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Forum -- Voice, Thu, Dec 03 2009, 0:19:23 [1]
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Carl Herman Climategate: summary, comprehensive explanation of unethical science, and Jon Stewart's take:

Sir Christopher Monckton of the Science and Public Policy Institute has written the most comprehensive understanding I’ve found of the “Climategate” scandal, Climategate: Caught green-handed. I wrote a condensed version, here. The even further condensed version:

Global temperature averages peaked in 1997, and have been on a slight overall decline through 2009. Among the six global warming gases, carbon dioxide (CO2) is the most important. CO2 readings have increased beyond 1997 through to the present. The global warming argument is that CO2 increases causes increased global temperatures. The scandal is that scientists at the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit (CRU), the main data point for the global warming argument, had thousands of internal e-mails leaked that revealed the following unethical and possibly criminal behavior:

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Forum -- Voice, Thu, Dec 03 2009, 0:17:23 [1]
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On his TV show, Glenn Beck is getting to be a little boring, although I will admit that he did talk a little about the "Global Warming" hoax, tonight. However, it is my opinion that this issue is one of the most serious things facing America and the world. Therefore, I would have liked to see him spend much more time on it ... including some really revealing discussion of the emails that have been published online.

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Forum -- Voice, Thu, Dec 03 2009, 0:08:09 [1]
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NRA Bloomington, Indiana Herald-Times Treats Law-Abiding Gun Owners like Registered Sex Offenders!:

On November 30, 2009, the Bloomington Herald-Times made the following announcement:

“This week, HeraldTimesOnline.com will launch its new gun permit database. You’ll be able to search gun permit records by county, city or town and street."

The Herald-Times has begun receiving calls and emails, and their response is a defiant defense of their online gun permit database.

Anyone who visits the newspaper website will be able to search the number of permits on a given street or neighborhood. Although at this point the names and house numbers are not listed, the newspaper’s website treats law-abiding Indiana gun owners like sex offenders on a searchable database.

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anyway........... -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:31:15 [1]
bedtime for this BONZO. later gators

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Geno............... -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:30:01 [1]
since he let you down........ keep this around for the next time your buddy AL shows up.
http://md.tgpsitecentral.com/pod/2009-11-10.jpg

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did I tell you my Dan Burton story??? -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:21:30 [1]
think I did, nevermind.

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If Men wrote advice columns -- a Pirate, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:19:56 [1]
Dear John,
I hope you can help me, yesterday morning I drove to work while my husband stayed home watching TV. My car stalled about a mile from home and I had to walk back. I was shocked when I got there to find my husband in our bed with neighbors daughter! I'm 32 and he' 34 and the girl is 19, we've been married for 10 years and when I confronted him, he broke down and admitted they'd been having an affair for 6 months. He refuses to go to counseling and I'm a nervous wreck PLEASE HELP!!
sincerely Deb
Dear Deb,
A car stalling after being driven just a short distance can be caused by a variety of faults with the engine. Start by checking if the fuel line is clear, if it is clear check the vacuum lines and also for any loose wires, if this checks out and it still won't start, it's probably a fuel pump failure or so weak that not enough fuel is being pumped to the injectors,
Hope that helps , John

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I have it on reliable sources -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:16:51 [1]
The GENE did like the Bush/Kennedy "No child left without getting it in the behind" Bill

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BTW ProtaB -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:11:26 [1]
do you turn around and look if you hear someone say EDUCATED IDIOT ????

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no shit............ -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:07:47 [1]
Bush gave you Obama. Fools like Hannity and Rush backed that liberal piece of shit while the media got away with calling him a conservative. I watched for 30 years as the repubs crawled to the top of the heap in '94 only to have Bush throw them over the cliff. The Connecticut born, east coast faux texan should have gone home in tar a feathers. May he rot in hell with the other phony, unprincipled, fuk

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there's a reason the squint eyed Matthews -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:03:34 [1]
called Obama's cadet audience "the enemy camp." Obama's (friendly) camp is that of the truly ignorant.

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RSQUARED -- a Pirate, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 23:01:25 [1]
You're one of the few guys I know that don't like Bush :-)

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:58:10 [1]
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Las Vegas sun Congress races to restore benefits subsidy for laid-off workers:

WASHINGTON -- This week, the subsidy to help pay health benefits for those who are laid off begins to phase out, leaving Congress scrambling to renew the aid.

For Nevada families, who pay $1,038 a month, on average, to continue to receive employer-sponsored health care benefits after being laid off, the saving is substantial, according to a report from Families USA, an advocacy organization that supports extending the subsidy.

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well good luck to Glen Beck -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:56:49 [1]
democrats have it easy......... they just head to the slums and round up all the ignorant unwashed masses to the polls with a few thousand free bus rides.

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for the Glenn Beck admirers..... -- Achilles, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:53:21 [1]
...there was this item in the Sunday edition of the NY Times:
"Glenn Beck, the popular host on cable news and talk radio, said he would sponsor voter registration drives and seven 'conventions' around the country to organize his right-wing fans into a political movement.

Mr. Beck, who is promoting a new book and has promised another one in August, said his efforts were meant to help his fans 'sharpen their teeth' in politics, but that he would not endorse candidates for office. 'America, we cannot wait for a leader anymore,' Mr. beck told his audience on Monday. 'The people must lead and the leader will follow.'"

It appears that Glenn hasn't read much history of the past 20th century and the history of last 9 years too. Demagogues of both left and right have always invoked the peoples' will as their reason for instituting repression of dissidents, non-conformists and oppositionists. Currently, the most glaring example is Hugo Chavez.

In the USSR, the soviets were the governing councils---local, intermediate and national---elected by and representing the people, thus constituting a pyramidal governmental structure, with the village and town soviets as its base and the Supreme Soviet as its apex. The "people" were theoretically the real "leaders." Evidently Stalin and all subsequent party leaders never got the word---until Gorbachev.

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I don't think it's a win win.............. -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:53:09 [1]
I wonder how much money they paid Bush to give Vincente blow jobs (and american taxpayer's hard earned cash) OR maybe Bush just liked it

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Heh heh heh -- a Pirate, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:50:19 [1]
I just figured out how to get rid of demoncRATs

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letter and attempt to brainwash those who read it -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:45:49 [1]
and it would appear that it's washed all the logic right out of his brain. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, reminds me of the children's story about the Jewish, er Catholic, er Dutch mother who kept her kids so clean she washed their faces off.

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muted one.......... but, but, but, -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:27:23 [1]
Dr. Laura was Catholic and converted to what?

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 22:19:11 [1]
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Many times I have expressed the question I have of why many so-called Jews convert to Roman Catholicism. An example of such a conversion would be Robert Novack. It has been a long time since I read the pamplet I linked below called "Facts Are Facts," but on just now reviewing that writing I find that it does answer my question.

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WoooOOOoooT -- dribble, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:58:32 [1]
Climate train is on time, next stop, Copenhagen.

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waf -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:24:31 [1]
RE: "As a true believer"
Voice doesn't qualify as a true believer.

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Jack the Pirate -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:20:32 [1]
RE: "My bumpersticker says simply. ABORT HEALTHCARE!"
I love it. Thank you. I would like to see that idea spread.

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The perfect couple -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:19:45 [1]

Perfect Couple

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waf -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:15:29 [1]
RE: "and I have to admit that I am perplexed why it would matter if Jesus was a Jew,"
It matters because God created the people known as Hebrews or Jews during the time of Abraham to go into all the World and spread the "good news" of the coming into the world of His Messiah. The Hebrews failed to do so but the Messiah was born in human flesh to a virgin named Mary. She was a Hebrew. Her firstborn son was a Hebrew by virtue of being born to a Hebrew mother. Jesus lives today in the resurrected body of that young Hebrew man, Jesus. Because He was resurrected we believers can know that one day we will also be resurrected.

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Voice -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:09:25 [1]

The letter in that link you posted sound like pure propaganda and spin, I read about 1/4 - 1/3 of it and could stand no more. Soft soaping drivel is what it sounds like, stroking himself and the one he is writing to, trying to build up to what should have taken a paragraph to say....... No wonder the guy doesn't want to meet with him..... I would kick him out the door in short order for talking like a socialist(Al Gore comes to mind)....... and out he would stay. I would say that letter is a direct attempt to brain wash those who read it.....

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Voice -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:06:02 [1]
Just so you know the idea behind the EU is to eliminate the sovereignty of all of the once indendent nations of Europe. Get ready for it. The disease will be spreading to this hemisphere before you know it.

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Gerryb -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 21:01:23 [1]

I wonder what Ken is looking up now that the Judean question is settled...... and I have to admit that I am perplexed why it would matter if Jesus was a Jew, a Judean, or from some other tribal origin anywhere else in the world..... I think Jesus was a Soul Man......

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Gerryb -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:58:56 [1]

The only bright spot on CNN was Lou Dobbs, Beck was OK also...... CNN doesn't seem able to hold on to those that like more than a minute bit of truth expressed during their show

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waf -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:55:03 [1]
RE: " It is now the RNN RED Non-News Network"
CNN has never been a news network. It has always been the voice of the leftists/socislists in this country.

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Jack the Pirate -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:50:25 [1]

"ABORT HEALTHCARE!"
That is one type of abortion I will not oppose, as long as it means gov't healthcare.....

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Voice -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:47:47 [1]

"The title, that Pilate wrote, which was put on the cross, and which was written in Latin, stated "Iesus Nazarenus rex Iudaeorum" (John 19:19, Latin Vulgate). This translates into English as "Jesus the Nazarene King of the Judeans"."
Now we really know.....

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Voice -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:46:51 [1]
RE: "Benjamin H Freedman"
Benjamin H. Freedman - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Benjamin Harrison [1] Freedman, (1890 – May 1984) [2] was a convert from Judaism to Roman Catholicism, [3] known for his antisemitic views and writings."

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""King of the Judeans."" -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:45:00 [1]

Here you go....... A Judean is a Jew There, now we know..... and what does it matter if Jesus was a Jew, an Egyptian, or a sub-Saharan African? It doesn't matter........ why would it?

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""King of the Judeans."" -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:42:46 [1]

Damned if I can figure out who the Judeans were or are..... could the Judeans be the Jews???????????? What is the translation for Judean.....? I will Google it.

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Waf -- Jack the Pirate, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:39:34 [1]

Dare I say it? Has no one else copywrited the phrase yet?

My bumpersticker says simply. ABORT HEALTHCARE!

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Voice -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:39:09 [1]
RE: "'Jesus was a Jew.'"
That statement is certainly wrong. Jesus is a Jew who lives today in Heaven where He serves as our advocate with the Heavenly Father. BTW He is a descendant of King David. That makes Him as Jewish as anyone could be.

Last edited by author: Wednesday, December 02, 20:49:21 Edited 2 times.

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Poh leetle Gene/Bill -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:38:39 [1]

Finally, you sober up enough to type and still you type nonsense......... What's it feel like to fall flat on your face again and again and again??????????
Tired of being attacked and made a fool of Gene? Stop attacking all that is decent and good, start attacking the fascist socialist Democrats...... attack those actually doing harm to our society......... attack t he criminals, illegal aliens, foreign workers, Congress, try upholding our Constitution for a CHANGE.......

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Waf -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:38:12 [1]
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I believe that if you read the article "Facts Are Facts" it will state that the sign on the Cross read "King of the Judeans."

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Voice -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:33:29 [1]

" Jesus was NOT a Jew "
Does that surprise you? Jesus was reported "King of the Jews" by Romans.
As a true believer, you should know that Jesus was the Son of God, and He still is, he was a man while on earth, a man unlike any other before Him or since. Perhaps Ghandi came closest to emulating Jesus........ Al Gore doesn't..... obama doesn't....... Gene doesn't...... Achilles doesn't........ most of us don't........ and no Democrat/socialist/fascist/communist can even/ever approach that state of being, they are too greedy........

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:25:12 [1]
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Benjamin H. Freedman The Truth about Khazars (Facts are Facts):

My dear Dr. Goldstein, you are a theologian of high rank and a historian of note. Of necessity you also should agree with other outstanding authorities on the subject of whether "Jesus was a Jew." These leading authorities agree today that there is no foundation in fact for the implications, inferences and the innuendoes resulting from the incorrect belief that "Jesus was a Jew". Incontestable historic facts and an abundance of other proofs establish beyond the possibility

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:23:53 [1]

R²: "The obnoxious fckup is Al Gore"
Yeah Gene, it was dumb fuk Algore's video, not mine....... I didn't see you sticking around to help get rid of the bastard's video....... but, that is typical of a leftist, hide when the work is here to be done..... lay on the beach while others starve........ go fishing while people are dying because of socialism....... yeah, you rock Gene.......

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:19:06 [1]
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Henry Makow (Jewish) Jesus was NOT a Jew --Benjamin Freedman:

The utterance by the Christian clergy which confuses Christians the most is the constantly repeated utterance that "Jesus was a Jew." ... That misrepresentation and distortion of an incontestable historic fact is uttered by the Christian clergy upon the slightest pretext....

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How to ride a bike like a capitalist -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:17:57 [1]

How to ride a bike like a capitalist, taking risks, learning from failure, succeeding despite the obstacles This guy gets better and better as the video goes. It starts on its own, so won't embed.

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Gene, poor little fatman Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:03:51 [1]

Is that the best you can do Gene? You can't even spell network! Let alone set one up.

