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EagleRanch PRIMARY Forum 1
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qwerty,,,May I Please Interject??? -- beesting, 14:07:07 10/30/03 Thu

I agree in most part with your message but have to add a few words of my own here & there:

(qwerty)-One has to think in terms of maybe - where on earth can i have the most freedom and happiness ...
money does buy freedom to some degree on this planet ...

(beesting)- Very true but instead of using the word "money" by itself, please substitute the word,"REAL" money as in Gold/Silver money.

(qwerty again)-for us who truly care about what is happening, we need to take action ... and that may mean
something as simple as getting out of the way and just taking a few protective measures.

(beesting again)- I think some of us who see the "REAL" worlds situation are in the process of taking a few protective measures/ and action already.

beesting, what in the world could I be talking about???

First lets examine exactly how ,"We The People" lost our "REAL" money which also equaled "REAL" liberty or real freedom, in the first place.

Over the years, and mostly long ago, Governments thru hook, crook, & steal accumulated most of//enough of the "real" money(Gold/Silver) to start printing their own substitutes for real money in the form of paper notes. This eventually led to the situation[s] we see in the world today since an estimated 99% of things & services are paid for with these paper substitutes.(war machines/political machines/news release machines/covert operation machines/ etc. etc.)

In my opinion a way to eventually "break the bank" or in this case put "The Power Of Real Money" back in the hands of ,"We The People" as the founding fathers in the USA originally intended, is for "We The People" to accumulate as much Gold/Silver as the budget allows.

Lets do some math for Gold only, since I don't have a clue as to how much Silver is out there!

There is supposed to be about 33,000 tonnes in Central banks and about 70,000 tonnes(mostly Gold jewellery)in private hands.(However the 24 carat Gold jewellery could also be classified as monetary Gold)

The simple fact is if "We The People" are able to buy up the majority of the central bank Gold and use it in commerce as "REAL" money it maaaaaay break the power hold the governments//banks possess now.

So if we multiply 33,000 tonnes by the 32,150 ounces in a metric ton we come up with: about 1,060,950,000 ounces of central bank Gold, which seems like an awful large amount until you realize that about "TWICE" that amount is "ALREADY" in private hands,,,,,,And the many, many people of China have just started their accumulation stage.

Lets say out of the billions of people in the world only 100,000,000 have the ability to "SAVE" for a rainy day or their own retirement or whatever savers save for.......Which would again divide out to a little over 10 ounces per person or about $4,000.00 in U.S. dollars per person......A huge sum you might correctly say for the average person from a third world country........And you would be right,,,,,,But not an overwhelming figure for around 20 or 30 million affluent American/Canadian/New Zealand/Australian/Japanese/English/German/European///etc.etc.....however with these new "Digital Gold Currencies" just now coming into widespread circulation, the ownership of Gold is now again available for the masses of people with limited means and who truly understand exactly how fraudulent the worlds monetary systems have become.

(qwerty again)-we need to take some action...

(beesting again)-I'm taking action by saving physical & "Digital" Gold right now, how about any of you reading out there??????????? Are you taking action or just waiting for the so called "Stalker" to buy up all the available Gold?????

By the way James Turk of Goldmoney.com started a plan called "GAP" which is a way to accumulate Gold on a monthly basis for only 1.9% over the "Spot" POG.

Thanks For Reading.........beesting.

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shillspec still doesn't get it. -- SLATT, 14:00:03 10/30/03 Thu

You are not a miner nor a geologist. You merely buy mining stocks while deluding yourself that you possess any level of expertise regarding your investment. You are as much in the know as those who lost their shirts in Enron or the tech wreck. You are a sucker begging to be fleeced. And you picked the right type of investments for just that.

Odd that you make comparisons for stocks you picked though do not show the change in stock prices. Also any stock valuation is meaningless unless it is sold at a profit at better than average yields for other investments over that period of time. Unless you wish to regale us with all the dividend income you have realized from the list of stocks you posted over the past 8 months? You at least make me laugh.

You should stick to mining molars.

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dotti -- qwerty, 13:25:41 10/30/03 Thu

>I don't trust most of the information on the Internet--and certainly not that on the media news.

the NWO has a massive presence on the internet plus they subvert search engines ... that is why it takes time, experience and some energy to get a bearing on the truth

put the search for truth on the big things

Costa Rica ... Land prices tend to be higher but when the gold train takes all of us over the moutain then it won't be a problem

if gold goes over $1000 an ounce, i think many of us will be well over at least a million dollars if not a whole lot more. they have more dollar based economies down there so a depreciating currency will hopefully not impact prices i don't think.

i probably would like to get a farm like set up and something near the ocean where one can grow ones food and even get real cows and get the real milk

I just read that one can buy real estate in nicaragua and one doesn't need to be a citizen. only 1% tax. that's pretty good. a lot of countries require citizenship.

nicaragua has been one of the countries near the top of my list to investigate

although the politicians in nicaragua of all parties as they are here, seem to be on the NWO payroll ... they seem to be pushing NWO agenda stuff on the nicaraguan people even in face of a lot of protest ...


i know if i was looking to retire and i did't have much money and i wasn't brainwashed into thinking i need the "modern" medical system then i would retire to the southern hemisphere. live very inexpensively and better

once we get above 500 gold, i will hopefully have commenced my search for a home

i was thinking of using new hampshire as a temporary residence just in case a miracle occurs and the patriot act gets cancelled ... nice thing about new hamshire geographically is that it is near the ocean, near vermont, near canadian border ... potentially, a lot of free thinking people could do something

if more politically aware people move there, maybe there will be enough critical mass to do something ... the biggest obstacle will be awareness of COINTELPRO and whether they watch their politicians like a hawk ... the nwo still controls the state politicians just like they do in vermont



listen to "the power hour" with joyce reilly and dave klondienst ... they try to document everything they say ... they'll make your head spin ... it is well worth it ... plus they are bible christians which you may like ... you'll like them ... i'd rank them number one in the country as far as info on what is going on ... this is one of the radio station shows i will expect to fall when the really dark days approach ... they plan on being there to the very end

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@qwerty, et al -- dotti, 12:15:58 10/30/03 Thu

qwerty: "all it takes for evil to triumph is for all good men ( and women ) to do nothing or or delude oneself or be indifferent or just forget about it"

Even with the Internet, the main source of "information" for the masses is programmed news. I don't trust most of the information on the Internet--and certainly not that on the media news. I don't know what is true anymore. Nor does anyone else, as far as I can see. Not you, either, querty!

Heeding the Serenity Prayer, I just focus on my day-to-day. Although, I have thought of Costa rica.

Take care.

dotti

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There it isn't -- volavka, 11:25:16 10/30/03 Thu

There is no such thing as the patriot act:





It is the Psittaciformes act.
Or the puppet act.

ONLY YOU CAN GOVERN YOURSELF.
Todays gold action; warm up to allow last shorts out..

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Cor Tauri and dotti ... JUSTICE -- qwerty, 10:35:37 10/30/03 Thu

my sense of things ...

People have this enormous ability to forget, disaasociate and compartmentalize their information. Also there are the people who are indifferent or apathetic about other people in general or who will commit any unethical deed against other people without any compunction. For them, they got theres, so there is no problem as far as they can see.

Those listed above are the people who truly deserve the NWO. These people make up the overwhelming majority of people

Like I was talking about yesterday. How could so many veterans on a vast scale be murdered and assaulted but hardly anyone is aware. Surely, one would think they would speak out. Amazingly, only a small fraction of one percent ever spoke out. Who are warnin the younger generations. It is the former soldiers who should be at the forefront. Inspite of these treasonous acts, they either remain silent or just too dumb to even function. There is an internet which allows even house bound people to speak out. Amazingly, they don't. Just a handfull.

The same behavior pattern gets repeated over and over by victims of other government covert operations in the population.

Many spouses get violence committed against them by their other spouse. Inspite of this, they stay with the other spouse. So much of the population are psychologically addicted to the constant abuse. They rationalize it. They can't break out of the herd instinct.

Do most people get the kind of government and rights they deserve ?

MY answer is definitely YES.

this is why we have the patriot act

people just stake out there little part of the land and anything outside of that they just don't care. as long as their little world is ok, they just go along with the bigger program. murder or repression or false imprisonment by the government doesn't bother them. they rationalize it away.

Are the treasonous criminals getting justice ?

My answer is - in the context of this world, they are. they are thriving and should be.

Most of the people are mindless cogs with personal self interest agendas mixed in.

For the people who truly have a desire for freedom and realize what is happening ...they don't deserve to live in this shit hole of a world


personally, if there were alternate worlds where freedom truly is supported by a large bastion among the beings living there, i would pack up and leave. The NWO and all that stuff wouldn't even bother me. The questions of justice would be irrelevant. If I died there and i would reincarnate, it would be a preferrable place to be


On a practical level, all one can do is try to avoid the destruction. I use to think of this country as home but I have been forced by things like the patriot act to think on global view.

One has to think in terms of maybe - where on earth can i have the most freedom and happiness ... money does buy freedom to some degree on this planet ...

for us who truly care about what is happening, we need to take action ... and that may mean something as simple as getting out of the way and just taking a few protective measures

i don't know how large our numbers are but let's just say that as far as invasion of the body snatchers ... the pods are pretty much taken over ... best to let them suffer the consequences for their pod like behavior

if the california election is any barometers, our numbers are maybe 5% or maybe a fraction of a percent

as the noose grows tighter especially economically, i expect more people to wake up on a more primitive level but it won't be enough ... they won't even have the intelligence to understand what they are up against or what is happening ... they will even vote for NWO candidates without having a clue ... they won't have anyone to blame but themselves

so there is justice but it is on the terms of a population that accepts or is indifferent to corruption, treason, indifference and injustice ... and also on terms with the intelligence level of people that allow them to compartmentalize, disaasociate and forget with amazing consistency


all it takes for evil to triumph is for all good men ( and women ) to do nothing or or delude oneself or be indifferent or just forget about it

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@Cor Tauri -- dotti, 06:49:43 10/30/03 Thu

Thanks for your post--and the kind regards.

I think that I was in a moment of sheer desperation at the time of my post. I agree with you--no punishment in this world for those of evil nature. Particularly with regard to those we refer to as TPTB--those behind the curtains for generations, manipulating through (free) markets and wars.

I, like you, get flashes of something that seems profound--far above and beyond what my level of knowledge would justify.

I am a Christian, brought to faith through reason, and trust that this world is not our true destiny. Tribulations here are not more than we can endure.

I am fascinated by the world we live in and the way that others perceive and respond to a "reality" that seems weird to me--while my "reality" would, indeed, seem conspiracy-ladden to them.

Oops. I have lapsed into babble. I have a show this weekend and need to be in the studio. Just checked in to refill my coffee and saw your post. Always nice to get a nice response.

Do you have an opinion on the record growth in GDP? I suspect it has to do with the fact that going from .1 to .2 is 100% growth, etc. Don't know the numbers and don't have the time/incentive to look them up.

Take care.

dotti

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dotti -- Cor Tauri, 06:31:25 10/30/03 Thu

Hello, I think you have been here or at kitco as long if not longer than I have. I've never had occasion to post at you, but I have always gotten the impression from your posts that I should respect and admire you.
You asked when would the bad guys get "what is coming to them...when will it really happen?"
Understand that I don't really know anything. I used to be a rational, reasonable, pragmatic person. That is changing, I am becoming an idealistic, flaky "new-ager" sort of person. I'm not waving crystals around yet, but you know the sort, and like all of that ilk, my ilk I guess, I think I know profound stuff, that I really can't possibly know. What I want to suggest is that I have come to believe that the bad guys are not going to get whats coming to them. At least not in anyway I can watch. I am not certain that there is any sort of cosmic justice. And I am very certain that there will be no justice for these folks in our world. They are going to get away with every terrible thing that they have ever done. At least it will appear that way to the rest of us. I am almost ok with that. I mean if I had a way of bringing them to account, I would do it, but I don't. What will happen is that their activities will stop. They may start some new mischief, or some other group may replace them. Then again maybe not. The world seems to be changing. I don't know if it's because of some imminent pole shift or awareness thing. It may only be that it is now technologiclly possible for any very small group with a fringe ideology to wield as much military and economc power as any very large nation. If so I think that the beginning of the obsolescence of nation states is at hand. Perhaps humanity will devolve into some sort of Mad Max world. Maybe humanity will "ascend" and there will be peace and love. Maybe I will look into buying a nice crystal to wave around, and some .22 ammo to sit on. As I said, I don't know, but really deep down, do you believe these people will ever be brought to justice in our world?

Very Best Regards

p.s. I purchased Nevsun at $0.33 US and sold a bit more than half at $0.64 US. My spirit guide suggested them. No, not really it was someone on Kitco and I looked into them and liked what I saw. It was some deamon of some sort that suggested I buy an equal value of Intl. Taurus.

[Edit]
Good Morning, All! -- dotti, 06:04:29 10/30/03 Thu

"Economic growth for third quarter is best in 19 years."

From CBS Market Watch.

Comments?

TIA.

dotti

[Edit]
WW IV -- 6 pack, 01:33:54 10/30/03 Thu



"God told me to strike at al Qaeda and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East." President George Bush 25 June 2003 Haaretz

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/world_war_4.htm

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suuure -- number six, 00:12:16 10/30/03 Thu

Yep Volavka, that was me who bought all 9 million shares of apll.ob, right after I gave Miranda Otto and Veronica Zemanova a good seeing to... in the back seat of my solid gold Bugatti.

But seriously, up 60% in one day was quite fun; I usually never get the timing just right like that. Thanks for the original tip.

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Buffett sells the dollar... -- Netking, 23:30:26 10/29/03 Wed

Snip from The Daily Reckoning [Fair use copyright protection etc]

Addison Wiggin, writing in Paris...

- The Sage of Omaha said he never bought foreign currency - until now. Yesterday's BBC report tells us that Warren Buffett is worried about the dollar. The U.S. government deficit has "greatly worsened," he said, "to the point that our country's 'net worth,' so to speak, is now being transferred abroad at an alarming rate." The budget deficit this year is nearly twice the previous record.

- "Our country [the U.S.] has been behaving like an extraordinarily rich family that possesses an immense farm," Buffett warned in an interview with Fortune magazine. "In order to consume 4% more than we produce - that's the trade deficit - we have, day by day, been both selling pieces of the farm and increasing the mortgage on what we still own." Continuing his analogy, Buffett goes on to explain that, as foreign ownership of the "farm" grows, income flows out of America in the form of dividends and interest payments.

- The U.S. trade deficit with China was a record $11.7 billion in August, according to U.S. government figures cited by Bloomberg. The trade gap with China, which widened to $77 billion in the first 8 months of this year, was a record $103 billion last year. "We have entered the world of negative compounding," laments Warren. "Goodbye pleasure, hello pain."

- Back in the bubble days - when New Era hero George Gilder and his ilk 'got it' - Buffett was crying wolf. When it came to investing in Cisco, Yahoo!, or Amazon, Buffett just didn't 'get it.' He couldn't understand the valuations...so he stayed away. And unlike the thousands - nay millions - of investors with the New Era light flashing in their eyes, Buffet still has his money. In fact, as we pointed out a few days back, Buffet has more money than he has investment ideas.

- "I am crying wolf again," Buffett continues, "and this time, I'm backing it with Berkshire Hathaway money. Through the spring of 2002, I had lived nearly 72 years without purchasing a foreign currency. Since then Berkshire has made significant investments in - and today holds - several currencies."

- Coca Cola announced another layoff yesterday. Nine hundred more people will get pink slips. Coca Cola was one of the companies that helped make Berkshire Hathaway shareholders into millionaires...and Buffett famous for it. Now he regrets not having sold the stock in '99...he wished he had got going when the going was good.

- Easy Al and his Fed pals decided after breakfast yesterday to further underwrite the rapidly swelling U.S. asset and housing bubbles; they left interest rates unchanged at 50-year lows. And there they will remain for at least another six weeks.

- "Surely it must mean something when U.S. house prices are up nearly 20% in two years," writes our London correspondent, Sean Corrigan, commenting on the Fed's decision, "pushing up medical costs, tuition fees and insurance premiums by double digits, too? Or that good, old, speculative equities are roaring - with Semiconductors up 136%, Internets up 142% and Networkers up 209%? Or that four major commodities indices - each with a different composition - are up between 37% and 55% from their late- 2001 lows?

- "Doesn't it matter that long bond yields on U.S. Treasuries have risen 1% from their lows...meaning a 14% drop in T-bill prices? Shouldn't economists worry that U.S. household credit continues to boom, as current and budget accounts yawn ever-wider to record gaps...?"

- Well, apparently not. The Fed's official communiqué stated: "The probability, though minor, of an unwelcome fall in inflation exceeds that of a rise in inflation from its already low level. The Committee judges that, on balance, the risk of inflation becoming undesirably low remains the predominant concern for the foreseeable future. In these circumstances, the Committee believes that policy accommodation can be maintained for a considerable period."

- In plain English, the Central Bank of history's greatest debtor nation thinks it wise to keep on fuelling today's enormous consumption of capital.

- The lumps loved it...by the market's close, fools had rushed in to push the Dow up 140 to 9748, the S&P 500 up 15 to 1046, and the Nasdaq up 49 points to 1932. One wonders whether the greater fools will show up when those in question decide that buying stocks at these valuations isn't such a good idea.

