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Subject: Coaching Question


Author:
IvyFootballFan
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Date Posted: 19:32:43 06/07/18 Thu

Question for the board and this is entirely subjective but feel I have some knowledge on the subject. How would you rank the current Ivy football coaches overall in terms of leading the program, a role model for young men, wins/losses, recruiter, tactician, fundraiser, respect among peers, and how they manage considering the resources at hand. I actually believe the head coaches are as solid as they have ever been in the league, so a tough call. But here is ones man’s opinion:

1. Teevens
2. Bagnoli
3. Surace
4. Murphy
5. Estes
6. Priore
7. Reno
8. Archer

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Replies:
[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
holtsledge
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Date Posted: 21:07:32 06/07/18 Thu

although I love the silver tongued devil (Teevens). I have corresponded with Surace a few times and he doesn't know me from Adam yet he immediately answered. I have given a fair amount to the D program and nothing to PTon yet Surace is always available. I get the handwritten note from Teevens after giving but Bob Surace took the time to answer an e mail while he was on recruiting trip in the Detroit airport. The guy is number 1 in my book, impressive

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[> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
sparman
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Date Posted: 21:23:02 06/07/18 Thu

So write him a check.....

Thanks for your support.

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[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
OldLyme
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Date Posted: 22:37:11 06/07/18 Thu

1) Bagnoli
2) Murphy
3) Teevens
4) Surace
5) Priore
6) Estes
7) Archer
8) Reno

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[> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Son of Eli
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Date Posted: 23:23:33 06/07/18 Thu

Reno is 4-2 against Bagnoli, 4-2 against Archer, and 4-2 against Estes. He's is 3-3 against Surace. He is 21-21 against the Ivy League and he has one unshared Ivy Championship title. I could see him being ranked anywhere from 4-7. It is nonsensical to rate him last behind Archer.

This is not an easy ranking to make because the Ivy League has excellent head coaches for 7 of their 8 teams. Here is my ranking:

1) Bagnoli
2) Murphy
3) Teevens
4) Surace
5) Reno
6) Priore
7) Estes
8) Archer.

The reason I'm rating Priore behind Reno is because his success has come with Bagnoli's recruits. 1 and 2 are solid and unlikely to the change no matter what happens this year. 3-7 could end up scrambled after this season as they're all close. That's part of what makes Ivy Foorball so compelling.

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[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Old LIon (Bum Phillips)
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Date Posted: 08:14:51 06/08/18 Fri

The immortal Bum Phillips once said of the great Don Shula,"he can take his'n and beat your'n, and take your'n and beat his'n". I have always thought that this is a pretty good measuring stick. So take any one of these programs and figure out who could step into another school and improve the results. Based upon the miracle of 218th street, which might have been the greatest coaching turnaround in Ivy history, it is tough to match any other coach against Al Bagnoli. So after Al, I would probably go with Teevens, followed by Murphy and then Reno. As far as the rest, I would go with Surace, Priore, Estes and Archer.

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[> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Calvin
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Date Posted: 08:37:18 06/08/18 Fri

Actually, Bum first said that about Bear Bryant. https://www.houstonchronicle.com/sports/columnists/harvey/article/Legendary-coach-Phillips-didn-t-let-football-4908937.php

But no matter.

IMO, while the concept is interesting, I don't agree it means much in our lttle pool where recruiting plays such a large role it can overshadow true coaching in controlling outcomes. For example, I don't believe Bagnoli could have taken old Columbia teams and defeated old Murphy teams; likewise we have heard (interminably) how Teevens was unduly hamstrung by admissions restrictions.

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[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Michael Valmas (Perplexed)
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Date Posted: 10:09:12 06/08/18 Fri

Would love to see what any of the above pecking orders look like six months from now; or how they may have appeared in December, 2014, following Coach Bagnoli's last stand in Philadelphia.

