes to grip with her feelings, whereas Seven gets to "discover" real love, real passion - all the good stuff she's been missing - at the first romantic touch between the two. Seven doesn't "suffer" (alright, she does have to deal with Chuckles - and that has to be insufferable *g*) so much as she is unaware - or perhaps willing to believe that love and passion aren't what they're cracked up to be - ie. typical human weaknesses

In "Adrift," the Captain pursues Seven and I think because of that, the story calls for a certain darkness, or melancholy. In the beginning of the JB series, Gina has Seven pursue the Captain, to comic effect.
Do you think that one situation is naturally more comic and the other more serious, or romantic?

I'm just scratching the surface of this excellent story by a talented writer, of course. But that leaves lots of room for other readers to add their two cents.

So please, be my guest!

Oh it's great to be home. *vbg* Who says you can never go back?

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[> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- andrewsfan, 13:10:46 09/08/02 Sun


I haven't read Gina's "Adrift" yet though I was pleasantly surprised to see her post a J/7 story. Since we are the only two J/7er's in the entire universe that knows the board is running again I will have to make a special effort to read it tonight. Wouldn't want you to sit here and talk to yourself. *g*

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[> [> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- Arlene, 16:04:46 09/08/02 Sun

I thought I was imaging things!...lurking has suddenly become very interesting...Welcome back.

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[> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- Michele, 11:46:47 09/09/02 Mon

I really liked this story too - on several levels I thought it created much more complex incarnations of both Seven and Janeway. It's played out in keeping with the way I see the characters. This Seven is so much more - well, just more, for want of a better word. I like the fact that she has spent time discovering who she is. It takes Seven a long time to figure out that what she feels for Chakotay is simulation rather than reality, but when she does, she takes care of it right away and then proceeds to move on with her life. No mooning over Janeway and falling into her arms right away, but rather a continuation of the path Janeway started her on, discovery of what it is to be human. Big difference, though, she's exploring what it means to be human for her specifically. I like the fact that she's spent time exploring her sensuality and her sexuality - again true to her curious nature.

And, yes, I do think that the story has a more melancholy quality, but only partly because Janeway is pursuing Seven. I think it's also tied to the fact that Janeway has had a very difficult time over three years, and is just now understanding how to deal witht that. I think that it also has to do with Seven's loss of innocence - In pre-Endgame J/7 stories, Seven is both wise and innocent - wise becasue of her memories from the Collective, but yet innocent in the ways of humanity, including innocent about love. Her romanitc relationship with Janeway is the first that she's had. In Adrift, Seven has lost much of her innocence, both about being human, and about relationships. Yet, it's made her stronger and more complex, more interesting. That doesn't mean that the love between Janeway and Seven isn't as binding, necessarily, just that it has a different starting point. And so, I think it is rather melancholy to see these two women so battered by experiences, yet able to still recognize that they belong together. Of course, I love the J/B stories, and the Seven that develops there too, I just thought this one was intriguing - wouldn't mind more stories with these incarnations of Seven and Janeway. Oh my, I have rambled on...

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[> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- Julie, 00:20:54 09/10/02 Tue

hmmm

I did enjoy this, and am trying to get used to slightly different characterizations of Seven and Janeway from an author whose Seven and Janeway I "know".

Musette, I have the exact opposite take on Gina's liking Seven or the Captain more. I think she loves writing the conflicted Kathryn, she's complex and tricky. Kathryn is not always aware of her own motivations, Gina's quite good at getting that just right and I imagine she enjoys that element of Jameway.

But what do I know? -- making stuff up about an author's character preferences -- shame on me.

As for the question is one situation more comic one more romantic? I think there is a bittersweet feeling evoked when two people who belong together taking a long time to get there. (In this example many years.) There is all that time they could have had if they only communicated a bit better. That to me has less comic possibilities.

But then humor is what? pain + distance. Perhaps there is much room for humor in the second scenario, after all

I like how Gina addresses that perhaps Seven wasn't ready for the relationship years ago. Having Seven mature emotionally and no longer under the command of Janeway is one way to address the power issue of Seven being subordinate and inexperienced emotionally. Reading it, it feels... what's the word... like a more developed Seven. Which is interesting to me, because she can be somewhat of a blank slate in some fiction.

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[> [> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- musette, 22:50:20 09/10/02 Tue

Thanks all for your replies. I always learn so much and get a deeper appreciation for a story I've already enjoyed.

I agree whole heartedly with Julie (and others) that this Seven is more developed. I like the fact that she has had time to figure things out (up to a point). The moment she "recognizes" Janeway as the real thing is always a thrill for me to read...even after all this time. ;-) I too like to read standalones, 'cause I love to "see" J and 7 discover each other all over again - and in so many ways. *g*

Please note that when I say that Gina "likes" one character over another, I am not speaking from some insider perspective! I'm not privy to her feelings for these characters, nor do I want or need to be to enjoy her amazing works. That said, I do feel that the way Gina writes Seven seems effortless and full of a kind of simpathetic understanding, while Kathryn poses more challenges. Still I do appreciate and recognize KJ in Gina's characterization - completely!

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[> [> [> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- Julie, 17:21:57 09/14/02 Sat

I think when I say I think she prefers writing one over the other, all I really am uncovering is who I prefer to read about.

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[> [> [> [> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- musette, 20:57:02 09/14/02 Sat

That's an interesting point, but after much soul searching, it's still Janeway, I'm consistently drawn to...so...? *g*

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- Julie, 16:53:24 09/15/02 Sun

so?

so... there goes another one of my theories.

Oh well.

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[> [> Re: Let the fun begin! ("Adrift" spoilers) -- Jane, 07:30:23 09/15/02 Sun

This is such a completely different story from "Timeless Passages" that it could almost have been written by a different author. I loved TP because it instantly put right so much that was wrong with Endgame - wrong even by the standards of the series itself, because how likely was it that the serious breach of the temporal prime deirective would go unchallenged? I also liked the way that the older Seven in that story had matured and lost her innocence(perhaps in a similar way to the Seven in "Adrift", though it's less explicit).

However, "Adrift" is an interesting and compelling story and a real treat to read. Just good to see Gina returning to one-shots, even if briefly.

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[> A good start -- andrewsfan, 17:06:18 09/08/02 Sun


I have musette worshipping me. (goddess indeed!) I have Arlene thinking she is imagining things. Nom has declared she will read "Adrift" (hey, everyone heard you) and I expect your comments and insights to keep musette occupied. *sigh* Otherwise, she turns into the most incorrigible flirt!

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[> [> Re: A good start -- andrewsfan, 10:43:24 09/12/02 Thu


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