- Select foreign currencies also loved the Fed's decision. "The Kiwi [New Zealand Dollar]," writes Chuck Butler, our friend over at the Everbank trading desk, "hit a 6-year high overnight, and hasn't stopped on profit taking! In December 1997, the Kiwi last traded at .6142, and again, it was going in an opposite direction then on the slippery slope down to 39 cents 3 years later! Both the Aussie [Australian Dollar] and Kiwi got a nice kick when the Fed left rates unchanged, which gives the positive interest rate differential that both of these enjoy, new life!"

http://www.everbank.com/main.asp?affid=eb&idpage=pro_wc&referID=11570

[Edit]
New $20 Dollar Bill -- Au_Wag, 23:05:25 10/29/03 Wed



[Edit]
Shillspec's Track Record -- Shillspec, 21:31:47 10/29/03 Wed

Just for the record:

I posted on 2/26/03 that there were many 'pregnant' mining stories abounding in the junior/explorers. I listed the following as examples:

XCL
SWG
Nevsun
Cordero
Wolfson
Altius
Aurora Platinum
SSO
Virginia
Tan Range
Vista
Almaden
BPN
etc

I challenge mr Slurs, Lies & Temper Tantrums to pick any 5 of these companies and we'd make a lil wager as to the outcome of these particular issues. Of course, I was told that mr slatt doesn't wager even though he clearly does wager on sports. BUT, he's a mining expert.

Well, it looks like it's a pretty good thing that he doesn't wager, no? I wish someone would "shill" me such early stories.

XCL.........now at .66C
SWG.........recently at 29.00 C
Nevsun......just hit $8 C
Cardero.....2.00 C
Wolfson.....4.90 C
Altius......2.85 C
Aurora......2.85 C
SSO.........Has hit over 11.00 C
Virginia....5.74 C

Tan Range...Has hit 2.00 C
Vista.......5.74 C
Almaden......1.59 C
Bpn............43 C

OOPS! Looks like one would have absolutely cleaned up taking ANY 5 of these "SHILLS". BIG winners almost to the tout. What more is there to say other than:

Please give us your best advice mr mining "expert". I will, still, fight for your right to free-moronic speech.

Sorry {not really}.........

Give it up slatt

play 'gotcha' w someone else

G'night

[Edit]
Current POG, POS, POP & U$D Live Price -- CHARTs, 21:14:49 10/29/03 Wed

US$/POG: from www.kitco.comUS$/POS: from www.kitco.comEURO/POG: from www.kitco.com[Most Recent USD from www.kitco.com]








LbS/POG: from www.kitco.com London Fix: from www.kitco.com LbS/POS: from www.kitco.com






US$/POP: from www.kitco.com

US$/POP: from www.kitco.com


[Edit]
"signs" -- Tree in the Forest, 21:07:41 10/29/03 Wed

We are seeing unusual signs now. Roustabouts in the west are now working 24 hours a day drilling and fracing gas wells. They are preparing fields for max max output. The reasoning given is that they must finish prior to herd migrations in the middle of November. But this year is far busier than any previous year. It looks like panic mode.
An insider buys huge amounts of gold on a speedy timetable. Sure, insiders have been accumulating for quite sometime. But one senses that the end is nigh. There is this sense of great urgency. Also, take a look at November's calendar setup. I've discussed this before. I know that you think I'm crazy (sometimes I think I am crazy). But consider that the wealthy never take chances with their money. They insist upon a sure thing. Everything must be in alignment (including, perhaps, the stars) before an important move like the one we see coming. Your last opportunity to buy gold at a low price may be here. Make the most of it.

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Slurs, Lies And Temper Tantrums -- mini{ng}, 20:59:11 10/29/03 Wed

Those "shills" have brought forth 2X, 5X, and more.....just getting warmed up mr 'mining expert' who owns none. I guess those secondary silver mines were brought into being with a snap of the fingers..........so "easy" eh? Primary silver has to be started from scratch yet secondary silver already exists? Hahaha. SLATT logic @ it's best.

Nice to know you read my stuff. Until we don't meet agin..........

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WRONG AGAIN (sigh sigh sigh) -- SLATT, 20:44:22 10/29/03 Wed

"There's no accounting for peoples' thought processes; right here @ ER we got a bloke who thinks it's 'easier' to set up a secondary silver mine than it is to take readily available silver from near surface. Fortunately for him he doesn't buy mining stox, yet he claims to be expert. I guess when they find secondary silver down near the center of the Earth, he'll want a part of that action because the silver will somehow be "free". OK............."

No need to set up any "secondary" mines. The mines and the production already exist. And compared to you and any silver shill "expert" du jour you wish to tout, yes, I am an expert. But not in the shilling of mining stocks, rather the science which is misrepresented and twisted in order to separate suckers from their money. Stick to drilling teeth, since it is as deep as your understanding of mining gets.

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qwertyuiop[] -- auspec, 20:28:18 10/29/03 Wed

{smile}

Yes, $1B plus is a big nut to crack. How exactly it's covered is most ionteresting. This "Stalker" wouldn't be taking $1B down from Crimex, would he? I don't have the numbers off the top of the head {or the bottom} but I don't think Crimex could handle a $1B delivery order and still function anywhere near curreent levels. Am I wrong?

Sinclair? He was at the N.O. Conference last year and drew a crowd everywhere he went. Very straight laced in appearance and somewhat professorial. Did not mind being the center of attention to put it mildly, and that really is not a criticism. He was and is again, "Mr. Gold". He's a trading genius and has guts to back it up, an unbeatable combination. Personally, I still believe him to be the "Pied Piper of Paper Gold" though as he draws so many into the paper games of Crimex. Delivery is the only game that should be played on Crimex as far as I'm concerned. He's personally winning a rigged game and in the process lending credence to it. That's yesterday's war. Oh well.

Still, I read him regularly and greatly admire his knowledge. Much to learn. I had opportunity to ask him when exactly he knew all wasn't exactly right in the gold market, thinking about the GATA process at the time, and he said in the mid 1990's. Now he says the market isn't really manipulated as GATA alledges. Can't have it both ways. Barrikk ties concern me frankly. How can they not? Now I see JS giving it to others, like Andy Smith, about 'elitist connections'.

In sum total...........JS is a most worthy Generalissimo, but I'm still keeping a close eye on him.

Yes, the 'cabal' constantly buys in order to sell later. I have always thought they could work off a good deal of any off-side position in this manner. The opportunities to make money in each direction, mostly known in advance, have been near limitless. Still, current buying is overwhelming and if they join in instead of sell we will be off to the races. Every level that has been defended since the $250's has fallen...........$400 soon to follow. That's simply bad strategy but what else could one expect from these central planners. Why did Communism supposedly fail? They say that their markets had no resemblance to true values because of government interference in these processes. Misallocations of capital. Well, let's look at that a little closer to home, eh? If that's really why the Iron Curtain came down we're not too far behind. They bankrupted and we're bankrupt but still in denial.

$400 would be real nice but, in reality, that's only about 3.5% higher than current price of $380. No big deal in actuality. Short covering rally........? No, not like most have been looking for in the last 6 or so years. Simple monetization is the substitute as many have stated at ER FAR before other experts. Raise the bar, monetize, paper over the problem.............that's what weill continue to see in the coming months. EVERY defended level will continue to fall because of the arrogance of the elitist bankers. They simply DON"T have enough good sense to defend a position $50 higher, as some of us continue to tell em. They could buy themselves enough time to extricate their short positions if they didn't insist on their all or none approach. Alas {party hardy}, the die is cast.

They want a stealth bull market in gold? Works for me. What could be much better? I still ask around for more common interest in gold by the public and it's non existent. This with stocks going 2X, 5X, 10X and more. Nothing quite like having the punch bowl to oneself.

"Financial intelligence"? Like you mention.........many get the inside scoop and literally steal from other participants. "We" do have to read between the lines, but at least we're looking there and capable of understanding what exactly is going on. Everyone else is just plain screwed, ne? The poor sheared sheep, as always.

New Orleans is sold out this year. 2 years ago it was OK but still somewhat sparsely attended. There is plenty of money for exploration these days and acquisitions will soon be front page once more. The wall of worry is still front and center and makes for great comfort.......GREED will follow somewhere along the line.

My personal philosophy, since the Bre-X scandal and SEVERE gold stock declines, has simply been that, regardless of how long it takes, we're sooner or later going to have ANOTHER mania. Cycles, nada mas, nada menos. Patience wins that game. Only a complete fool, or a central planner, would try to intervene in the cyclicality of markets.

There's no accounting for peoples' thought processes; right here @ ER we got a bloke who thinks it's 'easier' to set up a secondary silver mine than it is to take readily available silver from near surface. Fortunately for him he doesn't buy mining stox, yet he claims to be expert. I guess when they find secondary silver down near the center of the Earth, he'll want a part of that action because the silver will somehow be "free". OK.............

Butler is strongly in favor of keeping Crimex open because it is an American institution. Might as well keep our bot and paid for Congress on the dole while we're at it or our supposedly free press. Krud, folks.........run it honest or SHUT IT DOWN!!! Why celebrate the Commies failing for central planning but cherish it when we do the same? Ted............I love ya man, but you're becoming the Pied Piper of Paper Silver. You and Sinclair make perfect bookends. TAKE DELIVERY AS THE RULES ALLOW AND RUN IT HONEST OR SHUT IT DOWN!!! WHO NEEDS DISHONEST MARKETS???

Heading for the epicenter soon.

[Edit]
controlled media -- qwerty, 19:54:06 10/29/03 Wed

Operation Mockingbird -
The Subversion Of America's Free Press By The CIA
http://www.psychicspy.com/ciamed.txt

"You could get a journalist cheaper than a good
call girl, for a couple hundred dollars a month."
CIA operative discussing with Philip Graham, editor
Washington Post, on the availability and prices of
journalists willing to peddle CIA propaganda and
cover stories. "Katherine The Great," by Deborah
Davis (New York: Sheridan Square Press, 1991)

As terrible as it is to live in a nation where the
press in known to be controlled by the government,
at least one has the advantage of knowing the bias
is present, and to adjust for it. In the United
States of America, we are taught from birth that
our press is free from such government meddling.
This is an insideous lie about the very nature of
the news institution in this country. One that
allows the government to lie to us while denying
the very fact of the lie itself.

The Alex Constantine Article

Tales from the Crypt The Depraved Spies and Moguls
of the CIA's Operation MOCKINGBIRD

By Alex Constantine

Who Controls the Media?

Soulless corporations do, of course. Corporations
with grinning, double-breasted executives,
interlocking directorates, labor squabbles and
flying capital. Dow. General Electric. Coca-Cola.
Disney. Newspapers should have mastheads that
mirror the world: The Westinghouse Evening
Scimitar, The Atlantic-Richfield Intelligentser .
It is beginning to dawn on a growing number of
armchair ombudsmen that the public print reports
news from a parallel universe - one that has never
heard of politically-motivated assassinations,
CIA-Mafia banking thefts, mind control, death
squads or even federal agencies with secret budgets
fattened by cocaine sales - a place overrun by lone
gunmen, where the CIA and Mafia are usually on
their best behavior. In this idyllic land, the most
serious infraction an official can commit __is a
the employment of a domestic servant with (shudder)
no residency status.

This unlikely land of enchantment is the creation
of MOCKINGBIRD.

It was conceived in the late 1940s, the most frigid
period of the cold war, when the CIA began a
systematic infiltration of the corporate media, a
process that often included direct takeover of
major news outlets.

In this period, the American intelligence services
competed with communist activists abroad to
influence European labor unions. With or without
the cooperation of local governments, Frank Wisner,
an undercover State Department official assigned to
the Foreign Service, rounded up students abroad to
enter the cold war underground of covert operations
on behalf of his Office of Policy Coordination.
Philip Graham, __a graduate of the Army
Intelligence School in Harrisburg, PA, then
publisher of the Washington Post., was taken under
Wisner's wing to direct the program code-named
Operation MOCKINGBIRD.

"By the early 1950s," writes former Village Voice
reporter Deborah Davis in Katharine the Great,
"Wisner 'owned' respected members of the New York
Times, Newsweek, CBS and other communications
vehicles, plus stringers, four to six hundred in
all, according to a former CIA analyst." The
network was overseen by Allen Dulles, a templar for
German and American corporations who wanted their
points of view represented in the public print.
Early MOCKINGBIRD influenced 25 newspapers and wire
agencies consenting to act as organs of CIA
propaganda. Many of these were already run by men
with reactionary views, among them William Paley
(CBS), C.D. Jackson (Fortune), Henry Luce (Time)
and Arthur Hays Sulzberger (N.Y. Times).

Activists curious about the workings of MOCKINGBIRD
have since been appalled to f__ind in FOIA
documents that agents boasting in CIA office memos
of their pride in having placed "important assets"
inside every major news publication in the country.
It was not until 1982 that the Agency openly
admitted that reporters on the CIA payroll have
acted as case officers to agents in the field.

"World War III has begun," Henry's Luce's Life
declared in March, 1947. "It is in the opening
skirmish stage already." The issue featured an
excerpt of a book by James Burnham, who called for
the creation of an "American Empire,"
"world-dominating in political power, set up at
least in part through coercion (probably including
war, but certainly the threat of war) and in which
one group of people ... would hold more than its
equal share of power."

George Seldes, the famed anti-fascist media critic,
drew down on Luce in 1947, explaining tha__t
"although avoiding typical Hitlerian phrases, the
same doctrine of a superior people taking over the
world and ruling it, began to appear in the press,
whereas the organs of Wall Street were much more
honest in favoring a doctrine inevitably leading to
war if it brought greater commercial markets under
the American flag."

On the domestic front, an abiding relationship was
struck between the CIA and William Paley, a wartime
colonel and the founder of CBS. A firm believer in
"all forms of propaganda" to foster loyalty to the
Pentagon, Paley hired CIA agents to work undercover
at the behest of his close friend, the busy grey
eminence of the nation's media, Allen Dulles.
Paley's designated go-between in his dealings with
the CIA was Sig Mickelson, president of CBS News
from 1954 to 1961.

The CIA's assimilation of old guard fascists was
overseen by the Operations Coordination Board,
directed by C.D. Jackson, formerly an executive of
Time magazine and Eisenhower's Special Assistant
for Cold War Strategy. In 1954 he was succeeded by
Nelson Rockefeller, who quit a year later,
disgusted at the administration's political
infighting. Vice President Nixon succeeded
Rockefeller as the key cold war strategist.

"Nixon," writes John Loftus, a former attorney for
the Justice Department's Office of Special
Investigations, took "a small boy's delight in the
arcane tools of the intelligence craft - the hidden
microphones, the 'black' propaganda." Nixon
especially enjoyed his visit to a Virginia training
camp to observe Nazis in the "special forces"
drilling at covert operations.

One of the fugitives recruited by the American
intelligence underground was heroin smuggler Hubert
von Blcher, the son of A German ambassador. Hubert
often bragged that that he was trained by the
Abwehr, the German military intelligence division,
while still a civilian in his twenties. He served
in a recon unit of the German Army until forced out
for medical reasons in 1944, according to his
wartime records. He worked briefly as an assistant
director for Berlin-Film on a movie entitled One
Day ..., and finished out the war flying with the
Luftwaffe, but not to engage the enemy - his
mission was the smuggling of Nazi loot out of the
country. His exploits were, in part, the subject of
Sayer and Botting's Nazi Gold, an account of the
knockover of the Reichsbank at the end of the war.

In 1948 he flew the coop to Argentina. Posing as a
photographer named Huberto von Bleucher Corell, he
immediately paid court to Eva Peron, presenting her
with an invaluable Gobelin tapestry (a selection
from the wealth of artifacts confiscated by the SS
from Europe's Jews?). Hubert then met with Martin
Bormann at the Hotel Plaza to deliver German marks
worth $80 million. The loot financed the birth of
the National Socialist Party in Argentina, among
other forms of Nazi revival.

In 1951, Hubert migrated northward and took a job
at the Color Corporation of America in Hollywood.
He eked out a living writing scripts for the
booming movie industry. His voice can be heard on a
film set in the Amazon, produced by Walt Disney.
Nine years later he returned to Buenos Aires, then
Dsseldorf, West Germany, and established a firm
that developed not movie scripts, but anti-chemical
warfare agents for the government. At the Industrie
Club in Dsseldorf in 1982, von Blcher boasted to
journalists, "I am chief shareholder of Pan
American Airways. I am the best friend of Howard
Hughes. The Beach Hotel in Las Vegas is 45 percent
financed by me. I am thus the biggest financier
ever to appear in the Arabian Nights tales dreamed
up by these people over their second bottle of
brandy."

Not really. Two the biggest financiers to stumble
from the drunken dreams of world-moving affluence
were, in their time, Moses Annenberg, publisher of
The Philadelphia Inquirer, and his son Walter , the
CIA/mob-anchored publisher of the TV Guide. Like
most American high-rollers, Annenberg lived a
double life. Moses, his father, was a scion of the
Capone mob. Both Moses and Walter were indicted in
1939 for tax evasions totalling many millions of
dollars - the biggest case in the history of the
Justice Department. Moses pled guilty and agreed to
pay the government $8 million and settle $9 million
in assorted tax claims, penalties and interest
debts. Moses received a three-year sentence. He
died in Lewisburg Penitentiary.

Walter Annenbeg, the TV Guide magnate, was a lofty
Republican. On the campaign trail in April, 1988,
George Bush flew into Los Angeles to woo Reagan's
kitchen cabinet. "This is the topping on the cake,"
Bush's regional campaign director told the Los
Angeles Times. The Bush team met at Annenberg's
plush Rancho Mirage estate at Sunnylands,
California. It was at the Annenberg mansion that
Nixon's cabinet was chosen, and the state's social
and contributor registers built over a
quarter-century of state political dominance by
Ronald Reagan, whose acting career was launched by
Operation MOCKINGBIRD.

