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Subject: Re: Just saying


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 11:49:54 06/07/17 Wed
In reply to: holtsledge 's message, "Just saying" on 11:38:16 06/07/17 Wed

Actually not close to being the first and won't be the last. Usually there are reasons - financial, family or special circumstances. The Ivies in fact are making a concerted effort to increase the number of community college transfer admits but there have always been some and a few have been athletes. Even Harvard did it - remember Cem Dinc.

Nick Robinson was recruited by Penn out of hs. He decided to walk on at Georgia. When he made his decision to transfer out, it was after the Ivy League transfer date. So he spent the year at Saddlebrook. Unfortunately in doing so he used up a year of eligibility. So he only has 3 left. But he did get a year of experience on the field and quite honestly - some of those SoCal Community College teams could hold their own in the Ivies.

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[> [> [> [> Subject: meant outa


Author:
holtsledge
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Date Posted: 14:05:23 06/07/17 Wed

Saddlebrook, would love to hear CC guys names that made it into Ivies

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: meant outa


Author:
IvyFBDad
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Date Posted: 14:33:47 06/07/17 Wed

Not specific to football CC but provides some insight into CC transfers in general.

https://www.quora.com/Which-Ivy-League-universities-accept-the-most-community-college-transfers

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: meant outa


Author:
Sprint66
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Date Posted: 22:57:02 06/07/17 Wed

Cornell hasn't had a starting CC transfer in football for at least 10 years. We had a WR who came to Cornell for the Animal Science program as he wanted to become a vet, and he was All-Ivy, but that is the last one I can remember. All of Cornell is Ivy League! Cornell is a land grant university and not a state school. What that means is the property was gifted to Cornell by the state of NY. Our state supported schools like the College of Veterinary Medicine were founded to help support live stock in the NYS region. The College of Agriculture is primarily a plant and animal science program and it's very tough. We produce some of the best genetic engineers in the world. Next time you enjoy a glass of wine think of Cornell as the United States has become a top producer due to their work.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: meant outa


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 09:03:54 06/08/17 Thu

This link is from 2012 and shows the number of transfer students accepted at our schools each year. Obviously schools like Cornell, Columbia and Penn are far more likely to have more CC transfers than schools that accept far fewer transfers.

http://transferweb.com/stats/transfer-acceptance-rates/#.WTlBEusrLIU


Cornell runs a very successful wrestling program that greyshirts some of it's top recruits at Finger Lakes Community College before Cornell enrollment. The Finger Lakes wrestling club, which they all participate in, actually practices at Cornell's very high quality wrestling facility. It is so systematic and pervasive that it almost amounts to running a farm team. Other schools, likely all 8, park recruits in prep school for a year. There is nothing illegal or immoral about either of these practices. The key determinative is whether or not the student athlete ultimately qualifies under admission standards that control each schools athletic recruiting process.

Penn has been much more active in trying to attract community college students across the board as part of a broader attempt to diversify the student population. Many of them are a little older and had deferred college for financial, family or other immediate concerns.

Penn does occasionally end up with a athlete on a varsity team who transferred in from a community college. The most well known is Matt Maloney who left Vanderbilt mid year freshman year and parked himself at a CC in Philly prior to coming to Penn. In football we had a QB a couple years back named Olsen who came from a CC. He actually ended up helping us grind our way to an Ivy title that year stepping in for the often injured Billy Ragone during a very critical part of the year. I'm sure there are a couple others among the nearly 900 student athletes at Penn.

I posted these highlights of Robinson because they actually reveal a newbie that has an accurate arm and very good feet. Highlight films can be deceptive, but - they can also be revealing. Whether he turns out to be Penn's best option in the fall is yet to be seen and I certainly have no insight on that matter. But - I do have concern about replacing Alek and I felt a little better about our ability to fill some of the hole he left behind by watching those videos.

