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Subject: Re: Do personal religious values or beliefs affect how nudity is managed within the family ?

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Date Posted: 15:21:36 08/04/17 Fri
In reply to: Mitch 's message, "Re: Do personal religious values or beliefs affect how nudity is managed within the family ?" on 10:04:08 07/20/17 Thu

Since I wrote the comment about not believing that the family's casual attitude of family nudity combined with a non-corporal discipline attitude bore any direct relationship to further "issues," I have been watching other families, almost to the point of taking written notes.
I have come to believe that repressive religious customs and serious corporal disciplines, coupled with strong anti nudity are good predictors of future unresolved sexual and aggressive behaviors.
I bought a new Family Tree program and began to amass family data which gave me the opportunity to contact almost all my cousins who are still living and most of their children constructing a large group to chat with, in person, or by phone and mail, e-mail or snail-mail.
Since those who have married and have children also have a connection with the spouses family, united by blood through their common children. I kept it interesting by tracing all the connected families giving me a base of well over 800 people.
Of course the past generations are mostly deceased and a few stretch back to the 1700s in Europe.
I tried to generate casual conversations to get them to talk about their childhoods and what they could recall their parents, uncles and aunts having told them as they grew up.
Discipline, Religious devotion, and social customs were, and are a big part of what I was seeing, but I tried to do so indirectly.
It is amazing what people do remember when they relax and chat, individually, rather than in large groups about the things their moms and dads did to them.
I had long known that my mom's dad was a sexual predator and huis night time behavior had affected her attitude towards sex in general and boys peepees, mine and my brother's in particular.
And I had had several close adventures with him before he died a painful death which I thought had been some king of stomach cancer. I now suspect that it was an untreated dose of one of those nasty social diseases for several reasons. One the generally vague things my surviving cousins have of what it was , and then how wide was his contacts with the older girls (older than me). I found one story of a fist fight with one of my uncles that seemed to have ended with a shouted comment, "If you ever come near any of my daughters again, I will cut your cock off."
Another source was two male cousins who very quietly, somewhat tearfully admitted, after several glasses of wine that ol'gramps liked to do more than just fondle little boys and girls.
In several of the different family loops there were similar skeletons. It is surprising what a glass of sweet vermouth or two will loosen up. I stopped heavy drinking some forty years ago eventually even socially, but this project needed something to loosen tongues and sweet vermouth with its harmless looking grape juice appearance and taste worked quite well.
There are several stories, with changed names and locals, of course that I may relate as conversations develop here or in another forum. But for now I have a preliminary conclusion. The tales of those who were, or still are strong Catholics (Most of the limbs of the Family Tree are at least ostensibly Catholic. ) tell of religious repression that could almost bring tears to my eyes.
Those families were the least likely to espouse any form of casual nudity were the most likely to use public forced nudity as a punishment. While much of that discipline was private in a closed bedroom, a significant amount was done in the kitchen or living room in front of family members, while some spanking rituals included friends or neighbors. Up to the earlier teens bare bottom spankings were occasionally given in public, a park, the quiet corner of a store, near a stopped auto on the roadside, where ever the offense occurred, things that are seldom seen today.
As posters in this forum and others know and have observed boys were far more likely to be paraded around the house during and after a spanking completely naked. Girls may have had dresses removed and panties lowered but that usually occurred in a closed bedroom or with male siblings sent to be or out to play.
Families that allowed children more latitude in dressing
or not were far less likely to employ a belt or dedicated spanking implement. Boys were allowed casual nudity more often even when a female sibling was present. Where there were several sisters semi-nudity seems to have been common and curiously most boys had never seen their sister even partly naked. Almost all the females who had brothers, younger or older not only had seen their baby brothers completely nude, ,any were frequent bathers or up to mid teens bath supervisors.
All these things were more predominant in the WW II/Depression generation, and less so with their children to the point that bare heiney spankings are quite rare in later generations.
There are several other curious things I noted here and there.
Conversely, he less religious the more likely to discipline in other ways, nudity was less likely to cause a spanking and by the mid teen years both genders had seen their siblings nude or almost nude.
Mow these are my conclusions, based of things I managed to get from relatives, some quite distant. And there were quite a few people who were very tight lipped and only told me of names, relationships, birth dates, places and so on, avoiding personal revelations. In truth quite a few I had only just met, so perhaps if I can develop a warmer relationship I'll learn more.

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Re: Do personal religious values or beliefs affect how nudity is managed within the family ?micheleFFS12:40:50 08/06/17 Sun

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