The commercialization of television, coinciding
with Reagan's recruitment by the Crusade for
Freedom, a CIA front, presented the intelligence
world with unprecedented potential for sowing
propaganda and even prying in the age of Big
Brother. George Orwell glimpsed the possibilities
when he installed omniscient video surveillance
technology in 1948, a novel rechristened 1984 for
the first edition published in the U.S. by
Harcourt, Brace. Operation Octopus, according to

{{ Anniversary of Terror: October 12 - Operation Octopus
I was reminded this morning - as if anyone could ever forget- by a
newsman that October 11 would mark the one-month anniversaryof the
terrorist attack on America. Memorial services will be heldin New
York and Washington for the victims
http://www.theperspective.org/octopus.html ]]

federal files, was in full swing by 1948, a
surveillance program that turned any television set
with tubes into a broadcast transmitter. Agents of
Octopus could pick up audio and visual images with
the equipment as far as 25 miles away.

Hale Boggs was investigating Operation Octopus at
the time of his disappearance in the midst of the
Watergate probe.

In 1952, at MCA, Actors' Guild president Ronald
Reagan - a screen idol recruited by MOCKINGBIRD's
Crusade for Freedom to raise funds for the
resettlement of Nazis in the U.S., according to
Loftus - signed a secret waiver of the
conflict-of-interest rule with the mob-controlled
studio, in effect granting it a labor monopoly on
early television programming. In exchange, MCA made
Reagan a part owner. Furthermore, historian C. Vann
Woodward, writing in the New York Times, in 1987,
reported that Reagan had "fed the names of suspect
people in his organization to the FBI secretly and
regularly enough to be assigned 'an informer's code
number, T-10.' His FBI file indicates intense
collaboration with producers to 'purge' the
industry of subversives."

No one ever turned a suspicious eye on Walter
Cronkite, a former intelligence officer and in the
immediate postwar period UPI's Moscow
correspondent. Cronkite was lured to CBS by
Operation MOCKINGBIRD's Phil Graham, according to
Deborah Davis.

Another television conglomerate, Cap Cities, rose
like a horror-film simian from CIA and Mafia heroin
operations. Among other organized-crime
Republicans, Thomas Dewey and his neighbor Lowell
Thomas threw in to launch the infamous Resorts
International, the corporate front for Lansky's
branch of the federally-sponsored mob family and
the corporate precursor to Cap Cities. Another of
the investors was James Crosby, a Cap Cities
executive who donated $100,000 to Nixon's 1968
presidential campaign. This was the year that
Resorts bought into Atlantic City casino interests.
Police in New jersey attempted, with no success, to
spike the issuance of a gambling license to the
company, citing Mafia ties.

In 1954, this same circle of investors, all
Catholics, founded the broadcasting company
notorious for overt propagandizing and general
spookiness. The company's chief counsel was OSS
veteran William Casey, who clung to his shares by
concealing them in a blind trust even after he was
appointed CIA director by Ronald Reagan in 1981.

"Black radio" was the phrase CIA critic David Wise
coined in The Invisible Government to describe the
agency's intertwining interests in the emergence of
the transistor radio with the entrepreneurs who
took to the airwaves. "Daily, East and West beam
hundreds of propaganda broadcasts at each other in
an unrelenting babble of competition for the minds
of their listeners. The low-price transistor has
given the hidden war a new importance," enthused
one foreign correspondent.

A Hydra of private foundations sprang up to finance
the propaganda push. One of them, Operations and
Policy Research, Inc. (OPR), received hundreds of
thousands of dollars from the CIA through private
foundations and trusts. OPR research was the basis
of a television series that aired in New York and
Washington, D.C. in 1964, Of People and Politics, a
"study" of the American political system in 21
weekly installments.

In Hollywood, the visual cortex of The Beast, the
same CIA/Mafia combination that formed Cap Cities
sank its claws into the film studios and labor
unions. Johnny Rosselli was pulled out of the Army
during the war by a criminal investigation of
Chicago mobsters in the film industry. Rosselli, a
CIA asset probably assassinated by the CIA, played
sidekick to Harry Cohn, the Columbia Pictures mogul
who visited Italy's Benito Mussolini in 1933, and
upon his return to Hollywood remodeled his office
after the dictator's. The only honest job Rosselli
ever had was assistant purchasing agent (and a
secret investor) at Eagle Lion productions, run by
Bryan Foy, a former producer for 20th Century Fox.
Rosselli, Capone's representative on the West
Coast, passed a small fortune in mafia investments
to Cohn. Bugsy Seigel pooled gambling investments
with Billy Wilkerson, publisher of the Hollywood
Reporter.

In the 1950s, outlays for global propaganda climbed
to a full third of the CIA's covert operations
budget. Some 3, 000 salaried and contract CIA
employees were eventually engaged in propaganda
efforts. The cost of disinforming the world cost
American taxpayers an estimated $265 million a year
by 1978, a budget larger than the combined
expenditures of Reuters, UPI and the AP news
syndicates.

In 1977, the Copely News Service admitted that it
worked closely with the intelligence services - in
fact, 23 employees were full-time employees of the
Agency.

Most consumers of the corporate media were - and
are - unaware of the effect that the salting of
public opinion has on their own beliefs. A network
anchorman in time of national crisis is an
instrument of psychological warfare in the
MOCKINGBIRD media. He is a creature from the
national security sector's chamber of horrors. For
this reason consumers of the corporate press have
reason to examine their basic beliefs about
government and life in the parallel universe of
these United States.

[Edit]
correction -- qwerty, 19:39:59 10/29/03 Wed

correction

> the informers got paid off to point out "communists"

the informers got paid off by the communists controlling the white house, congress, intelligence and military, who were in charge of searching the US government for communists, to point out "communists"

[Edit]
dotti -- qwerty, 19:33:45 10/29/03 Wed

there is the attack on the Liberty during johnson era

israeli pilots knew the ship was american but were ordered to attack

the johnson and the cabal in america were hoping the ship would be completely destroyed so there would be no witnesses ... another gulf of tonkin incident ... manufacture an incident and use the lies built up around it as a pretext

johnson carried out treason along with democrat and republican members of congress who did nothing ... all those deaths happened with collusion

imagine going in the military on the assumption you fighting for america only to be murdered by your own govt by various ways and for hidden agendas

the most sickening aspect of an investigation now is that it is over 30 years later ... how much of this delayed investigation shit can people put up with ... it is their modus operandi ... the public simply doesn't care ... if you point this out to people, they will say ... "well, that happened a long time ago, it is not like that anymore" ...

the military is really for the real dumb feckers

there was this guy who came back from guatanamo bay and i asked about the guilt of the imprisoned people. he said they were guilty. i said, how do you know. he said, because they were pointed out by informers. i said, well, they were given 10K to inform on people. he said, "for 10k, i'd inform on my friends, relatives and almost anybody too .... that's good money" ... pretty sick ... when the economy goes way into the toilet, people can make a living informing on other people ... it'll be great

won't be too difficult finding "domestic terrorists" especially with a finansial reward

the so called mccarthy period during the 50's ... the informers got paid off to point out "communists"

[Edit]
@qwerty, et al -- dotti, 18:27:10 10/29/03 Wed

One of the smartest people I ever knew was a Master Chief in the Navy. He told me that when they lined everybody up for the vaccines, he would ask for a cotton swab with alcohol. Then he would start rubbing his arm with it and slowly, but surely, leave the site as though he had already had his shot. He made it sound easy. Don't know if it was true, but I hoped that it was.

I don't like the way things are going these days!

dotti

[Edit]
@jAll -- dotti, 18:22:21 10/29/03 Wed

I hate to spoil the party, but didn't we hear before that once we topped $290 the POG would be set free. And. All along the way. Will it be different this time?

I want so much--so very much--for the gold cartel to get what is coming to them...when will it really happen?

dotti

[Edit]
frisco fred -- qwerty, 18:20:00 10/29/03 Wed

what is Rangel and Conyers going to do to prevent the next batch of draftees from having their health destroyed thru vaccines along with depleted uranium, experimentation etc

what have they done about the tens of thousands of deaths and hundreds of thousands of people who have had their health permanently destroyed during gulf war 1

what have they done about the pentagon conducting involuntary experiments on the vets for at least the last 50 years ... members of congress actually voted overwhelmingly to give them that authority

large scale military atrocities against people serving in the US military that are allowed to happen and covered up on a continual basis by the upper echelon

i find it real difficult that conyers doesn't know what is really going on ... he is part of the problem

does the bill include the right to refuse vaccines

does the bill disallow experimentation on the draftee by the pentagon

what is rangel and conyers going to do about the treason in the higher echelon ranks of the military

who would be stupid enough to serve in the military where the real enemy has hijacked the military

i think the people who should be drafted should be people voting and supporting for rangels and conyers and anybody else supporting the draft. i have less of a problem with that.

we need to get all the US politicians, fly them over to iraq and afghanistan, put them on the front line. also give them and their families all the vaccines - just to "protect" their health of course.

rangel and conyers have been silent about so much that it is sickening

i remember congress had all those hearings on gulf war syndrome - the result - they let them twist in the wind when all was said and done

[Edit]
Charlie Brown Keeks a Touchdown! -- auspec, 16:12:11 10/29/03 Wed

From tonight's Midas w permission:


10/29 The Stalker Stuns Gold Cartel



October 29 - Gold $386.50 up $3.70 - Silver $5.11 up 4 cents

The Stalker Stuns Gold Cartel

"The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it." --Chinese Proverb

Gold made no sense this morning, at least that is what I thought upon waking and seeing gold down $2.50. The dollar was weaker, the stock market called lower and many commodity prices were higher, with platinum and soybeans leading the way. On the Comex opening gold took out $380, but then quickly reversed course and took off for the upside. Was The Stalker in there doing his thing, as advertised in MIDAS yesterday?

BAM! Gold rose $7 off its opening low with little else going on in the investment world. I’m writing this commentary early because I have to catch a plane early this afternoon for the New Orleans Investment Conference. Thus my commentary may be a bit disjointed. Will make notations to you as I see them while I pack and finish my conference presentation. By the way, GATA has a surprise in store for the conference attendees and for Café members. It will be much fun and I will make it known during my presentation on Friday.

Back to The Stalker again. I have been at this commodities futures business a long time. NEVER do you get information in advance, tell everyone what is going to happen and why and THEN have it actually happen. I can’t say for sure it was The Stalker, but if it wasn’t, then it was the "Luck Of The Irish."

I wonder how much more The Stalker still has to buy out of his $1.1 billion dollar gold order?

As is often the case with gold, The Gold Cartel regrouped after being stunned by the swiftness of the price rise this morning. Deutsche Bank was the designated stopper this time. In addition, the floor tells me that when DEC gold hit $388.20, SOMEONE gave a monster sell order to AlL the dealers with orders to take gold down hard. They did as it dropped more than $2 in minutes. Manipulation of the highest order.

The crooks desperately want to keep gold from closing about $390, which leaves $400 gold only a hop, skip and a jump away. More and more talk is beginning to circulate that if gold can clear $400, we might get a gold melt-up. The gold derivatives neutron bomb could go off.

END

Comments: Gold bugs, in large part, are skittish when they really needn't be and will end up being the boldest when they also shouldn't be. We're going MUCH higher regardless of the short term moves, tis baked in the cake.

still checking the mail daily for some of me v's promised gold stock dividends................

Right now, New Orleans is the epicenter of the gold world, right? Well, not exactly, unless millions of Indians, Chinese and Islamic folks show up. They WILL be their in spirit for sure. James U. Blanchard, founder of this conference, was early with the "China Factor" some 8 or so years ago.

[Edit]
qwerty -- Frisco Fred, 15:54:28 10/29/03 Wed


qwerty, I could be wrong (as I often am) but my thought on Rangel and Conyers push for the draft is so that some of the elite sons and daughters would have to serve their country and not just mostly poor people. Some would find a way to dodge (as almost all of Congress, Clinton, Bush and their children did), but it would catch some of them.

It's an ill wind,
FF

[Edit]
number six -- volavka, 13:24:33 10/29/03 Wed

you must have bought the 9 million + shares of apll today.

[Edit]
H.R.163 Universal National Service Act of 2003 -- qwerty, 12:44:00 10/29/03 Wed


Rangel and Conyers are co-sponsors in re-instating the draft and of course they are suppose to be "anti-war". what NWO scumbags they are.

the major problems for any draftee is

a ) it is legal for the pentagon to conduct experiments on the draftee

b ) it is legal for them for forcibly inject vaccines into the draftee

c) they will be under the command of treasonous upper echelon military and political people.

a) and b) threaten the life and health of the draftee in a major way. like previous vets, they will be discarded into the trash can call post traumatic stress syndrome or some psychiatric diagnosis and given anti-depressants and counseling as treatment. another words, they will be fecked over good. they won't even be able to sue the military or government for harm done to them. many soldiers even got micro-chipped against their will.

talk about being caught between the rock and hard place.

i think the key to surviving any induction is keeping the government from getting physical access to ones body and the avoiding involvement in the manufactured wars and conflicts.

[Edit]
auspec -- qwerty, 09:28:23 10/29/03 Wed

thanks for that midas snippet

the cabal will need to deal with a billion dollar of gold purchase, it won't be easy

should make it over the $400 bar and maybe even the $410 bar if they purchase it

the support / resistance line will be raised higher

maybe some more heavy purchases from other sources before end of year to get us over $425

i can see why sinclair is being aggressive in going long ... he'll make a bundle

maybe even the cabal is going long knowing that the line in the sand will be moved up

i would think the cabal would support a higher price of gold as a defensive measure to head off the purchase or push it further into the future

the cabal could front run everyone and dump them later

hopefully the sinclair and speculators take that opportunity away

a counter measure for the stalker would be to spread the purchases out over time so they minimize any artificial pump and front running by the cabal

i think closing above 425 by years end would be good

i think getting to 450 by years end would be ideal

then go into 2 or 3 months of some correction and consolidation and then resume the upward trend in spring

i don't really want to see the public involved in a major way until $525 or so since i think we have sufficient rocket fuel to get to that level. i'd rather see real gold demand be the base

when china allows the individual to get in on the gold, that will be real interesting. i suspect some of the current stalker buying is being done to satisfy expected demand when they allow individuals in china to own gold

many of us are wondering when the american public gets involved. the chinese public may get there ahead of the american public who will become even poorer since they have to buy at premium prices

i'm sure the very wealthy in china have always been able to buy gold thru the back door especially through mongolia and hong kong

the equity gold funds will be another source when they come on line

i can see a feeding frenzy coming at some point all around the world because at some point, i expect the cabal to go long and be "gold friendly" at least until they get control of it again

i'm sure the volatility along the way will be very scary. for many people but since most of us know the nature of gold and market manipulation, it will be just the same ole same ole ... after it stabilizes above 450, we should be comfortable

so he price of gold shooting up today doesn't surprise me

all those insiders especially the ones in intelligence who collect or have access to financial intelligence ... what an easy way to become rich ... us peons have to contend with all the disinformation and scrape for info that privileged insiders get handed to them on a gold platter

[Edit]
You all gave up too soon -- volavka, 09:25:55 10/29/03 Wed

u could not push it over 388.00
I'll settle for a 386 dec close.

[Edit]
EUR/USD -- Netking, 09:00:29 10/29/03 Wed

EUR 10/28/03 @ 1.1655 bottom, last today @1.1696, Eur, your mission should you decide to accept is to get past the recent double top @ apprx 1.1858, followed by 1.1933 [reached May/June]....strong upside exists [ditto Au] beyond this for the EUR, the land of Canan...

[Edit]
Silver Stocks [Comparative Valuations] - Jason Hommel -- Netking, 08:37:01 10/29/03 Wed

2003-10-29 update:

http://www.minersmanual.com/silverarticle.php?SA_ID=86

[Edit]
hmmmmmmmmmm -- number six, 08:10:45 10/29/03 Wed

Very rare & auspicious lochness monster formation on the palladium chart there. Dunno what it means.

[Edit]
run thru 388 -- volavka, 07:27:53 10/29/03 Wed

could produce close over 400.

[Edit]
Dr Hwang say -- volavka, 06:36:26 10/29/03 Wed

"What difference between Harley and Hoover?"

Position of dirt bag.

[Edit]
Grasso -- volavka, 06:11:28 10/29/03 Wed

didn't make the tyco party.

Dwarf tossing not allowed.

[Edit]
We having fun yet -- volavka, 05:42:16 10/29/03 Wed

Very soon all the weak shall be cleaned out then the fun starts.
Very soon...

Dr. Hwang say," no disneyland in China, no one tall enough to go on rides."

[Edit]
Netking re Butler -- auspec, 04:48:00 10/29/03 Wed

The man is a profit, pure and simple {not misspelled}!

[Edit]
Tai -- auspec, 04:04:33 10/29/03 Wed

Many, many times my friend. All along the way from $250 to current $380 plus, all the way along the trip to "da bank". Midas knows gold! Midas is a bulldog but so is Chris!

Happy trails {of NO tears}!