As for Saddlebrook, all I know is that they do play at a fairly high level, although their players are likely younger than the typical starter on an Ivy team. I also know that the community college system in California plays a far important role in the public sector of their higher educational system. So - all things being equal - I view it a net positive that at least one of our newbie QB candidates had this experience last year and, if I had some video of him playing there, I would have posted it.

I am aware that a couple years ago the Ivy Presidents voted to allow an extension of the transfer application dates for athletes. This is because our mandated dates are not in sync with normal transfer cycles and the requirement that athletes get releases before approaching
prospective new schools. I'm not sure what that new date is, but it's not the same date imposed on non athlete transfer candidates.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: I'm sure the guy is decent


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 09:19:40 06/08/17 Thu


But playing Dartmouth early should not be viewed as a positive for Penn this season.

Assuming good health and good grades, we should have one the best secondaries and defensive lines in the league in 2017. That will not be an ideal situation for a QB starting his first league game.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: meant outa


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 09:33:53 06/08/17 Thu

Better Dartmouth than Princeton or Harvard :)

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: meant outa


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 10:18:58 06/08/17 Thu

Actually Olson stepped in for the injured Keiffer Garton - not Ragone. My memory is slipping. He came to Penn from another Calif CC named Fullerton.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: meant outa


Author:
YAGreen
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Date Posted: 18:55:19 06/07/17 Wed

Dartmouth takes some CC transfers, especially vets. You may recall the 31 year old football walk-on at Dartmouth a few years ago - he was a CC transfer and a vet. But I don't know of any recruited athletes at Dartmouth who have suited up at CCs.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Vet


Author:
holtsledge
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Date Posted: 10:11:16 06/08/17 Thu

I was at the game when he got a carry late and rumbled for 50 yds and the crowd loved it. Unfortunately it was called back for a penalty, when he got back to the bench he was mobbed by his teammates

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Vet


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 10:16:29 06/08/17 Thu


I'm sure whoever committed that penalty felt like crap afterwards.

:)

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: A JC transfer to an Ivy seems unusual


Author:
al's wingman
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Date Posted: 16:18:18 06/08/17 Thu

I don't have any idea of Ivy admissions decision making process but in my decades of following Ivy football I don't recall many transfers into a program, JC or not. My guess is transfers into a football program are a case by case process. Also guessing Penn really wanted Mr. Robinson in the program and recruited him with diligence since he surely had other opportunities, perhaps even athletic scholarship.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: A JC transfer to an Ivy seems unusual


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 19:00:55 06/08/17 Thu

Football transfers aren't that rare. We have had a bunch over the past years including some who were high impact. Others didn't get on the field. I think Yale and Columbia have been more active in this area recently, although this year Penn has two in the incoming class.

As for CC transfers, they are much rarer. I can think of a couple Penn has had but they are not the norm. I saw Columbia has one in their bb recruiting class this year

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: A JC transfer to an Ivy seems unusual


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 19:29:33 06/08/17 Thu


The league could probably create a good all-star team of football transfers in the past generation--including Bushnell winners.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Not at penn


Author:
holtsledge
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Date Posted: 21:44:45 06/08/17 Thu

Come on Asia you guys (meaning Penn) have had more impact transfers then any other program other than Yale in the last 20 yrs. As you just stated 2 in this years class. I still think you lead by pretty wide margin. Princeton the least, D has had a few transfers unfortunately very few impact. We will see if Fitzgerald is different. Long live the "Little Sicilian" who started the trend. I don't care if Robinson was initially recruited by Penn seems a bit sleazy he goes GA Dawgs then Saddlebrook CC then Penn that is a wide careening path that IMHO stinks

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Dartmouth transfers off the top of my head...


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 21:58:09 06/08/17 Thu


Impact: Greg Smith (Alex Park would have made this list if Dalyn Williams hadn't come along).

Not bad: Robbie Anthony

Bust: Jerry Singleton, Julian Flamer

TBA: Jimmy Fitzgerald

I'm sure I'm forgetting others. Holtsie- can you help out?

