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Re: Hanging tough -- oldtimer #1, Saturday, January 10, 12:42:42am [1]
That's right Cindy, Nick and Ryan are two examples of players who are developing well. Both are halfway through their Sophomore year and only a blind man would refuse to see their progress. Haven't seen Nick trapped once this year or his pocket picked. Still turnover prone but mainly due to his aggressive style of play. Resonable observers may disagree with that style but I like it. Outplayed Lewis tonight. Defense has also improved tremendously.
Bacon may be even a bigger development story. The last few games his offense has picked up dramatically. Wants the ball and wants to score. Beautiful moves around the basket tonight but still no face to the basket game. All-MAAC potential next year if he gets some help (Conley), which will allow him to freelance. That is what he does best.
The box score will not reflect Reid's positive play and impression on all the fans in attendance. Still looks a bit lost, in terms of positioning, but eye opening passes (not converted), rebounds and blocks. One astute fan mentioned that when we lost Brandon Hall to fouls and with Dunne reinserting Reid that may have been a net positive. More than held his own against the strength and athleticism of several Niagara players.
Finally, a word about each players work ethic and intensity on the court. Except for one or two games this year, our team effort has been outstanding.While winning ugly still beats losing well this ongoing effort does say something about the kids and even the coach.
Bottom line is that we need another scorer, especially at #3. If we get that (if, if if..) we will have more than a competitive team within the MAAC. Meanwhile let's see if we can pull off any upsets.
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Re: Hanging tough -- SPC Fan, Saturday, January 10, 09:09:18am [1]
Agree on all counts with the above. Only negative from the night was the continued toal lack of offense from Brandon Hall. Best lineup we had on the floor was Bacon,Costner,Reed,Jekins ,Leon.
On the plus side for Hall he is very good handling against the press and has learned to push it up court aggressively rather than stop or dribble side to side breaking pressure. Problem is complete lack of offense in half court. Defends very well.If he is to be our point guard of the future he must develop some semblence of a shot and learn how to shoot free throws at least.
I was pleasantly surprised with the play of Reed. Showed fine passing ability and very strong underneath for his size. With Gooding out he got his chance finally for some time. Hope we see more of him as the season goes on.
Leon had to me his best career game ,intense yet under control and agressive.Bacon was outstanding against big Niagara center. Costner was strong on the boards as well. If only he was strong enough to get his shot on his drive down the stretch when he had the shot.
Overall fine effort against what i think may well be the best team in the league.
On another note Mihalich may be the best coach in the league. I love the way they play aggressive defense and are so physical even when playing their smaller lineup. He does a great job in a place where it's very tough to get players utilizing transfers,JUCO'S and his Philly conection for High School talent. Remember he was Speedy Morris' assistant at La Salle during their glory years in the early 90's.
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Re: Hanging tough -- loyal, Saturday, January 10, 11:04:09am [1]
Bacon and Leon has the best games I have seen them play in a St. Peter's uniform. Ryan Bacon is making strides as this season progresses, no doubt about it.
Reid and Hill show occasional glimmers of promise during their cameos....way too early for me to determine what type of players they can be. We can only hope Hill is a hard worker; if so, his upside (in two years?) is pretty big. Question is, does he go the Alex Roberts or Kinzey Reeves route?
Wesley will come out of it sooner or later. I think he is pressing because he knows he has to score big for the club to win. Wesley will be outstanding in the MAAC if the players around him get better.
Brandon Hall's long term development is critical to this roster's ability to succeed. We can take solace in the fact Jasper Walker couldn't drop the ball in the ocean as a frosh, but became an adequate scorer later in his career, given everything else he brought to the table. I think Hall will be a functional scorer eventually; only question with me remains his quickness and whether or not his "D" and passing can rise to a "premier" level....like Jasper.....whose passing in transition, hands and overall defense were outstanding.
Will say Niagara looked pretty good, even when shooting under 30% or so for the game!! When the Purps have a decent shooting game, they definitely are in the same class as the Saints this season. Kudos to JM...again.