[Edit]
Butler - Silver -- Netking, 23:16:39 10/28/03 Tue

http://www.investmentrarities.com/10-28-03.html

[For those of you who bash Ted in cyberspace, well...shame on you. More power to you man]
~~~~~~~~
The Stalker, he's gone back to China, Who? that's right.

[Edit]
Current POG, POS, POP & U$D Live Price -- CHARTs, 22:59:12 10/28/03 Tue

US$/POG: from www.kitco.comUS$/POS: from www.kitco.comEURO/POG: from www.kitco.com[Most Recent USD from www.kitco.com]








LbS/POG: from www.kitco.com London Fix: from www.kitco.com LbS/POS: from www.kitco.com






US$/POP: from www.kitco.com

US$/POP: from www.kitco.com


[Edit]
Hey Rusty... How Many Times... -- Tai, 22:55:01 10/28/03 Tue

...have we heard Midas say this.?.

"The cabal won another battle, but if
my latest information is right, they will be on the defensive shortly."

Just asking...

[Edit]
P-Nuts Splitz the Uprights! -- auspec, 19:31:23 10/28/03 Tue

Snippet from tonight's Midas {w permission}:

The Stalker to Strike Again This Coming Week

"Last Friday’s gold bashing by JP Morgan Chase in the last half hour was a warning by The Gold Cartel to the longs they were going to have their hands full if they stayed that way. Gold has dropped virtually $10 off its late Friday high in two sessions since the cabal launched their attack."

"Great Lakes was a huge seller this morning. Goldman Sachs was actually a small buyer. The cabal won another battle, but if my latest information is right, they will be on the defensive shortly. Got a call today from my Stalker source. He tells me The Stalker ("gold buying group" whose orders are emanating out of New Zealand and Australia) bought 1/3 of its $1.6 billion buy order and backed off on the rest as the gold price took off. However, we now hear that as gold has dropped back, they will be buying again SOON and expect the remainder of the HUGE order to be filled within a week to ten days."

END

Comment: By Halloween the "Stalker" will be roaming the streets of NY. Lucy has some "splainin to do" for not pulling da ball away quick enough.

The "Gold Bug Ball" starts tomorrow. Some think gold will be bashed in honor of same. Naw!

Gold shares are still flying high.........some are really kicking butt. Buyouts will be on the agenda in the coming months {6 or so}. Let the games begin....we're not even close to a public mania. Slow and steady, as the R Man sez............this bull is gonna last numerous years after an 18 mo bear.

P.S. I think FeTop is actually the Stalker.........sly dog that he is.

[Edit]
number six -- volavka, 11:26:41 10/28/03 Tue

yep, apll like magr, it's all about percent per cent, follow my point...

You can own alittle or millions and when they show a chart pattern, especially the 97 percent, you buy the hell out of them.

[Edit]
hmmmmm -- number six, 07:31:12 10/28/03 Tue

Hey volavka, if you're out there, you were recommending APLL.ob apolo gold right? Well I just done gone bought some. Couldn't resist a gold and silver company with a forward p/e of less than point five! Sure they are a two-bit little operation, but asking for a p/e of 5 instead would surely not be asking too much.... They just need their story to get out.

[Edit]
@Netking -- Questioner, 05:24:09 10/28/03 Tue

Really like that photo from space. Great post! Looks like Southern California is getting a bit of a cleansing. Makes one wonder what happens when the rains come? Should provide some economic stimulus for reconstructing the homes and jobs. Makes you think of the Eagles and that song off The Hotel California album called, The Last Resort:
(The Last Resort by the Eagles)

She came from Providence, the one in Rhode Island
where the old world shadows hang heavy in the air.
She packed her hopes and dreams like a refugee,
just as her father came across the sea.

She heard about a place people were smilin',
they spoke about the red man's way, how they loved the land.
And they came from everywhere to the Great Divide
seeking a place to stand or a place to hide.

Down in the crowded bars out for a good time,
can't wait to tell you all what it's like up there.
And they called it paradise, I don't know why.
Somebody laid the mountains low while the town got high.

Then the chilly winds blew down across the desert,
through the canyons of the coast to the Malibu
where the pretty people play hungry for power
to light their neon way and give them things to do.

Some rich man came and raped the land, nobody caught 'em,
put up a bunch of ugly boxes and, Jesus, people bought 'em.
And they called it paradise, the place to be,
they watched the hazy sun sinking in the sea.

You can leave it all behind and sail to Lahaina
just like the missionaries did so many years ago.
They even brought a neon sign 'Jesus is Coming',
brought the white man's burden down, brought the white man's reign.

Who will provide the grand design, what is yours and what is mine?
'Cause there is no more new frontier, we have got to make it here.
We satisfy our endless needs and justify our bloody deeds
in the name of destiny and in the name of God.

And you can see them there on Sunday morning
stand up and sing about what it's like up there.
They called it paradise, I don't know why.
You call some place paradise - kiss it goodbye

[Edit]
NetKing -- qwerty, 04:22:44 10/28/03 Tue

===
Dr James Dobson reports an organization has been granted a Federal Hearing on the same subject by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in Washington,DC. Their petition, Number 2493, would ultimately pave the way to stop the reading of the Gospel the airwaves of America. The 287,000 signatures that back the stand suggest if this attempt is successful, all Sunday worship services being broadcast on the radio or by television are at risk. This group is also campaigning to remove all Christmas programs and Christmas carols from public schools.

Think you live in a free country? Play it again Sam.
===

this makes me very very very suspicious

to gather a large number signatures for such a stupid thing raises a red flag

it's another NWO operation with the evangelical NWO people complicit

so many evangelicals even tout Bush and the Homeland Security brotherhood as "christians" ... many "christians" view bush as christian ... talk about how dumb people are and what they can be convinced of

it is the thesis - anti-thesis modus operandi to bring about a hidden agenda

it would be very intersting to find out where their funding comes from ...

this whole thing SMELLS like another behind the scenes covert psyops operation with a front group acting as a distraction

and with the destruction of the US constitution and ushering in a police state happening in the mean time ... groups who don't focus on the serious stuff now show themselves to be most likely FAKE

it'll get many of the christian mind controlled sheep in a polarized state ... bush will align wih them ... they will work together with satan ur i mean bush

stopping the reading of the Gospel on radio etc ... how absurd can things get ...


soon there will be a group putting forward a petition to make parents who don't GPS chip their kids for locatability as child abusers since they could create missing children

If Dr James Dobson has not warned people of the shering in police state and patriot act then one can assume he is just an actor playing out his role

[Edit]
thomas -- qwerty, 04:03:25 10/28/03 Tue

>but is a player behind the scene

is it sinclair or memorex

[Edit]
"No Gospel allowed on the airwaves!" -- Netking, 01:06:05 10/28/03 Tue

Dr James Dobson reports an organization has been granted a Federal Hearing on the same subject by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in Washington,DC. Their petition, Number 2493, would ultimately pave the way to stop the reading of the Gospel the airwaves of America. The 287,000 signatures that back the stand suggest if this attempt is successful, all Sunday worship services being broadcast on the radio or by television are at risk. This group is also campaigning to remove all Christmas programs and Christmas carols from public schools.

Think you live in a free country? Play it again Sam.

[Edit]
Current POG, POS, POP & U$D Live Price -- CHARTs, 00:41:05 10/28/03 Tue

US$/POG: from www.kitco.comUS$/POS: from www.kitco.comEURO/POG: from www.kitco.com[Most Recent USD from www.kitco.com]








LbS/POG: from www.kitco.com London Fix: from www.kitco.com LbS/POS: from www.kitco.com






US$/POP: from www.kitco.com

US$/POP: from www.kitco.com


[Edit]
Canadian Zinc--Silver Potential -- Netking, 23:09:12 10/27/03 Mon

http://www.minersmanual.com/silverarticle.php?SA_ID=84

"...Canadian Zinc has some of the highest grades of ore in the world, with 12% zinc, 10% lead, and over 6 ounces of silver per ton over 11 million tonnes in "zone 3" of 12 zones. Canadian Zinc (CZN.TO and CZICF.PK) was up 22.37% today to break out to a new high of $.93 CAN. Zinc and silver prices continue to go up, hitting .42 cents/lb. for zinc, and $5.11/oz. for silver. Canadian Zinc has zinc, of course, and also plenty of silver...

...Why is there such excitement about Canadian Zinc? It could be that this was the mining operation financed by the Hunt brothers, who were key silver players in the run up to $50/oz. silver back in 1980. The mine was 90% complete in 1980 as the project had $50 million in infrastructure set up back then. At today's prices, the value of the existing mill and the rest of the buildings may well exceed $100 million...

...the company has mineralization across 12 zones, but has a pre-feasibility study that concentrates on zone 3, which is obviously the largest and richest target. So there is a lot of exploration potential here that is not considered..."

[Edit]
qwerty -- Thomas, 22:17:05 10/27/03 Mon


qwerty, thank you for the explanation about Sinclair. "Tongue twists and turns" is an apt description to tie together your two posts that at first reading seemed contradictory. I wonder if his speaking is as "blustering" as his writing. It seems at times that he knows more about real estate mine deals than he does about gold deals. I have heard that his wife is much more knowledgeable about gold than he is, but is a player behind the scene.

Appreciate your explanation,
Thomas

[Edit]
California Burning From Space -- Netking, 22:11:14 10/27/03 Mon



An image from NASA's Modis satellite of California's out of control wildfires.

[Edit]
@ Slatt and number six -- Galearis, 12:58:57 10/27/03 Mon

About silver mining...

There are grey areas to grey areas in the mining world and lots of opinion on what is what. However, it is generally accepted that silver production from base metal and sometimes gold recovery operations is generally inelastic. This is especially the case as the economies (world) slow down in recessionary times. They simply don’t ramp up production of zinc, for example, to recover more silver. Zinc demand actually falls and so we are likely to see even less silver coming out of the sector, not more.

Primary producers, the few of them out there, have a tendency – if their management is wise – to cut back on silver production as the bang for the ounce rises. This way they maintain an even cash flow, employment level, and generally get back some of the lost reserves that they squandered high-grading their ore during the rigged market, excuse me, low POS period. This obviously is not black and white. Some miner managements would be stupid, or in debt (short), or just plain greedy to the point that they would have to ramp up production,,, so a few keep on high-grading. Hard to call, it’s a big nasty world out there, especially in pms.

What we are reasonably sure about is that silver production will likely fall gradually thru this century and new uses for silver will augment demand. We are probably running low both above and below ground - in the practical sense. It is hard to say whether production will even surpass consumption ever again. But I am VERY suspicious of statements made of most the surface primary silver has been discovered….Silver deposits of the primary type are usually small and not easily found and while the world is shrinking seemingly, most of it still hasn’t been seen with educated eyes. Things are missed all the time.

Regards,

G.

P.S. Gold Corp fortunes changed for the better when it was noticed that the cook throwing out the dishwater behind the mess hall had exposed a lot of native gold in an outcropping quartz vein system. New mining commenced. Missed for years.

A major mine was discovered on the Klondyke Trail with gold in a vein actually polished by the thousands of mule hooves riding over it...Thousands of prospectors on their way to the placer fields never noticed.

Things are missed. A LOT.

[Edit]
thomas -- qwerty, 11:51:15 10/27/03 Mon

i think sinclairs tongue twists and turns

sinclairs posting where he gave a gloomy gold outlook is gone

maybe that one was scheduled to come out after gold went above 415

sinclair can sometimes mimic the stuff happening on this planet and can make one wonder alot about him

on the bright side, i think his tehnical analysis is ok

and even if one were to suppose that is covertly work for the cabal, one can get valuable information from him for personal investing growth

and if one supposes he is sincerely expressing his views, it can be very depressing thinking that the human species will become extinct because of it's sheer stupidity and i mean on an individual level

[Edit]
number six -- SLATT, 11:09:36 10/27/03 Mon

Silver production as a byproduct is the easiest. Case closed. It is a simple matter of profitability. The existing byproduct silver production is more profitable since there isn't additional cost in it's production. As I see it the example (from 10% to 36% of revenue) you gave proves that point. If the mine operated at a profit before it is extremely profitable now. And with no added risk.

Opening new or abandoned silver mines is indeed very costly. So is the cost of production of the silver. The profitability can be quite less than byproduct silver. The production will be tied to POS exclusively, thus making the operation of the mine hostage to POS.

[Edit]
qwerty -- Thomas, 11:02:26 10/27/03 Mon


Does Sinclair speak straight or with forked tongue? It has to be one or the other.

[Edit]
gold will go way down -- qwerty, 10:31:36 10/27/03 Mon


reading sinclair latest

my impression is that

he seems to have inside info

he seems to say dollar may retest 101 area before going back down

gold will likely go way down to 350's

sinclair seems to say there will be a dollar pump

[Edit]
Silver Stocks -- Comparative Valuations -- Netking, 09:03:53 10/27/03 Mon

http://news.goldseek.com/GoldIsMoney/1067160023.php
Yeeehaaa!


[Edit]
intelligent agent exposure story is a joke -- qwerty, 08:53:54 10/27/03 Mon

in regards to supposedly exposure of intelligent agent by bush

this is nothing but a contrived trash story

there are so many intelligence agents above the surface that one can see that it is a joke. all one needs to pick out a lot of names is a directory listing.

we could tag them with round purple dots on their foreheads

i could go to any US embassy and put a purple tag on just about every employee and be able to detect the one's working for intelligence

we could put a purple tag on dan rather and a bunch of other media people ... gee, they are exposed

what a joke this whole story is

why don't we put a purple dot on clinton's forehead

what made me sick was that bob chapman actually said that he thought novak should be shot for treason

yeah, right bob ... hasn't said much about shooting people in the upper echelon of financial, military, intelligence and political who have committed blatant treason against the country

i would like to ask all those intel agents out on the web whether we need to shoot almost the entire upper echelon on intelligence agencies officials ... how could decades of treason be carried out without so many upper echelon officials being unaware

how do all these outraged intel people feel about working for an organization controlled by the NWO ...

what about the upper echelon military people

where were these people outrage when ...

OKC bombing treason was carried out

911 treason was carried out

WTC 1993 treason was carried out

Operation Norwood treason

JFK assassinaion treason

destruction of the US constitution

treason in the theft of 3 trillion dollars in defense spending

biological attacks against the american people over the last century

treason against hundreds of thousands of veterans, POW's and so called MIA

treason in the manufacture of wars fought for the elite

and a whole lot more

do you think we ought to do anything about the hijacking and subversion of the media and expose the disinformation intelligence agents



do you think we ought to expose the treason by intel agents

it will be the sinclairs, schultz and even partly bob chapman who talks in contradictions who will be responsible for the destruction of this country

the intel agents are doing a good job in doing nothing to stop the destruction of this country

some of the ones i have personally come across have partaken in the looting of the taxpayers

this is not to say there are some trying to do something but they have no real power



the mindless cog behavior of intelligence agents are helping carrying out the destruction of this country by their blind loyalty to the organizations of the dark forces.

most intelligence agents are nothing more than little privileged pawns of the elite. too many are corrupted and have no patriotism to their country.

i would suspect that many true patriots of the intelligence community have been murdered by their own agency ... the lockerbie airline crash is a case in point ... where was the outrage about this ... agency personel helped cover this up

people compartmentalizing the treason to a few lone individuals are either very politically stupid or complicit in treason themselves - for running a psyops campaign and helping cover up all the other treason against the USA

Treason is a way of life in the USA for upper echelon political, financial, military and intelligence people. The NWO is the power behind them. They promote people to high positions who will obey their orders to destroy america. On a lower level, you have your mindless and corrupt cogs. If someone like Bush Sr is popular in the CIA, it would make sense why.

The good guys within the machinery who have managed to survive that are trying to fight it are outnumbered and mostly powerless in the bigger picture.

Unwittingly, allying themselves with the NWO is J6P. They will allow the few good people in the system to burn at the stake. J6P aids and abets the enemy from within. J6P views themsleves as patriotic. The NWO views J6P as stupid and controllable.

The good guys only seem to win on TV.

The bad guys are winning in real life.

[Edit]
Iraq -- Netking, 08:49:21 10/27/03 Mon

Yep, up to 40 people killed, 224 injured in Iraq on the first day of Ramadan, Red Cross considers pulling out all foreign workers...not a good situation over there folks...indications suggest this is just "early days". President Bush: "...the more progress we make, the more desperate these people are to destroy freedom. We will not be intimidated...", the classic "...bring 'em on..." words were left out of this speech, guess that's exactly what happened.

GI's under friendly fire for marrying Iraqis

[Edit]
Slatt -- number six, 07:21:58 10/27/03 Mon

Mate, you've got it all backwards when it comes to silver-as-by-product mining. It would take a huge and sustained increase in POS before most mines could comit the big bucks required to increase mine capacity. Building new shafts, buying new mills, redrawing the whole life-of-mine plan, rejigging the whole processing plant while it's still operating... these are a royal pain in the arse and they cost a LOT. Imagine a mine with $100 mil revenues, including $10m from selling 2mil oz/ag. Now if silver was previously only contributing 10% of the mine's revenue at $5/oz, if it hits $25/oz it would still only be contributing 36% of revenue. You'd still have to give a lot more heed to the other 63% and how those commodities were going. You'd have to have a lot of faith in a continued high pos before you'd comit the $20-50-100 mil required to seriously increase overall output. If the pos went back down you'd have turned your nice little earner into a white elephant, and this is what they would fear even if silver had stayed above ~$25 for a few years.

Now pure or near pure silver deposits that need $8 pos to be worth it, (silver standard has a bunch of them,) these will be put into operation quickly - i.e. producing within 2 or 3 years after pos starts to fly. But the polymetallic silver by-product guys won't, for the most part, be upping production greatly for a few years after, if it's worth their while at all. Some will, most won't.

[Edit]
Rocket science -- volavka, 06:33:35 10/27/03 Mon

U.S. told from day #1, snipers and using your car as a missile.

[Edit]
WRONG AGAIN (sigh) -- SLATT, 05:41:08 10/27/03 Mon

"Has the "easy" silver been picked over? Yes, of course it has. The majority of the earth's land surfaces have had some degree of geological analysis. New primary silver mines are much more likely to come as a result of POS increasing and affecting the economics of a previously explored property than as a result of brand new discoveries."

Silver is silver. The "easy" silver is being produced as a byproduct of mining for other metals. Can't get any easier than that. And that "easy" silver production will increase with the rise in POS.