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PETITION -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 20:02:34 [1]

Stop Socialist State run health care

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From Live Scince---Quick row the other way, now it is global cooling -- Kevin L. Martin, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 19:42:15 [1]
In the film, "The Day After Tomorrow," the world gets gripped in ice within the span of just a few weeks. Now research now suggests an eerily similar event might indeed have occurred in the past.
Looking ahead to the future, there is no reason why such a freeze shouldn't happen again - and in ironic fashion it could be precipitated if ongoing changes in climate force the Greenland ice sheet to suddenly melt, scientists say.
Starting roughly 12,800 years ago, the Northern Hemisphere was gripped by a chill that lasted some 1,300 years. Known by scientists as the Younger Dryas and nicknamed the "Big Freeze," geological evidence suggests it was brought on when a vast pulse of fresh water - a greater volume than all of North America's Great Lakes combined - poured into the Atlantic and Arctic Oceans.
This abrupt influx, caused when the glacial Lake Agassiz in North America burst its banks, diluted the circulation of warmer water in the North Atlantic, bringing this "conveyer belt" to a halt. Without this warming influence, evidence shows that temperatures across the Northern Hemisphere plummeted.
No time to react
Previous evidence from Greenland ice samples had suggested this abrupt shift in climate happened over the span of a decade or so. Now researchers say it surprisingly may have taken place over the course of a few months, or a year or two at most.
"That the climate system can turn on and off that quickly is extremely important," said earth system scientist Henry Mullins at Syracuse University, who did not take part in this research. "Once the tipping point is reached, there would be essentially no opportunity for humans to react."

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Achilles -- Kevin L. Martin, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 19:27:30 [1]
Your lawn jockey is not sending the number of troops requested by his hand-picked general McCrystal.

Remember you were foaming at the mouth about Rumsfield and Bush not going with the inept General Shinseki numbers need for Iraq, yet you seem willing to give your lawn jockey and Robert Gates, a free pass on them not listing to their hand picked General.

So tell the forum, hypocrite what is your problem?

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Dimwit Fascist Bob -- Roadking, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 18:35:51 [1]
FASCIST: Should the admitting physician or RN refuse to treat him? He is merely evidencing some of the symptoms of epidemic typhus.

RK: The wetback in question should be immediately quarranteend and given basic care until he either recovers or dies. If he dies, burn the body and dispose of the ashes. If he lives, deport him. In the meantime, treat all citizens exposed by the cretin to the pathogen.

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slight correction -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 18:25:15 [1]
The obnoxious fckup is Al Gore

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Waffiecakes, the netwerk guru -- Gene, ahahhaahaaahaa™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 18:21:38 [1]
Had a hell of a day, a great day, played cards, set up a network(small today), fixed a computer system
Good news, Algore is gone...... it took more than a few pretty pictures and mean comments, but the lying SOB left the premises. ahem..... silence is now golden.
Short answer, forum members FINALLY posted enough to scroll your obnoxious fukup to the archives. You really weren’t paid to “set up” that netwerk, were you??

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 18:19:00 [1]
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Robert Fisk This strategy has been tried before – without success:

"They shoot Russians," the young paratrooper told me. It was cold. We had come across his unit, the Soviet 105th Airborne Division, near Charikar, north of Kabul, and he was holding out a bandaged hand. Blood seeped through, staining the sleeve of his battledress. He was just a teenager with fair hair and blue eyes. Beside us a Soviet transport lorry, its rear section blown to pieces by a mine – yes, an "improvised explosive device", though we didn't call it that yet – lay upended in a ditch. In pain, the young man raised his hand to the mountain-tops where a Soviet helicopter was circling. Could I ever have imagined that Messers Bush and Blair would have landed us in the same sepulchre of armies almost three decades later? Or that a young black American president would do exactly what the Russians did all those years ago?

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Oh Boy! Just when I thought it couldn't get any better...... along comes Johnny -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 18:06:02 [1]

OH Boy, here it comes.....

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CNN -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 18:02:51 [1]

What happened to CNN? I haven't watched since Dobbs QUIT the leftist bastards. All that can possibly remain are lies...................... and smarmy squarks like Rick Sanchez, Don Lemmon, etc......... Anderson Cooper..... etc.... It is now the RNN RED Non-News Network

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A Pirate -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:57:43 [1]

Good news, Algore is gone...... it took more than a few pretty pictures and mean comments, but the lying SOB left the premises. ahem..... silence is now golden.

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Last article -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:55:31 [1]

Read the comments..... the one on Global Norming especially.

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And I am thus some how responsible for those scientists "fudging" the data? -- a Pirate, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:54:44 [1]
Nope , it's a man thing, you'll never be responsible.

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Oh Boy, this one is a dandy...... -- Thee Humble Waffle™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:50:37 [1]

Dandy Climate Gate Fraud article Oh Boy, the shit hits the fan........ splatters..... Australia doesn't buy the carbon credits scam...... more.....

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US Military Deserters -- Gus, Wed, Nov 25 2009, 7:47:55 [1], Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:49:33 [1]

I'll give you safe haven. There's no need for you to keep suffering abuses. There's no dishonor deserting this shit-hole of a country.

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Why is obama ignoring climategate? -- Thee Humble Waffle™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:47:34 [1]

Another good article that points out specific fraud confirmed in the emails. scandal-fraud-obama-UN-Democrats=socialists=fascists=communists=All guilty of FRAUD Now I have to find more damning articles......

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He is merely evidencing some of the symptoms of epidemic typhus. Dimwit. -- Gus, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:46:02 [1]
What a curious statement. Do typhus symptoms change depending on whether its an isolated case, or part of a larger epidemic? You're absolutely senile BobJ.

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He is merely evidencing some of the symptoms of epidemic typhus. Dimwit. -- a Pirate, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 17:35:36 [1]
Wouldn't those same evidences be evident in his own country? HCPFPM, your "wife" has some experience in the medical field, how about you take in the wetback?( Soon our healthcare will be every bit the healthcare of Messyco,where will they go then?)

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Oh Boy !!! -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:52:14 [1]
thanks, good one from UK news.........

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" that a "wetback" enters an ER and is complaining of high fever, chills, a severe headache, malaise and has brownish skin areas. Should the admitting physician or RN refuse to treat him?" -- Gus, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:49:10 [1]
He should tell him that brown skin is normal for a wetback, and to take 2 aspirin and call him in the morning.

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Bob -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:47:37 [1]

Great plane photos.

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Achilles -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:44:13 [1]

" that a "wetback" enters an ER and is complaining of high fever, chills, a severe headache, malaise and has brownish skin areas. Should the admitting physician or RN refuse to treat him?"
Face it Bob, you are the perpetual guvy, you moron. The damned illegal alien should not be in this country in the first blush. If one shows with that malady, arrest him, bag him, and immediately deport the criminal to mexico. If the bastard returns, execute him. What the hell is wrong with your head Bob?
Cap and Trade Tax Bob...... explain how it is going to help this nation's poor? Or this nation?
Climate change FRAUD Bob, explain why any of their so called scientific data should be trusted? Its all a scam to tax people Bob. What the hell is wrong with your head Bob?
Your head apparently needs a good soaking.

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Roadking -- Achilles, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:34:48 [1]
Suppose, perpetual guvvy, that a "wetback" enters an ER and is complaining of high fever, chills, a severe headache, malaise and has brownish skin areas. Should the admitting physician or RN refuse to treat him? He is merely evidencing some of the symptoms of epidemic typhus.
Dimwit.

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this might be of interest -- Achilles, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:27:51 [1]
http://home.comcast.net/~bzee1a/Edwards09/Edwards09.html

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Re: a fascist tidbit from today's government controlled San Jose Mercury News....... -- Roadking, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:27:42 [1]
FASCIST: The Plavix was $248 each (he pays $8 at home) and his Crestor ($3 at home) was $65. The medications were part of his $58,000, 1-day hospital stay."

RK: I believe that you can probably thank the millions of wetbacks (among others) who come to that hospital's emergency room for non-emergency treatment, and who get admitted to that hospital then leave without paying a dime. Hey, the hospital is a "for profit" establishment, and has to make up the loses somehow!!!

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Climate Fraud -- OH Boy, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:26:21 [1]

Climate change fraud has Europeans up in anger They aren't buying the explanations for the fraud. Prison looks like the best bet for the so called scientists involved, along with the politicians who urged them to create the phony climate scam to grab power and money.

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:23:22 [1]
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Mail Germany still paying off £50million in reparations following World War One - more than 90 years on
Germany is still paying off £50 million in 'reparations' demanded from it after the end of World War One over 90 years ago.
The German Finance Agency, the country’s authority on debt management, said tens of millions of euros are still being transferred to private individuals holding debenture bonds as agreed under the treaty of Versailles signed on June 28 1919.
Those bonds were issued at the time to investors hoping to make money out of Germany’s financial quagmire. ...
With the signing of the Versailles accord Germany accepted blame for the war which cost nine million men their lives.
Article 231 of the peace treaty the so-called 'war guilt' clause - declared Germany and Austria-Hungary responsible for all 'loss and damage' suffered by the Allies during the war and provided the basis for reparations.
The treaty was despised by Germans and seized upon by the Nazis to foster a feeling of victimhood among their followers. ...
The principal representative of the British Treasury at the Paris Peace Conference, John Maynard Keynes, resigned in June 1919 in protest at the scale of the demands, warning correctly that it was stoking the fires for another war in the future.

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 16:14:25 [1]
.
Daily Express LISBON TREATY: EU TAKES CHARGE OF BRITAIN:
FAT cat Eurocrats celebrated a “shameful” new era of Brussels domination last night with a lavish ceremony and fireworks – all at the hard-pressed taxpayers’ expense.
New EU President Herman van Rompuy and Brussels chiefs toasted victory as the Lisbon Treaty, which moves vast swathes of power from Westminster, became law across the EU at midnight on Monday. ...
But in Britain, angry anti-EU critics declared that it signalled the end of our independence after the latest massive surrender of sovereignty to Brussels.
Campaigners have pledged to fight on against the emergence of a Brussels superstate.
UK Independence Party Euro MP Nigel Farage said: “This day should go down in history as National Loss of Independence Day. We now live in a new legal order. We are just a province of a new legal entity called Europe.”
UKIP yesterday launched a national campaign for a referendum on whether Britain should quit the EU. Tory MP Douglas Carswell said: “Britain has ceased to be a sovereign country. Shamefully, the freedoms our forefathers fought for have been given away by the politicians at Westminster. We need a referendum now.”

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Voice -- Glenn, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 15:58:48 [1]

Hey Buddy, watch it and find out. See who I go after today. Enjoy the show, you will unless you are a socialist. I promise, I am not going to clown around tonight, I mean business.

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 15:53:37 [1]
.
Did anyone watch Glenn Beck, today? If so, was it worth me staying up late for?

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waf -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 15:40:30 [1]
You can put a suit on an ape but you still can't make him human. This should really upset the believers in macro evolution.

Last edited by author: Wednesday, December 02, 20:59:28 Edited 1 time.

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Connie -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 15:37:43 [1]
RE: "The Jewish Holocaust is no hoax"
I see that Voice didn't bother to stick around after I told him the same thing. He, Gene and Achilles are the same sort of animal.

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The president and those democrats should lead by example -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:28:18 [1]
and join the troops they are sending into that hellhole.
Carreteras, Afganistan

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If socialists miss Al -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:25:37 [1]

You can find him at the top of archive 1...... waiting for you......

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Gore has left the forum...... -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:22:52 [1]

Guess it took some monkey business to get rid of the greedy fool.....

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Achilles = Kenny "Boy" Lay -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:21:19 [1]

Enron Sought Global Warming Regulation, Not Free Markets
By Paul J. Georgia, Created 02/03/2002, Georgia Op-Ed in The Roanoke Times
It’s not surprising to most people that Enron delivered truckloads of money to politicians in an attempt to influence the political process. What may surprise many, however, is that Enron believed that one of its main opportunities to make money by gaming the political system was global warming.
Enron became one of the biggest corporate boosters of the Kyoto global warming treaty, which would require huge reductions in energy use by consumers and industry. According to an internal Enron memo, quoted by The Washington Post, the Kyoto treaty would “do more to promote Enron’s business than almost any other regulatory initiative outside of restructuring the energy and natural gas industries in Europe and the United States.”
In addition to all its political lobbying and contributions, Enron became a founding member of the Pew Center on Global Climate Change’s Business Environmental Leadership Council, a leading industry front group pushing the Kyoto agenda. Enron chairman Ken Lay also served on the board of the Heinz Center for Science, Economics, and the Environment, along with Fred Krupp of Environmental Defense, and former Alcoa CEO and current Treasury Secretary Paul O’Neill.
Even after President Bush decided to withdraw the U.S. from the Kyoto treaty, Enron continued to push for a domestic regulatory scheme known as cap-and-trade, whereby the government would set a cap on the total amount of carbon dioxide emissions allowed in the U.S.
It would then distribute permits or allowances to companies affected by the cap giving them the right to emit a certain amount of carbon dioxide. Those allowances could then be traded in the open market.
Enron executives believed that a cap-and-trade program would put them in a position to dominate the U.S. energy market. Electric utilities, required to reduce emissions of carbon dioxide, would be forced to switch from coal to natural gas as the only practical alternative to electricity production. As a leading trader of natural gas, Enron would be the recipient of a huge financial windfall.
Moreover, Enron is already a major trader of carbon dioxide emissions throughout the world, making it similarly positioned to take a fee with each and every ton of carbon dioxide traded within the United States.
The potential redistribution of wealth involves more than just energy companies. As noted by Ross McKitrick, an economist at The University of Guelph in Canada, “If emissions are controlled by tradable quotas, this creates a new, artificial scarcity in something that hitherto had been free: the right to release carbon dioxide.”
He also explains that the value of this newly created asset “represents the capitalized value to existing users of fossil fuels of the right to emit carbon dioxide at no charge. This value is already counted into balance sheets, investment portfolios, collateral for loans, etc., all through the economy.”
Putting a price on carbon dioxide emissions, says McKitrick, “extracts that money from its current use and hands it over to the beneficiaries of the policy.”
One of the main selling points of a cap-and-trade system is that it is allegedly less costly than other policy options, because trading allows reductions to take place where it is least expensive. But when uncertainty, which is pervasive throughout the economy, is taken into account, costs have been shown to be significantly higher.
When government caps emissions, there is really no way to forecast future permit prices. Mistakes in forecasting lead to large social costs. The emissions trading program to reduce sulfur dioxide has been plagued by wildly fluctuating prices, making it difficult for businesses to plan long term, thereby creating large costs that trickle down to the consumer.
A study by Resources for the Future found that given uncertainty about costs and benefits, emissions trading is about five times costlier than a carbon tax. Moreover, revenue collected from a carbon tax could be used to at least partially offset the higher energy costs. This isn’t the case with emissions trading.
If Enron’s lobbying efforts had succeeded, the United States would have ended up with a costly regulatory scheme designed to redistribute wealth from the American people to politically powerful companies like Enron.
So why would elected officials pursue such wrongheaded policies? Because cap-and-trade is a complex regulatory scheme that hides the true costs of compliance from taxpayers. Politicians can regulate energy use through the hidden tax of cap-and-trade to avoid accountability, creating the perfect cover for vultures like Enron to swoop in and capture the rewards.
Enron is gone, but the threat of energy rationing lingers on. Other companies are waiting in the wings to fill the political void. For example, on the day that the Pew Center on Global Climate change took Enron off its business council list, 29 major corporations were still listed. If these companies are successful, the cost in terms of money and jobs would dwarf anything seen since the reckless energy policies of the 1970s. (Source)
-----------
Isn't High Priest Albert Gorebbels one of the big carbon traders?
Weren’t you a big proponent of Kyoto, Dr. Stadler?
How much would you have raked in if Kyoto had passed, mon amie?
Ken Lay = Al Gorebbels = schemers.
=

Poopsie?