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Re: Hanging tough -- jajk, Saturday, January 10, 12:27:39pm [1]
I was not able to make game so appreciative of everyone's comments . A poster here in the past has talked with some justification ,about Dunne's failure to establish an identity for the team into third year . Always being an optimistic rooter ( I just find it is more fun that way ), maybe , just maybe in the last three games we are starting to see signs of that . We held some high-scoring teams and players pretty well in check over this span . It was nice to see Schneider , Ubiles and Lewis( plus Benn , Garrison )not go off on us . I have no problems at all with fans of opponents talking about ugly basketball or their teams having off nights in a game they took for granted .
Both Dukiet and Fiore put teams on the floor where no passing lane was safe and virtually every bucket was contested . And there is the potential for that with this team . That will keep us in lots of games as this young team establishes a better offensive flow . Gooding can be the kind of stopper we have had on SPC solid teams in the past , and Ryan and Wesley , while still subject to getting beat one on one at this stage in their careers , have the potential to be really excellent parts of "team" defense . Costner , Hall , Hill and Reid all show signs of being valuable to this kind of team identity . But this kind of basketball is really dependent on wanting it every minute of court time you get . But just one fan that wants to say , I am appreciative of the players' efforts .
From the first minute that I saw Ryan on the floor at the Rutgers summer league a year and one-half ago , I said to myself this is going to be a young man that it is going to fun to root for over four years . He has done nothing to disappoint that expectation . And great to hear your comments about Wesley and see his stats last night . In the midst of a struggle scoring now , 3 assists ,8 rebounds , a steal and a block are all positives that he is fighting through it . Lastly , as one poster who at times has talked about not believing that Leon should be our point , let me say that it was just great that he had such a big game . Obvious that this team needs his scoring abilities in a big way .
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Re: Hanging tough -- oldtimer#1, Saturday, January 10, 01:21:09pm [1]
Don't want to beat a dead horse especially since I respect different points of view. I'm not as worried about whether Brandon Hall develops or not as you are. I liked your original posts about the need for a stud at #3. If we get that player the development of Hall while important is not as crucial as one thinks. With two or three scorers Hall has less pressure to be a scorer than is apparent now. That said, I totally agree with SPC Fan's point that Brandon will have to develop some type of offensive game to keep opponents honest.
Hate to keep harping on this Leon thing, especially since I respect figgy's point of view on this topic, but the kid has been bad mouthed by some (not figgy) from the start. First, why is he playing over Lampley?, next he can't play defense, can't handle the ball, gets trapped, turns it over too much etc., etc, etc. Since a lot of negative posters only appear after a poor game by our team or players I'll take a que from their book and state the Leon case before he has that inevitable stinker game.
No player is given the complete package, especially at 5'10" but Nick is a player. And just to negate those who don't attend games Nick rarely has been trapped this year, handles the ball equally as well or better than any player on the team including Hall (both are excellent) and, as pointed out last year, drives and finishes at the hoop as well as any small player in the league. Has the ability to get to the foul line where he his head and shoulders above any player we have and almost anyone in the league. He played 39 minutes last night and handles the ball game in and game out much more than Hall. Just like Wesley he gets the attention of the top defenders. Last night it was Lewis who he outplayed and we all know his credentials. Nick's defense this year has improved dramatically and he is every bit as good a defensive player as Hall. No doubt Wesley is our star and like Bacon has much more upside than Nick (figgy's point with which I agree entirely) but Nick has had the better season to date. All three are Sophomores.
Now to what I consider the valid criticisms. Nick will turn the ball over. He is a combo guard who can play the #2 or #1. But so was Spann and I'm not one of those who bemoans the fact that we don't have Kevin. Gave Nick a chance to shine and Hall hopefully develop. Nick attempts to make the aggressive pass and as SPC Fan pointed out last night often gets credited with a turnover when some of our interior players exhibit hands of stone. Some should try to understand that when you drive and create that you will be stripped on occassion, throw the bad pass or have good passes go through the hands of less talented players. Note that Brandon Hall did attempt to become more aggressive last night, driving and dishing. Look at the results. It may have been his first negative assit/turnover game. No suprise. When you are a creator you will turn the ball over. When you sit back and wait for players to come off screens it's easy to have nice stats. No knock on either type of player. By the way, check out Wesley's assists/turnover ratio. Similar or worse than Nick's because Wesley also drives and creates.
So Loyal you are right on target with that wish for a #3. Think we have all reached that consensus. However, if we do get that player I want Nick to be on the court 25 plus minutes per game. All that garbage that he can't play the #1 is just that. He's a natural #2 but becomes invaluable in that he can play either position. You don't prove things on a posting board, you do it on the court. At #1 or #2 Nick is a player, period.