[Edit]
Insane market -- john, 05:21:09 10/27/03 Mon

I took this post of wwww.freebuck.com which has many articles by this author and i also visited the site to read the other free articles all of which are very interesting

19 October 2003



General market commentary

The biggest problem to date has been the markets extreme refusal to even give a modest decent correction and against all odds and all beliefs it seems to keep churning upwards, like a blind man with a purpose. The plaguing question is what is the purpose, what is the market trying to tell us? Or is it the market talking or just the easy money policies of the fed that are blindly pumping this market up. Every technical indicator is in the overbought range, every psychological indicator is in the extreme bullish range to(which is usually a negative for the market), contrarain indicators which most fall under psychological indicators are also suggesting that we should have already started to correct. And the esoteric hourly cycles have been in the screaming overbought zone since the 8th of October, while they can stay for quite extended periods of time in the overbought zone, this is extremely unusual, however the only ray of light and I mean that in an ironical way is that the daily cycles are not overbought, which is something I find very hard to believe, I do not try to direct the cycles, I just make sure I am able to read what they are saying, so while all the indicators are in the extreme overbought zone, the only one that has not given a major sell signal is the daily esoteric cycles .



The daily cycles have just touched the overbought zone, which is technically the minimum level needed in order to start a decent correction, however this is not a guarantee and in an irrational market one usually ends going to the extreme zone, we are in an irrational market, the cycles are suggesting that 9900-10000 is a possibility.



Lets us look at the irrational factors.



Vix has dropped to multi year lows, in June 2002 it was at 54, recently it dipped below 17 and into the lower 16 point range. To show you how irrational this is if one looks at a chart you will see we just made a new 5 year low. At the height of the biggest mania ever ( 99 peak of dot.com era) we did not dip to such low levels, clearly insanity is in the driving seat. We have to go back 6 years to find a point in time where we were below such levels, and we find that year was 1998, when we briefly dipped to levels lower than these ( look at chart below). However that was a different era, jobs were easy to get, corporate spending was uncontrolled, and the air was filled with great expectations. Fast forward to today, jobs are hard to come by, over 3 million have been lost in the manufacturing sector and the situation is going to get worse, thousands of more jobs lost permanently in the high tech sector, no hiring relief in sight, very few companies talking about a brighter future, we have no surplus anymore, we are running huge budget deficits that will only get worse. The dollar is extremely weak. The probability of another major war somewhere in the Middle East or with N. Korea looms in the horizon. The possibility that the Asian countries will dump their dollar reserves and switch to gold or the euro or a mix of the two, this alone would have untold negative ramifications that could rock this so called weak economic recovery to the stone age and the list goes on and on.



http://tacticalinvestor.com/vix.gif



If one starts to look for positive news, one has to hunt very deep and actually stop thinking in a sane manner, you need to start thinking like someone who has just escaped from a lunatic asylum to be able to find any sane reasons to have faith in this economy or market,( however sanity has not made to many people rich but that is a point for another day). The only argument one can come up with is that, we needed to see some sort of rally in this market after everyone was on the negative gloom and doom bandwagon as a contrarian you knew that the market had to put in a temporary bottom and rally as the negativity had reached incredible levels by October 2002, however this has long since ceased to be a technical rally and has actually become a rally with intermediate bullish implications. One cannot use the argument that earnings are getting better because that is like the kettle calling the pot black. Earning have ratcheted down so much that it makes no sense to do any comparison, every quarter the analysts keep adjusting the earnings, usually in a downward direction to such a point that it is virtually impossible for most companies not to exceed these lowered earnings estimates. Lets try to do that in college, lower down the % ones needs to to get an A, from maintaining an 90% average to 65% and soon you will have almost every idiot strutting around calling himself an A student. Take it one step further, to fall into the wealthy bracket you only need to make 20,000, at this point almost no one will be able to call themselves poor anymore and welfare will almost cease to exist. You get the point.



To literally find any good news you have to hunt for it, while if you are looking for bad news and this bad news that is factually correct, there is an endless supply of it, yet like ostriches who have decided to bury their heads in the sand, the masses have virtually ignored all the recent volley of bad news and chosen instead to focus on the minuscule amounts of good data out there.



Even for seasoned traders, top notch market watchers and writers these last 3 months have been nothing short of puzzling, I sincerely doubt there is any trader or analyst or newsletter writer that can comprehend the markets persistence to march forward. The problem is not that we are in a bullish phase now, that is fine the trend reveals that, what the problem is that even in a healthy bull market you never get such stupendous advance without some healthy pull back we have virtually gone from 7400-9800 without one serious pull back. This rise is one for the record books, if we were back in the 1990’s era this would somehow be justifiable but we are not. Even we have been hit with the few puts plays we have taken, we did not load up on puts or get to aggressive, because we started sensing some anomaly that we could not quite place our hands on, but it was there, and so as a precaution we abstained from becoming to bearish, and recently with the our new tool esoteric cycles it has helped us avoid taking many a short position that looked perfect technically but would have ended disastrously had we taken those positions.



I don’t mind saying that all of us at the tactical investor, the few individuals involved in research are completely perplexed at how this market simply refuses to give in and we have to rely on our new tools and this so called new paradigm where we rise on bad news, with no good news anywhere in sight, a phenomenon which is beyond contrarian investing the only term I can come up with is insane investing.



This would be a good contrarian view point if the we were rising on bad news but the worst was behind us, but that does not appear to be the case, in an economic recovery one main ingredient is key, companies stop firing and actually slowly start hiring but here the corporate firing squad is busy increasing their supply of bullets and trading in their rifles for machine guns. Without new jobs you cannot have sustained economic growth, if your earnings are simply improving as a result of better cost cutting methods, than that is not economic recovery that is called desperation, you are fighting to say alive and recovery is very very far away.



What is my point here? it is very simple I agree with all you that are writing in and sending me stories with bad news and I also agree when you tell me all your technical indicators are screaming sell and suggesting that we should crash and I agree with you that market should pull back, crash yes but not right now. However I cannot and will not start to scream like a bear when everything around looks and sounds bullish even though it is from an insane perspective and then you have the other camp that which is primarily composed of Experienced traders and professional newsletter writers that are extremely bearish. we have two extremes sentiment readings occurring simultaneously.



. Lets take a second to reflect on these points, If we at the tactical investor had maintained nothing but a bearish stance, and taken huge short positions where would we be now, that’s right slaughtered like pigs. Wall street is lined with graves of people who were right but right to early. We have not changed our stance that this is market will one day crash very severely but it wont be doing so right now. However as I mentioned before we are surprised that there has not been any decent correction what so ever.



It is for that reason that we have been looking to use this market to our advantage, rather than force the market to cater to our needs, we have decided to look for opportunities that we can live with, that are contrarian in nature and that will pass our technical tests and it is for that reason we have been taking more and more long positions, but they are in extremely oversold sectors or in sectors that are already performing well but one or two stocks have been getting hammered and have reached mouthwatering levels where the risk to reward ratio is favorable, simply shorting stocks or using put options or going short via a futures for any length of time has been extremely dangerous.



There is something very abnormal in this current market and till it returns to some sort of normality, it seems most TA indicators are not going to be use full as they once were. When in doubt sit out that is my motto. Sometimes the best thing to do in market is be patient and that’s what we are going to have to do here. Instead of trying to force the market down lets simply invest in sectors or stocks that are extremely oversold and make a good contrarian play. Or if you are conservative then wait for a decent correction to transpire before taking new positions. As we all know when playing with the markets the saying no pain no gain has never been truer.



I will end with this, I believe the market should correct. For the last month or so we have been rising on lower than average volume and so I think we are either at or close to a short term top, however this correction is just going to be brief, before the market carries on rallying. As of right now I don’t see us going below 8800, most likely the 9000 range won’t be breached. These above scenarios should hold unless we have some catastrophic event take place, and that is beyond all timing systems. I believe this decline will provide many of us a with very good stock plays and some spectacular call options.

[Edit]
@qwerty, et al -- dotti, 23:21:49 10/26/03 Sun

"if people can't comprehend the larger con job then the sovereignty of this country is certainly finished"

qwerty, thanks for your post. You're probably right. I know that politics is rigged, but I still think of elections as being "free". I find more to like on the Republican side than on the Democrat side--but you're right--it doesn't relly matter. Pretty depressing thought.

Unfortunately, I don't think that there is any way that "we, the people" will ever regain the control of this nation--or any other. For that to happen would take the media getting the truth to the people. That won't happen.

It's good that I do not believe that this place is "as good as it gets". We learn.

Thanks for your post.

dotti

[Edit]
dotti -- qwerty, 22:44:26 10/26/03 Sun

>I do not trust the media. They played their part on the demo side.

don't compartmentalize your thinking

step back

look at the big picture

the democrats and republicans are on the same team

they are playing you

the media is controlled. they manipulate people with emotion. emotion bypasses the intellect.

the media's role in this is to get you to think that the democrats and republicans are in opposition

the democrats and republicans are mostly front men for the real power

you never really see who calls the shots

the democrats and republican are colluding in riggong the elections for the real power

the most unfortunate outcome for florida election is that most people are continuing to support the democrats and republicans

if people can't comprehend the larger con job then the sovereignty of this country is certainly finished

[Edit]
Superconductivity Researchers Win Nobel Prize - Silver Plays a Prominent Role in Certain Superconductivity Applications -- Netking, 22:09:13 10/26/03 Sun

Silver Institute Press Release:


Pioneering contributions to the theory of superconductors and superfluids resulted in the 2003 Nobel Prize in Physics being awarded last week to Vitaly L. Ginzburg, Alexei A. Abrikosov, and Anthony Leggett. The Secretary of the Department of Energy, Spencer Abraham, said of the Nobel Award, "Through their efforts, tremendous strides are being made in understanding these processes, leading to the development of new superconducting materials and technologies that have great promise to benefit the entire world."

The silver industry has had a keen interest in superconductivity since silver is a key component of superconductive wire, which operates with no electrical resistance at practical operating temperatures and provides better performance at significantly reduced weight and size to cables, motors, generators and transformers.

About 16 years ago, researchers achieved a breakthrough when several unusual oxides were combined and proved to be superconductive at relatively low temperatures. However, they were brittle and unworkable. That was the case until a solution was developed at the AT&T Bell Laboratories, which incorporated silver into the mix to combat the earlier frustrations.

Placing these oxides into practical use generated worldwide research, and already over 700 patents have been issued. For example, the patents held by the American Superconductor Corporation (AMC), Westborough, MA (www.amsuper.com) have resulted in practical silver-jacketed superconducting oxide wires that carry more than 140 times the electric load of copper wire with less than 1 percent of the weight.

With over a decade of development behind it, AMC recently shipped 18 miles of silver- jacketed, high-temperature superconductor (HTS) wire to China for new electric-power projects. According to Greg Yurek, chief executive officer of American Superconductor, "We have sold samples of our wire into China and have been working with a number of companies and government agencies to meet this dynamic new Chinese industry. We believe this initial order represents just the beginning of what is ultimately enormous growth potential for all our products in China." Yurek added, "In every case we know about, a noble metal, primarily silver, is put on top of high-temperature superconducting wires."

The Silver Institute has previously reported that this wire takes about 1,000 ounces of silver per mile. Do the math on this one boys and girls, this market is so very finely balanced....if the projections on this alone are anything like what the initial calculations suggest, then, ergo.

Netking

[Edit]
Periodic Ponzi Update PPU -- $hifty, 21:54:09 10/26/03 Sun

Ponzi Chart

Periodic Ponzi Update PPU

Nasdaq 1,865.59 + Dow 9,582.46 = 11,448.05 divide by 2 = 5,724.025 Ponzi

Down 93.05 from last week .

Thanks for the link RossL !

Go GATA !

Go GOLD !

Go Comets!

$hifty



[Edit]
Only 12 guys in the Group of 20 -- $hifty, 21:39:14 10/26/03 Sun

Only 12 guys in the Group of 20 photo below. I guess the other 8 leased out their ties and could not get them back!

:-)

$hify

[Edit]
Mr. V's "no gold ties here." I love it! ha ha ha -- $hifty, 21:29:47 10/26/03 Sun





Finance officials from 20 nations and Central Bank governers pose for the official photo of the annual meeting of the Group of 20 nations in Morelia, Michoacan, Mexico on Sunday, Oct. 26, 2003. (AP Photo/Eduardo Verdugo)

[Edit]
Current POG, POS, POP & U$D Live Price -- CHARTs, 21:12:51 10/26/03 Sun

US$/POG: from www.kitco.comUS$/POS: from www.kitco.comEURO/POG: from www.kitco.com[Most Recent USD from www.kitco.com]








LbS/POG: from www.kitco.com London Fix: from www.kitco.com LbS/POS: from www.kitco.com






US$/POP: from www.kitco.com

US$/POP: from www.kitco.com


[Edit]
synthetic reality -- Questioner, 18:38:49 10/26/03 Sun

We live in very plastic/pliable times. One day hard rock is toxic waste and the next it is hard rock. Too much carbon dioxide is suppose to make us feel guilty about breathing cause we cause global warming by exhaling. Instead of Catholic guilt it is replaced with environmental guilt, go figure. The current reality is about what we make it, still plenty of freedom out there to go out and create. Let us hope it lasts.

[Edit]
From NY Currency on MineWeb -- qwerty, 18:14:19 10/26/03 Sun

Good fun reading ...

===

The resolve is clear. Our objectives will be met.
We have seen the enemy, and his A$$ is ours ! We will lure him in with his dreams of granduer, and with hopes of profiting from his folly. Then we will stomp on his head, and crush his body as we lay out his financial positions profitless while he bleeds green monetary blood.

Some of these sorry gold-bug terrorists say that there is a shortage of gold. This is absolute nonsense ! In fact, we have to pony up a kings ransome just to store the massive quantities of these gold bars. For us it is a huge albatross around our necks, but not nearly so obnoxious as the gold-bugs pronouncements against our government, our society, our democracy and our welfare. Our currency is strong ! And our resolve is clear !

Rest assured, we will draw these gold-bugs into their own "Waterloo." At each turn, we have drop kicked each succesive grouping of would-be aspiring gold-bugs as we have allowed the gold price to meander higher on occasion ... AND THEN WE KICK THEM IN THE TEETH ! We draw in the newbies like flies, and burn their A$$ES good ! Look around and see how many of you actually profited more than if you had invested in the mainstream welfare of this great country, and of the world !

Our resolve is firm. We will use whatever means is necessary. Our first line of defense is through normal suppression of their financial activities. But if all else fails, we will disenfranchise them and their families, revoke property rights, and force them to swim in a pool of hell wrought by their own destructive actions. OUR RESOLVE IS FIRM !

GOLD will be DISCREDITED as a financial asset. GOLD-BUG TERRORISTS will be HUNTED DOWN, and treated like the conniving dogs they are ! ! ! !

May God continue to bless the United States of America, and the George W. Bush administration, and May we endeavor strengthen the SA Rand, and the New Guinean Kina (since some of the gold-bugs have decided to support the terrorist gold industries in this region). On that note, We would like to thank the Papua New Guinean government for their openess to the new regime in our partnering with the gold mining industry in your region. Your support at this crucial time in world history will be of benefit to the world in making it a safer more stable place for our children. Also, I would also be remiss if I didn't reiterate a strong message of support for President Mbeki of South Africa, and Prime Minister Somare of New Guinea.

How many ways to crush those gold-bugs into a fine powder ? 6 ways to an eternity ! ! !

===


I'm more concerned about the crushing of the US Constitution

If our government didn't get hijacked by treasonous criminals and were destroying the economy, I could live with lower gold prices

[Edit]
@qwerty, et al -- dotti, 18:13:32 10/26/03 Sun

Good to see you!

Don't know the series.

It really disturbs me that i do not know what is truth and what is not--regarding Iraq, Afghanistan, gold, etc. I understand that many--most, perhaps--just "short circuit". I do not believe that Bush was "not elected". Whenever I read that, I immediately reject whatever the idea is. I lived in Florida at the time of the election. Moments after Gore got ahead, he was declared the winner. Many at the polls in N.W. Florida, which is mostly Republican, gave up and went home. It was a rainy evening and the lines were long. I do not trust the media. They played their part on the demo side. I was never convinced of any wrong-doing on the other side.

All things considered, however, I cannot trust in anything that I read or hear. Even the Jessica Lynch "rescue" seems to have been nothing more than a ploy--a PR sketch.

It is a sorry state of affairs. How does one know how to select right from wrong when one does not know the true facts?

I am afraid that the good ol US of A is not on the side of right anymore.

dotti

[Edit]
Questioner -- volavka, 17:56:18 10/26/03 Sun

Article carried in wsj on friday, of Mines and Men, on 1872 mining law.

What was not mentioned is that of the 260 million acres of blm lands, just 0.06 percent is affected by mining.

[Edit]
dotti -- qwerty, 17:48:36 10/26/03 Sun

"taken" ... good series ... part 5 on tonight

[Edit]
Somebody said that before -- volavka, 17:46:49 10/26/03 Sun

no gold ties here.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&u=/031026/481/mor11010262156&e=10&ncid=

[Edit]
auspec -- qwerty, 17:45:25 10/26/03 Sun

i have no confidence in predicting what gold will do tomorrow, this week or this month. could go down steeply.

i do have confidence that it will be much higher 6 months from now. If we make can get a trading range around 450 plus or minus 20 points, that will be fine

