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Date Posted: 06:26:05 03/25/18 Sun
Author: Chuck
In reply to: Albert Parker 's message, "Re: COMPARATION BETWEEN BRITISH TREE DECKER 98 GUNS AND FRENCH TWO DECKERS 80 GUNS" on 21:25:47 03/22/18 Thu

>I'm not sure how many people are still here. To
>begin, I suggest that you stick to Spanish.
>I think that if you compare the broadside weight of a
>French 80, especially a 24-pounder 80, with that of a
>British 90, later 98 (an extra 4 9-pounders per
>broadside didn't make a big difference), you will find
>that they about the same or that the 98 was inferior.
>Measured by displacement (not British
>burthen or builder's measure "tons"), French 80s were
>also larger than British 90s and early 98s.
>You should keep in mind that while the transition from
>90 to 98 did not make a big difference in the
>firepower of British second rates (the addition of 10
>carronades was another matter), the French replacement
>of 18-pounders on the upper decks (deuxième batterie)
>of their 80s with 24-pounders did. During the 1730s
>the French navy had no ships more powerful than their
>74-gun two-deckers (a three-decker burned on the
>stocks). Their first two-decker 80 was launched at
>Toulon in 1744 but had not been completed yet when the
>French fleet sailed with a Spanish squadron to fight
>the British fleet based at Hyères Bay. This ship,
>Tonnant had 30 * 36, 32 * 18, 18 * 8 or 6. The
>French navy built six more 18-pounder 80s before
>launching Saint Esprit in 1765 and fitting her
>with 24-pounders on the upper deck. All of their
>subsequent 80s had 24-pounder main batteries, but two
>of the older 18-pounder types were still in service
>when France entered the War of American Independence
>(WAI) in 1778.
>After Tonnant, the French did not have any
>three-deckers until Ville de Paris (1764) and
>Bretagne (1766), and they remained the only
>French three-deckers until late in the WAI. (Royal
, 116,launched in 1759 and completed in 1762
>had to be repaired in 1766 and was broken up after
>dry-docking in 1771, perhaps without ever having
>really been seaworthy.) Therefore, French 80s played
>the same role as subsidiary flagships as British 90s
>and 98s. The served as squadron flagships in large
>fleets when there weren't enough three-deckers to go
>around, and as sometimes as flagships of small
>squadrons. In this role, they would also have played
>the role of squadron strongpoint that British 90s/98s
>The 80s were, however, superior to British second
>rates in speed and maneuverability. I don't know of a
>case where this was tactically significant. However,
>assignment of a 90 or 98 to a detached squadron could
>slow it down in a way that inclusion of a French 80 in
>a squadron of 74s and 64s would not.

Didn't the French Navy usually carry a few more guns than just the standard 80 on their 2nd Rate Two-Deckers?

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