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Re: Hanging tough -- figgyprez, Sunday, January 11, 12:29:45am [1]
No doubt that Nick shut me up for a night. He was perhaps the best player on the floor. Only thing is that we've seen false starts before. I am looking forward to whether he can continue vs Loyola tomorrow. One big thing to remedy- Down 5 we got three straight stops but no points. Now Niagara is better and knows better how to win at this point, but it is opportunities like this that we need to capitalize on. I"m not blaming anyone, just making a point about knowing how to win. Also I still think that the refs missed a critical one on NU's bucket to get to 60. Possession started at 5:15 and ended at 4:39. Do the math shot clock violation. A win is imoporatnt tomorrow
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Re: Hanging tough -- Cindy Crawford, Sunday, January 11, 07:24:01am [1]
Shot clock violation was clear,but I would put the blame on the SPC timekeeper.
Through the years we have been hurt many times by their incompetency.
I would suggest that they be sent to Monmouth U. for lessons in how to establish a real home court advantage rather than a disadvantage.
Also agree that a win is very big today.I hope Akeem can return and contribute,and that Wes finds himself.
Also looking forward to the Patsos comedy hour.
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Re: Hanging tough -- oldtimer#1, Sunday, January 11, 08:24:27am [1]
figgy, you're a stand up guy whose posts I enjoy. You take a position and explain your reasons why and never in a put down type of style. I respect and enjoy your point of view. As several posters have pointed out, reasonable people can disagree especially since none of us are experts (who is?).
With regard to Nick Leon, I understand your position quite well. You respect his playing ability but have serious doubts that he would be a starter on an upper tier MAAC team. You see him as a valuable role player. I see him as more than that. Our differences are probably different shades of the same color.
Nick had some very good games last year. I can think of several but one that I just checked the stat line was Providence. Shot 5/7, 12 points, 3 steals, 8 assists 1 turnover. Not bad for a freshman. Of course he had some poor games and had certain parts of his game that needed improvement. I think as a Soph. he has developed well. In three of our four wins he has been our dominant player (Wes did not play at NJIT). Even at the Cansius game where Wesley played lights out, Nick was almost as good.
IMO our future is with Wesley, Ryan and Nick and the two other now famous players that we may or may not have to be named later. Wes is our star and Ryan has the potential to be one. I would hope that Nick would be a solid contributor but I do not see his upside as great as theirs. With regard to how he plays this afternoon, I don't care if he goes 0 for the world, he has already proven himself to be a very, very good player.
I also agree with you and Cindy that a win today will be very big. It's definitely a game we could win. However, expectations are funny. The odds makers have us as a slight underdog (including whatever home court advantage they think we have). This tells me they think our chances of winning are slightly below 50%. Many of us are so anxious for a win that we will be disapointed if we don't put a W up on the board. Guess I will be also but it's not as if we should. JD and staff need to prove something and another loss will probably just confirm the lack of success the program has shown to date. In that we probably agree.
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Not going to make it an issue -- Peacock, Sunday, January 11, 10:38:41am [1]
But you do need to stop representing issues that make you feel good. The issue on Leon and Lampley was not who should be started but who should have been groomed at the point. In fact a major dispute last year was not that Leon was bad but that he was better suited at the 2 and was more a 2 guard. That is the fact that you are seeing today. The fact that by default he must play the point due to zero offense at that position does not alter the argument. In fact how many assists did Leon have at the Niagara game. In the end most felt both Leon and Lampley belonged on the floor, and not anywhere near the issue of who was the better player. Add in you midget arguments and one can see that revisionism is a key to your positions.
Also despite your need to continually invoke agreement with others and praise for others while throwing some stones shows that you are no more than a closet caricature of those you want to take shots at.
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Re: Not going to make it an issue -- oldtimer#1, Sunday, January 11, 12:34:48pm [1]
Try to stop telling other people what they need to do and your need to become an amateur psychologist.I read your posts last year and typical of when you feel threatened you rewrite the issue or ,at best, try to tone it down. Your posts last year were not as you try to represent above. Most were written in your typical put down style, and there were many. I've tried to keep you out of my posts but obviously I struck a nerve. Live with it, you create your own problems.