can't do anything about the trader activities in the gold related market. the operators will be there to scare the heck out of the J6P investors. if they can be kept out long enough, we may have dot com valuations when they do come on board bug time. maybe the J6P in china will come aboard even sooner.

[Edit]
@auspec, et al -- dotti, 17:44:52 10/26/03 Sun

Not to worry.

I have not been "taken".

Many of us read and support without posting.

I am amazed as things transpire. I agree that it seems that the politicians/fed governors are giving away our gold. seems that it should be treason. But. Any claims will be too late.

Take care, All.

dotti

[Edit]
1872 mining law -- Questioner, 17:41:31 10/26/03 Sun

From the Las Vegas Sun web site: http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/nevada/2003/oct/10/101010086.html

Interesting read on mining law

Comment: 1872 mining law gets new twist of interpretation. Could be good for gold exploration in Nevada and the West?

[Edit]
Golden Wall of Worry -- auspec, 17:06:47 10/26/03 Sun

Here we are, a few scant FRN's away from $400....previously labeled nirvana, yet there is no resounding confidence palpable amongst the gold troops. Certainly no overconfidence. That's good, no? Steady as she goes works just fine here.

P.S. It was real nice talking to a fellow axis of evil member this weekend, but wondering where that other bloke is? ER sure has been quiet this last month or so. What gives? Some already in train cars...........? No, I wouldn't be the last one 'invited' for sure.

As rc so aptly states:

"Have a good evening!"

P.S.S. Gonna be a party in N.O. & am not referring to goblins and ghosts.

[Edit]
@auspec...re: Condi... -- OmarD, 12:59:33 10/26/03 Sun

Is not just the "looking"...that makes "Condi" remind of "Gagool"...it is the "thought behind" and "acting like" where the resemblance really begins to ring true...

Read into second page of 1st link I posted below...you will see what I mean...

Rgds,

OmarD

[Edit]
Condi -- auspec, 12:18:50 10/26/03 Sun

Maybe her middle name is Francis or starts w an F......making her the consummate...........CFR?? Naw, it couldn't be.

Now Omar, she's really not THAT bad looking. Is she?

[Edit]
@auspec...re:"Condi" -- OmarD, 11:56:24 10/26/03 Sun

"Condi"...

Can't help see or hear of her doings in news with it conjuring up images of "Gagool" - the "witch advisor" of King "Twala" in the classic, "King Solomon's Mines" by H. Rider Haggard...

"Quartermain's" first encounter with "Gagool" and initial "description" can be read here...(a little more "graphic" then "auspec's")...

http://www.pagebypagebooks.com/H_Rider_Haggard/King_Solomons_Mines/Twala_The_King_p7.html


Full Text of Book...

"King Solomon's Mines" by H. Rider Haggard...http://www.pagebypagebooks.com/H_Rider_Haggard/King_Solomons_Mines/index.html


Rgds,

OmarD






"...See, Gagool, mother of evil, thou art so old thou canst no longer love thy life: What can life be to such a hag as thee, who hast no shape, nor form, nor hair, nor teeth --hast naught, save wickedness and evil eyes?..."



PS: Obviously, "Gagool" escaped her "end" in Rider's account...and she is alive and well, working in the White House...

[Edit]
GATA in New Orleans -- gata, 11:28:57 10/26/03 Sun

Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:

GATA expresses its heartfelt thanks to Durban
Roodeport Deep, the South African gold mining
company that has been among our earliest and
most generous supporters, for agreeing to
sponsor our reception at the New Orleans
Investment Conference on Saturday evening,
November 1.

Durban, considered the mining company most
leveraged to the gold price, will be represented
at the reception by CEO Mark Wellesley-Wood
and Investor Relations Manager Ilja Graulich,
and so they will be guests of honor.

Other guests of honor:

-- Frank Veneroso of Allianz Dresdner, a GATA
consultant whose research has disclosed that
central bank gold lending is two to three times
larger than officially acknowledged. In a recent
interview with CBSMarketWatch Editor Thom
Calandra, Veneroso declared that the central
banks have been trying to suppress the price of
gold as another form of currency intervention.

-- John Embry, president of Sprott Asset
Management in Toronto, who in several public
appearances in Canada has endorsed GATA's
research and conclusions about the gold market
and whose precious metals mutual fund was the
best-performing major fund in the world in 2002.

The GATA reception will be held just prior to the
conference's dinner/dance and will be open
only to GATA supporters (which, by definition,
includes subscribers at GATA Chairman Bill
Murphy's Internet site, LeMetropoleCafe.com).

Reservations for the reception will be required,
so if you haven't already made a reservation and
gotten a confirmation from me, please make your
reservation now by e-mailing me at
GATAComm@aol.com. I'll reply with details about
the reception's time and place.

GATA's delegation to the conference will attend
the reception -- Murphy, GoldMoney founder and
Freemarket Gold and Money Report Editor James
Turk, litigator Reginald H. Howe, statistician
Michael Bolser, researchers Andrew Hepburn and
Robert K. Landis, and your secretary/treasurer.

In addition to GATA's Murphy, Turk, and Veneroso,
the conference's speakers include Bill O'Reilly of
Fox News, Richard Russell of Dow Theory Letters,
renowned global investor Jim Rogers, and
CBSMarketWatch's Calandra.

The conference emphasizes natural resource
investments and always has been a favorite with
investors interested in gold, silver, and energy.

While the conference hotel, the New Orleans
Sheraton, is now fully booked during the conference,
there's still a little time to register for the
conference and lodging is available at another
excellent Sheraton hotel just a few blocks away
within easy walking distance.

You can register for the conference and find out
all about it and New Orleans here:

http://www.neworleansconference.com/

The conference has generously offered to make
a contribution to GATA for every GATA supporter
who attends. So when you register online, watch
closely for the section of the registration form
that asks how you heard about the conference.
Open the answer box and click on "GATA."

So if you haven't already, please let me know if
you're going to attend the conference and would
like to attend the GATA reception.

CHRIS POWELL, Secretary/Treasurer
Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.

[Edit]
Think U Can P.O. the World w/o Consequences? -- auspec, 11:24:47 10/26/03 Sun

Germany, France and Russia.........not to mention China {OK, China mentioned}.

Russian oil soon to be priced in Euros. OOPS!

Chinese trading centered upon the EU. OOPS!

The former exclusive world rerserve currency. OOPS!

The world's largest trading currency. OOPS!

The arrogance of the Bush Misadministration. OOPS!



Just maybe the French and Germans aren't really so lame after all................?? Too bad they were forced to choose to be 4 us or agin us. OOPS!




Inside scoop {I could get in big trouble for letting this little secret out but what the hey}:

Bush will make a race out of it by dumping Cheney before r.m. fully sets in..........and bringing aboard CONDY RICE {CFR}. I will personally fix her diastema prior to the campaign as she is a member of enough minorities w/o being an Ugly Teeth founding member. Coming to a Comedy Club near U soon. OOPS!

[Edit]
200 Billion -- volavka, 07:23:11 10/26/03 Sun

currency trading is a 200 Billion a day colonic exchange.

Bullions shares a 50 billion mkt cap.

When she goes, you will not be able to comprehend the move.

[Edit]
Hu downunder - cont. -- Netking, 01:41:15 10/26/03 Sun

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200310/26/eng20031026_126842.shtml
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Meanwhile, inside George's diary [aka Things Are Spinning,...Out of Control!]:
http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0310/S00179.htm

[Edit]
From GE forum tonight -- Goldustorm, 22:26:33 10/25/03 Sat

Goldus sayz in reply to Phantasm:
"That's some money supply growth! As you sow, so shall you reap. Why even Dr. Frankenstein himself couldn't hold a candle to this phantastic megamorphosis.
Patent medicine with a short shelf-life was brewed to stimulate the monster economy so the poaching and harvesting could stumble forward. Within the brain of this beast the economic circuit was jury-rigged so the protruding anode(bond market) and cathode(stock market) made both ends of the economy meet. Be forewarned then:
Watching the short-circuit is a gross-out, not a turn-on. Not unlike the IRS hitting the particle accelerator. Just all in a day's work for such a nasty piece of work.
Phantasm friend, you will find "phantasmagoria" in the dictionary, and it's meaning will be within spitting distance of the way it sounds."

[Edit]
OmarD -- auspec, 21:06:42 10/25/03 Sat

Hello Friend,

"The great "gold snatch" is on in Iraq. Daily reports in Arab news of US troops looting family gold hoards in their nightly house to house searches (official policy?) - where does the "liberated" metal go...expect is traded back eventually to Iraqi people with "paper.""

"PS - wide scale looting, rape and even "murder" are a long time "soldier's" prerogative a on conquered/occupied people - If you think our soldiers are not doing it (or our "allies" - think again.) All Arab homes have gold (there are no banks) --- wonder how much those guys with fancy "mine" detectors are turning up buried in countryside."

Not exactly what I would call a nice lil bedtime story, but the type of things that certainly DO come out of war. Personally, I long for "Heaven on Earth" as I perceive it.

War to Americans is anything BUT up close and personal these days..........911 being the exception. We're fat, entertained and deluded while obscene battles rage overseas. Our Military leaders have learned that it is not acceptable to beam reality back to the American people as was done {to a very small extent even} w the Vietnam War. Out of sight........out of mind.

Numerous analysts firmly believe that the US has been suckered into expending its human and capital resources in places such as Afghanistan and Iraq. Guerilla wars basically from the start. That's Richard Maybury's take on the issue as you likely well know.

A life centered around survival, defense, and/or hatred and revenge is NO life at all. Gotta find ways to move the world's poor up Maslov's {?} pyramid. Life's most basic needs are air and water, yet palatable water is not available to incredible percentages of the world's populations. This, in spite of the fact that there is plenty of water that could be provided by relatively inexpensive well digging. Water for drinking as well as irrigation.

"Population control" ultimately lies at the heart of such solutions not being taken.

I think I'll go distract myself a little more so I can sleep 2night.

Still, very proud of American roots! May they spring forth vitality once again. That's been our finest export over the centuries. Today we mostly export the near worthless banana.......making us a Banana Former Republic. Smile. We can yet become a former Banana Former Republic. Maybe.

Bush and his war will not receive hands off treatment in the coming 12 months. If he were a fish he would be a Flounder not a Marlin. He will lose and lose big, imh&so. He could BARELY {to put it mildly} beat DelusionAl in 2000 and the election to come will make that one seem like and old folks Bingo game.

If you read the John Sprott interview I recently posted you'll see how many very discerning bright and worldly people look at Bush and his policies as an absolute disaster. I called em "cowboys" nearly from the start and they are now seen as reckless by more and more people, economically as well as militarily. Maybe the Dems could have done worse but I doubt it. I do not see myself voting for either of these parties again in my lifetime, as voting for the lesser of 2 evils only exacerbates the problem.

I also no longer send money to the likes of organizations such as "Citizens against Government Waste" in spite of having supported them for years. No Band-Aids on a terminally corrupt and bankrupt system.

Peace be w you and us all,

auspec

[Edit]
Production Cuts? -- OmarD, 20:52:59 10/25/03 Sat

Have not yet seen reported or commented on in our media yet...if so, things are starting to get really "freaky" out there in the world...Is it the US is losing "control" or is it OPEC (not want to reveal fact that "peak oil" days are over...and production rates are being "forced" )...sure sign of "changin times ahead"...


AlJazeera

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/178CDEDD-8907-4ECB-9FED-4C7A64E04F78.htm

Saturday 25 October 2003, 21:02 Makka Time, 18:02 GMT



OPEC set to cut oil output
OPEC is cutting output to prevent oversupply in 2004


Kuwait's Energy Minister has said OPEC's plans to cut output by 900,000 barrels a day from 1 November would proceed despite prices being still high.


"Yes, the 900,000 barrels cut from 1 November will go ahead," said Ahmad Fahd al-Sabah.

"We are following the prices and we think it is still in the average of the OPEC price band, although it’s a little high," the minister said on returning from Saudi Arabia after talks with his Saudi counterpart...

----

Rgds,

OmarD



PS: Goldustorm - Israel has long been setting stage for its own "Armageddon" --- I have no doubt it is coming sooner then later..."Justice" & "Compensation" are universal laws that even NOONE can escape from!!!...Omard



[Edit]
Middle East heats up now: Coincidence? -- Goldustorm, 20:39:52 10/25/03 Sat

**************
"Several steps closer to Armageddon"
Printed on Monday, October 20, 2003 @ 07:29:42 CST http://www.yellowtimes.org/article.php?sid=1628
By John Chuckman
YellowTimes.org Columnist (Canada)
(YellowTimes.org) – The United States apparently has fitted out the Harpoon missiles it previously supplied Israel to accommodate nuclear warheads. These missiles are carried on three German-built submarines, making a reality of Israel's grandiose plan for a nuclear-triad force, a miniature replica of America's land-air-sea nuclear force in a country with a total population smaller than greater Chicago. Perhaps more pertinent, the missiles' nuclear capability extends a threat towards Iran, bringing home to its leaders the possible consequences of "going nuclear."
A step like this, taken by either side during the Cold War, would have been regarded as a serious escalation in arms, but now it causes barely a ripple in the United States. There are, of course, signed obligations that American- supplied weapons are to be used only for Israel's defense, yet these have been violated many times, most notoriously during the invasion of Lebanon -- a bloody, aggressive war led by the very man who now leads Israel.
Iran almost certainly wants to become a nuclear power, and it has nothing to do with being "evil." It is for all the reasons that Israel secretly went nuclear, for all the reasons that South Africa secretly went nuclear before the end of apartheid, and for all the reasons that North Korea may have gone nuclear. When you have determined enemies, and especially when they include, as they do in Iran's case, the world's great power, nuclear weapons must appear reassuring.
This is certainly the case for North Korea, another country branded as "evil," and Bush is directly responsible for destroying a framework of understanding and cooperation with that country established through years of hard diplomacy, all in the interest of bluster and demonstrating how tough he is. There have been many threatening words and activities aimed at North Korea under the Bush version of foreign policy, as for example significant changes being made to the deployment of American forces at North Korea's southern border.
The United States has invaded and occupied Iran's neighbor, Iraq, has pointedly designated Iran as "evil," and during the long and vicious Iran- Iraq war, it supported the aggressor, Iraq, even to the point of shooting down an Iranian commercial airliner in error without so much as a proper apology and disgracefully tolerating Iraq's extensive use of chemical weapons. The older generation of Iranians must remember, too, that the United States overthrew their democratically-elected government and supported the Shah who for decades terrorized all who opposed him. Much of the excess of the Iranian Revolution sprang from grievances over that.
Of course, we have to put in the balance the so-called Bush Doctrine, a rather exalted-sounding expression for a crude threat against anyone suspected of wrong-doing by America's narrow and paranoid reckoning, something that has sent shivers through much of the world and will almost certainly drive still others towards more sophisticated weaponry. My, what a contribution to peace and stability!
Israel launched an attack against Syria (again using those American weapons supposedly restricted to defense), claiming it was against bases harboring terrorists. The President of the United States almost welcomed this open act of war, whose stated reason remains about as well demonstrated as Iraq's strategic weapons stockpile, but then Bush had talked around invading Syria himself before coming to understand into what a hornet's nest he had heedlessly thrust his fist in Iraq.
Someone in Gaza has killed Americans. It may well have been an accident because it truly does not serve the interests of residents. One has to admire the restraint shown by Palestinians all these years since America has hurt them many times with unfulfilled promises and unbalanced policy, a situation now grotesquely pushed to extremes by Bush. Almost any brutal thing Israel does is an act for peace. The Palestinians are told even who their leader cannot be and are treated like wayward children by a president himself never elected to office.
Sharon's concrete monster wall, called a neighborly-sounding fence in the odd political language of Israel, continues abuilding, taking additional Palestinian land here and there as its millions of pounds of concrete are poured. The wall effectively serves as a giant tourniquet applied to the arteries of any future Palestinian state, but that almost certainly is the idea, a new and less violent approach to ridding the area of undesirable residents. Greater Israel remains a dream for many, but especially for the party in power and its key allies.
I just received an e-mail vividly reminding me of that. It was from an Israeli still dreaming about Arab states taking the Palestinians, even naming the places they might go, as though these economically-depressed places with some of the world's highest birthrates could absorb about 3 1/2 million immigrants. In his dreaming there was no awareness that he truly was describing a form of ethnic-cleansing, no awareness that the hideous Nazis tried exactly same thing during the 1930s. Their effort to export Germany's innocent Jews, to expel those their blind ideology insisted were a problem, failed. This man's dream, too, cannot but fail, and God knows where that will take us.
[John Chuckman is former chief economist for a large Canadian oil company. He has many interests and is a lifelong student of history. He writes with a passionate desire for honesty, the rule of reason, and concern for human decency. He is a member of no political party and takes exception to what has been called America's "culture of complaint" with its habit of reducing every important issue to an unproductive argument between two simplistically defined groups. John left the United States as a poor young man from the South Side of Chicago when the government embarked on the murder of millions of Vietnamese in their own land because they happened to embrace the wrong economic loyalties. He lives in Canada, which he is fond of calling "the peaceable kingdom."]
John Chuckman encourages your comments: chuckman@YellowTimes.org
YellowTimes.org is an international news and opinion publication. YellowTimes.org encourages its material to be reproduced, reprinted, or broadcast provided that any such reproduction identifies the original source, http://www.YellowTimes.org. Internet web links to http://www.YellowTimes.org are appreciated.
http://www.yellowtimes.org/article.php?sid=1628

[Edit]
"Fire" & "Loot" -- OmarD, 19:19:20 10/25/03 Sat

Salutations auspec...

RE: "....all paper............will simply burn."

No question it is smoldering now...when/or if it combusts into a hot roaring flame is questionable...either way the end result will be worthless. Unfortunatly unbeknownst to those until till they try to trade it for something...

The great "gather" and "search" for available gold is on. Am really curious how much "large" volumn gold is really obtainable out in the world markets. I suspect little...current (& future) production has long been accounted and spoken for. CB's either have none & are frantically searching for that which they are "supposed" to have - or else holding on to current stocks with an iron fist. While there appears to be plenty floating about for us small fry to trade with or purchase at even these gradually increasing prices...will not be long before it disappears also.

The great "gold snatch" is on in Iraq. Daily reports in Arab news of US troops looting family gold hoards in their nightly house to house searches (official policy?) - where does the "liberated" metal go...expect is traded back eventually to Iraqi people with "paper."