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[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Grin and Bear it (Being fair)
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Date Posted: 15:08:48 06/08/18 Fri

I have been a loud critic of coach Estes in recent years but his low rating on this blog is not justified by his full body of work. Winning at Brown is a lot more difficult than winning at H or Y, a lot harder. Over 20 years Estes has won more than 57%. Certainly a modest number for some schools, but not for Brown. In recent years the record has suffered, and I tend to think that has to do with the improved league as well as Estes being no longer ahead of the curve.

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[> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Dr. V
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Date Posted: 15:42:38 06/08/18 Fri

Your point is well taken.

More generally, that's the problem with the artificiality of trying to "grade" 8 coaches from 1 to 8. The reality is probably a lot closer to there being clusters of ooaches in, e.g., "second" or "third" place.

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[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Unknown
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Date Posted: 15:57:38 06/08/18 Fri

I would argue that coaches 1-7 (#8 being Archer) are so close in ability that it boils down to the talent of the players each season. It's amazing that 7 of 8 coaches have won Ivy League titles.

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[> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Buck
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Date Posted: 15:57:19 06/12/18 Tue

Agree that 1-7 is extremely close but I do think Archer is making progress. Let's see how Cornell does the next 2 seasons. In terms of the coaching aspects you outlined:

Leading the program: Murphy
Role Model for Young Men: Teevens, Surace
Wins/Losses: Murphy, Bagnoli, Teevens more recently
Recruiter: Reno
Tactician: Bagnoli
Fundraiser: Surace
Respect Among Peers: Toss Up
How they Manage Considering Resources at Hand: Estes

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[> [> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Big Green watcher
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Date Posted: 00:32:45 06/14/18 Thu

This is a very thoughtful rundown of the coaches. Couldn't agree more from what I've seen last 6 years.

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[> [> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Memphis Bill
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Date Posted: 10:00:11 06/14/18 Thu

Very interesting, and I agree that all Ivy coaches have their virtues, with Archer in kind of a special category due to lack of institutional support and other negative factors that are not of his making. If there is any fair way to rank the eight guys, I would like to put a thumb on the scale for Tony Reno, in that most posters do not realize just how bad the situation was in New Haven when he took over. Someone once said that, after the first 25 years of Ivy play, it would strike anyone as strange that two schools as different as Yale and Dartmouth were able to dominate the conference in its last gasp of D-1 glory. Since that time, Dartmouth may have had its problems, but Yale's decline was precipitous. Going from winning the League almost on an every other year basis to once a decade is truly astonishing, and could only have been produced by out and out hostility to the program at the highest levels (think Giamatti and Levin). Tony picked up all the disparate pieces, and has brought a proud program back, all the way. He deserves a lot of credit. By saying this, I realize I am putting Al Bagnoli on a pedestal, because he performed an even greater miracle!

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
remember it well (to Memphis)
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Date Posted: 11:04:02 06/14/18 Thu

Agree with the dramatic decline and the reasons behind it. Also agree that it appears under Reno there is reason for optimism that Yale football may be on the way back to it's winning tradition.

In retrospect, (and I have said this before) given the lack of support for the program displayed by the senior admins, credit should be given to Jack Siedlecki who in three years turned a 1-9 season to a 9-1 record and a Ivy co-championship. He led Yale to another co-championship in 2006.

Reno has shown he knows how to beat Harvard which is what Jack didn't do often enough, despite a 70-49 record before he was pushed out. Who knows if Jack could have done even better with stronger admin support.

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
CU_88
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Date Posted: 15:49:55 06/14/18 Thu

I wonder how much institutional issues have lead to the decline of Brown in the last few years.

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[> Subject: Re: Coaching Question


Author:
Sprint66
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Date Posted: 19:57:04 06/13/18 Wed

I think it's hard to rate David Archer as despite being the head coach at Cornell the past five years, he's still a young coach and is learning. Like I said last year we have a very good DC in Jared Backus, but we should have hired a seasoned OC that could mentor Archer. I think our defense this year will be very good again, but we just don't have the talent to run a Clemson style offense. I am hopeful the coaches will adjust the offense for the upcoming season, but I didn't see any changes during the spring game.

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