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Subject: Re: Brown at Columbia


Author:
CU_**
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Date Posted: 07:40:52 11/15/21 Mon
In reply to: Old Lion 's message, "Re: Brown at Columbia" on 07:03:35 11/15/21 Mon

The only game in which we got crushed this year was vs Harvard. I remember years in which we only were competitive in 1 or 2 games. I still think the Yale game is the one in which the team would look at with regret . BTW Yale does have a powerful offense but am not sure what happened to it against Princeton.

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Replies:
[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Brown at Columbia


Author:
Old Lion (Yale game)
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Date Posted: 09:53:39 11/15/21 Mon

The Yale game was marked by two developments—during half time Yale modified its blocking scheme (we were crushing them in the first half at the line of scrimmage and sacked their very good QB 3 times) and we failed to response to the modifications; and we were victimized by a mistake by the refs in the third quarter when we were in Yale territory and driving for a score—on first down we gained 8 yards, on second down a pass for a first down was first declared complete and then reversed. But the refs spotted the ball to make it 3rd and 8 instead of third and two. Al pointed this out but the refs refused to correct the mistake. So instead of third and 2 it was third and 8 and we failed to convert.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Brown at Columbia


Author:
Old Lion (Yale game)
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Date Posted: 10:00:01 11/15/21 Mon

One more point-the reversal of fortunes in the Yale game, which was winnable, IMHO led to the letdown in the first half of the Harvard game. To be sure, Harvard was again IMHO easily the most talented team we faced all year, but I think that the carryover from the Yale game caused us to come out flat. Al noted that it was the only time all year when we did not come out with our usual enthusiasm and effort.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Don't want to doubt you (you're the consummate CU advocate), but...


Author:
Valmas (Skeptical)
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Date Posted: 18:26:00 11/15/21 Mon

...this is the first I've heard of this "improper" spotting of the ball, and sixteen whole days after the Yale game was played- surprised you didn't jump at the opportunity to present this information, sooner.

However, the officials are always marking the ball with the down box as a frame of reference after a no catch down; and for argument's sake, let's say it's second down and two yards to go for Columbia at their 30 yard line- meaning the down box operator is positioned at the 30 yard line with the box, right in front of the Columbia team area. So, a third down catch / no catch situation would be followed by hesitation on moving the down and distance equipment, till an on field determination is made as to the result of the play. If anything, the box operator may prematurely move forward, to the yard line of the potential catch; but there's no rhyme or reason to the box person casually taking a six yard stroll, in a backward direction. The chain operators did not move their sticks (according to your report); so, if the box person moved toward the back yard stick person, he/she would be told: "hey, you belong closer to the front stick!". Furthermore, the chain crew is an unpaid group, brought in by game management and operating at the behest of the officials on the field. The lineman is always there to direct every movement that box person makes; and that linesman at Yale was working in from of the Columbia sideline and with Al Bagnoli in his/her ear all game long. There's also a written record of down and distance for every play of the game; and that's generally maintained in the vicinity of the down box- again, right under the watchful eye of Al Bagnoli.

I'm sorry to seem objectionable, but your accounting of this event lacks credibility. Too many protocols to get through in order for what you described to have happened as such. And now you're reporting it, sixteen days after they played the game.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Don't want to doubt you (you're the consummate CU advocate), but...


Author:
observer
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Date Posted: 19:58:07 11/15/21 Mon

It happened. Watch the tape. Ask the coach. The league officials have botched many procedural items this year. All of them have been horrible, the striped shirts, the replay booth officials, and the clock officials. Equally awful.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: It's sixteen days after they played, AND....


Author:
Valmas (Still skeptical)
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Date Posted: 20:55:39 11/15/21 Mon

Can't imagine you guys were out trick or treating and couldn't find the time to express your outrage then. You're making a very broad statement, while offering little supporting evidence.
People just can't be taken seriously when they write in about "a million bad calls" in a league that plays four games per weekend / seven weeks per year

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: It's sixteen days after they played, AND....


Author:
Roar Lions
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Date Posted: 22:08:28 11/15/21 Mon

It happened exactly as described, Valmas. The entire crew brain farted and took away an 8 yard play. Al wrote about it in his game recap that is sent to donors. It’s not why we lost to Yale but it gets to the poor quality of officials in our league. And if you require more examples, watch the last 2 minutes of the Brown game and the officials’ problems with the clock. The league needs better training and some accountability.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: I hear the Roar and apologize to all concerned.


Author:
Valmas (Somewhat satisfied)
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Date Posted: 23:16:39 11/15/21 Mon

Still believe these are isolated cases being cited, not indicative of a systemic problem. The case some of you are trying to make would be more palpable if you'd stay away from the hyperbole about one million bad calls. Human beings will forever be making some mistakes; whether they're coaching; playing or administering the game. Brady / Belichek / Kraft / Goodell / NFL Officials (Supposedly the best; most highly compensated; and most thoroughly trained) ALL screw up at times in matters both large and small. The imperfections make the game even more appealing; and the memories of games past more
enduring, still.

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: It's sixteen days after they played, AND....


Author:
Lurker
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Date Posted: 22:18:03 11/15/21 Mon

Espn announcers even mentioned it on air. Crazy thing was the down marker was still in place at correct place, official refused to even consider why it was there

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Y v. P


Author:
Bengal
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Date Posted: 10:00:01 11/15/21 Mon

Answer: It ran into the P defense.

Also, Grooms had a rookie's day. He is very good and I think will be an excellent, dangerous Ivy QB going forward -- maybe as early as Saturday. But he threw 2 passes from over the line of scrimmage and 3 picks. I am not looking forward to playing him the next 2 years. He makes plays with his legs and his arm, and evaded tackles even more times than we committed false starts.

We also need to clean up our special teams' act. Cheers.

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[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Y v. P


Author:
Tiger81
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Date Posted: 12:04:08 11/15/21 Mon

And don't forget Harvard: 234 yards, 3.1/play, 12 (!) TFLs

All of the above highlights the disappointing performance against Dartmouth (350 yards, 4.4/play, 3 TFLs).

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Y v. P


Author:
Cam
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Date Posted: 12:18:42 11/15/21 Mon

If H beats Y would they be justified in saying they are co-champions with P and D?

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[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Y v. P


Author:
Tiger69
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Date Posted: 13:09:18 11/15/21 Mon

I recall that after a couple of early jumps to conclusion it was established that the film review had the authority to overrule the field ref.

So, we accept John Harvard’s apology.😎

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Y v. P


Author:
joiseyfan
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Date Posted: 17:38:24 11/15/21 Mon

Harvard’s 12 TFL were primarily Murphy’s fault — he continued trying to sweep long after the Tigers were zeroed in. Both offensive game plans were mediocre.

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[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Brown at Columbia


Author:
joiseyfan
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Date Posted: 10:45:30 11/15/21 Mon

What happened to Yale at Princeton was exactly what happened to Columbia at Princeton:

Lions 202 total yards, 3 yards/play, 9 tackles for loss.

Ei 220 total yards, 3.5 yards per play, 5 tackles for loss.

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