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Well they're shaking in their boots -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:18:24 [1]
KABUL (Reuters) – Thirty thousand more U.S. troops for Afghanistan? Esmatullah only shrugged.
"Even if they bring the whole of America, they won't be able to stabilize Afghanistan," said the young construction worker out on a Kabul street corner on Wednesday morning. "Only Afghans understand our traditions, geography and way of life."
U.S. President Barack Obama's announcement of a massive new escalation of the eight-year-old war seemed to have impressed nobody in the Afghan capital, where few watched the speech on TV before dawn and fewer seemed to think new troops would help.
Obama said his goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat" al Qaeda in Afghanistan and "reverse the Taliban's momentum."
The extra U.S. forces, and at least 5,000 expected from other NATO allies, would join 110,000 Western troops already in the country in an effort to reverse gains made by the Islamist militants, at their strongest since being ousted in 2001.
Shopkeeper Ahmad Fawad, 25, said it would not help.
"The troops will be stationed in populated areas where the Taliban will somehow infiltrate and then may attack the troops," he said. "Instead of pouring in more soldiers, they need to focus on equipping and raising Afghan forces, which is cheap and easy."
For many, the prospect of more troops meant one thing: more civilian deaths.
"More troops will mean more targets for the Taliban and the troops are bound to fight, and fighting certainly will cause civilian casualties," Ahmad Shah Ahmadzai, a former Afghan prime minister, told Reuters.
"The civilian casualties will be further a blow to the U.S. image and cause more indignation among Afghans."

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Here's hoping -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:18:09 [1]

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Achtung!!! -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:16:39 [1]
Another one of those will do the trick.........

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the other side of the fence -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:15:38 [1]

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Waffie -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:14:57 [1]
Has Birdbrain ever demanded an investigation into all the leaks the New York Times has posted?

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Not far to go....... bye bye Al -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:13:22 [1]

The socialists aren't helping scroll their troll into 'yesterday'......... a couple long winded socialist posts would do the trick.....

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Waffie -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:12:20 [1]
The woman is a complete idiot yet she keeps getting re-elected (she's in a safe district for her) but she may meet her waterloo next election. Another woman will be running against her and she's wealthy and tough. From my lips to God's ear....grin
BTW someone should tell Birdbrain that she has no jurisdiction over British subjects. That ended a couple of hundred years ago.

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Robert R Jordan aka Achilles aka Democratus aka Protogoras aka etcetera -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:11:10 [1]

Not that there is any thing wrong with aliases, the do in a pinch.......
What are you planning to do now that the entire socialist movement has been confirmed fraudulent? You can't ignore it, it won't go away unless socialist sociopaths go away......... Only Europe awaits you now, and since you extoll the virtues of European socialism........... maybe a vacation is in order again...... a refresher course..... a reminder........ or maybe you will find a far different climate over there now.........

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The Jewish Holocaust is no hoax -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:08:31 [1]
And anyone who says it is better show proof. I have known a couple of survivors of it and they still have the number tattooed on their arm and also the father of the pastor of the Foursquare Church here is a survivor. Don't try to tell them it was all a hoax. Also ask the U.S. servicemen that entered those camps what they found and what those survivors told them. Also visit the Holocaust Museum and refute what you see there. It's easy to claim something is a hoax when you haven't been a victim of it or known anyone who was. I say shame on anyone who has the audacity to claim it was a hoax.

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About 10 more posts -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:05:19 [1]

And the Algore lies will be gone......... they would be gone now if Bob had stayed around to regale us with his feat of satellites and electronic wizardry........

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Connie -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 13:01:06 [1]

Amazing, the socialists think they can ignore and distract this MAJOR FRAUD away........ this cannot be allowed to fade away........
She wants to make it a crime to disclose a crime..... which is criminal in an of itself....... There is also some question whether the emails and data were hacked or LEAKED...... Boxer's head has long had a leak....... a runny brown viscous fluid runs from that crack..... most would call it diarrhea, that which runs from her mouth.....

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From the Telegraph U.K. -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:59:27 [1]
Climategate: the final nail in the coffin of 'Anthropogenic Global Warming'?

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"with the highest schooling degree on this site" -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:54:41 [1]

Search returned nothing..... unless this Bob O chilles is an MD, a book writer, or something totally unrelated to what this Bob O Matic refutes to be his claim to glorious fame socialistic........ No, this Bob O Bobber just doesn't fit any search results....... No siree Bob......

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Voice -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:50:45 [1]
RE: "it has been over 65 years and the Jewish-holocaust hoax is still strong. Why is that?"
Because it is the truth.

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"with the highest schooling degree on this site" -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:48:54 [1]

Bob's education isn't worth the paper its printed on..... if he actually has any education at all....... he hasn't impressed with brilliance... other than himself...... I haven't found any papers by Robert R Jordan yet....... to be fair and balanced, I'll try another search....... I think the results will be the same though.....

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Birdbrain Speaks -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:48:47 [1]
Boxer: Hacked 'Climategate' emails may face criminal probe By Michael O'Brien - 12/02/09 03:26 PM ET
Leaked emails allegedly undermining climate change science should be treated as a criminal matter, Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.) said Wednesday.
Boxer, the top Democrat on the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee, said that the recently-released emails, showing scientists allegedly overstating the case for climate change, should be treated as a criminal matter.
"You call it 'Climategate,' I call it 'E-mail-theft-gate,'" she said during a committee meeting on Wednesday. "Whatever it is, the main issue is are we facing global warming or are we not. I'm looking at these emails, that, even though they were stolen, are now out in the public."
The emails, from scientists at the University of East Anglia, were obtained through email hacking. The messages showed the director of the university's Climate Research Unit discussing ways to strengthen the unit's case for global warming. Climate change skeptics have seized on the e-mails, arguing that they demonstrate manipulation in environmental science.
Boxer said her committee may hold hearings into the matter, as its top Republican, Sen. Jim Inhofe (R-Okla.), has asked, but that a criminal probe would be part of any such hearings.
"We may well have a hearing on this, we may not. We may have a briefing for senators, we may not," Boxer said. "Part of our looking at this will be looking at a criminal activity which could have well been coordinated."
"This is a crime," Boxer said.

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Artica and Antartica -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:46:03 [1]

In my opinion, the loss of ice is the direct result of scientist screwing around at the north and south polar regions...... drilling holes, breaking ice, adding their carbon footprint to the regions of ice, attracting solar heat to the caps, running machinery and generators, ships and planes moving in and out of the regions......... We didn't have any problems with ice before they started making problems....... The more they screw around, the more problems they create............ now they have created a problem of FRAUD for MONEY........ They are not scientists at all, they are scam artists of the Gore stripe.... the worst possible type......

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Re -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:41:05 [1]
...thinning of Arctic Ocean ice is occurring, diminution of glaciers is occurring, earlier advent of Spring in the Northern hemisphere is occurring Bush's fault of course.

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:38:40 [1]

”(not Thomfart who has no sense of humor---or of irony)”
Actually, Dr. Stadler, I have both.
I find your quaint beliefs most amusing and I find it ironic that you, with the highest schooling degree on this site, are about the only one who fell for High Priest Albert Gorebbels’ little scam.
Don’t you, mon amie?

Poopsie?

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AchillesGore -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:35:19 [1]

"review the science associated with the green house effect, it's obvious that you've never taken the time and expended the effort to do so. No, you use the forum to, in effect, join the know-nothings like Senator Imhofe (Redneck, Oklahoma) to say that "No worries, mate," and we can keep pumping green house gasses into the atmosphere and there'll be no rise in sea levels (as is occurring), no thinning of Arctic Ocean ice (as is occurring), no diminution of glaciers (as is occurring and as we were told in 2000 in Norway) and no earlier advent of Spring in the Northern hemisphere (as is occurring by 2 weeks in Sister Sarah's state). Religious weirdos will no doubt claim these are harbingers of Armageddon and the 2nd Coming."
Melt all the ice Bobby, it won't have much effect except on city dwellers on the coast, and they can move inland..... as if the oceans would rise that much. Doubtful Bob, doubtful......
And Bob, of just what use is reviewing FRAUDULENT DATA ????????????? Explain that Bob........... All Global Warming research is now in QUESTION as to its validity and truthfulness...... isn't that so Bob? You damn cockroacha stompin' momma it is........... Screw Al Gore and your band of LIARS........
But if you leftist idiots really still believe in your "socialist global warming religion", fraudulent data won't bother you a bit......
YOU ASS!!!! How can you still support that BULL SHIT ????????????? What happened to your head that your thinking is so twisted and warped????

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:34:46 [1]

One more little tidbit, Dr. Stadler:
If you had any guts you would apologize to all of those you made fun of, castigated and said were ignorant now that the evidence that your religion is snake oil is mounting.
In other words, you, with all of the wondrous schooling you so often and boorishly bloviated about, were too ignorant to see facts and fell for what is one of the greatest hoaxes ever.
But you have no guts so you will run from this topic faster than a Frog from a cap gun.

Poopsie?

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forum (not Thomfart who has no sense of humor---or of irony) -- Achilles, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:32:27 [1]
Six retired Irishmen were playing poker in O'Leary's apartment when Paddy Murphy loses $500 on a single hand, clutches his chest, and drops dead at the table.
Showing respect for their fallen brother, the other five continue playing standing up. Michael O'Conner looks around and asks, 'Well, me boys, someone got's to tell Paddy's wife. Who will it be?' They draw straws. Paul
Gallagher picks the short one. They tell him to be discreet, be gentle, don't make a bad situation any worse.
'Discreet??? I'm the most discreet Irishmen you'll ever meet. Discretion is me middle name. Leave it to me.'
Gallagher goes over to Murphy's house and knocks on the door. Mrs. Murphy answers, and asks what he wants. Gallagher declares, 'Your husband just lost $500, and is afraid to come home.' 'Tell him to drop dead!', says Murphy's wife. 'I'll go tell him.' says Gallagher.

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:07:58 [1]

”And I am thus some how responsible for those scientists "fudging" the data?”
Of course not, Dr. Stadler.
You are responsible for continuing your belief in AGW when it seems more and more to be a hoax perpetrated for political gain.
Did you fail to listen when the scientific method was taught in your shop classes?

Poopsie?

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Achilles -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 12:01:36 [1]

re: thinning of Arctic Ocean ice is occurring, diminution of glaciers is occurring, earlier advent of Spring in the Northern hemisphere is occurring
Who says? The same scientists that falsified the climatological data?
By the way, there was snow in Dallas today. Early advent of spring?

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ThomFaart -- Achilles, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 11:13:00 [1]
And I am thus some how responsible for those scientists "fudging" the data? As for my recommendations that clowns like you who's an alleged holder of an engineering degree from the Naval Academy and thus deemed marginally competent to review the science associated with the green house effect, it's obvious that you've never taken the time and expended the effort to do so. No, you use the forum to, in effect, join the know-nothings like Senator Imhofe (Redneck, Oklahoma) to say that "No worries, mate," and we can keep pumping green house gasses into the atmosphere and there'll be no rise in sea levels (as is occurring), no thinning of Arctic Ocean ice (as is occurring), no diminution of glaciers (as is occurring and as we were told in 2000 in Norway) and no earlier advent of Spring in the Northern hemisphere (as is occurring by 2 weeks in Sister Sarah's state). Religious weirdos will no doubt claim these are harbingers of Armageddon and the 2nd Coming.

I don't recall you once decrying the fact that Bush's invasion of Iraq was based on lies. some of your like minded cretins here were pointing to Saddam's alleged 550 tons of yellow cake as "proof" that he was on his way to acquiring an A-bomb. Forget the fact that there was no uranium isotope separation capability at all. In fact, you've attempted to, in effect, blame Hillary and Kerry and every congressional Democrat for the war because they voted to give Junior his war authorization. You do know it's the president as C-in-C who makes the decision to attack----and in the case of Iraq, a militarily prostrate nation.

Long ago, being the history simpleton that you are, you blamed FDR for the deficiencies in the M4 medium tank. Your ignorance of the US in the 1930s is sad----an isolationist Congress that starved the Army for R&D funds, the Army's antiquated doctrine concerning the kind of armor (light tanks)and its use (purely as an exploitation force to attack command posts,logistics nodes and the like after a breach in the enemy's MLR was made by the infantry)and the Army's not-invented-here syndrome which rejected the Christie and torsion bar suspensions. The torsion bar suspension made its 1st appearance in the M-18 tank destroyer in 1943 (3 years after the T-34 was in the Red Army inventory), then in the M-24 Chaffee light tank in late 1944 and in the M-26 Pershing in early 1945. The Army opted for the vertical volute suspension, meaning any tank using it had a high silhouette.

