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Subject: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
Diogenes
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Date Posted: 12:39:59 01/07/18 Sun

Watched the game at Harvard yesterday.

Impressions:

1) Harvard is good but not great. If yesterday's players were a fair representation of what they've got, Harvard will make the Tournament but I'd be surprised if they won the League during the regular season;

2) Harvard well outplayed Dartmouth, but played intermittently and substantially below its abilities;

3) Dartmouth could not get the ball to the rim nor keep Harvard from doing so;

4) One of Dartmouth's ballyhooed freshmen stunk up the gym whilst giving the appearance of not caring. McLaughlin sat him for the rest of the game. Good for McLaughlin. Hopefully the message was received;

5) Dartmouth needs to use a different offensive scheme or find some players who can run the existing scheme effectively. Right now, the personnel are not up to the tasks being set for them;

6) Dartmouth's defensive switching and blocking out were spotty at best. If they can't play man to man, go to a zone;

7) Everybody has a bad day, or game, from time to time. Dartmouth's point guard was completely shut down by Harvard. Hopefully it was an aberration. Painful to watch and can't continue if Dartmouth is to have any success this year.

Conclusions:

A) Harvard is good but needs substantial development. If they develop, they might win the whole thing;

B) Dartmouth has 4 promising freshmen. One, although talented, was quite properly benched; another could have been very helpful but did not dress for the game (perhaps hurt?); another played for most of the game and is definitely a solid performer; another is a very good athlete who hustles but needs to learn the game better. All in all, a good freshman class which holds promise for the future;

C) Dartmouth still doesn't have its act together but, notwithstanding the loss of Boudreaux, it's getting there.

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Replies:
[> Subject: note ....


Author:
Observer
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Date Posted: 19:38:03 01/07/18 Sun

Harvard was basically missing Aiken, their best player.

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[> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
Green Enthusiast
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Date Posted: 22:58:29 01/07/18 Sun

I also watched the game and agree with your observations. In my view Harvard is over rated. While they have talent I have not seen much improvement in last years top recruits. I would expect more even without Aiken. On the Dartmouth side, we just aren’t very good. Kudos to the team for fighting back but you capture our deficiencies very well. Miles Wright played well and inspired but he is very inconsistent. Why doesn’t that Miles show up every game. The front court was abysmal both offensively and defensively. The real question is what exactly is our offense. It’s hard to tell what if any plays we are running. The concern is that Barry is a spot up shooter and needs to have screens set to feee him. He is very accurate when that happens but doesn’t create well. He excelled in non conference but the last two games teams guarded him closely and shut him down. The rest of the Ivies will do the same. Why aren’t we making any adjustments. Our offense doesn’t match our talent and the coaches need to do something differently. My other concern is defense is even worse. I thought that was a focus for this year but it’s hard to see that and our rebounding is abysmal How can it be that our bigs average under 5 a game. I guess I was spoiled with Boudreaux pulling in 10 by himself. I’m hoping McLaugjlin can make some adjustments to both offense and defense to better use our skills and hide our defensive deficiencies. He hasn’t shown that aptitude yet however. In terms of our ballyhooed freshman he looked intimidated and had a bad game. He’s young and needs more experience but he has the raw skills and is one of our best athletes. It would be a shame to lose him too as I’m hearing he is unhappy as are a few of the others on the team. There’s a real lack of leadership apparently and not great bond with McLaughlin for some of the younger guys my source tells me. Not sure if that is just venting given their record.

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[> [> Subject: We'll know more in two days when Vermont comes to Hanover


Author:
Diogenes (Green Enthusiast)
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Date Posted: 19:12:16 01/08/18 Mon

Vermont has a very good team this year, barely losing to Kentucky.

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[> [> [> Subject: Re: We'll know more in two days when Vermont comes to Hanover


Author:
Ivy Patriot
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Date Posted: 09:32:31 01/09/18 Tue

Except their top scorer/top rebounder will miss the game and perhaps the rest of the season. http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/story/sports/college/vermont/2017/12/30/uvms-lamb-out-indefinitely-foot-fracture/992576001/

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Sucks, but...


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 09:35:39 01/09/18 Tue


I don't think Dartmouth is going to be sympathetic to UVM's plight.

:)

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[> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
John Harvard
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Date Posted: 09:49:32 01/09/18 Tue

I see Dartmouth as having a chance to turn the tables on Harvard in the rematch - especially because Harvard's Aiken did not look close to being able to contribute. In this game, Harvard outshot Dartmouth on 3's, an anomaly this year.

I do agree though, that Dartmouth is sorely missing a scorer around the basket (Boudreax) and a lightning quick - pass first PG who can hound the oppenent (like Malik Gil). With those two guys, Dartmouth probably would have won.

As for Harvard, basketball starts with ball movement. Harvard is literally without a PG at this point (starter and backup are injured). Towns, Lewis and Bassey played their roles, and they are the reason Dartmouth only scored 51 points. Those 3 Harvard sophomores are a little lost without a PG, but they still won the game for Harvard. There are missing pieces that will limit the Crimson all year though - you are not incorrect.

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[> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
Diogenes (John Harvard)
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Date Posted: 15:04:07 01/09/18 Tue

Harvard has a sophomore guard by the name of Juzang. He did a superb job of locking down Dartmouth’s point guard. It will be interesting to see how he performs against the rest of the League. Excellent defensive guards like Juzang are hard to find and are particularly important during tournament play.

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[> [> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 15:54:20 01/09/18 Tue

He had 5 turnovers in that game and is carrying an 82 ORAT which is pretty dismal. He's the back up for Aiken.