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Re: Not going to make it an issue -- Peacock, Sunday, January 11, 05:36:28pm [1]
You are so pompous it hurts. The issue was always about point guard and you sir are the classic revisionist. You got caught lying about an incident I supposedly had with Leckie and you now formulate lies to fit your need. From what I can tell you also lied about knowing anything about the Spann issue.
When one analyzes your position, you are an employee of St Peter's College athletic department that pretends to be objective and constantly defends or objects to anything that might put your buddies in a bad light. Why else does it take you so long to justify your own opinion. Let Drutz do the spin control as he is paid to do it. Also you should try reading the archives, you might see what kind of jerk you really are.
Just for fun go to these posts, and I can put up quite a few more to show what kind of biased jerk you really are.
Lampley Discussion If you don't recognize who BBIQ, just look in the mirror.
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Careful, before you self indict -- Sludge, Sunday, January 11, 05:53:35pm [1]
hmmmmmmmmmm....thank you for reminding who was critical of Dunne for bringing in too many midgets. Guess Jenkins of Iona did not fit that description.
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Re: Not going to make it an issue -- oldtimer#1, Sunday, January 11, 10:05:56pm [1]
Unfortunately, for you, your reputation has already been established in your history of posting. Don't like being called a liar but somehow from you I don't mind. So I took your advice and cherrypicked on my own. Here were some of your quotes on Leon: "too slow", "not a good head for smart basketball", "not even adequate at the point" and my favorite "his drives are horrible at best". Huh! Nick is the best driver and finisher on the team and among the best in the league!!!
It gets even better in funnier. Today you asked me how many assists did Nick get against Niagara? I nominate that for the stupidest post of the year. The guy scored 25 pts., was, along with Ryan Bacon, clearly the best player on the floor. Who cares how many assists he had! Stupid
Finally, regarding the Spann issue. While you pontificating about why Spann left I merely posted that I had no idea what happened and unless someone was in the room all, is hearsay and conjecture. Guess I hurt your feelings by challenging that you know the facts about every situation. One poster chided you and asked if you were a family member. That was funny also. Never met or knew Kevin Spann and posted that unless someone was in the room that all anyone posted was speculation and conjecture. Have a problem with that or were you indeed in the room?
Can't seem to lose you. Post your BS but try to keep me out of your stuff.
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Your lack of civility is only surpassed by your lack of recall -- Sludge, Sunday, January 11, 05:41:24pm [1]
You are a master of viewing through your anal end. A little bit of misdirection, mixed with your customary attempt to play loose with the facts once more.
Wonder who the "most" are that believed Leon and Lampley belonged in the same backcourt together. Yes, the lack of size was in fact an issue. Leon, Lampley, Jenkins and Orta on the same floor together? I don't think so. While most might agree that Nick is better suited for the 2, few, at least last year, saw Lampley with the capability, demeanor or understanding to handle the point. Thus, by necessity, Nick was burdened with the responsibilty for the lead. Only with Hall's arrival this year has he been able to gradually spend more time at the 2.
Nick has become without doubt our most valuable player this year. Oldtimer was probably the most perceptive in pointing this out to us, even as early as when last year was drawing to a close. Unlike some, I can admit to a change in my appraisal, first viewing Nick as too slow or weak defensively to be a major contributor. While some may also view player development as non existent under Dunne, the last several games are beginning to show that this is not the case (see Bacon).
I find amusing again your attempt to seek miniscule fault for detraction so that you might continue to hold fast to your intransigent agenda. Taking issue with Nick not having any assists in the Niagara game only further marks your ignorance. Perhaps your frequent reliance on a radio account for information may be responsible, as further examination would have revealed that Nick played only half the game at point and, by necessity, was forced to become the shooter and scorer. Others, aside from maybe Bacon, could not be relied upon to receive the ball and execute. Thus, the lack of any assists.
While Oldtimer has tried to establish some dialogue and reasonable debate, you continue to see stones that undoubtedly emanate and rebound from the source that I address. A good win today. Maybe it will give some the opportunity to relect upon one of our staff's primary objectives this year. Remember amongst all our criticisms what it was? DEFENSE!!!! Along with game management this seems to be what has kept us competitive of late. Call it playing ugly if you choose. Much like the detractors and mindless from the other boards that only know to love their own.
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