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Waffie -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 11:09:34 [1]
Have you ever noticed the constant refrain of taxing the rich, making the rich pay for freebies to the undeserving blah, blah, blah but what I find disingenuous is those same people are the rich and there's no way they are going to raise taxes on themselves or pay for anything else (including the latest suggestion that they pay for the war in Afghanistan) yet the gullible, anti-corporate, anti-American drink that kool-aid hook, line and sinker....glug, glug, glug. Too bad they can't tax "stupid." That would wipe out the debt in nothing flat.

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Back to the dark ages via elitist liberals -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 11:07:43 [1]
December 02, 2009 The new ruling class By J.R. Dunn
So William Jefferson, the man with the fine cold brick of cash in his freezer, is off to jail. This is a step in the right direction, but only a step -- there are plenty of others in need of the same treatment: Christopher Dodd, Harry Reid, Charles Rangel, just to note the most well known. Dodd has interesting financial connections with a number of Connecticut finance companies. Reid has serious real estate problems, which perhaps connect with Da Boys back in Vegas. Rangel's activities are so complex as to baffle even experienced experts in financial crime, who have been forced to call in a mixed crew of Jesuits, Talmudic scholars, and quantum physicists to help sort it out. In a just world, all three would be headed for the same cell block as Jefferson. Yet they're not only free and walking around, they're wielding power on a national scale. It can be said with little exaggeration that they (along with their unindicted co-conspirator Barney Frank) were in large part responsible for the crash leading to our current economic predicament. Each of them is now diligently working to make it worse.
Amid the necessary focus on our Dear Leader, we often forget that the problem isn't simply Obama, or the Congress, or even the Democratic Party as a whole. The problem is liberalism -- what it is and what it may be in the process of becoming.
We seem to be edging into a new form of aristocracy, with the noble egalitarian liberals leading the way. A shadow aristocracy, lacking many of the hereditary and legal aspects of the European variety, but an aristocracy all the same: a limited-entry oligarchy with privileges denied the rest of the populace. If we look around at the third millennial world, it is hard to deny this as the default state of human society. Russia, China, Latin America, Central Africa -- a society that fails to adapt a civilized system of governing devolves to some form of aristocratic rule. Europe too appears to be going in that direction, with a privileged bureaucratic class holding unlimited power over the countries comprising the European Union. Will the United States be far behind?
This country was founded in opposition to that kind of rule. The 18th century British aristocracy was one of the most arrogant, selfish, and corrupt in the historical record. It was the epoch of the Hellfire Club, of Lord Sandwich and his twenty-four hour gambling binges, of rotten boroughs, and bought and paid for military commissions. Over the previous century the Enclosure Acts, by which the nobility seized public lands open to use by all and locked them up for their own private purposes, had broken the ancient bond between the yeomanry and the rulers. While the aristocracy created huge private estates dotted with country houses the size of palaces, tens of thousands starved as their agricultural livelihoods vanished behind the new fencing. Others made their way to the cities, to suffer chronic unemployment and give rise to a crime wave perhaps not equaled by that of the U.S. in the late 20th century. England, which dodged the worst aspects of feudalism, appeared to be deteriorating into an even fouler state. The flavor can be gained by a view of Peter Greenaway's film The Draughtman's Contract, which deals with an early 18th-century architectural draftsman hired by an aristocratic family for the purpose of covering up a murder.
In a real sense, our War of Independence was a direct revolt against this class, which was seeking to gouge the colonies much as they had Britain's rural population. All the same, many of the Founders, including John Adams and Fisher Ames, supported the establishment of an American aristocracy based to some extent on that of Britain, on the grounds that only by this means could social stability be maintained. But the American "yeomanry", that is, nine-tenths of the country, weren't having any. A 1992 study by Gordon S. Wood, The Radicalism of the American Revolution, convincingly demonstrates that the Revolution went much farther than anyone involved intended, with the new Americans, taking the rhetoric of freedom and equality quite seriously, forcing an unforeseen and unmatched social revolution during the last decades of the 18th century, in the process creating the country that we know today. (Wood's book is not as widely known as it should be, due in large part, I think, to its unfortunate title, which gives the impression that it's one of those 60s New Left deals with Washington as Mao, Jefferson as Trotsky, and the revolution remaining "incomplete" until the appearance of such brave figures as William Ayres. It isn't, and deserves more attention than it has yet received.)
Since the founding, numerous pseudo-aristocracies have come and gone in this country -- the Southern plantation owners, the robber barons, the WASP ascendancy, and so forth. While they may have played the role, none of them quite matched the European aristocracy, a closed system kept in place by legal sanction and main force. Have we, in the new millennium, progressed beyond such a possibility, or could such a system arise now?
What we're seeing today is a growing symbiosis between politicians and the upper levels of business, particularly the grotesquely overpaid CEOs of the financial sector. We have the not-uncommon situation of sitting politicians being purchased or rented, as may well have occurred with Dodd and Rangel. (What did the financial chieftains get in return? Recall that much of the bailout and stimulus money was aimed precisely at these figures, who have spent the past year handing it back and forth to each other, with scarcely a dime making its way into the general economy. This is why the markets are booming in tandem with rising unemployment and stagnant growth.)
But we're also seeing a new phenomenon: business figures with fortunes in the hundreds of millions (if not billions) moving into politics in a big way. Consider Jon Corzine, who made a king's ransom at Goldman Sachs (which reportedly pushed him out of the firm), before moving on to become governor of New Jersey. Consider George Soros, international financial buccaneer of dark antecedents who has set himself the apparent goal of completely transforming Western politics. Consider (a slight reversal, but still pertinent) Al Gore, well on his way to becoming the first Green billionaire, Gaia be praised.
Fortunately, these types have proven to be more hat than cattle. Corzine was even worse at governing than he was at working the financial markets, and is unlikely to pursue a political career further. Soros is another one whose reputation has outrun his achievements -- after all, his latest protégé is failing to live up to expectations. As for Al, while little doubt exists that he wouldn't mind spending a couple hundred million righting the injustice of the 2000 election, there's no reason to believe that any but the most liberal voters would flip the switch for a man who has become an international joke.
But suppose somebody with serious intelligence, dynamism, ruthlessness, and vast sums of money were to attempt the same type of maneuver? And suppose it wasn't limited to one individual, but several such figures jockeying for control of the country? We've already had a taste of what this might mean with the Kennedy family. Old Joe parleyed his bootlegger fortune into the creation of one of the most squalid and inglorious dynasties in American political history. (The Kennedys. An American Drama, by Peter Collier and David Horowitz, tells that story more than adequately) Imagine how much worse it would have been if the family had enjoyed access to even larger amounts of money.
The long run offers an even darker prospect. Within a few years, with advances in stem-cell treatments and synthetic biology, the wealthy may well be able to purchase extended lifespans. This is one of the greatest privileges imaginable, and one that may be gained by some of society's most unworthy individuals. Imagine an unaging Corzine or Soros, then picture a society run by such types: a political-financial aristocracy consisting of people well into their second centuries, capable of rewarding loyal followers with more years of life, who own the government, run their cities and regions as personal fiefdoms, and protect themselves with private armies of "bodyguards". In sum, a Philip K. Dick version of 18th-century Britain.
How do we prevent such an outcome? By utilizing every democratic tool that we possess. Tie them all -- politicians and financiers both -- down with as many laws and regulations as necessary. Keep them under the microscope, watch them constantly, allow them to get away with nothing. Assure that the lines are clearly drawn and nail anyone who crosses them from either direction. Bury the malefactors in federal prisons "to encourage the others". Treat them the way that William Jefferson was treated, and announce the results far and wide. We can start with the trio mentioned above. Human nature being what it is, there will be no lack of others.
And while we're at it, we can overthrow liberalism, the major carrier of the aristocratic impulse in our epoch. But that will require a little more thought.

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today's San Jose bullshit.............. -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 11:05:42 [1]
guess Bobby doesn't realize just how much government interference has already screwed up the health care system in this country. Now he's pissed that someone has to pay much much more to cover all his freeloading friends. I guess the democrat's "final solution" will be to just close all those evil hospitals and run the doctors out of business. oh wait........ then they can get re-elected for the non fix to that!!!

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Where did you go Bob?????? -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 11:02:20 [1]

An early lunch, hoping things will cool off here on the forum? Take a nap too, then venture on back. Or wait until tomorrow....... it will still be hot...... same questions will be waiting for your response..... but don't feel bad, Gene can't answer about Cap and Trade Taxing either........ he side steps, you ignore...... maybe you are both ignorant of what it will do to the less affluent Americans..... the people YOUR party is supposed to help...... you Democrats are a joke......

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pretty pictures -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:58:58 [1]

On the forum as in the real world, it takes more than pretty pictures to rid a society of scammers and bad politicians who lie....... but it will be done to what ever extent possible.....

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Well we tried -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:57:17 [1]

We posted lots of pretty pictures in an attempt to rid ourselves of Algore, it was as if the red bastard had taken root........... now his roots are almost cut...... just as his globalist scam has been exposed and confirmed as a fraud........ Al is an unnecessary carbon footprint...... but what scam artist isn't?

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Bob Achilles Protagorass -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:53:53 [1]

I would be too ashamed to discuss this administration's deceit and attack on America too if I were a socialist like you. What's wrong with you Bob? Just because your party is in office, it doesn't mean you can't admit when Democrats are wrong or corrupt. Its OK to criticize your own socialist party, your own fascist party, your own communist party......... since the Democrat party is all three, you have a lot of targets.......

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Connie -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:50:37 [1]

West Point is only an enemy to enemies of America...... Chris Matthews knows that, he himself is an enemy of America....... he is an enemy of the truth......

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Achilles -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:48:56 [1]

Neither you or Gene can address the Cap and Trade Tax Scheme or the socialist created fake man made global warming......... Why???????? The proof that it is fake has been confirmed........ Why can't you address that issue? Why do socialists have to lie?

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Looks like Achilles ran off again -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:47:43 [1]

Keep this in mind the next time he bloviates about his vo-tech schooling.
Widdle Achilles aka Poopsie aka Dr. Stadler is to science what Paris Hilton is to virginity.

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Connie -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:46:50 [1]

The self starting Al Gore loon videos are almost at the bottom. My fault, I didn't realize the blabber mouth's videos of lies started by themselves. Won't make that mistake again. Al is a needy SOB, if people don't want to hear his lies, he speaks anyway.......... soon there will be silence from him, at least on this forum.....

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:39:41 [1]

I’m curious why you are so silent about the apparent fudging of data to “prove” man is causing global warming.
As a man of hard science, as you so often and boorishly claimed, I thought you would be the first to stand up and decry what fakirs like Mann did to honest scientific research.
I expected you to berate those who conveniently “lost” the original raw data leaving us only with what has been, according to Mann, “tricked”.
Why so silent about the theft of science and scientific principles in the name of political gain.
Are you this far gone that you place your faith in liars instead of science, Dr. Stadler?

Poopsie?

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Did you know -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:39:07 [1]
that West Point is the enemy camp (according to
Christ Matthews) that Obama ventured into last night to make a speech. Such courage, such fortitude, such daring is certainly deserving of a medal of some kind. (/sarc).

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a tidbit from today's San Jose Mercury News....... -- Achilles, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:34:01 [1]
......relevant to this nation's dysfunctional health care non-system:

"Annals of health care:
Patient Jim Bujalski complained to St. Anthony's Central Hospital in Littleton, Colo., in September about the cost of his prescription Plavix and Crestor tablets which he was forced to 'buy' from the hospital because it administers only drugs under its control. The Plavix was $248 each (he pays $8 at home) and his Crestor ($3 at home) was $65.
The medications were part of his $58,000, 1-day hospital stay."

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:27:32 [1]

I’m curious why you are so silent about the apparent fudging of data to “prove” man is causing global warming.
As a man of hard science, as you so often and boorishly claimed, I thought you would be the first to stand up and decry what fakirs like Mann did to honest scientific research.
I expected you to berate those who conveniently “lost” the original raw data leaving us only with what has been, according to Mann, “tricked”.
Why so silent about the theft of science and scientific principles in the name of political gain.
Are you this far gone that you place your faith in liars instead of science, Dr. Stadler?

Poopsie?

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Sir Gus -- Queen Constance, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:26:33 [1]
Am I the only one who starts hearing poor quality broken audio after I'm here for a few minutes? Its beyond annoying! No. I have the same problem. It's beyond annoying. I have to turn my speakers off.

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Rumsfeld responds to Obama's speech last night -- Connie, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:24:30 [1]
The statement from Rumsfeld:
“In his speech to the nation last night, President Obama claimed that ‘Commanders in Afghanistan repeatedly asked for support to deal with the reemergence of the Taliban, but these reinforcements did not arrive.’ Such a bald misstatement, at least as it pertains to the period I served as Secretary of Defense, deserves a response.”
“I am not aware of a single request of that nature between 2001 and 2006. If any such requests occurred, ‘repeated’ or not, the White House should promptly make them public. The President's assertion does a disservice to the truth and, in particular, to the thousands of men and women in uniform who have fought, served and sacrificed in Afghanistan.”
“In the interest of better understanding the President's announcement last night, I suggest that the Congress review the President’s assertion in the forthcoming debate and determine exactly what requests were made, who made them, and where and why in the chain of command they were denied.”
This is true as far as I know and conforms with what Steve Hayes reported in THE WEEKLY STANDARD in October:
Perhaps more infuriating for Bush veterans was the suggestion by [Robert] Gibbs that the Bush administration ignored requests for more troops. It's nonsense, they say. McKiernan wanted more troops--he asked for three additional brigades in the summer of 2008--but he understood that he could have them only when they became available. "McKiernan was making requests down the line," says a Pentagon official, "and late in 2008 we did have the ability to commit more forces. So we did." Indeed, Bush sent nearly 7,000 additional troops to Afghanistan before he left office, including one brigade that had been repurposed from Iraq.
One Bush veteran asks, "If it's true that the Bush administration sat on these troop requests for eight months, is the White House suggesting that the Pentagon was incompetent or negligent or both? That would be a good question to put to the defense secretary--and President Obama is in a position to make him talk."
I couldn't reach Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, but I did talk to a senior defense official who serves with him. This person stressed that Gates has gone to great lengths to avoid being dragged into political fights between administrations. Nonetheless, he offered a strong rebuke to the present White House political team.
"There was no request on anyone's desk for eight months," said the defense official. "There was not a request that went to the White House because we didn't have forces to commit. So on the facts, they're wrong."

