Date Posted:18:25:56 10/24/02 Thu Author: Yasmin Author Host/IP: banksia.netfilter.com.au / 203.222.130.26 Subject: Re: *blows the FictionAlley.Org minion Trumpet!* In reply to:
Sacrastic Sassy Laura
's message, "*blows the FictionAlley.Org minion Trumpet!*" on 14:12:28 10/24/02 Thu
You are a sick, psychotic loser who I am not going to waste any more of my time on. You're a jealous fuckwit who needs Anger Management therapy some unheard of little tosspot who has nothing better to do than pick on others. Well, let me tell you this, the only reason people know who 'Laura Hale' or 'Michaela Ecks' are is because of your bad mouthing, psychotic personality. Nobody knows you for your writing, and even if it were good (which I highly doubt) you would never gain popularity for it because of your acidic and repellent personality.
Way too many hostile personalities out there for my taste. Political campaign managers could learn a thing or two about demonizing opponents from the goings on here. Mind you, even they would cut down on the swearing.
>You are a sick, psychotic loser who I am not going to
>waste any more of my time on. You're a jealous fuckwit
>who needs Anger Management therapy some unheard of
>little tosspot who has nothing better to do than pick
>on others. Well, let me tell you this, the only reason
>people know who 'Laura Hale' or 'Michaela Ecks' are is
>because of your bad mouthing, psychotic personality.
>Nobody knows you for your writing, and even if it were
>good (which I highly doubt) you would never gain
>popularity for it because of your acidic and repellent
>personality.
Oh, and prove to me how CC writes and doesn't just copy?
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Re: *blows the FictionAlley.Org minion Trumpet!* -- Laura, 19:31:18 10/24/02 Thu(dialup-65.57.9.13.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net/65.57.9.13)
>>You are a sick, psychotic loser who I am not going to
>>waste any more of my time on.
Hmmm... One would sense you did.
>> You're a jealous fuckwit
I am jealous of...? You? Did I ever call you a fuckwit? Oh. Wait. I'm jealous of your astounding vocabulary, your witty come backs!
Okay, I'm not. :) This is my board. I didn't call you a fuckwit. I didn't say you needed anger managements. I was... to say amused by your behavior, guessed the buttons to press and PRESSED THEM. (te he he he. That makes me smarter than you.)
>>who needs Anger Management therapy
*te ha he ha* I'm not the person posting to another person's message board, to another person's site, going "JEALOUSY!" on a board about ethics. (Oh, wait. Brutally honest moment, I did accuse you of something... What was it? Oh yes. Being a minion trumpeting the drum of your leader in a way that makes you look bad and others look bad.)
>> some unheard of
>>little tosspot
I think you're looking for despot. That's my egotistical side you are flattering there.
BTW, did you go after the other despots who accused your friend, the great copy machine, of plagiarism? or am I special case because you really like me? (Because we all know that you want me. I'm hot and Cassie's not. I've been told that. *waggles eyes brows*)
>>who has nothing better to do than pick
>>on others.
I'll stop picking on you... I'll delete my part in this conversation. I'll just like leave yours here. Is that okay with you? :) Then people go go "Oh oh oh! Look at poor laura!" No wait. That would assume I have people and I give a rats ass about people looking at me. No, honestly, they'll go "he he he. Fuckwit. Now that rquires intelligence to come up with. I can see why she hangs out with plagiarism. She can't write her own lines." te he he he. (That's me picking on you in case you missed it.)
>> Well, let me tell you this, the only reason
>>people know who 'Laura Hale' or 'Michaela Ecks' are is
>>because of your bad mouthing, psychotic personality.
Bad mouthing? Gee... Did I call any one a fuckwit? No... darling, I know you're not going to read this but that was you.
I don't blast others outside of this board. That would be... who again? Oh yes, Heidi Tandy e-mailing people telling them to stay away from FanDomination.Net and me. Wait, that would put the impetus not on people having observed my behavior but on FICTIONALLEY.ORG! OMG, you destroyed your whole argument.
No one gives two shits about me. :) Let's keep it that way.
And why this obsession with me anyway? (Oh, because I'm hot and you want me. *baps ego* STOP THAT ego. You're just assuming everyone is jealous of you.)
>>Nobody knows you for your writing,
So what?
>> and even if it were
>>good
Once again, who cares? You're making this argument because YOU can't argue that plagiarism is ethical and that Cassandra Claire is nothing but a copy machine.
>>(which I highly doubt)
*tsk tsk* Do some research.
>>you would never gain
>>popularity for it because of your acidic and repellent
>>personality.
You know... Who wants popularity? Seriously, if you're writing to be popular, I find that repellant and offensive. Our views on right and wrong and motivation are at such opposite ends of the spectrum that I don't think you have the cranial capacity to understand my view points. (Ouch! Zinger! That was a slam at your IQ. Bad me.) I can understand your argument that what Cassandra Claire does is not plagiarism, is original and is just reconstituting material like many great writers before her. Hell, Shakespeare was a plagiarist too! (See, she has good company.)
I just refuse to accept that behavior as kosher. Beyond that, I really don't care. Oh wait, I will use your friend as an example of what not to do because it's so easy to relate and point because you know, she is highly visible and the evidence is so very much out there. People use names and big names for cases. I can say "Plagiarism is wrong. It is theft. Here is an article of it. Here is a fannish example of it." Beyond that... I've never attempted to contact CC (once... I did, about two days before FanFiction.Net banned her.) and I leave her alone. When I find her on a list I belong to, I generally leave it so that there won't be personality conflicts. The only exception is that I do hang out at SugarQuill.Net where I can guarentee you that no one affiliated with them has ever called me a fuckwit... I can't say the same for FictionAlley.Org. Are you representative of that group? If so, well, I'm glad I do avoidance :)
But back to the point at hand, why is Cassandra Claire's okay, how does it differ when people take Cassandra Claire's work and slap their name on it? Isn't plagiarism of a plagiarist okay because the fiurst plagiarist behavior is okay?