PS - wide scale looting, rape and even "murder" are a long time "soldier's" prerogative a on conquered/occupied people - If you think our soldiers are not doing it (or our "allies" - think again.) All Arab homes have gold (there are no banks) --- wonder how much those guys with fancy "mine" detectors are turning up buried in countryside.

Anyway...what is the point?..."oil" may not be the ultimate "loot" sought after in a "gold rich" environment like Iraq.

note: When I think about and read such stories like these that come out of areas of basically oppressed/occupied people - Iraq, Palestine, Europe after WWII I wonder what I would do and what steps I would take to protect both myself, family and "gathered wealth" -

It comes to me that such steps may have to be taken here one day. - It is awfully hard to say "no" to one that has a knife at throat of a loved one.

soo...would always make sure there is a "sub-stash" somewhere, or maybe even two...that could be "given-up" in just such a situation...an idea I put into practice long ago when I realized just how little "anonymity" I really had. - I think the government knows who, we ridiculously few, physical gold owners are...not to mention now "close friends" and "relatives" - who may not turn out to be so close in very difficult times.

Rgds,

OmarD

PS: --- Wonder how insurance and Mortgage companies are going to handle all that way over-priced real estate and property going up in "flame and smoke" down in CA...Some kind of "bailout" needed am sure. (throwing more gas on that "other fire.")

[Edit]
FYI: Offline for a Week.. -- Webmaster: Rex, 19:10:55 10/25/03 Sat

FWIW..

I will be offline for a week, beginning Sunday.
Gotta go reset all the clocks to Standard Time..

The ER Website and Forums will be on AutoPilot.

..Rx

[Edit]
Familiar Message -- auspec, 17:42:14 10/25/03 Sat

Snippets from G-E by Wallenwein, fair use copyright:

http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_03/wallenwein102703.html

"When truth is lost, freedom is lost, because, when you do not have true information to base your decisions on, you essentially lose the freedom to make your own, effective, decisions. Money is supposed to convey information about the economic value of a product or service. When that information-carrying function of money is distorted, all decisions Based on it are distorted as well, and therefore in reality ineffective. Your freedom is gone. Lost in a coordinated illusion - a financial "Matrix" of sorts."

"Therefore, in addition to representing economic truth, gold also represents economic freedom. Not by accident did the founders of the Constitution decree that only gold and silver shall be made a payment for debt. When FDR confiscated Americans' gold in 1933, he consequently also confiscated their economic freedom."

"So, when the entire rest of the world is changing course, and even our own governing elites can no longer afford not to (though they may try), can we, the gold advocates, the purveyors of free-market economics, afford not to change course? Can we afford not to adopt a truly gold-centric world view?"

"As long as we se things the "old" way, we will continue to play into the hands of the still governing gold manipulators. By chasing our hoped and dreamed-for paper profits, we will continue to help them use the very derivatives we invest in (futures, options, cash) to push the dollar price of gold down (or better put: the gold-price of the dollar up)."

"Gold is no longer a "buy and sell". It is no longer an "investment." Gold has become a definite long-term SAVE. It will soon resume its role as the standard for all economic value. And all paper that is traded in ignorance of this "new" old dynamic will simply burn. Only paper that is traded in recognition of this new 'euro vs dollar' dynamic (i.e., paper that is not used to suppress gold) will even have a chance to exist in the future."

END

::::::::::::::::::::::

Comments: "....all paper............will simply burn."
Maybe we should make that "Sir" Alex...???

He's got it about right, imh&so.

[Edit]
GATA...Embry Speaks Out -- gata, 07:59:13 10/25/03 Sat

Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:

Thanks again to GATA supporter Mark Webber for this
transcript, slightly edited, of Sprott Asset Management
President John Embry's remarks on ROB-TV in Canada
on Tuesday.

CHRIS POWELL, Secretary/Treasurer
Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.

* * *

"Lunch Money" with Michael Hainsworth
ROB-TV, Canada, Tuesday, October 21, 2003

http://www.robtv.com

Hainsworth: John Embry is from Sprott Asset Management.
He joins us now ahead of his date on "Market Call." We're
talking gold and the underlying element, the U.S. dollar.
Good to have you with us.

Embry: Nice to be here, Michael.

Hainsworth: There's been some talk, everyone from your
conspiracy theorist/Fox-Mulder X-Files economists right
down to your level-headed players, that the White House
is intentionally keeping the U.S. greenback low ahead of the
election because the economy is in such a sad state. That
plays well into gold, but what's your take on the dollar side
of it?

Embry: I think it's more than what the White House wants
and would like to see. Very simply the U.S. dollar is
fundamentally weak. When you're running a current account
deficit that's homing in on $600 billion and you've got budget
deficits that are out of control at all levels in the United
States, clearly there is a problem. There's a zillion dollars
being created and a lot of them are going out in the world.
As long as they're being recycled, the decline in the dollar
will be, shall we say, controlled. The great fear is that it's
going to get out of control. When the dollar starts to fall too
rapidly, a lot of these foreign holders -- the Chinese, the
Japanese, what have you -- will think, "Wait a minute. We've
got too many of these dollars and they're going down too
quickly. If they start to sell them, instead of buying them as
they have been doing, you could have a catastrophe. So it's
a bit of a game of chicken.

Hainsworth: Does Mr. George W. Bush or -- depending on
your perspective of the man's economic policy, his advisers
-- do they understand well enough that issue as you pointed
out? Such that they are talking up the prospects of devaluing
the yuan and trying to make some movement in Japan as
well?

Embry: They understand the problem -- there's no question.
They think that the yuan should move up against the U.S.
dollar. But the fact is that the whole thing is so tenuous. It's
fine to say that, but you don't want the American dollar to fall
too quickly. The balancing game, and they understand the
problem perfectly, is to make the U.S. dollar decline gradual
so there isn't a tremendous fallout in other things like interest
rates and what have you.

Hainsworth: You mention the current account deficit as being
one of the reasons the U.S. dollar is under pressure. The
billions of dollars being sent to Iraq on a daily basis to fund
the operations there are playing a very big role in the deficit.
That isn't expected to change soon either. So do we expect
continued depreciation of the U.S. greenback?

Embry: I think so. Clearly this is just added on to the traditional
current account and trade deficits. The Iraqi situation is just
making a bad situation worse.

Hainsworth: So what do you do? When you're in power, you're
heading into an election year, many Americans don't have jobs,
and you've got this situation with debt spiralling not only at the
federal level but also at the state level. California is just one of
the many states in trouble. How do you deal with that in 2004
and what does this mean for gold prices?

Embry: I'm in the camp, and I may be in the minority camp at
this point, that thinks that Bush isn't going to get re-elected
because the problems will manifest themselves before November
2004. And clearly if the U.S. dollar comes under considerable
pressure I don't think a lot of these other countries want to see
their currencies going up sharply. So they're going to print money
and they're going to buy U.S. dollars to try to keep the thing from
getting out of control. That is what I call global debasement of
currency, the best possible situation for gold. I'm on record as
saying that the gold price will probably be $500 dollars by the end
of next year. I don't see any reason to change my point of view.

Hainsworth: Setting aside the reasons why you feel George W.
Bush won't be in power at this time next year, what would that
do to the U.S. dollar if he was defeated? What would that do to
the U.S. economy to bring a Democrat back into power?

Embry: That's a very good question. But I think they're doing a
horrible job now. I don't think anybody could do a lot worse. So
would it make it any worse? I don't think so.

Hainsworth: Do you think Wall Street sees it more as the devil
you know versus the devil you don't?

Embry: Conceivably. There is a sort of belief on Wall Street that
Republicans are good and Democrats are bad. To date I think
their policies have been reckless in the Bush administration.

Hainsworth: Do you think though that those reckless policies
are enough to have Wall Street put pressure to make some
changes heading into that election year?

Embry: Yes, I think Wall Street does have a huge impact on the
administration. I think they're becoming a little uncomfortable with
(Treasury Secretary) Snow. His comments are all over the place.
Paul O'Neill was essentially driven from the job. I don't know
whether Snow's long for it either. I think there will be quite a bit
of
upheaval in the next 12 months. And the idea that you can start
putting in place policies here and run for the next 13 months
and get re-elected is, I think, the height of optimism.

END

[Edit]
@Rusty -- Murray, 02:00:21 10/25/03 Sat

Re: "What does one think about this Sino-Islamic influence?

Rus, the Sino and Islamic influence/s is/are certainly expansionist in a pronounced way, everywhere no. I don't see though any blatant orchestration of involvement though between the two. Sino is more economic, Islamic more religious in orientation, both are insatiable & will take no prisoners. I would have expected [but then again] more focus on Europe for Sinclairs analysis & inferences than where he has gone. It appears that whatever ones stance, neutrality of view may not be an option, interesting days here now & ahead mate.

[Edit]
remember Barrick has this up their sleeve -- number six, 20:38:41 10/24/03 Fri



Long term, their alleged silver shorts aren't so naked. Short term? Maybe they are.

[Edit]
"The big picture" is bigger than any of us except the big eye in the sky, no pun intended -- Goldus, 19:28:12 10/24/03 Fri

"The big picture that I want the community to focus on is "What happens after November 2004?'" -Jim Sinclair
J. S., the media and newspaper columnists might take heed that this happens before EVERY election.
And that following the election, tried and true lines change to:
1) "We have to give this administration time to settle in.
2) "Foreign states must be given time to get acquainted with the new president, his ambassador, his "style" ad nauseum.
3) "The world (the citizens, the terrorists, the markets) are waiting to see the new agenda (this speech and that appearance, the appointment of this person and that, the selection of this advisor and that, the state of the union address, the kept campaign promise and the terminated, changing this modus operendi and dump that, ad nauseum...)
Hey, maybe he DOES read newspapers. Qwerty knows where this guys coming from except that I doubt he knows everything coming out of places such as CFR, Trilats, Bilderbergs, IMF or BIS, or much from the Politburo and KGB, PRC Peoples Committee, Arab alliance, etc.

[Edit]
Hu 'Zimmerman' [aka: The times, they are a changing] -- Netking, 17:32:24 10/24/03 Fri

"....Hu's visit to Australia, on his way to New Zealand, paid an immediate bonus with the signing of a A$30 billion ($34.5 billion) deal under which the China National Offshore Corporation will join the Gorgon natural gas development off northwestern Australia.

It was a visit that Prime Minister John Howard conceded he once could never have imagined and which demonstrated how much the world had changed.

"It would be no exaggeration to say that 10 years ago an event such as this would have been seen not only as unlikely, but indeed highly improbable," he said.

The Chinese President, whose trip was far more relaxed and conducted with markedly less security than Bush's 21-hour stopover, also signed a trade and economic agreement that could lead eventually to a free-trade pact and a number of other agreements.

During his speech he also outlined further steps to open the Chinese economy and to strengthen its legal system, both of which have frustrated Western investors.

"I'm convinced that China and Australia will shape a relationship of all-round co-operation that features a high degree of mutual trust, long-term friendship and mutual benefit," Hu said...." More later.

[Edit]
Toast Masters -- auspec, 15:45:29 10/24/03 Fri

Along the same lines of discussing a Sino-Islamic alliance with currency ramifications........here's a few snippets from an article by Anthony P. Mueller at Misis:

http://www.mises.org/fullstory.asp?control=1348
fair use copyright

"What would happen if the dollar should surpass the threshold and a crisis of confidence emerges? The consequences would not be confined to the United States itself. The dollar crisis would affect the rest of the world and it would put the current international monetary system at stake with the potential of bringing it down. While the pillars on which the dollar stands may still seem to be intact today—the statue itself may come down. But when the dollar should fall, the pillars on which it has stood, will crumble too."

"Given the trend that the U.S. foreign debt position will continue to deteriorate, a severe dollar crisis seems almost inevitable. But this is only half of the story. The dramatic part of the enfolding scenario is that there is no ready substitute for the dollar as a global currency and that the dollar crisis will put the overall economic and political position of the United States at risk. With the loss of the privileged position of the dollar the economy would weaken and this in turn would undermine the political role that the Unted States plays presently as the world's hegemon."

"International finance is closely intertwined with international politics. While a predominant role in international finance does not come without the basis provided by politics, it is sound finance on which the continuation of the dominant global role will depend later on. Both of these, however, have a more profound basis: it is basically the ethical attitude to the matters of money and finance, the deeply rooted sense for prudence and rectitude, which is required to be maintained in order to keep the privileged position."

END

Comment: Now, Sinclair says these folks have been accumulating ALL the gold sold throughout most of the 90's. That is blatantly false because, I personally bought one ounce of gold bullion in 1999 and I'm neither Chinese or Islamic. Sheesh!

Reality DOES state that it would take an extended period of time for accumulation. Has it been done? There is NO ready substitute for the buck, but quite possible a few are in the making. Disruptions? What do U think?

Let's hold together {I have my ounce}.

[Edit]
good news -- qwerty, 15:33:43 10/24/03 Fri

Solar gas cloud racing to Earth

all life on earth will be extinquished

and the terrorism threat will end

[Edit]
where do they get these brilliant ideas -- qwerty, 15:16:15 10/24/03 Fri

===
Germany is pushing for the creation of a fully-fledged Euro-army, according to plans obtained by the Conservative Party in Britain, writes the Telegraph. This revelation is likely to send ripples of concern through Britain, one of the more sceptical member states - over close military co-operation in Europe
===

oh heavens, what a surprise

and the nwo country britain says we're sceptical ... right!

they're already unifying the government and security apparatus

oh, jeez

will eventually need to buy one of those anti-gravity spaceships ... build a house on the europa or something

[Edit]
Sino-Islamic Alliance w a Russian Twist? -- auspec, 13:46:22 10/24/03 Fri

Sinclair is hammering on this Sino-Islamic influence that he believes is becoming a major factor in world economics and monetary issues. He obviously knows more than he is comfortable coming out and saying, but he recently stated the Ruskies would like to align w this influence as well. At first, the thought of the Chinese and the Muslum world cooperating with each other strikes me as somewhat strange..........simply a new concept. But the more I think about it................

Of course, none of these countries, outside of Iran, Syria, etc would come right out in a forthright manner w policy directly opposed to US dollar hegemony. They really don't have to, they will just pretend to go completely along with whatever the US DEMANDS but in actuality do whatever they perceive to be in their own best interest. Nothing new there.

Frankly, I don't know the historical relationships between China and Islam. China has been "isolationist" for so long and it still strikes me as peculiar that they would be Muslim friendly since they tend to persecute Christians so severely. They don't seem to accept any religion other than that of the "State" and its powers therein. Anyone? What does one from N.Z. think about this Sino-Islamic influence? Murray?

Maybe we're simply talking monetary alignment........with little other relationships formed other than this common interest. What are a {very few} commonalities of China, Islam and Russia that might drive this alliance forward? A few just off the top of my balding head just to stimulate a thought and/or conversation process:

1. Dollar hegemony is a long abused privilege.

2. American arrogance lately has no boundaries.

3. ALL of these mentioned entities have an understanding and historic appreciation of honest money {!}.

4. These countries would all like to move upwards from 3rd world to 2nd world status, or from 2nd world to 1st world status.

5. Maybe they're not all "for us" so, naturally that makes them "against us". Duh. GWB split the globe right down the middle a few scant years back.

6. These various countries are often known for their shrewdness. Russia and China in particular. It is often heard what tough traders the Russians are, etc.

7. Only a complete fool is blind to the complete dishonesty of American markets and their unit of measure. The world isn't blind to the likes of Enron and Haliburton even though the American people seem to be.

8. I don't remember the last time I ran down to the courthouse and tried to form a lasting relationship with a terminally bankrupt acquaintance, who just happened to be in public denial.

9. There is a better way.

10. They're historic neighbors for the most part {couldn't stop at 9, should have stopped after 1}.

Anyway.........we did recently hear that Russia was considering pricing its plentiful oil in Euros, which is a tiny step towards a currency that at least has a gold mini-link/facade {well, they do at least have some gold, don't they?}. They ARE considering these issues.

This is most interesting, at least to me. Completely honest markets and money........? Not in this age, but we could clean out the septic tank every decade or so, no? We have no one to blame but ourselves.......we abused the "exorbitant priviledge". Not blindly, I might add.

Pathetic when we have to look to the Commies and former Commies for sound money. Who would have thunk it?

{P.S. For those w any degree of interest in Biblical insights: most Christian eschatologists believe Russia and China will invade Israel to precipitate Armageddon. Gee, I wonder which side Islam will fall on? There's a link for the ages, no? I guess they'll pay for the journey in gold backed currency, smile}

Chewin along...hoping the wabbitz won't attack,

a

[Edit]
dollar & gold -- Netking, 12:55:18 10/24/03 Fri

...watching the EUR against the USD . . . if the EUR fails [at this point] to pass through 1.1933 again we could see a pull back to 1.10-1.08 and gold weakness in the short term . . . next week [weak] may reveal some keys of direction therewith.

[Edit]
Sino-Islamic Monetary Influences per Sinclair {beesting} -- auspec, 10:58:20 10/24/03 Fri

From www.jsmineset.com................fair use distribution:

Jim Sinclair: Warren, I have long rejected the concept of “radical Islam” having lived in areas of the world with large Islamic populations. The West appears quite different when you look at it from an Islamic perspective.

Having said that, I am certain the most significant world event today is the Sino-Islamic Alliance, including the initiatives that are being put forward by Russia’s Putin to become a part of it.

I have mentioned to the Community before that the distribution phase of this generational gold market will not be into the market but rather into a currency relationship which will not be the dollar.

I haven't a clue if this administration really understands that they have been totally manipulated into a ground war in Afghanistan and Iraq. Russia will work diligently as will China to see that no other countries give the US financial or military aid other than the token variety.


Bin Laden knows markets and his strategy is more economic than military. Saddam is no mountain of brains but rest assured Bin Laden is a capable opponent that should be respected if we wish to understand him.