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Voice -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 10:18:01 [1]

Why do you claim the Holocaust was a hoax?

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Didn't realize -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:33:10 [1]

how long it takes for stuff to scroll off to the archives.

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more correctly -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:22:51 [1]
HE/she/it (phony, unprincipled, fuk) IS a lying democrat

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I just leave the volume in mute -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:12:50 [1]
when I come to the forum (for now). I leave the volume down because I knew Gore was lying from the beginning. Gene leaves the volume down because he's in denial of the lying democrats.

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Obama delivering Bush's speech -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:08:00 [1]
Obama said Bush was wrong, but now looks to his policy to continue. Whatever.......... Bush was never a conservative, he was Geno's man all along.

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:07:25 [1]
.
Two of the modern world's biggest hoaxes are the "Global Warming" hoax and the "Jewish holocaust" hoax.

After about 30 years, the Global-Warming hoax is finally falling apart. But, it has been over 65 years and the Jewish-holocaust hoax is still strong. Why is that?

As a general answer, I will state that the Western Right has opposed the Global-Warming hoax. But, it still took them 30 years to destroy it.

But, the Western Left and the Western Right all have interests in continuing the Jewish-holocaust hoax. And, that is the reason it continues.

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Gus -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:07:23 [1]
Waf posted a You Tube video of Al Gore that automatically begins to play when you come onto the forum.

In a day or so, it will scroll to the archives and then you won't hear it anymore..

I doubt it was intentional. Most You Tube videos need you to click on them before they start playing. This one doesn't for some reason.

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why they lie......... -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:04:35 [1]
keep the money coming in.......... the e-mails

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Am I the only one... -- Gus, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:02:35 [1]
...who starts hearing poor quality broken audio after I'm here for a few minutes? Its beyond annoying!

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 9:00:41 [1]
.
As the Tiger Woods' story continues, I am more and more inclined to believe the versions in the first reports of it.

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climategate.......... cock-a-doodle-do -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:56:54 [1]
http://www.examiner.com/x-31244-Louisville-Public-Policy-Examiner~y2009m12d2-Climategate--The-chickens-are-coming-home-to-roost

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:30:20 [1]
.
WilliamPitt President Barack Obama delivered the best speech George W. Bush ever gave in his life.:
On Tuesday night, President Barack Obama delivered the best speech George W. Bush ever gave in his life. Mr. Bush, if he was watching, would have recognized virtually every facet of Obama's speech, for it was the Bush administration that hammered out the template used by Mr. Obama to deliver the news that he is doubling down on the war in Afghanistan. ...
It took exactly 130 words for Mr. Obama to invoke the attacks of September 11, which is just about how long it usually took Mr. Bush whenever he unleashed one of his linguistic muggings upon the populace.
Mr. Obama blessed the calamity of Iraq as a success - "We have given Iraqis a chance to shape their future, and we are successfully leaving Iraq to its people," said the president - which was a favorite habit of Mr. Bush, no matter how brazen facts to the contrary happened to be.
Mr. Obama likewise blessed the recent fraud-riddled election in Afghanistan as a positive thing, despite the cancerous effect that farce of a vote has had on the confidence of the Afghan people. In this, the president echoed Mr. Bush once again, as it was often Mr. Bush's practice to fete Iraqi elections that were controlled by Iran and riven with violence as successful steps towards democracy.
Mr. Obama re-introduced the American people to the menace of weapons of mass destruction, a favorite note of Mr. Bush. Obama did not go so far as to say that Afghanistan is in possession of 26,000 liters of anthrax, 38,000 liters of botulinum toxin, 500 tons of sarin, mustard and VX nerve agent, 30,000 missiles to deliver the stuff, mobile biological weapons labs, and uranium from Niger for use in a robust nuclear weapons program, as Mr. Bush did during another memorable prime-time speech, but the call to dread was there all the same. The threat of "loose nukes" is indeed real enough, but it was a kick in the stomach to see the Bush Handbook on Fear put into play once again.
Mr. Obama acknowledged in his speech that America's war in Afghanistan has lasted eight long years, and even tipped a wink at America's share of responsibility for helping to shape the bleak and battered history of that nation. But then, as Bush so often did with Iraq, Mr. Obama threw the responsibility for putting the pieces of that shattered nation back together squarely on the shoulders of the Afghan people. In effect, the occupier demanded that the occupied shape up and fly right. The Hebrew word for this is "chutzpah," and it fits the situation like a glove.

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Our first female president, will complete the transition to an American police state by arresting critics and protesters of Washington's immoral foreign and domestic policies -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:26:44 [1]

Sheer paronoia/lunacy.

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The people want health care, but the government does not listen. -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:25:24 [1]

Not true. Most already have it and are satisfied.

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:19:14 [1]
.
Paul Craig Roberts The Obama Puppet -- The world's least powerful man:
It didn't take the Israel Lobby very long to bring President Obama to heel regarding his prohibition against further illegal Israeli settlements on occupied Palestinian land. Obama discovered that a mere American president is powerless when confronted by the Israel Lobby and that the United States simply is not allowed a Middle East policy separate from Israel's.
Obama also found out that he cannot change anything else either, if he ever intended to do so. The military/security lobby has war and a domestic police state on its agenda, and a mere American president can't do anything about it.
President Obama can order the Guantanamo torture chamber closed and kidnapping and rendition and torture to be halted, but no one carries out the order.
Essentially, Obama is irrelevant. ...
The US invasion of Iraq had nothing whatsoever to do with American national interests. It had to do with armaments profits and with eliminating an obstacle to Israeli territorial expansion. The cost of the war, aside from the $3 trillion, was over 4,000 dead Americans, over 30,000 wounded and maimed Americans, tens of thousands of broken American marriages and lost careers, one million dead Iraqis, four million displaced Iraqis, and a destroyed country.
All of this was done for the profits of the military/security complex and to make paranoid Israel, armed with 200 nuclear weapons, feel “secure.” ...
In actual fact, the American people have no say about what “their” government does. Polls of the public show that half or more of the American people do not support the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan and do not support President Obama's escalation of the war in Afghanistan. Yet, the occupations and wars continue. According to General Stanley McChrystal, the additional 40,000 troops are enough to stalemate the war, that is, to keep in going forever, the ideal situation for the armaments lobby.
The people want health care, but the government does not listen.
The people want jobs, but Wall Street wants higher priced stocks and forces American firms to offshore the jobs to countries where labor is cheaper.
The American people have no effect on anything. They can affect nothing. They have become irrelevant like Obama. And they will remain irrelevant as long as organized interest groups can purchase the US government. ...
In less than one year, President Obama has betrayed all of his supporters and broken all of his promises. He is the total captive of the oligarchy of the ruling interest groups.
Unless he is saved by an orchestrated 9/11-type event, Obama is a one-term president.
Indeed, the collapsing economy will doom him regardless of a “terrorist event.”
The Republicans are grooming Palin. Our first female president, following our first black president, will complete the transition to an American police state by arresting critics and protesters of Washington's immoral foreign and domestic policies, and she will complete the destruction of America's reputation abroad.

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Waf re: I have never seen or heard any magic in obama's speeches, -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:12:17 [1]

Me neither but, when you think of it, the article is very cleverly written.
Instead of disputing whether he had any "magic" to begin with, it takes the premise he did (as some believe) but has now lost it.
Much more devastating that way.

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Voice -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:10:32 [1]
RE: "I guess nobody wants to jump in and give their views of Paul Gottfried's article called Christian Heresies."
I read it and Gottfried just sounded confused. Why don't you tell us what you got from it?

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ThomKaat -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:06:38 [1]
I read the Walter Williams piece. As usual he hits the nail right on the head. No, Gene and Achilles wouldn't understand it. It makes sense.

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The Algore -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:04:10 [1]

Continues his slide towards the bottom and into the archives of history........ he won't be missed....... and I will be careful not to post anything that plays automatically......

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Murray -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 8:02:06 [1]

I have never seen or heard any magic in obama's speeches, he has always rang hollow....... and false...... I don't see where his magic is wearing off as the writer says..... what I see are the people waking up...... a little bit..... their eyes aren't wide open yet, but at least they can't keep them completely closed as reality starts to tug at their lids.....

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R² -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:57:55 [1]

What never ceases to baffle me is why people will not believe it when they are informed that it is the Democrats that have attacked Social Security every step of the way. I have shown proof to people and they say, "oh, that can't be, the Democrats GAVE us Social Security."......... As one of the founders said, if it comes from government, government can take it away.......
I understand that resistance is not futile........ not for the socialists when people continue to resist the truth.....

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Forum -- Voice, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:56:30 [1]
.
I guess nobody wants to jump in and give their views of Paul Gottfried's article called Christian Heresies.

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regarding the man and the sign -- RSQUARED, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:52:55 [1]
as if it is every seniors fault that democrats lied to them, robbed them, and then robbed the social security system they lied about to begin with.............

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waf -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:52:51 [1]
RE: "It was Gene commenting on the man holding the signs saying the various federal agencies are broke....... just scroll down.
Yes, I found it. Thank you. I wonder if Gene knows the guy personally? I doubt it. He looks too intelligent to be a union guy.

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Der Spiegel: "Never before has a speech by President Barack Obama felt as false...." -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:52:27 [1]

Never before has a speech by President Barack Obama felt as false as his Tuesday address announcing America's new strategy for Afghanistan. It seemed like a campaign speech combined with Bush rhetoric -- and left both dreamers and realists feeling distraught.
One can hardly blame the West Point leadership. The academy commanders did their best to ensure that Commander-in-Chief Barack Obama's speech would be well-received.
Just minutes before the president took the stage inside Eisenhower Hall, the gathered cadets were asked to respond "enthusiastically" to the speech. But it didn't help: The soldiers' reception was cool.
One didn't have to be a cadet on Tuesday to feel a bit of nausea upon hearing Obama's speech. It was the least truthful address that he has ever held. He spoke of responsibility, but almost every sentence smelled of party tactics. He demanded sacrifice, but he was unable to say what it was for exactly.
An additional 30,000 US soldiers are to march into Afghanistan -- and then they will march right back out again. America is going to war -- and from there it will continue ahead to peace. It was the speech of a Nobel War Prize laureate.
Just in Time for the Campaign
For each troop movement, Obama had a number to match. US strength in Afghanistan will be tripled relative to the Bush years, a fact that is sure to impress hawks in America. But just 18 months later, just in time for Obama's re-election campaign, the horror of war is to end and the draw down will begin. The doves of peace will be let free.
The speech continued in that vein. It was as though Obama had taken one of his old campaign speeches and merged it with a text from the library of ex-President George W. Bush. Extremists kill in the name of Islam, he said, before adding that it is one of the "world's great religions." He promised that responsibility for the country's security would soon be transferred to the government of President Hamid Karzai -- a government which he said was "corrupt." The Taliban is dangerous and growing stronger. But "America will have to show our strength in the way that we end wars," he added.
It was a dizzying combination of surge and withdrawal, of marching to and fro. The fast pace was reminiscent of plays about the French revolution: Troops enter from the right to loud cannon fire and then they exit to the left. And at the end, the dead are left on stage.
Obama's Magic No Longer Works
But in this case, the public was more disturbed than entertained. Indeed, one could see the phenomenon in a number of places in recent weeks: Obama's magic no longer works. The allure of his words has grown weaker.
It is not he himself who has changed, but rather the benchmark used to evaluate him. For a president, the unit of measurement is real life. A leader is seen by citizens through the prism of their lives -- their job, their household budget, where they live and suffer. And, in the case of the war on terror, where they sometimes die.
Political dreams and yearnings for the future belong elsewhere. That was where the political charmer Obama was able to successfully capture the imaginations of millions of voters. It is a place where campaigners -- particularly those with a talent for oration -- are fond of taking refuge. It is also where Obama set up his campaign headquarters, in an enormous tent called "Hope."
In his speech on America's new Afghanistan strategy, Obama tried to speak to both places. It was two speeches in one. That is why it felt so false. Both dreamers and realists were left feeling distraught.
The American president doesn't need any opponents at the moment. He's already got himself.

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Murray -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:46:36 [1]
RE: "I answered you on the other forum, btw."
Yes, I saw it when I went over there. I'm glad that our little disagreement is settled. Now if we could only get a few others to start posting there. All are welcome, even Voice. Even Gene.

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Gerryb -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:44:07 [1]

The time stamp is 3:35

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Gerryb -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:42:27 [1]

It was Gene commenting on the man holding the signs saying the various federal agencies are broke....... just scroll down.....

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Thom Katt -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:41:11 [1]

Walter Williams....... good article..... maybe Gene and Bob will read it and understand it...... read maybe, understand? I doubt it..... hive constraints.....

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Anyone -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:39:32 [1]
RE: "As the phony son of a bitch collects his Socialist SecuriMurray, my friend"
Where did that come from. I wanted to find it so that I could find out the context.

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Sometime today -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:37:10 [1]

That Algore propaganda video will scroll off the forum....... which will allow for more decorum...... then Gene can come back...... after sleeping it off in the sack........ or on the beach...... watch the tides...... some are red......

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:34:21 [1]

Due to a malfunction resulting from a brain worm infestation, Gene will be unable to answer questions this morning, and may remain elusive and unavailable as long as questions are posed in a manner that requires a concise and clear answer.......... maybe we can catch up to him in the after life..... but he may be headed for a different destination.......