I watched a bit of it after the Princeton/Penn women's game started running away from Penn. Both teams looked like they will struggle without major improvement from the level of play displayed on Saturday. But - it's only January. Anything is possible.

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
Diogenes (AsiaSunset)
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Date Posted: 16:43:15 01/09/18 Tue

Asia,

Wasn't familiar with the term "ORAT" so looked it up (offensive rating). Good to know. Thanks. There is also a "DRAT" (defensive rating) which rates Juzang at 102.5 (whatever that means). Juzang did not play much last year but is getting much more time this year.

In the process of looking things up on the Internet, I also came across a post to the effect that Juzang's younger brother attends Harvard-Westlake in L.A. and has just been offered a basketball scholarship by Oregon. Harvard-Westlake is a fine school which sends athletes to Ivy schools. I wonder if Amaker (or any other Ivies) are also on the Juzang recruiting trail??

Best wishes for 2018. Hope you and your family are doing well.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 17:31:54 01/09/18 Tue

Mike James does a lot of quality statistical analysis for Ivy League basketball.

What you want is a high ORAT and low DRAts. But both Mike and the stat experts all agree that DRAT numbers are less reliable and more a function of team play rather than individual performance; that is, one’s DRAT is more a function of how others on the court are performing while ORAT is a more reliable indicator of a particular individual’s contribution.

I do not know anything about his brother but both Harvard and Princeton have highly rated point guards in next year’s incoming class.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
AsiaSunset
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Date Posted: 18:13:50 01/09/18 Tue

Looked up his brother. He's a 6'6" shooting guard who is very highly ranked and has a number of Power 5 offers. don't think we'll see him in our league.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
Diogenes (AsiaSunset)
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Date Posted: 19:43:50 01/09/18 Tue

And therein lies the problem with Ivy football and basketball. Ivy hockey and lacrosse teams can recruit excellent players because they regularly compete against the best teams and players. Football never competes against the best and basketball only occasionally.

Ivy football and basketball, absent unusual circumstances, can’t recruit against Duke, Stanford, Northwestern, Cal, Georgia Tech, Vanderbilt, UCLA, Michigan, Wisconsin, Notre Dame etc.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Dartmouth-Harvard Men's B-Ball


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 08:22:17 01/11/18 Thu


"Harvard-Westlake is a fine school which sends athletes to Ivy schools."

Yep.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Mark Harmon fun fact


Author:
Diogenes
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Date Posted: 11:14:14 01/11/18 Thu

Mark Harmon, son of Old 99, played six man football at what was then known as "The Harvard School". He went to UCLA and became its starting qb.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Mark Harmon fun fact


Author:
An Observer
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Date Posted: 11:35:11 01/11/18 Thu

More Mark Harmon fun facts: He first attended and graduated from a local junior college before transferring to UCLA.

One of his two older sisters married Ricky Nelson, son of Ozzie and Harriet, and the other (Kelly), one of the most beautiful women ever, was briefly married to John DeLorean. Harmon himself has been married for a long time to Pam Dawber, better known as Mindy from "Mork & Mindy." That's a lot of celebrity marriages for one family.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Mark Harmon fun fact


Author:
Diogenes
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Date Posted: 11:55:48 01/11/18 Thu

My recollection is that Harmon went to a j.c. in order to learn 11 man football. He was an excellent player for UCLA.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Mark Harmon fun fact


Author:
An Observer
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Date Posted: 12:06:55 01/11/18 Thu

That makes sense. Quarterback is the one position which does not translate cleanly from six-man to eleven-man football. ESPN has been running a recurring feature story on six-man football in Texas. There, the first player to receive the ball from the center is not allowed to run with it past the line of scrimmage, because the field is so wide open.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Mark Harmon fun fact


Author:
BigRed23
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Date Posted: 12:40:22 01/11/18 Thu

I had the pleasure of working out with Mark Harmon at Harvard Westlake in LA the summer between my Junior and Senior year at Cornell. Very nice guy I remember him telling me that he got loaner cars from John DeLorean, who was the head of Chevrolet operations for GM, each month. I always hoped his dad would show up but it didn't happen.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Story I heard was


Author:
Go Green
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Date Posted: 12:49:23 01/11/18 Thu


Story I heard about Harmon was that he did not play his senior year at Harvard School because when he matriculated, he repeated whatever grade he had just finished at his previous school. Thus, his junior year was his fourth year of high school ball.

Hence, no college offers. Hence, the JC route.

And the rest is history....

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Story I heard was


Author:
Diogenes (Go Green)
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Date Posted: 13:53:13 01/11/18 Thu

Thanks, didn't know that. From what I read on the Internet, Harmon was offered a scholarship to Oklahoma, but chose UCLA instead. One thing's for sure, he wasn't just a spoiled Bel-Air kid.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Mark Harmon fun fact


Author:
Calvin
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Date Posted: 14:04:26 01/11/18 Thu

I suppose some people would consider this woman to be beautiful.

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/actress-kelly-harmon-poses-for-a-portrait-in-1985-in-los-news-photo/464963690#actress-kelly-harmon-poses-for-a-portrait-in-1985-in-los-angeles-picture-id464963690

http://c7.alamy.com/comp/BP6Y3M/kelly-harmon-bay-city-blues-1983-BP6Y3M.jpg

http://www.kellyharmondesigns.com/about

I, on the other hand, .... Oh hell, is she available?

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Mark Harmon (sort of) fun fact


Author:
Calvin
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Date Posted: 14:21:13 01/11/18 Thu