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: How could I forget?


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 22:06:24 06/08/17 Thu


Pete Oberle. Would have been an impact player if he hadn't suffered an ACL injury before the surgery really got good.

At worst, he was a "not bad."

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Not at penn


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 08:09:39 06/09/17 Fri

Holtsledge - not quite sure I understand your comment. I said clearly that Penn was active in the transfer market (although not very in the last 10 years) and that we had a few transfers that were impact transfers whom I'm sure Dartmouth would have grabbed in a second. The guys that come to mind in this century are Gavin Hoffmann, Sam Mathews and Cory Gedin (all pre 2007) and there also was a RB from Duke whose name escapes me, but he contributed back in that same period.

Since then I can think of only a couple - one being Olson the QB from a California JC and a kid from LaSalle which dropped its program, plus a QB from Colorado who is currently on the roster. The LaSalle kid wasn't an impact player but did play some on special teams. Other than that we haven't been major players in the transfer market in terms of football players.

Transfers actually need to get a written release and approach you. You don't actively recruit them. It helps to have tried to recruit them out of hs or to have a relationship with their hs coach. This year we have two coming in and they both look like they could contribute. One is the QB referenced in this thread and the other a kid who was at UConn who was a 3*** coming out of hs in New Jersey. But - nothing is for sure. We'll see how both do over the course of their careers. Hopefully they'll both contribute.

Lastly - I think your crack about the JC situation is a little unlike you. Robinson was recruited by Penn out of hs. We have 4 players from JSerra in SoCal on our squad which indicates a strong relationship with the respective staffs. When Robinson got his release from Georgia he was past the Ivy transfer deadline. So he spent a year at Saddlebrook. Had the deadline not past he would have been at Penn last year. It actually wasn't a bad thing for Penn and Robinson because Torgersen would have taken all the snaps in any case. But - he did consume a year of eligibilty at Saddlebrook.

Penn is the 2nd largest Ivy and we run a significant junior year abroad program that creates capacity to accommodate transfers. We take 200-250 each year and best guess is around 20 are athletes that are spread across various varsity teams.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Not at penn


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 09:09:55 06/09/17 Fri


Matt Rader should be on that list as well. Very good QB for Penn.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: I wish this board had an "edit" feature


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 09:13:07 06/09/17 Fri


Matt Rader was the Duke guy.

*THESE* guys should be on the list.

http://www.pennathletics.com/news/football_adds_two_transfers_2016_06_27

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: I wish this board had an "edit" feature


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 09:52:05 06/09/17 Fri

Yes - forgot Moskal whom I would categorize as an impact guy. Reader was not in this century but was also an impact transfer in the 90's. The Duke guy I was referring to was a RB. I think his last name started with a V

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: I wish this board had an "edit" feature


Author:
jeff2
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Date Posted: 11:50:55 06/09/17 Fri

there was a lineman from grand valley state who was pretty good.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: I wish this board had an "edit" feature


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 13:33:22 06/09/17 Fri

You'd have to track that one down. i think it was back in the 90's but I kind of remember it happening. We also had a good DL come when Boston U folded their program in the 90's - Germano I think. We used to take 3 or 4 a year back then. A few were big contributors.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: I wish this board had an "edit" feature


Author:
WarriorII
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Date Posted: 13:51:13 06/09/17 Fri

Michael Pierce from Grandvalley state was outstanding. Second-team all Ivy. Great student too.. Class of 2005

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: was just getting cranky


Author:
holtsledge
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Date Posted: 14:14:04 06/09/17 Fri

remember I am dyspeptic

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: was just getting cranky


Author:
Diogenes (Holtsledge)
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Date Posted: 08:30:40 06/10/17 Sat

Humorous, fair, balanced, unbalanced, kind, loyal and dyspeptic. A nice combo. Keep on keeping on. Cheers.

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