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:29:15 [1]

"1. True religious freedom (Not of the Talibangelical/your kind)."
We know what you mean, freedom for the socialist religion.
"2. Religion and it’s batshit craziness OUT OF MY GOVERNMENT as Jesus said. Criminal indictments of Catholic pedophile priests, the bishops and Vatican official that enabled/hid them."
Religion and government already addressed. You will find agreement from conservatives about erradicating the pedophiles, not only from churches, but from society...... look out socialists.....
"3. A healthcare system removed from the commodities market. Profit earned off the illness of America’s sick and infirmed?? How friggen unconscionable is that??"
Should doctors, nurses, other medical people, researchers, funders, and all others connected to health care, work and or invest for nothing? There is news for you, without profit there is no progress. Now there is one area where that doesn't hold true, socialists think they are making progress when they spiral profits downward.... I call it regression...
"4. Making money off of money instead of investment in the future i.e. building/creating something substantial and viable. Again, How friggen unconscionable is that??"
Again, already answered. Look to the Federal Reserve Banking Scam, a socialist tool
"5. A strong military that is used in defense of this country. Adequate arms and research and development to fulfill that mission. NO more nation building. Kill EVERY extremist terrorist that has attacked America INCLUDING our own homegrown."
already answered, but those home grown terrorists are Democrat socialists and neo-con-libs. We are all for a strong military that only defends this country.
"6. Removal of the philosophical globalists/Raygone holdovers from our government. No more of their use of American taxpayer dollars to outsource and help corporate America move off shore."
Who are the holdovers? Why are the Democrats importing 125,000 foreign workers per month???? Why are the illegal aliens being allowed to enter this country???
Can you answer questions Gene?

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Gerry P.S. -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:20:46 [1]

I answered you on the other forum, btw.
Christian Beliefs Forum

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Forum -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:17:06 [1]
RE: "Talbangical."
No such word except in that twisted morras which passes for a mind in Gene's head.

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:14:37 [1]

We still have to do some posting to rid the forum of the Algore video of lies, won't you be a good boy and help by doing some posting?????? Post anything, nonsense(as usual), pictures, whatever you want....... help your country and the forum, get rid of Algore..........

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Gerry -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:13:03 [1]

It's a sad joke when Gene ventures into biblical issues.
He's probably referring to when Jesus drove the moneychangers out of the temple but the analogy he's trying to make does not hold of course.

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Gerryb -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:11:09 [1]

Gene should be a Christian through and through...... didn't Jesus say, "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" or something similar??????? Gene seems to bee all for rendering unto the government.......... yet he talks about others being bat shit crazy........ I wonder if he has ever heard of "godless Christians"........ I wonder if he knows who they(socialists is my take) are.......

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:06:48 [1]

I have been looking at 'Cap and Trade', how is it going to help this country or the poor? It looks like another TAX designed to keep the poor in poverty.
You like to stay in your box and not think about it, because thinking about what the socialists do would require leaving your box........... the farthest you get from that box is when you stand on it............. like an Algore......

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Gene -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:06:20 [1]
Come on Gene, get youe head out of your backside and answer some of the questions this morning. Drunk already?

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waf and Murray -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:03:43 [1]
I want Gene to tell us just exactly where in the Bible Jesus said anything about getting people out of Government. The only Government that Jesus spoke of was that of the Kingdom of God. What a fool Gene is.

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True religious freedom (Not of the Talibangelical/your kind -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:01:56 [1]

In other words, free and unrestricted abortion rights through all 9 months of pregnancy.
Also, no parental involvement whatsoever when a minor becomes pregnant.

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 7:00:52 [1]

"As the phony son of a bitch collects his Socialist SecuriMurray, my friend -- Gene, in "teaching" mode™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 5:41:52 [1] "
Thats the post where you are unintelligible, you are against everything.
Why shouldn't people make money off money? The Federal Reserve Banking Scam does just that and manipulates the economy to establish maximum profits while doing it. You attack the wrong people and policies......... its a wonder you can walk, being so blind as you are......................... I think in your case, it isn't blindness, it is blind-folded and fooled.......

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waf -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:57:45 [1]
Good morning. That is quite a spectacular set of photos. Thanks for posting it.

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:55:55 [1]

"As the phony son of a bitch collects his Socialist Security/Medicare."
Do you know the man personally Gene??????????????? You don't know a damn thing about the man.......
"Ohh, BTW good job on fuking up the audio on this forum."
You are very welcome Gene, but your thanks should actually be directed to Al Gore and his bat shit crazy supporters and believers........ all damned tax crazed thieves......
You are very confused in one of your longer posts this morning, you are being shredded as a result....... sober up man....

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:46:47 [1]

"And you have been where the last decade (Of HeeHaw conservatism)??"
Gene, don't you find it a bit strange that you are the only one who thinks the last decade was conservative? I found it to be socialist nearly all the way......... stop looking thru the bottom of a tequila bottle and you might see a bit clearer.....

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Gene -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:42:39 [1]

"Religion and it’s batshit craziness OUT OF MY GOVERNMENT as Jesus said"
Did Jesus really say that?
All I see IN YOUR GOVERNMENT are godless specters from Hell........... specters that are turning this country into a hell hole......

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Roadking -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:39:04 [1]

""Kill EVERY extremist terrorist that has attacked America INCLUDING our own homegrown.""
This is what Achilles/Bob would say to that if a sane conservative had written it: "By that sentiment "including our own homegrown", Gene can only be calling for the elimination of the Democrat socialists in Congress and society." He would infer that it was a death threat. The name would be different, but otherwise...........
And I have no problem with that, if that is what Gene is inferring, it would be good for the country, but the secret police may want to talk to him.........

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A healthcare system removed from the commodities market. -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:38:02 [1]

What? So the government can take it over?
Now there's a leftist solution if ever there was one.

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Religion and it’s batshit craziness OUT OF MY GOVERNMENT as Jesus said -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:33:50 [1]

You got a chapter and verse for this supposed saying of Jesus?

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Zepplin and Planes -- waf, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:31:27 [1]

San Francisco view from zepplin At the bottom the page are linked photos to WW2 planes. Also a range of jetfighters it looks to be.

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RoadKing -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:25:10 [1]
I guess that my questions were too tough for Gene to answer this morning,

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Gene -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:08:04 [1]
RE: "Kill EVERY extremist terrorist that has attacked America INCLUDING our own homegrown."
Just which "homegrown terrorists" do you advocate kiilling. Name some.

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Gene -- Gerryb, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 6:02:37 [1]
RE: "Religion and it’s batshit craziness OUT OF MY GOVERNMENT as Jesus said."
Just where and in what words did he say that? Certainly the US Constitution doesn't say it.

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Good Morning Road King -- Gene™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 5:43:55 [1]
RK: That statement along makes you a leftist and also demonstrates that you know nothing about conservatism since it has been proved over time that conservative policies are the only ones that WORK!
And you have been where the last decade (Of HeeHaw conservatism)??

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Murray, my friend -- Gene, in "teaching" mode™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 5:41:52 [1]
You think yourself clever by being almost completely negative in your posts. Once more for the numb of skull; My “negativity” is a result of the monumental failure of the policies of the rightwing batshit crazies. Murray my friend, when something does not work and that philosophy has proven itself to be incapable of governing the nation militarily, economically AND socially it’s time for change.

In this way, you never have to man up and clearly say what you are FOR. What in the world are you whining about??

1. True religious freedom (Not of the Talibangelical/your kind).

2. Religion and it’s batshit craziness OUT OF MY GOVERNMENT as Jesus said. Criminal indictments of Catholic pedophile priests, the bishops and Vatican official that enabled/hid them.

3. A healthcare system removed from the commodities market. Profit earned off the illness of America’s sick and infirmed?? How friggen unconscionable is that??

4. Making money off of money instead of investment in the future i.e. building/creating something substantial and viable. Again, How friggen unconscionable is that??

5. A strong military that is used in defense of this country. Adequate arms and research and development to fulfill that mission. NO more nation building. Kill EVERY extremist terrorist that has attacked America INCLUDING our own homegrown.

6. Removal of the philosophical globalists/Raygone holdovers from our government. No more of their use of American taxpayer dollars to outsource and help corporate America move off shore.

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Gene, in denial of reality mode -- Roadking, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 5:28:42 [1]
GENE: Just how the hell does being AGAINST everything that has been the major contributing factors to the demise of this country (batshit crazy Neo-con socio-clownism) being a “leftist”?? The very shit you people stand for AND would do so willingly again..
RK: That statement along makes you a leftist and also demonstrates that you know nothing about conservatism since it has been proved over time that conservative policies are the only ones that WORK!

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Brilliant piece! -- ThomKaat, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 5:07:35 [1]

The Pretense of Knowledge
Walter E. Williams, Wednesday, December 02, 2009
The ultimate constraint that we all face is knowledge -- what we know and don't know. The knowledge problem is pervasive and by no means trivial as hinted at by just a few examples. You've purchased a house. Was it the best deal you could have gotten? Was there some other house you could have purchased that 10 years later would not have needed extensive repairs or was in a community with more likeable neighbors and a better environment for your children? What about the person you married? Was there another person who would have made for a more pleasing spouse? Though these are important questions, the most intelligent answer you can give to all of them is: "I don't know."
Since you don't know the answers, who do you think, here on Earth, is likely to know and whom would you like to make these decisions for you -- Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, George Bush, a czar appointed by Obama or a committee of Washington bureaucrats? I bet that if these people were to forcibly make housing or marital decisions for us, most would deem it tyranny.
You say, "Williams, Congress is not making such monumental decisions that affect my life." Try this. You are a 22-year-old healthy person. Instead of spending $3,000 or $4,000 a year for health insurance, you'd prefer investing that money in equipment to start a landscaping business. Which is the best use of that $3,000 or $4,000 a year -- purchasing health insurance or starting up a landscaping business -- and who should decide that question: Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, George Bush, aczar appointed by Obama or a committee of Washington bureaucrats? How can they possibly know what's the best use of your earnings, particularly in light of the fact that they have no idea of who you are?
Neither you nor the U.S. Congress has the complete knowledge to know exactly what's best for you. The difference is that when individuals make their own trade-offs, say between purchasing health insurance or investing in a business, they make wiser decisions because it is they who personally bear the costs and benefits of those decisions. You say, "Hold it, Williams, we've got you now! What if that person gets really sick and doesn't have health insurance. Society suffers the burden of taking care of him." To the extent that is a problem, it is not a problem of liberty; it's a problem of congressionally mandated socialism. Let's look at it.
It is not society that bears the burden; it is some flesh and blood American worker who finds his earnings taken by Congress to finance the health needs of another person. There is absolutely no moral case, much less constitutional case, for Congress forcibly using one American to serve the purposes of another American, a practice that differs only in degree from slavery, which we all should find morally offensive.
Whether it is health care, education, employment or most other areas of our lives, I ask you: Who has the capacity to master all the complexity to make choices on behalf of others? Each of us possesses only a tiny percentage of the knowledge that would be necessary to make totally informed decisions in our own lives, much less the lives of others. There is only one reason for the forcible transference of decision-making authority over important areas of our private lives to elite decision-makers in Congress and government bureaucracies. Doing so confers control, power, wealth and revenue to society's elite. What's in the best interests of individual members of society, such as a person who'd rather launch a landscaping business than purchase a health insurance policy, ranks low on the elite's list of priorities.
-----

Poopsie?
Gene?

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Just how the hell does being AGAINST everything...etc -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 5:04:56 [1]

Good point and glad you brought it up.
You think yourself clever by being almost completely negative in your posts. In this way, you never have to man up and clearly say what you are FOR.
Nevertheless, whether it be through your slavish devotion to copy and paste from the far left Huffington Post or your support for the President, who, by his voting record was one of the top three leftists in the Senate, a pattern emerges.
Besides, the blood of a real American boils every time Obama bows before a foreign head of state. (3 and counting so far, btw.) You've given him a pass every single time.
P.S. How's "card check" coming along? Looks like the unions were played for the fools once again by the Democrats. You'll keep voting for them though and they obviously take you guys for granted, just as they do the blacks. What tools you guys are. Utter friggin tools.

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Ohh waa waa, Murray -- Gene™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 4:38:15 [1]
Regardless of your overt denial of belng a leftist, every post you write says that you are. Just how the hell does being AGAINST everything that has been the major contributing factors to the demise of this country (batshit crazy Neo-con socio-clownism) being a “leftist”?? The very shit you people stand for AND would do so willingly again.. Seems to me it is YOU people who have got some issues with the reality you caused.

Evidently, it is part of the Socialist handbook not to admit one's true political leanings. Not doing so is just one of the many reasons you richly deserve your designation as a phony, unprincipled fuk. You and your religious fellow extremists whining about “principles” is one of the bigger laughers of the day. Thankx for starting out my morning on an up note

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There are two or three Liberal/Leftists posting here. Not exactly. We Americans blah blah blah -- Murray, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 4:25:19 [1]

Regardless of your overt denial of belng a leftist, every post you write says that you are.
Evidently, it is part of the Socialist handbook not to admit one's true political leanings. Not doing so is just one of the many reasons you richly deserve your designation as a phony, unprincipled fuk.

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Waffiecakes -- Gene™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 3:35:42 [1]

As the phony son of a bitch collects his Socialist Security/Medicare.
Ohh, BTW good job on fuking up the audio on this forum.

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Voice -- Gene™, Wed, Dec 02 2009, 3:29:35 [1]
There are two or three Liberal/Leftists posting here. Not exactly. We Americans are able to understand the absodamnedlootly batshit crazy straits we find ourselves in by allowing fun-dumb-mental-ist neo-clowns to run this nation.

