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Subject: Niagara Really Blew It Author: purplehaze [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: Saturday, June 27, 09:38:50pm Author Host/IP: cpe-74-78-176-69.buffalo.res.rr.com/74.78.176.69 Just saw Bemidji and Omaha got accepted into the WCHA which now opens a spot in the CCHA for Alabama. Niagara should have held out instead of joining the Atlantic. There was so much talk of realignment but Niagara took the easy way out. Burkie was right we should have tried the indy route first than it could have been us. What a disgrace. Burky must be very happy. [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

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[> Subject: Re: Niagara Really Blew It Author: Truthful [Edit] Date Posted: Saturday, June 27, 09:48:26pm Author Host/IP: cache-ntc-ac04.proxy.aol.com/207.200.116.133 You're absolutely right, purplehaze. The AHA was always going to be there for NU , there was need to rush, the indy route for a year or two would have been the wise thing to do. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: me thinks trouble is a brewing Author: dekes1969 [Edit] Date Posted: Saturday, June 27, 10:48:43pm Author Host/IP: pool-98-118-148-102.bflony.fios.verizon.net/98.118.148.102 let the hedgemony begin [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: I was getting worried.... Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Saturday, June 27, 10:49:48pm Author Host/IP: cache-dtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/205.188.116.72 Good to see you back at your old self again. It must have killed you to think of something good to say about a kid from California finding Niagara. Burky doesn't have to pay the bills from the kids flying all over the place to play away games with an uncertain future. He also didn't have to buy up the unsold seats that NU had left over from the CHA. At least they know what they have before them right now. Hindsight is 20-20. Wake up and smell the stench of your discourse. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Niagara Really Blew It Author: Go Purps! [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 02:53:37am Author Host/IP: cpe-74-78-170-218.buffalo.res.rr.com/74.78.170.218 It's interesting that people on here think that NU "blew it" by not getting into the CCHA and by settling for "AHA"... even though these are the same people who think that the Associate Head Coach of 13 years was Jerry Forston (It's Forton, and he left to go to UMass-Lowell). There is a reason that conferences are the way they are in college sports... usually based on college size, location etc. Bemidji State getting into the WCHA... seems fitting considering their are other teams from Minnesota in the conference. Would it make sense for NU to play Michigan, Ohio or Alaska, places in the mid-west or beyond, or teams that are close to NU (Mercyhurst, RIT, Canisius, RoMo)? Would it make sense to take on schools like Ohio State, Notre Dame and Michigan State, where their enrollment is about 10 times the size of Niagara? Where would we have a better shot at the NCAA Tournament? I'm going to say Atlantic Hockey. What makes more sense (like times, location etc.) Atlantic Hockey. For a cost conscious environment that is today's economy, AHA is MUCH better then an indy schedule. Without an autobid, its that much tougher to get into a 16 team tournament. The ONLY game that Niagara sold out last year was the Canisius game - an AHA team... so instead of one of them every two years, we get a few more, which is good for Niagara. It wasn't even sold out for the 2008 CHA Championship game, that we won @ Dwyer. So, for everyone who is so quick to teardown AHA... why so quick to condemn? Besides scholarships, whats bad? We get more rivalries, teams that people are better familiar with. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Your position is defendable only to a point! Author: NOSHOT [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 06:38:22am Author Host/IP: 67-72-98-45.propel.com/67.72.98.45 Where was the business model analysis before NU committed to hockey. To have the chairman of the board publically state major conference, national aspirations, major arena, etc and then quietly back away from such....and try to have us believe that current uipgrades to the rink was all that was in the plans is an insult. But you know, most alums don't give a damn and that's because the admin thinks small local only...that's what separates NU fron the schools you mentioned. The ECAC put NU where it belongs...someplace else as in AHA. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Sorry the above was for Go Purps! Author: NOSHOT [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 08:14:45am Author Host/IP: pool-72-79-209-53.spfdma.east.verizon.net/72.79.209.53 [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: "most alums don't give a damn"...noshot Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 10:07:16am Author Host/IP: cache-dtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/205.188.116.72 There you go, noshot. That was a valuable part of your post. If you have to build a national program in order to get alums to support their school, that pretty much says it all. The vast majority of Niagara alums have ALWAYS been casual observers, and that is where the true power to change things comes from. Could it be that you are beginning to see the light? Nah, you just ran in and out of it. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Your position is defendable only to a point! Author: Go Purps! [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 03:29:27pm Author Host/IP: cpe-74-78-170-218.buffalo.res.rr.com/74.78.170.218 NoShot, There are only approximately 60 D-1 Teams. Taking a look at this year's schedule, if playing Michigan, Cornell, North Dakota, possibly Notre Dame and a hot Bemidji State team isn't a national schedule then I dunno what is. NU has tried to get in the ECAC many times including 2005, but didn't get in. ECAC, Hockey East and AHA are the three viable options for Niagara. Rome wasn't built in a day. And yes, Dwyer isn't what it could be.. but if its good enough to host a rookie camp for the Buffalo Sabres last year and this year, plus approximately half of the 2011 IIHF WORLD Juniors, then it can't be that bad, can it? All in all, to build a national program, we need to make it to the NCAA Tournament. Either we go indy and we have to be near perfect to get in the tournament as an at-large or go to the AHA, with a GUARANTEED autobid. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Your position is defendable only to a point! Author: ha [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 03:47:19pm Author Host/IP: 138.sub-75-193-143.myvzw.com/75.193.143.138 All this complaining is funny. How about winning the AHA tournament before saying the competition is sub par. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Your position is defendable only to a point! Author: RCM [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 04:53:29pm Author Host/IP: cpe-76-180-81-11.buffalo.res.rr.com/76.180.81.11 "And yes, Dwyer isn't what it could be.. but if its good enough to host a rookie camp for the Buffalo Sabres last year and this year, plus approximately half of the 2011 IIHF WORLD Juniors, then it can't be that bad, can it?" One of the best things ever posted here [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Who Cares Anymore, NU Hockey Is Now Irrelevant ! Author: FocusOn Hoops [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 05:50:06pm Author Host/IP: pool-71-186-142-102.bflony.east.verizon.net/71.186.142.102 [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Who Cares Anymore, NU Hockey Is Now Irrelevant ! Author: Go Purps! [Edit] Date Posted: Sunday, June 28, 06:55:58pm Author Host/IP: cache-mtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/64.12.116.72 Irrelevant? It's a FACT that the MIH team have better odds at becoming a national champion instead of MBB. How can people claim to be NU supporters, when they only cheer for ONE of the 18 teams and joke about the others? In 13 years, NU has been to the NCAA Tournament 3 times, 3 regular season championships, several players to NHL/AHL contracts, one of the longest home unbeaten streaks in the nation, while Dwyer Arena plays host to Buffalo Sabres rookie camp and the 2011 IIHF World Championships. But that's all irrelevant right? I don't see the Gallagher Center holding the Raptors mini camp. Seriously, if your going to be an NU fan, then cheer for all of their teams, not just picking and choosing to meet your needs. Not to discount the basketball team, since the JAM era has indeed been magical thus far, but NU hockey has been just as good. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: NO SHOT: NU desired mid-major status/ STUPID ! Author: le [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 08:21:02am Author Host/IP: xpsh2101.hud.gov/170.97.167.61 End of story ! They desire a cost containment mid-major league as opposed to major conf. affiliation. The innovative hockey minds have all left NU, time for Burky to get out as well. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: NO SHOT: NU desired mid-major status/ STUPID ! Author: nubball86 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 09:06:03am Author Host/IP: NoHost/12.228.1.30 Nice Name calling. I thought this might be the bball site. With regard for hockey. I know it is hard for the 3-4 hockey fan's to believe but NU loses lots of money on hockey, add in women's hockey for T IX and the loses are higher. Plus there is zero to know alumni support with equals zero dollars (Dwyers would have donated to something else). Non of the big 6 leagues had any interest in NU. We did not geographically or size of school. Indepenedent would have cost even more money. END OF STORY. Go win the CHA or AHA numerous times and you can bitch about what we missed. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Double Standard Author: Truthful [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 09:43:43am Author Host/IP: cache-ntc-ac04.proxy.aol.com/207.200.116.133 Interesting how money is always an issue when it comes to hockey, but money seems to no factor with men's basketball with JAM passing up in excess of $100,000 a year in playing two up games . If money is needed to help the other athletic programs, what's the harm in playing two up games. We need an AD who actually can make a decision on his own. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Double Standard Author: nubball86 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 09:53:30am Author Host/IP: NoHost/12.228.1.30 1st. I do not give a s*** about other sports. I would help men's hockey if we did not have this farce of women's hockey. 2nd. You always mention 100k + for guarantee games but have never proven where you lack of information comes from, Please do not waste my time with Travelers. By the way. SU is not paying a guarantee for us to come to the dome. This is direct form Coach B. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Double Standard Author: Truthful [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 10:08:00am Author Host/IP: cache-ntc-ac04.proxy.aol.com/207.200.116.133 "2nd. You always mention 100k + for guarantee games but have never proven where you lack of information comes from, Please do not waste my time with Travelers. " Are you kidding ???? Travelers is where colleges post requests for various type games. Just what type of proof are looking for ? You say that SU won't play NU without a shred of evidence and yet we are expected to believe it, however, information publically posted on Traveler's is not proof enough for you. So let's see , Coach Boeheim is refusing to play NU on what basis ? Oh yeah, now I remember , SU is afraid to play NU, darn I keep forgetting. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: truthful just doesn't get it.... Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 10:11:54am Author Host/IP: cache-dtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/205.188.116.72 If playing guarantee basketball was the way to go, you would NEVER see a team advertising to offer them. I bet 80% or more of college BB teams lose money, so one would wonder why the 85%+ aren't fighting with each other to death in order to enter into such agreements. truthful is completely blind to this understanding of the situation. You would even wonder if he understands that teams want to win games more than to fund other money losing sports. The guy just doesn't get it. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: in addition....how about the offspring? Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 10:15:34am Author Host/IP: cache-dtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/205.188.116.72 The university athletic programs apparently were good enough for truthful to send his child up here to be a part of one of them. That pretty much is the END OF STORY to me. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: in addition....how about the offspring? Author: Truthful [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 11:02:41am Author Host/IP: cache-ntc-ac04.proxy.aol.com/207.200.116.133 I've seen first hand the things the "other " athletic programs must do in order to raise revenue . As an example , some teams are required to work the Buffalo Bills games , working the concession stands , and yes, serving beer to more than their fair share of drunks . In addition, they must work the basketball games serving as ushers or selling programs. There's nothing wrong with making sacrifices, but it seems as though the sacrifices should be made across the board. So what if a couple of losses are incurred in the OOC..... things need to be done for the benefit of the university and not for the benefit of a select few. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Would you see beer for 120K in free education? Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 11:53:10am Author Host/IP: cache-mtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/64.12.116.72 I sure as hell would. Wake up and smell the stench of your discourse. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Double Standard Author: nubball86 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 10:13:31am Author Host/IP: NoHost/12.228.1.30 I quess talking with C Beihem and him telling me that he does not want to pay a guarantee to play NU in the dome is not good enough. By the way on Travelers, they say guarantees and high Guarantees but do not mention the $ figures but since everything out of your posts are speculation than this is a good one as well. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Double Standard Author: Truthful [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 10:51:33am Author Host/IP: cache-ntc-ac04.proxy.aol.com/207.200.116.133 I suggest you back to your pal Coach Boeheim and I'm sure he'll explain to you what the range for " guarantee " and " high guarentee " are. As an EXAMPLE....Middle Tennessee State is offering a guarantee of $50,000.....I'm sure some schools offer less and some offer more . No, I'm NOT suggesting NU play Middle Tennessee , I merely pointing out the opportunities that exist if one is truly committed to generating revenue for the school. Actions speak louder than words ! [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: You just gotta be dumber than dirt. Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 11:46:01am Author Host/IP: cache-mtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/64.12.116.72 They don't want NU for 50K. They want a bigger school you idiot. Thay can pick or choose which one they want as well. How can you FOR A FRIGGIN MINUTE think that they will pay NU 50K to play them? [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Hey truthful.... Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 11:55:33am Author Host/IP: cache-mtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/64.12.116.72 If NU had said to me that in exchange for free education, I would have to raise some bucks by selling beer at the Bills games, I would be the first guy there. I think a great sacrificve is giving free rides to athletes who otherwise might not have gotten such a generous offer...what u say to that? [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: NO SHOT: NU desired mid-major status/ STUPID ! Author: nubball86 [Edit] Date Posted: Tuesday, June 30, 10:14:53am Author Host/IP: NoHost/74.191.76.105 Truthful Say something nice about JAM, I dare you. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: NO SHOT: NU desired mid-major status/ STUPID ! Author: Truthful [Edit] Date Posted: Tuesday, June 30, 11:00:19am Author Host/IP: cache-ntc-ac04.proxy.aol.com/207.200.116.133 nubball86 Unlike you, I evaluate things on their merit, not on my personal relationships with an individual. You have a personal relationship with him and therefore there isn't any semblance of objectivity in your positions . Nobody suggests that JAM is a bad person, to the contrary, he's a good guy. The issues I have with him are his reluctance to the following : keep fans informed, to play a game at HSBC , to play two up games a year to help the university's other athletic programs , raise the bar for the basketball program . His status quo mindset is going to leave NU basketball in the dust as Siena is clearly taking their program to the next level. In addition , it won't be long before Iona catches us if we continue on the same path. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: raise the bar for the basketball program ???? Author: dekes1969 [Edit] Date Posted: Tuesday, June 30, 09:56:52pm Author Host/IP: pool-98-118-148-102.bflony.fios.verizon.net/98.118.148.102 now truthful the other items you listed are issues that you have a somewhat strong argument but if you do not think that in his 11 years at NU JAM has not raised the bar for this program you are really missing something. just look at the expectations and the results for his tenure and then look at the 20 years before him... if that is not raising the bar and what the expectations are I would like to see what fills the bill [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Sorry - this thread is ridiculous ! Author: DD [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 12:17:26pm Author Host/IP: NoHost/38.117.216.142 WCHA - Note the word WESTERN ! We're bent outta shape cuz teams in Nebraska and Minnesota have joined a league that makes GEOGRAPHIC sense for THEM ??? What in God's green earth has this got to do with Niagara Hockey ? Appears some here are in favor of running the school into the freaking ground, let alone the hockey program. Multiple annual travel dates to ALASKA, COLORADO, MINNESOTA, NEBRASKA ??? BULLETIN - NU Hockey has always LOST MONEY and would lose MUCH MORE MONEY if we ever were stupid enough to join a far-flung league like the WCHA. 90% of ALL COLLEGE HOCKEY teams lose money ! Do we have any finance majors here ? Anyone ever do a budget ? Why am I wasting my breath on such nonsensical tripe as this ???? ENOUGH....I'm begging....please ENOUGH ! [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: You have to remember, DD. Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 02:13:59pm Author Host/IP: cache-mtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/64.12.116.72 Those who have done the most complaining are NU graduates themselves. What else would you expect from a bunch who know-it-all but have no experience or training in the field they are "experts" in. Maybe we know now why NU is not among the top colleges. Get a load of some of the alumni. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Niagara Really Blew It Author: nubball86 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 02:11:29pm Author Host/IP: NoHost/12.228.1.30 Because basketballis supposed to pay for everything else. We are NFalls version of Duke Stop being logical you will get drilled by the know it alls. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Niagara Really Blew It Author: DHC [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 04:05:05pm Author Host/IP: mail.thepreferredgroup.com/216.136.44.83 NU is mismanaged and has no one to blame but inept administration under the Vincentians since Fr. Golden who was run out. The Trustees are a rubber stamp and should be retired as well. It has been and will continue to be one excuse after another under the Vincentian regime who are determined to hold on to power.. Other schools that once existed in the shadows of NU have now passed Her by and are not looking back. The idea that mediocrity is somehow acceptable is and should be an anathema to an educational institution. It is time for NU to shed its Vincentia leadership(?). They are clueless. Location isn’t the issue and it isn’t the alumni who are completely ignored by the athletic administration and constantly denied insight into the hoops program development. Hoops is and will remain primary asset in developing alumni support. If the hoops program ignores their interests who can fault them for looking elsewhere and support other entitites? [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Now explain what you propose.... Author: Purp 1 [Edit] Date Posted: Monday, June 29, 04:52:56pm Author Host/IP: cache-mtc-ab08.proxy.aol.com/64.12.116.72 What interests of the alumni are you refering to? The Vincentian part was pretty spot on. Poor managers. But hey, they will be the first to tell you that they are supposed to be missionaries first. That's the part they can't get over. They don't see the possibilities of duality. To be frank, the NU Alumni Association could actually be a very powerful arm of the school except for the fact that few give that much of a shit about their alma mater enough to spend their precious time involved with it. They will from time to time however write their complaints out on a sports board because it's easy, annonymous and doesn't cost a dime. A completed puzzle has a lot of pieces, but if they don't come together you never finish the puzzle. The alumni could be steering the ship instead of expecting the basketball team to do it for them, and that assumes that they give a shit enough to reciprocate big time in the financial department should things go their way. This is not a gripe of your post by any means. It is right on for the most part. I'm just saying that you (assuming you are a NU grad) ARE the NU Alumni Association and your absence means that others run the show. It could easily go the other way. Just have to gather the pieces like in a puzzle. There are many other "interests" than basketball for NU donors...like Castellani, Dwyer, et all. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]