How is plagiarism, IE COPYING PAGES AND PAGES AND PAGES to the point where it is distracting when you're reading a Babylon 5 script in prose, different that being inspired by? Is there a difference? What are the lines and when should they be drawn?
Are you for the abolishment of copyright and trademark laws? What are the ethical implications of that?
How do your fannish believes regarding intellectual property effect your views and perceptions? Will you support a canidate for your local government or national government who supports the RIAA?
If JK Rowlings had said that she was offended by slash, would you stop writing it, publishing it, hosting it?
When you can get past the jealously refraim (which I so cunningly mocked), please answer those questions. I still believe that once we cut through the jealousy montra and crap, we can have some honest discussion about the actual issue of plagiarism, copyrights, trademarks, the legal issues behind them and the ethical implications surrounding them. I'd honestly, the crap like "fuckwit" aside, like to have that dialogue with some one I disagree with because the insight would be valuable.
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For Ivy Blossom, with love :) Shakespeare -- Laura, 14:38:02 10/30/02 Wed(dialup-65.58.44.109.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net/65.58.44.109)
*hugs and kisses all around* I've made it! I'm popular. My goal in life is finally realized and I can now retire to Bermuda with my lover boy, Pierce Brosnan.
Anyway, my Big Name Fan status is courtesy of Ivy Blossom! She loves me! SHE REALLY LOVES ME! I've Made IT! (Side note for Ivy Blossom who is reading this, this is sarcasm. Obviously, I haven't made it but *zing* as you didn't get the comment made below, I'm having to explain this to you because your feable mind isn't quite capable of grasping it. Yeah, it might be unethical to say that but considering you missed the point of my obviously witty intelligence and didn't quote me right [OMG! YOU DID QUOTE ME RIGHT!!!!!!!! JUST ASK CASSANDRA CLAIRE!!!!!! IT IS OKAY TO QUOTE THE WRONG BOARD AND NOT KNOW THE AUTHOR!!!!! THAT ISN'T PLAGIARISM!!! THAT'S AN ACCIDENT OF FATE!!!!] *howls with laughter* I amuse myself ;-) Where was I? Oh yes, belittling your feeble mind.)
Anyway, Ivy Blossom is friend locking entries so I can't read them (damned. I so wanted to read them to. It's why I spent a good 20 mintues trying to figure out how to get you off my friendsfriends list of LJ. You know, you could have shown me a little more BNF type loving by trying to get off mine first.)
You referenced this board so I know you're reading it. (Despite the minions assertiongs otherwise... but you know minions... They have to spy for their masters...)(Oh side note, blast me all you want all over the place. :) I'm not going to your sites to mailing lists to check. Besides, it makes me look good for you to do that.)
I said:
>>you would never gain
>>popularity for it because of your acidic and repellent
>>personality.
You know... Who wants popularity? Seriously, if you're writing to be popular, I find that repellant and offensive. Our views on right and wrong and motivation are at such opposite ends of the spectrum that I don't think you have the cranial capacity to understand my view points. (Ouch! Zinger! That was a slam at your IQ. Bad me.) I can understand your argument that what Cassandra Claire does is not plagiarism, is original and is just reconstituting material like many great writers before her. Hell, Shakespeare was a plagiarist too! (See, she has good company.)
You or one of your sexy cohorts (this one must be sexy as they relate back to me on some level. Isn't fandom insidious? Who in your circle do I know and who do I contact? Who contacts me? How much do I know and how much do I care? More importantly, will you Ivy Blossom dance dirty with me to Harvey Danger's song about paranoia? Or is that garbage? Oh... what does it really matter.
Anyway, that quote references the fact that Shakespeare is a plagiarist. It means that Shakespeare is a plagiarist. It means that Cassandra Claire is a plagiarist. It means that both Cassandra Claire and Shakespeare are plagiarist. It does NOT mean that Cassandra Claire is a good author who will even 5 years from now be remembered as a good writer, let alone an exceptional writer like Shakespeare. You know, because like Shakespeare at least improved upon that which he stole. Cassandra Claire is still a hack, IE her (I'm sorry. I can't bring myself to even refer to it as her writing because it isn't) words taken from the mouths of others pale in that she butchers them. Her writing is nothing more than kitsch. (No, no, no. Don't come back with popular here minions. *slaps minions around* Look up the word kitsch first. It means her stuff IS POPULAR but still well blah. If you throw that jealous word around in reference to kitsch, you'll look like jealous minions who defend that which makes them lovers of kitsch.) Cassandra Claire doesn't hold a candle to Pamela Dean, jms, Joss Whedon. She doesn't. Those people are true authors in every sense of the word, weaving the fabric of the culture into their stories with out co-opting the text. This is what makes a writer a writer, and a plagiarist a two-bit-hack-wanna-be-writer-with-out-a-clue.
Anyway, because I respect your intelligence and the off chance that I wasn't clear with my sexy and cutting and witty sarcasm the first time, I wanted to spell it out for you so when you or your friends read this, they will know who made the comparison to Shakespeare and Cassandra Claire.