And, there are a couple Christian-Zionists. Part of the same bunch of assholes (see above). Above all else the Talibangelical in America bear the majority of the responsibility for the ongoing fiasco in the mid-east. They promoted it under the traitorous regime of Ron Raygone and culminated our destruction under Cheney/Bush. They would continue our downfall with the queen of disaster, the Wasilla hillbillie.
Most of the others are Libertarians. Noo, they are disaffected/disenfranchised republicants looking to relabel themselves. There isn’t a true “Libertarian” amongst any of them. As soon as they understand what a true libertarian stands for (individual liberty) they immediately run home to mama (I’m a con-servative/anti socialist sniff snort burb)

But, as I said, I am the only traditional, American-Conservative posting here.Maybe so

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Bill -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 22:54:24 [1]
.
There are two or three Liberal/Leftists posting here. And, there are a couple Christian-Zionists. Most of the others are Libertarians. But, as I said, I am the only traditional, American-Conservative posting here.

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How a black man became the U.S. president -- Bill, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 22:50:35 [1]

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Bill -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 22:44:32 [1]
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Actually, I am the only Conservative posting here.

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gerryb -- Bill, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 22:41:54 [1]
This is quite a conservative Tourette's support group you all have here. A lot of spontaneous jerking and surprise outbursts. Do you all ever get together, take pictures maybe?

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 22:10:30 [1]
.
I sure get tired of these "cool" people and their use of the term "Green," as in the "Green building" or the "Green Car."

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 21:26:24 [1]
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What do you suppose is the real reason that Obama is putting more American soldiers into Afghanistan?

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 21:24:55 [1]
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Jerusalem Post 'Don't call J'lem Palestinian capital':

Sweden's attempts to insert language into an EU resolution on the Middle East that would recognize east Jerusalem as the capital of a future independent Palestinian state harms European efforts to play a significant part in mediating between Israel and the Palestinians, the Foreign Ministry said in a statement issued Tuesday morning.

The statement followed a Haaretz report that the Swedes were pushing a resolution that will be discussed at a monthly meeting of EU ministers next week in Brussels that would officially call for the division of Jerusalem.

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 21:15:02 [1]
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Gallup Obama Approval on Afghanistan, at 35%, Trails Other Issues:

PRINCETON, NJ -- Americans are far less approving of President Obama's handling of the situation in Afghanistan than they have been in recent months, with 35% currently approving, down from 49% in September and 56% in July. ...

"The decline in Obama's approval rating on Afghanistan is evident among all party groups, with double-digit decreases since September among Republicans (17 points), independents (16 points), and Democrats (10 points)."

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holy crap !!! -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 21:05:02 [1]
anyone watch the ACORN hearings today??? (evidently not)........ repeating on C-SPAN now. The depth of the DNC corruption should be on blairing on every media outlet right now. (oh wait, the national tee vee media is part of the corruption)

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:58:51 [1]
Brother Nathanael Kapner WHY IS THE ADL PROMOTING ALEX JONES?
THE ANTI DEFAMATION LEAGUE’S RECENT ‘BLAST’ at radio conspiracy ‘patriot’ maven, Alex Jones, appears to be more - AND less - than it seems upon closer examination and rational consideration.

That world Zionism is the center of evil on the planet is beyond any rational dispute. From AIPAC and the ADL to the bogus Southern Poverty Law Center to B’nai B’rith, Zionism is the most ruthless geopolitical (thermonuclear Israel), financial and political force in the United States…and much of the world. ...

VETERAN JERUSALEM POST REPORTER, David Shamah, (a vehement Zionist Jew), admits, or to be more accurate, exposed Alex Jones for “being on the Jews’ payroll.” Yes, that is a direct quote from the article.

On Shamah’s Website, Digital Newzgeek, where he archives his Jerusalem Post articles, Shaman posted a piece which he penned for the Jerusalem Post on April 14 2009, titled, What Creeps Under Internet Rocks. In the article, Shaman exposes Jones as a “rebbe” whose fans fear his Jewish ties will make him “look bad:” Wrote Shamah: ...

Jones has a specific agenda that unquestionably covers for Zionism. Sure, he wears the cloak of the Patriot…he’s a master at it. Remember …the BEST disinformation is at least 90% truth. And Alex ‘Bullhorn’ Jones appears to be the best friend world Zionism has in the often murky milieu of ‘patriot’ radio and the alternative media. Remember…connect the dots…and the true picture eventually congeals in front of ones eyes…truly a stark and painful image in this case.

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Billy Gene -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:58:35 [1]

'"Furthermore, the uncertainty is surely higher than normal now because the current recession is unusual both in its fundamental causes and its severity.'"
Bull Shit Bill........ greed caused it, socialist greed..... and socialist greed exacerbates it........ unusual your ass Bill, it is common where socialists get any degree of control....... you dumb fuks are out of other people's money Bill, that always happens when socialists can't control themselves......

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Who is it working for? -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:55:32 [1]
"Forbes" --a liberal rich man
"Oxford Analytica" --oxford is synonymous with socialist
"Fiscal Stimulus Works" --Not for Real Americans
"Oxford Analytica, 11.26.09" --Again, synonymous with socialism........ try again Bill.

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Bill -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:48:27 [1]
RE: "'It should be understood that all of the estimates presented in this memo are subject to significant margins of error. [Not small, Murray. Significant.] ...Furthermore, the uncertainty is surely higher than normal now because the current recession is unusual both in its fundamental causes and its severity.'"
In other words they have no more idea about what is hasppening than you other socialists do. That's what I thought all along.

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Socialists heavy -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:40:48 [1]

Jimmy san

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Socialists caught without his mask -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:32:57 [1]

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Socialists -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:19:38 [1]

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Socialist Queer Light Cast -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:14:35 [1]

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Mama was a rollin stoner, looked for men with a real big ....errr smile -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:14:20 [1]

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anon a-clown in case you missed it Murray -- Bill, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:14:10 [1]
This is the first sentence in the January, 2009 Romer-Bernstein report on projections for the stimulus package that you haven't read, Murrray:
"A key goal enunciated by the President-Elect concerning the American Recovery and Reinvestment Plan is that it should save or create at least 3 million jobs by the end of 2010."
See? Not "by the end of 2009."
They repeat that claim often in the report, Murray. Four or five times, and it is not a very long report. It is hard to miss.
Oh, but Romer and Bernstein did say that they expected unemployment to stay at or below eight percent.
The did, but Romer and Bernstein add this prominent disclaimer:
"It should be understood that all of the estimates presented in this memo are subject to significant margins of error. [Not small, Murray. Significant.] ...Furthermore, the uncertainty is surely higher than normal now because the current recession is unusual both in its fundamental causes and its severity."

Did you read the news today, oh, Murray?

As many as 1.6 million jobs saved or created by the limited amount of stimulus funds that were spent between February and September of this year.

Can you count the number of months from February 17 through September 30, Murray? Let's count them together:
One, two, three, four, five, six, seven months, 1.6 million jobs.
And let's try to remember the key claim of the Romer-Bernstein report, that the stimulus package "should save or create at least 3 million jobs by the end of 2010."
1.6 million jobs in the first seven months, and 15 months to go.
"In case you missed it," we are already 1/2 way there with just 1/4 of the stimulus funds spent.

Do you think they'll get that 3 million job mark by next November's election, Murray?

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Socialist Queer Light Cast -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:12:28 [1]

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Achilles coming up the mountain -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:08:38 [1]

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Achilles skillet -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:04:29 [1]

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???? ........... this way maybe? -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:02:36 [1]
Bobby's favorite

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poor 'ol ProtaB.......... -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 20:00:39 [1]
ain't into the girly image thing.........he's, more likely, into vegetarian images http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/4230/124115922e0c0feebfaoqt6.jpg

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The Big Picture (same shit different day) -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:58:55 [1]

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a second date with HCPFPM -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:53:28 [1]

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R² -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:53:14 [1]

Yes, Veracity-Robin is the moderator-operator.

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a date with HCPFPM -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:50:38 [1]

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Speaking of DOLLS -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:43:51 [1]
gotta' luv Dana Perino (and she can talk all she wants)

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blow up doll......... like that ??? -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:40:52 [1]
is it mute? How much, lol

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that is the "inflatable" model, is it not? -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:40:32 [1]
One is for sure

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Whenever I think of Robin -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:39:43 [1]
I think of the beautiful Virginia. I remember my visit to Monticello........... I think of teachers that our schools really need.

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GeneJanes date........... -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:35:20 [1]
that is the "inflatable" model, is it not?

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NUF SAID -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:30:47 [1]

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Genejanes date with Mariah -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:28:20 [1]

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Nope 1/2 a page to go -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:25:01 [1]
But we're getting there

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Robin silenced it............. -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 19:24:49 [1]
ROBIN as in OUR Gummy/Veracity/Robin ??? Who runs this forum nowadays anyway?

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Alsnore -- dribble, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:50:53 [1]
Nope, still there.

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Did that do it? -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:38:25 [1]

Al Gore shows an error and I can't hear the bastard any more..... its always a good thing when Al Gore can't be heard or seen.

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This is Pelosi talking her normal every day spew -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:26:03 [1]

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This is Bob in pain -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:20:14 [1]

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:19:28 [1]
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I read that the anti-immigration sherriff of Phoenix was trying to give a speech but was shouted down by college students and he had to give it up. It is almost always the Left that participates in such attacks on free speech.

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Class and NO class -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:18:53 [1]

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Sorry about that blabber mouth Gore video -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:16:37 [1]
Ain't nothing but a thang :-)( But if you could post BIG pictures, we can shuvvvv the socialshit over board )

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Who dis? -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:16:24 [1]

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Sorry about that blabber mouth Gore video -- waf, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:11:26 [1]

Seems the only thing that will shut that red bastards dirty lying leftist Democrat potty mouth is COLD WEATHER. tee hee, or scrolling the bastard off to never never land......... have a short life Al, very short.

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Bye Bye raghead guy -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 18:03:49 [1]

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Bye Bye red -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:59:59 [1]

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Bye Bye red -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:58:17 [1]

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Bye Bye red -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:56:57 [1]

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Bye Bye red -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:53:37 [1]

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Bye Bye red -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:51:59 [1]

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Bye Bye red -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:50:00 [1]

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:49:34 [1]
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American's Journey 12.01.2009 - Rush Limbaugh admits he believes Osama bin Laden is dead on todays show - plus Thom Hartmann DRG interview - so what is the mission in AFPAKistan?

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Bye Bye blue -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:46:02 [1]

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:45:37 [1]
.
Evidently, a lot of people around the world are upset with the people of Switzerland who just voted for a ban on anymore construction of Muslim Minarets.

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Bye Bye Dubai -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:43:21 [1]

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some wanna be tall -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:39:26 [1]

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heh heh heh some like em tall -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:37:05 [1]

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a few more of these and I'll have that job done -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:31:23 [1]

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a few more of these and I'll have that job done -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:30:56 [1]

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:-) -- :-), Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:28:16 [1]

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Just moving the page along :-) -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:26:58 [1]

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Americans are jobless for some reason -- Can Bob explain? Or Bill? Or Gene? -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:10:14 [1]
ooh ooh lemme lemme... ! Bush did it! :-)

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"President George W. Bush expanded public spending by 70 percent, more than double the increase under President Clinton. -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 17:08:06 [1]
I didn't complain , you did, now with a new even larger increase, you've stopped , why is that?
I wonder what the Bush increase would have looked like sans 911? certainly you don't get all that HLS for free? Why couldn't we cut all the socialshit programs and just hire the socialshits to fill the positions?

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Fascist Bob, the "global warming" con-artist -- Roadking, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 16:31:09 [1]
FASCIST: Now, I can be certain that you have studied the scientific findings concerning global warming and that you actually can comprehend their meaning and the science that derived them, correct?

RK: Actually, that's part of the problem. The "peer reviews" that they site have either been rubber stamped without actually being looked at, or these "scientists" have refused to release their data for review. I believe that the majority of the e-mails released have dealt with HOW TO HIDE INFORMATION, OR HOW TO REMOVE PEOPLE WHO DON'T AGREE WITH THEIR RELIGION. And anyone with a command of the english language can understand the fraud going on within the "global warming" community. One need not be a genius to read the truth, Bob.

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Americans are jobless for some reason -- Can Bob explain? Or Bill? Or Gene?, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 16:14:32 [1]

I doubt that they care enough to explain why this is happening:
JOBLESS AMERICANS, Washington needs to explain why a socialist Congress is giving out 125,000 new work permits to foreign workers EVERY MONTH.
Congress and obama are destroying jobs, yet allowing foreign workers and illegal alien into the country, I don't see any sense in that even if Americans were not out of work.

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Stupid Socialists Are Delusional -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 16:06:01 [1]

By the way, that speech at Cairo got him nowhere.
The Muslim world doesn't think any more highly of us as a result. Actually, in their culture, they look down on people who bad mouth their own culture, even if it's one they also do not like or respect.
What an amateur this guy is.

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re: Evan Thomas -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:58:15 [1]

Distubingly biased, isn't he?
I remember friends of mine had a bumper sticker in about 1988 that said, "I DON'T BELIEVE THE LIBERAL MEDIA."
At the time, I thought they were loony but the bias has just gotten much more obvious since then.
Sorry, Bruce & Patricia, you were onto something and I wrote you off.

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SkyHawk -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:50:57 [1]

Waf posted a You Tube video of Al Gore that automatically begins to play when you come onto the forum.
In a day or so, it will scroll to the archives and then you won't hear it anymore..
I doubt it was intentional. Most You Tube videos need you to click on them before they start playing. This one doesn't for some reason.

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Sound Bites??? -- SkyHawk, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:45:32 [1]
Anyone hearing sound bites as you scroll through the forum posts?

To whoever may have hacked the site to show us how smart you are, it's very distracting.

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Achilles -- Stupid socialists are delusional, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:42:59 [1]

Still can't address Cap and Trade Tax or the man made global warming tax scam can you. Old farts like you are the cause of global warming, you are full of methane.

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Thomas thinks obama is god -- Stupid socialists are delusional, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:41:22 [1]

"“I mean in a way Obama’s standing above the country, above – above the world, he’s sort of God.” – Newsweek’s Evan Thomas on Obama’s speech at Cairo University in June 2009"

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Murray -- Thomas article and Palin, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:39:50 [1]

Thomas is a shill Evan Thomas is a Newsweek editor who is squarely in the bag for the left

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Who posting here on the Right was complaining about Bush's deficits or that he never once vetoed a bill?" -- SkyHawk, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:36:42 [1]
I protested Bush's pushing through his Farm Bill and prescription drug bill.

