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Date Posted: 10:56:52 12/29/08 Mon
Author: Ron
Subject: Re: spanish navy 1779-1780
In reply to: Albert Parker 's message, "Re: spanish navy 1779-1780" on 10:09:17 12/29/08 Mon

Gentlemen,
I saw the comment on my last contribution. I thought doing the forum a pleasure with translating a presumably unknown source for the most of us. Althought I'm aware that it's a private published paper it gives an idea of the knowledge about what was happening outside the Netherlands. And the author needed to be accurate because Netherlands was still a seafaring nation. I did't check the details elsewhere because I wanted to give the original source without comment.

I won't bother the forum with other contributions. I got a new job on 1 January 2009 and other things to do,
Ron

>>I found some pieces of information in a Dutch
>>contemporary magazine of the 18th century dealing with
>>the Spanish navy. Perhaps of some interest for some
>>among us.
>>
>>In the Maandelykse Nederlandsche Mercurius, fol 45,
>>published at Amsterdam by Bernardus Mourik 1778, are
>>some news items dealing with the Spanish naval
>>strength that year.
>>
>This is a private newspaper or magazine, publishing
>the latest and most reliable information the editor
>can obtain (otherwise, his subscribers wouldn't buy
>it), but not official. The information is a handy
>compendium of what European journalists thought was
>going on in Spain, and it is certainly possible to
>look for confirmation in other sources.
>>
>>Page 84. The Spanish court ordered [August 1778] to
>>fit out at Corumba
>
>I presume this is La Coruña, on the other side of the
>bay from the naval base at Ferrol in northwestern
>Spain.
>
>two fast sailing royal packet boats
>>to choose sea at first order. The officers on board
>>are able to speak and understand English and well
>>known with the coastal waters of England.
>
>Obviously intended for reconnaissance in the English
>Channel. Note that in 1778 Spain was still a neutral
>power. By August of 1778 France was at war with
>Britain, and had already fought a fleet action in the
>northeast Atlantic, the "Battle of Ushant," in June.
>Spanish warships would have been able to come and go
>in the waters between Britain and France as neutrals
>in 1778. Spain did not declare war on Great Britain
>until June 1779; British reprisals were ordered in
>early July.
>
>The squadron
>>lying at Cadiz is daily strengthened. The day of
>>departure and destination of the fleet is still a
>>secret. However the Spanish fleet was never as strong
>>as nowadays. To prevent problems with the merchant
>>shipping and fishery, the court of Naples delivered
>>10.000 sailors, 3000 were born in Naples, and the
>>others 7000 were Greece born, from Lipari and
>>surrounding islands. So it becomes possible to give
>>10.000 Spanish sailors shore leave for 2 years to
>>serve in fishery and merchant shipping. After this two
>>years they have to come back to substitute another
>>10.000 sailors, at that moment in military service.
>>
>Spain had a great shortage of experienced mariners,
>especially those with deep-sea experience (many of the
>"sailors" registered in the Spanish equivalent of the
>French Inscription maritime were coastal
>sailors with experience and skills to operate small
>boats in coastal waters in good weather but not
>necessarily any experience operating large ships on
>the high seas), so help from other countries would
>certainly have been useful. Nevertheless, I would
>want to see confirmation of this in a careful Spanish
>history such as Fernandez Duro, José P. Merino
>(Armada española en el siglo XVIII), or the
>recent work by Juan Alsina Torrente (Una guerra
>romántica, 1778–1783: España, Francia e Inglaterra en
>el mar).
>>
>>Page 124. A news item dated 27 August [1778] mentioned
>>that Don Louis de Cordoba, lieutenant general hoisted
>>his colours on board of the ship called De
>>Drieëenheid,
>
>This is definitely La Santisima Trinidad, 112
>guns.
>
>arriving from Ferrol at Cadiz. The
>>Spanish fleet lying in the Bay of Cadiz numbered 42
>>ships-of-the-lines, 7 frigates, 2 bombgalliots, 2
>>fluyts and 2 fire ships. She will be divided in 3
>>squadrons, commanded by don Adriaan Coudron-Cantin,
>>Don Michel Gaston and Don Antonio Posado.
>
>Note translation of Christian names. I'm not familiar
>with "Adriaan Coudron-Cantin," but I am with
>Miguel Gaston.
>>
>>In the Maandelykse Nederlandsche Mercurius, fol 46,
>>published at Amsterdam by Bernardus Mourik 1779
>>
>>Page 94. [February 1779]. Since 2 years the Spanish
>>court is strengthening her navy, without saying why.
>
>Because they wanted to go to war to get back Florida
>and Gibraltar, that's why!
>
>>At the moment there were 8 new warships built, 5 of 80
>>and the other 5 of 74 guns? As soon as they are
>>completed, they will start the building of the same
>>number. More than 6000 men are building new shipyards
>>and storehouses.
>>
>It should be possible to figure out what ships these
>were from Christian St. Hubert's list.
>>
>
>>
>>In the Maandelykse Nederlandsche Mercurius, fol 47,
>>published at Amsterdam by Bernardus Mourik 1779.
>>
>>Page 9. Madrid, 16 June [1779]. The Spanish Court
>>appointed 25 captains for ships-of-the-line, 26
>>captains for frigates and a large amount officers of
>>lesser rank.
>
>This is obviously a reference to promotions to the
>ranks of capitán de navío and capitán de
>fragata respectively.

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