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Date Posted: 08:54:27 04/22/08 Tue
Author: Albert Parker
Subject: Re: Dutch gunlist around 1700
In reply to: Ron 's message, "Dutch gunlist around 1700" on 22:51:32 04/21/08 Mon

>Sadly the list was not dated, the ships mentioned were
>built between 1683 and 1748, however the 3-deckers
>with 92 guns were built between 1683 and 1689 and the
>Vrijheid with 96 guns in 1695, so probably the list is
>from around 1700.
>
>1st rate, 92 guns (28 24pdrs lower deck, 28-18pdrs
>middle deck, 28-12pdrs upperdeck, 18-6pdrs above the
>cabin)

Since it would be rather stupid to arm the poop deck and not the quarterdeck, these guns "above the cabin" are probably on what the English would call the "quarterdeck." In English three-deckers, the captain had a cabin on the quarterdeck, but the admiral occupied a larger cabin on the upper deck, and the quarterdeck guns would be "above" that. The British navy installed guns not only on the open quarterdeck immediately abaft the mainmast, but also in the captain's cabin in the aftermost part of the quarterdeck. The French navy did not do this, at least in 74's; there, the 8-pounders on the upper works were confined to the forecastle (which seems to have been unarmed on these Dutch 92's) and the forward part of the quarterdeck. The number of 6-pounders suggests that some of them must have been in the cabin under the poop deck, but it would be interesting to know what Dutch practice was in that regard.

>2nd rate, 74 guns (26-18pdrs, 26-12pdrs, 18-6pdrs,
>4-3pdrs)
>
>3rd rate, 64 guns (24-18pdrs, 24-12pdrs, 16-6pdrs)
>
>4th rate, 52 guns 22-18pdrs, 22-8pdrs, 8-4pdrs)
>
>5th rate 46 guns (20-12pdrs, 20-6pdrs, 6-4pdrs)
>
>6th rate 38 guns (16-8pdrs, 16-6pdrs, 6-3pdrs)
>

This is a good illustration that the terms "first rate" for ships of 100 guns or more, "second rate" for ships of 90-98 guns, etc., are limited to the British navy. I believe that Ron is translating the Dutch word "charter" here as "rate." The French term was "rang." "Rates" were bureaucratic terms that covered different ranges of size and armament according to the needs of each navy, not universal, international terms.

>The Vrijheid had 69 guns (28-24pdr, 28-18pdr,
>30-12pdr, 10-6 pdr).
>Ron

Thanks for transcribing this list, too.

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