Pay attention, DickHead!

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un Newsweek's Thomas is in the hammer and sickle obama bag -- Poster 273, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:33:44 [1]

Thomas shills for obamb The former link worked at first, now it redirects to Voy. Maybe they don't like links that expose the left.

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:33:38 [1]

“Who posting here on the Right was complaining about Bush's deficits or that he never once vetoed a bill?“
Other than me, Dr. Stadler?
Now back to the main question:
I’m curious why you are so silent about the apparent fudging of data to “prove” man is causing global warming.
As a man of hard science, as you so often and boorishly claimed, I thought you would be the first to stand up and decry what fakirs like Mann did to honest scientific research.
I expected you to berate those who conveniently “lost” the original raw data leaving us only with what has been, according to Mann, “tricked”.
Why so silent about the theft of science and scientific principles in the name of political gain.
Are you this far gone that you place your faith in liars instead of science, Dr. Stadler?

Poopsie?

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Achilles -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:16:06 [1]
RE: "Who posting here on the Right was complaining about Bush's deficits or that he never once vetoed a bill?"
I complained about his socialistic spending during both of his terms. On the question of vetos you are wrong. He vetoed one bill. I forget what it was but it deserved to be vetoed. It was late in his second term.

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Achilles -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:14:39 [1]
RE: "Who posting here on the Right was complaining about Bush's deficits or that he never once vetoed a bill?"
I complained about his spending during both of his terms. On the question of vetos you are wrong. He vetoed one bill. I forget what it was but it deserved to be vetoed. It was late in his second term.

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Jim From KC -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 15:07:01 [1]
RE: "Wasn't Coinky dink's husband named Bill?"
Yes, but if I fremember right, he was older than I am and very sick. I expect that he might be dead by this time.

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anon a-clown in case you missed it: Time Magazine: Obama's Stimulus Plan: Failing by Its Own Measure -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 14:25:31 [1]

By Stephen Gandel Tuesday, Jul. 14, 2009
Back in early January, when Barack Obama was still President-elect, two of his chief economic advisers — leading proponents of a stimulus bill — predicted that the passage of a large economic-aid package would boost the economy and keep the unemployment rate below 8%. It hasn't quite worked out that way. Last month, the jobless rate in the U.S. hit 9.5%....
This was in July. The unemployment rate is now officially at 10.2%. It was at 7.2% when Obama took office. So, anon a-clown, looks like you're the one who more fits the description of bald-faced liar and con-artist.
The two advisers who wrote the paper, Christina Romer and Jared Bernstein, went on to land key jobs in the Obama Administration. Romer is the head of Obama's Council of Economic Advisers, and Bernstein is the chief economist and economic-policy adviser to Vice President Joe Biden. And the stimulus bill that both economists championed became law in mid-February. What has not come to pass, however, is the boom in job creation that Romer and Bernstein predicted. A little over a month ago, the Administration said the stimulus bill had created or saved 150,000 jobs. That's a far cry from the 3 million to 4 million jobs that Romer and Bernstein foresaw back in January.

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"(anonymous assclown)" -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:15:21 -- Bill, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 14:17:08 [1]
Murray, the words are Obama's, and that is what he sold.
Unemployment will get worse before it gets better is what he plainly said.
We all knew that, Murray. Nothing could prevent it, and Obama said so.
Your straw man arguments flow more freely when you are looking at the straw man in your mirror, I take it.

You never answered the question -- in the winter of 1929, how many Republicans or Democrats thought the Great Depression would be as severe as it later became, when unemployment was 25% in the USA?

Yet, you whine because unemployment has risen to 10% from 8% in a disaster that Obama and the Democrats only inherited from the stupidest president and most corrupt congress since Reconstruction.

Man, you're a bald-faced liar and a con artist. Obama didn't promise you a rose garden that grows no thorns, and you know it. Quit whining.

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Who posting here on the Right was complaining about Bush's deficits -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 13:58:43 [1]

Why do you think we all pretty much disown him, genius.
Fiscal discipline-wise he was a train wreck.
Obama is worse, of course. A detail you conveniently left out.
Must suck to you be you right now, by the way, with the exposure of massive fraud on the climate issue known as Climategate coming to light.
You sure drank and also dispensed a lot of that "politics masquerading as science" Kool-Aid on this issue.

Last edited by author: Tuesday, December 01, 14:10:38 Edited 2 times.

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a reality check for the Bushies here -- Achilles, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 13:54:29 [1]
"President George W. Bush expanded public spending by 70 percent, more than double the increase under President Clinton. Bush was the first president in 176 years to continue an entire term without vetoing any legislation.

The tax cuts, recession, and increases in outlays all contributed to record budget deficits during the Bush administration. The annual deficit reached record current-dollar levels of US$374 billion in 2003 and US$413 billion in 2004. National debt, the cumulative total of yearly deficits, rose from US$5.7 trillion (58% of GDP) to US$8.3 trillion (67% of GDP) under Bush, as compared to the US$2.7 trillion total debt owed when Ronald Reagan left office, which was 52% of the GDP."

Who posting here on the Right was complaining about Bush's deficits or that he never once vetoed a bill?

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Murray -- Jim from KC, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 13:39:07 [1]
Murray, Gene has been posting on the internet as long as I have and neither of us has ever changed our names. I have never and I don't think Gene has either posted under some guise. If I am ashamed to post something under my name I just won't post it. So far, I haven't been faced with that decision. Although I don't agree with Gene much I think he feels the same.

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So, you don't think "Bill" is Gene, I take it? -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 12:21:05 [1]
Not unless he's on some mood altering drug, Genejane can be checked, he often cut and pastes from the extreme left websites ( not that Bill isn't extreme left ). To me Bill is a "true believer" of what we know to be socialshit programs.

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a Pirate -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 12:09:47 [1]

So, you don't think "Bill" is Gene, I take it?
I see stylistic similarities.

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Wasn't Coinky dink's husband named Bill? -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 12:07:35 [1]
Good call!

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forum -- Jim from KC, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:48:05 [1]
Wasn't Coinky dink's husband named Bill? I seem to remember her husband posting once in awhile and he was articulate too. I don't think this is Gene.

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:35:20 [1]
.
Obama Orders 1 Million US Troops To “Prepare For Civil War”:

Russian Military Analysts are reporting to Prime Minister Putin today that US President Barack Obama has issued orders to his Northern Command’s (USNORTHCOM) top leader, US Air Force General Gene Renuart, to “begin immediately” increasing his military forces to 1 million troops by January 30, 2010, in what these reports warn is an expected outbreak of civil war within the United States before the end of winter.

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Time Magaznine: Obama's Stimulus Plan: Failing by Its Own Measure -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:32:56 [1]

By Stephen Gandel Tuesday, Jul. 14, 2009

Back in early January, when Barack Obama was still President-elect, two of his chief economic advisers — leading proponents of a stimulus bill — predicted that the passage of a large economic-aid package would boost the economy and keep the unemployment rate below 8%. It hasn't quite worked out that way. Last month, the jobless rate in the U.S. hit 9.5%....
The two advisers who wrote the paper, Christina Romer and Jared Bernstein, went on to land key jobs in the Obama Administration. Romer is the head of Obama's Council of Economic Advisers, and Bernstein is the chief economist and economic-policy adviser to Vice President Joe Biden. And the stimulus bill that both economists championed became law in mid-February. What has not come to pass, however, is the boom in job creation that Romer and Bernstein predicted. A little over a month ago, the Administration said the stimulus bill had created or saved 150,000 jobs. That's a far cry from the 3 million to 4 million jobs that Romer and Bernstein foresaw back in January.
http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1910208,00.html#ixzz0W6RDR70u

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"Bill" (anonymous assclown) -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:15:21 [1]

Nice spin move but not good enough.
The Obama Administration sold the $787 billion stimulus bill as a way to hold unemployment under 8%.
Go hump somebody else's leg, "Bill." That's a saying made famous here by a guy named Gene, a person you evidently know very, very well.

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and the discussion continues -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:06:08 [1]
HOUR THREE, today

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Do you think "Bill" is really Gene -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:03:45 [1]
hench........... Billie Jean (make it Billie Gene)

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GeneBill -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:03:33 [1]
RE: "That work begins with this plan -- a plan I am confident will save or create at least three million jobs 'over the next few years.'

--Obama, January 8 stimulus speech"
It is a well known fact that Barack Obysmal is a liar.

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Murray -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:00:45 [1]
RE: "Do you think "Bill" is really Gene?

Could be."
Yes, I do think that Bill is Gene in drag. If you go back to the last time that he was here he made several comments that if he hadn't called himself "Bill" you would have sworn that it was Gene writing them.

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and only a total dumbass -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 11:00:23 [1]
would think it's a good idea to steal billions from the public and pass out hundreds of thousands for $20 jobs. (unless of course, you're just another unprincipled fuk)

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Well it sure as hell ain't science -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:57:44 [1]
science is that which can be shown and demonstrated. CONSENSUS is anything but

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your saving grace -- Bill, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:54:51 [1]
You pose your straw man in the form of a question, Murray.
"We are talking about the stimulus bill that was sold to the American people on the premise that it would hold unemployment under 8% if passed?"
No, we were talking about what Barrack Obama actually claimed when he promoted the stimulus package earlier this year.
"It's important for us to have a bill of sufficient size and scope that we can save or create 4 million jobs. That still means that you're going to have some net job loss, but at least we can start slowing the trend and moving it in the right direction."
-- Obama, Feb 9 stimulus press conference
"That's why we need to put money in the pockets of the American people, create new jobs, and invest in our future. That's why we need to re-start the flow of credit and restore the rules of the road that will ensure a crisis like this never happens again.

That work begins with this plan -- a plan I am confident will save or create at least three million jobs "over the next few years."

--Obama, January 8 stimulus speech

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Gerry -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:53:59 [1]

Do you think "Bill" is really Gene?
Could be.

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Billie Jean (just another fool) -- RSQUARED, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:50:37 [1]
I luv the way the guilt ridden (?) old lefty whitey gives Oogla Boogla the worst street in town and names it Martin Luther King Street. Just another democrat code? (don't wanna' live near this) lol

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I�m curious why you are so silent about the apparent fudging of data to �prove� man is causing global warming. -- a Pirate, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:48:22 [1]
Because it's his religion we're attacking and it's a sin for him to speak out about his religion in a negative way.

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Bill -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:38:34 [1]
RE: "It's a success story that failures won't admit is a success, Murray."
That is a damnmed lie, Gene.

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Achilles -- ThomKaat, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:37:27 [1]

I’m curious why you are so silent about the apparent fudging of data to “prove” man is causing global warming.
As a man of hard science, as you so often and boorishly claimed, I thought you would be the first to stand up and decry what fakirs like Mann did to honest scientific research.
I expected you to berate those who conveniently “lost” the original raw data leaving us only with what has been, according to Mann, “tricked”.
Why so silent about the theft of science and scientific principles in the name of political gain.
Are you this far gone that you place your faith in liars instead of science, Dr. Stadler?

Poopsie?

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Whomever -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:35:02 [1]
RE: "Thomas is in the hammer and sickle bag."
That link didn't work.

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Murray -- Gerryb, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:33:11 [1]
RE: "Is this the same stimulus that was promised to keep unemployment under 8% if passed?"
Yes, it is. You can see how well that worked can't you? Even GeneBill can see that. He won't admit it, though.

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Forum -- Voice, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:18:35 [1]
.
AP Laid-off workers face expiration of health benefit:

WASHINGTON – An auto parts employee laid off from his job last year has been able to hang onto his health insurance because the federal government has picked up most of the tab. That subsidy ends Tuesday for Don Hall and thousands of other Americans.

Hall's premiums will jump $500 a month, becoming unaffordable for him and his wife. A new study finds that many other workers will be in the same position unless Congress acts. ...

A report being released Tuesday by the advocacy group Families USA finds that, on average, unemployed families who lose the COBRA subsidy will see their premiums increase from $389 per month to $1,111 per month, an amount that few long-term unemployed families will be able to afford, the group says.

It finds that premiums of $1,111 would consume 83.4 percent of the average unemployment check, leaving little for food, housing, and other necessities. In nine states — Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Delaware, Florida, Louisiana, Mississippi, South Carolina and Tennessee — COBRA costs would actually exceed unemployment benefits.

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My My, we have a god -- YUK, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 10:02:05 [1]

Thomas is in the hammer and sickle bag.

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Can the commentators be kept honest -- Only by a public that is honestly informed, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:54:43 [1]

Keeping them honest

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Talk about an imbecile -- pas de PC and de Lie, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:42:22 [1]

As such, imbecilic assholes, they refuse to see that Black Friday is a term that retailers use to describe the day that may turn their bottom line black, positive, out of the red. But these imbecilic assholes prefer red for everyone, even the retail bottom line. These twits belong on Twitter.

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Talk about an imbecile -- pas de PC and de Lie, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:39:29 [1]

We can call them twits also. Sold souls. Racists. Liars. Communists. Rich Leftists. Call them what you will, they are imbecilic assholes.

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What the Democrats envision -- Democrats ain't no friends o mine, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:29:45 [1]
http://image.patriotpost.us.s3.amazonaws.com/2009-11-30-brief.jpg
Nice shot of their vision.

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What the Democrats envision -- Democrats ain't no friends o mine, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:28:42 [1]
http://image.patriotpost.us.s3.amazonaws.com/2009-11-30-brief.jpg
Nice shot of their vision.

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RSQUARED -- Murray, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:24:48 [1]

It gives me no joy to have arrived at that conclusion.
It's sad actually.

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About those so-called environmental "scientists" -- pas de ICE mon ami, Tue, Dec 01 2009, 9:24:44 [1]

Why "scientists" Lie Why do pollsters lie, why do politicians lie, why do economists lie, what is in the lie for them?

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