Failure to respect your opposition is a sure formula for disaster.

We are not winning in Iraq or Afghanistan when you understand the big picture. The big picture that I want the Community to keep in focus is 'What happens after November 2004?'
END

Comment: Both gold and silver were whacked, as usual, in the last 1/2 hr or so. The Power struggle continues......

[Edit]
Defense Mounted..............$389 @ 1:16 -- auspec, 10:31:01 10/24/03 Fri

Who's got the final word 2day?

[Edit]
12:46 -- auspec, 10:05:49 10/24/03 Fri


[Edit]
@ mr v's $392 @ 14:46...........Sinclair got the Power -- auspec, 10:03:44 10/24/03 Fri

Snippet from www.jsmineset.com.........fair use, in order to educate the cabal about exactly how{e} stupid they really are. Prechter won't be far behind as it relates to gold.

Sinclair this AM:

You don’t have to read my lips to know what I’m going to tell you. Gold is going through $400 to $410, $420 and beyond. In case you hadn't guessed, I’m beyond long and going longer by the minute. (Well, perhaps nanosecond would be a better description). Even my dog Mia is on the auction block, albeit with a buyback provision.

My CFO has gone out of the country, my wife is in Florida, and the wild man she left behind is ready to bounce off every wall in sight - even the ones without the padding.

Come on Cartel, I’ll have you for lunch even if it causes me indigestion for a week. In this case, I am hot and they are not.

Now don’t all you guys and gals act like me. This is when a pro sees victory and knows what the word “POWER” means in commodity markets. This is also why my former partner, Lenny, had to drive a cab for three years before he could buy back his seat on the exchange.

Remember this! We are legion and they are a bunch of losers about to lose a lot more. The wind is at our back.

This is when Bert and Jesse come screaming out of me and I’m dragged along to victory by their silver cords with you in tow.

Good hunting Jimmy. Good hunting to everyone in the Gold Community.

END


Comment: Surely some form of 'defense' will be mounted here? "Power" in the pits has to be an ultimate high, ne?

[Edit]
you'll close 392+ -- volavka, 09:47:23 10/24/03 Fri


[Edit]
$390 @ 12:15 -- auspec, 09:31:16 10/24/03 Fri

Don't ya just know there's a real WAR going on as we head into this weekend close.......? Would you like to be short over the weekend when some of these issues effecting gold come out?

Let's see how we close...........

[Edit]
Current POG, POS, POP & U$D Live Price -- CHARTs, 23:20:13 10/23/03 Thu

US$/POG: from www.kitco.comUS$/POS: from www.kitco.comEURO/POG: from www.kitco.com[Most Recent USD from www.kitco.com]




LbS/POG: from www.kitco.com London Fix: from www.kitco.com LbS/POS: from www.kitco.com



US$/POP: from www.kitco.com
US$/POP: from www.kitco.com


[Edit]
Hush money, slush money, flush money -- Tumbleweed, 21:00:06 10/23/03 Thu

$82 BILLION
STOLEN FROM SOCIAL SECURITY
By: Ed Henry
In fiscal 2003 that just ended, Social Security produced an $81.8 billion surplus. This was an overcharge paid by American workers in payroll taxes, extra money that the Social Security Administration did not need in order to meet all of its obligations to the currently retired and disabled. It is profit that could have been either refunded or invested properly so that it might have the chance to grow and provide better benefits for future retirees. But that's not what happened.
Congress and the Bush administration stole this $82 billion. You might prefer to call it something more polite, like embezzlement, but it was outright theft.
Of course, the pirates will tell you that they simply "borrowed" this money. But who's going to pay it back? Certainly not Congress or any future administration. At least not without fresh taxpayer money or legitimate borrowing. They have no other revenue and they sure as hell aren't going to come up with it out of their own pockets.

To carry out the pretense of "borrowing," the Beltway Bandits put markers in a debit black hole account that they deliberately and dishonestly label a "trust fund," an account that never holds anything but debt and today accounts for 22 percent of the national debt.
In the last four years, they have stolen $364 billion this way. In the last ten years, they have stolen $615 billion of our retirement money.
This is bad enough, worse than anything done by Enron, WorldCom, and other crooks in the private sector. But it gets worse.
To carry out the "borrowing" scam, our crafty Beltway Bandits add annual interest to the black hole debit account. They do this by simply handing the Social Security trust funds more debt markers, more "special obligation" nonmarketable Treasury bonds. No money involved, but increasing our indebtedness.
Remember, the surplus is gone, spent, never to be seen again. It is now represented by debt markers. What the bandits call "IOUs" but are truly "UOUs" since it's up to you or your children to pay them off someday.
In fiscal 2003, the trust fund increased $155.2 billion. Many news people will think that this increase was entirely due to surplus money generated by Social Security, but $73.4 billion was annual interest calculated on the balance that the trust fund held at the close of fiscal 2002, the previous year.
The cumulative total now stands at $1.5 trillion in what is commonly referred to as the Social Security trust fund, the combination of the Federal Old Age & Survivors Insurance trust fund and the Federal Disability Insurance trust fund. Both are fraudulent.
Here's the way the Social Security trust fund increased month-by month during fiscal 2003, including interest:
This is the trust fund that the Beltway Bandits tell us will "sustain the Social Security system" until at least 2041. As the theft increases, so does the trust fund and the length of time Social Security can be "sustained" this way increases also. It was just a short time ago they were telling us that the trust would keep Social Security alive only until 2034.
In the real world, this means that the day the Social Security Administration must turn to its trust fund Americans will be double taxed plus interest. Workers will still be paying their payroll taxes, but on top of that every taxpayer in the country will also be paying to redeem the phony debt in the trust fund.
If you doubt that this will happen, witness the following that is happening right now, today, as you read this:
Because payroll tax receipts, contributed by employers, were not sufficient to meet the monthly commitments to the unemployed during fiscal 2003, the Labor Department cashed-in $25.9 billion of its bogus holdings in the Unemployment trust fund.
This means that the $25.9 billion necessary to pay benefits to the currently unemployed came either from the U.S. Treasury's general fund of taxpayer dollars on hand or money borrowed honestly, openly, and under contract from investors (the "Public Debt" side of the national debt).
Nineteen different entitlement trust funds account for about 42 percent of the national debt under the deceptive label "Intragovernmental Holdings" and include, besides Social Security, the Military Retirement and Civil Service Retirement trust funds. These three are the biggies.
Fraudulent entitlement trust funds make up 93 percent of the Intragovernmental Holdings side of the national debt. The other seven percent is represented by about 122 equally bogus trusts for department, employee, and federal judge's perks that function as hush money and make it difficult to sue the government in federal courts.
Simply name a trust, throw some bogus "nonmarketable" bonds in it, and draw the cash out of the Treasury's general fund as needed. No employee or federal judge wants to lose the cushy retirement and health care plans provided this way.
What's more, federal employees hold one of the nine real trust funds managed by the government. The Thrift Savings Plan allows employees to invest up to 10 percent of their salaries, 40 percent of which is matched by taxpayer dollars, in the Standard & Poors Index of the New York Stock Exchange handled by Barclay Bank of Great Britain, an account that returned an average of 17 percent on investment last year during a declining economy. Isn't that nice?
Unless they are incompetent, every member of Congress understands this rip-off and none of them, including all of the hack candidates in the 2004 elections, are addressing this problem. If they don't participate in the many finance, budget, tax, and other committees where expected entitlement surpluses are considered "off budget revenue" they receive it in reports from these committees as well as from the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), Office of Management and Budgets (OMB), and Government Accounting Office (GAO).
Taxpayers should be prosecuting every one of these pirates. At the very least, we should not re-elect them.
The ball is in your court. Stop the rip-off.
"Published originally at EtherZone.com : republication allowed with this notice and hyperlink intact."
Ed Henry is the founder of TUFF, the Taxpayers Union, and a regular columnist for Ether Zone.
Ed Henry can be reached at ctzcrank@mindspring.com
Ed's FREE pamphlet-"To The Moon, Alice" the national debt, your Social Security, and the Pay-It-Again Sam scam.
We also invite you to visit his website at www.uncle-scam.com
Published in the October 23, 2003 issue of  Ether Zone.
Copyright © 1997 - 2003 Ether Zone.
http://www.etherzone.com/2003/henr102303.shtml

[Edit]
Hu say, respect us, we both be winner -- Netking, 19:57:52 10/23/03 Thu

China on da move:
http://smh.com.au/articles/2003/10/24/1066631607415.html

[Edit]
Morgan on Silver -- auspec, 19:55:26 10/23/03 Thu

Snippet from G-E via outright theft, fraud and vandalism {actually fair use copyright}:

http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_03/morgan102403pv.html

"I thanked Mr. Ted Butler for his work that finally shed the much needed light on the topic. Ted's work on the leasing situation provided the piece of the puzzle needed. His work explained how physical silver could enter the marketplace at such a low price and the silver deficit could be fed year after year. His work is extensive and if you do not believe the silver (and gold) leasing "problem" by now you never will. My main point then and still is succinctly stated as "I just do not see silver prices rising until the actual physical bullion supplies reach critically low levels"."

"Because of my research I was able to predict that the critical time frame would be the summer of 2003. This time frame was first discovered by me over twelve years ago. Of course, each year the new data was studied I performed the calculations again. Year after year it appeared that the critical time frame was the middle of 2003. This gave me the confidence to publish this prediction on the internet so a verifiable record would be established."

END
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Comment: We'll know the end is near when we hear belly aching and see red herrings everywhere from all directions {or at least things will sure seem fishy to those in the know}. The zebra doesn't change his stripes or his linens. They'll be ranting about digital cameras, Chinese dumping as well as the Buffet factor right up to and especially AT the END. They may even come up with something new.......like paper representing physical at Crimex. Clinton said the {in}famous lines........."up until, the last hour of the last day.........". What a guy! Guess he's been put out to pasture.......? Oops, he thought he was already there during the White House years {I hope they've scrubbed that place down thoroughly}.

I look at many silver stocks and STILL believe we're heading for 10X's from current points, a true mania is way overdue. Stay tuned {w an Ag tuning fork preferrably}.

Counting the days.

[Edit]
Necessity is the Mother of Invention -- auspec, 18:54:08 10/23/03 Thu

Snippet from CBS Market Watch via LeMet. Fair use copyright.

By Paul Erdman,

CBS.MarketWatch.com
Last Update: 6:36 PM ET Oct. 22, 2003

Here we have the Secretary of the Treasury of the United States who is going to have to borrow a half trillion dollars a year to cover this nation's deficit, plus a whole lot more to refinance the enormous debt that is outstanding, telling us the he will be "frustrated and concerned if long term interest rates do not rise."

Did anybody tell him that if he gets his wish the additional interest cost on new government borrowings could be staggering?

Did anybody tell him that mortgage rates would soon rise to a level sufficient to undermine the strength of housing sector, which has been the strongest pillar holding up the economy during the past couple of years?

Did anybody tell him that the refinancing of mortgages that has been a much-needed source of liquidity for millions of American households would cease altogether?

Did anybody tell him that vehicle sales would go the way of housing sales if the cost of financing a car goes from zero back up to 10 percent plus?

Did anybody tell him that the cost of corporate borrowing could rise to the point where the much-needed revival in capital spending for new plant and equipment could be kept on hold indefinitely?

Snow is just as fuzzyheaded where the dollar is concerned.

He is a strong dollar advocate, yet in favor of forcing China and Japan to allow their currencies to float way up against the dollar. One simply does not square with the other.

END

::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Comments: Just like the recent Dubai meeting results.......the US pretends the inevitable is actually the desirable. Complete FedSpeak, but also powerful messages to those who actually understand what is transpiring. To complete the lie.......the higher interest rates will be/are portrayed as resulting from a stronger economy. More like a little closer to Ponzi's demise.

On another note........I had a close encounter w the federal bean collectors today. They sent back a recent collectivist return from this household w no explanation. The gent I contacted was actually quite pleasant and helpful but had no inkling of why a return would be sent back to originator. Pretty user friendly for the most part. Oh well.........what exactly can one expect from the TreasureLand?

Scrimpin along,

mini

[Edit]
generals -- volavka, 18:47:53 10/23/03 Thu

who are unable to estimate enemy's strength,who allow a weak force to engage a strong force, and who neglect to place picked soldiers in front rank will end up being routed.

The rules of engagement are clearly different and you are in another league entirely. You are in over your head. Govern yourself accordingly.

[Edit]
Dr Hwang say -- volavka, 18:41:10 10/23/03 Thu

650.00

[Edit]
Fascism -- Frisco Fred, 17:47:19 10/23/03 Thu


How did Mussolini describe Fascism? Paraphrasing some of his writings - He thought it was unnatural for government to protect individual rights. The government should be master, not the servant of people. He wrote, "Fascism believes neither in the possibility nor the utility of perpetual peace." "Fascism affirms the immutable, beneficial and fruitful inequality of mankind which can never be permanently leveled through the mere operation of a mechanical process." "Fascism conceives of the State as an absolute, in comparison with which all individual or groups are relative, only to be conceived of in their relation to the State." "Never before has this nation stood more in the need of authority, direction or order."

In the 1930"s many economists from other countries, including the USA had high praise for "corporatism". A type of corporatism was adopted in the U.S. and still exists - but here it is called "industrial policy". The State being the Master can be observed in our IRS, industry regulations, Patriot Act, etc.

If I may, I would like to say that according to
THE THEORIES AND PRACTICE OF HELL, German records and encyclopedias, Auschwitz had a mixed population of Jews, Gypsies, conscientous objectors, homosexuals, vagrants, political adversaries and felons. All were used as slave labor. The location of some of the camps was planned close to industries, quarries, mines, etc. for that purpose.

A repugnant wind,
FF

[Edit]
cnn -- qwerty, 17:37:28 10/23/03 Thu

===
Some traders said that the current vogue for gold amongst funds could end if prices stalled.

"The funds are lightening up. If we don't break through $393 and head up to $400 in the next week or two soon I think a lot of people could be disappointed and move away from gold," one trader said
===

media bashing gold

that is good news for gold in my book

[Edit]
Out of Asia....... -- auspec, 17:25:19 10/23/03 Thu

From 2nite's Midas:

"A VERY good source tells me he is hearing the Chinese are going to take their gold reserve position up to 10% from the present 5%. With the amount of dollar reserves they have, it could blow the lid off of the gold market. Besides this potential surge of buying by the Chinese government, the Chinese public is entering the gold buying arena. Yep, The Gold Cartel is in BIG trouble!"

"This latest potential Chinese maneuver fits in perfectly with The Stalker input we have received. You may recall the orders for this $6.4 billion gold buy are coming out of New Zealand and Australia. My source believes these orders are of Chinese origin. It all fits together. The Chinese gold smoke is billowing."

END

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Comment: This may be what Sinclair was referring to, but there's likely MORE. Gotta be an Islamic presence as well to satisfy JS's descriptions...........

InspectorAu

[Edit]
beesting.......re "Guesswork" -- auspec, 16:12:27 10/23/03 Thu

Excellent analysis, amigo! Right on. There was really nothing profound in the message JS referred to.........other than the simple "economic" attack. I expected something much more elaborate, but the hint/message is sufficient. The gold does not get distributed to individuals, but exactly as you say, to various "states".

Sinclair travels Eastward as an economic advisor, clearly. He performs this act for "us" by being pro-gold...as well as possibly moderating the shock to the western world, somehow, someway.

JS has deep ties to Barrick and you pretty much know what that means. He is "Mr. Gold", indeed as well as a purebred. He is and aspires to be a global force. I say he travels east on behalf of gold bugs as well as some western elitist forces. If this 'influence' is not already in place it soon will be. A giant ego is most susceptible. Victory will be ours but it will also be conditional..............moderated. No point burning down the entire forrest, eh?

So, what is the 3rd avenue of attack?

Thanks for parsin along,

a

[Edit]
no inflation here -- volavka, 13:50:54 10/23/03 Thu

http://www2.barchart.com/mktcom.asp?code=BSTK§ion=grains

[Edit]
The Latest News On Digital Gold Currency. -- beesting, 13:16:06 10/23/03 Thu

http://www.prweb.com/releases/2003/10/prweb84052.php

Jim Davidson, President of the Global Digital Currency
Association, commented recently, “What the GDCA offers
is a network of individuals who are interested in expanding
the digital gold and online currencies marketplace.

The listing system also provides an opportunity for
customers to identify merchants and exchangers with icons
similar in intention to the Underwriters Laboratory or Good
Housekeeping Seal of Approval.

Michael Moore
http://www.www.gdcaonline.org

Reprinted under the Fair Use doctrine of
international copyright law.
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.html

[Edit]
Some Guesswork on auspec's 20:31 Wed. Post. -- beesting, 12:38:04 10/23/03 Thu

Hi auspec,
I have been thinking about this type of a scenario since the 9/11 events:
(Snip)
How does distribution take place but "NOT be into any market"? Distributed amongst some
particular players?

Anyone up for parsing these JS statements?
(Unsnip)

It was revealed after those 9/11 events that Osama bin Laden(or whoever was responsible?) had initiated the "FIRST" of what was to be a three pronged attack. The first attack was NOT against the American people, but against the American international policies and the U.S.dollar, which represented these policies.

The world trade center destruction was "maybe" intended to disrupt the smooth flow of the worldwide payment systems between countries,which are settled in U.S. dollars.
I remember reading that bin Laden owned, or had controlling interest in his own bank somewhere, which would make him quite aware of exactly how the world banking system operated concerning international payments.

Noone could guess what or when the "SECOND" pre-announced attack was due to begin or anything about the targets.

Now could it be possible that the second phase of whoever/whomever is involved in 9/11,is really trying as I write this, a direct attack against the U.S. dollar on a worldwide scale?
How could this second phase of the attack be accomplished, when the USA has the most fearsome arsenal of weapons ever assembled under the sun and under their command?

The obvious answer is so simple to Goldhearts(only)that it is really baffling that noone else has caught on yet.

*The Worlds American Dollar Monetary Settlement System is Slowly Replaced By an International Gold/Silver Settlement system.*

Wouldn't it be much easier with little or no bloodshed, to destroy American money than physically "Invade" the USA and any of it's Territories?

Malaysia, south of Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam, & mainland China on the world map, has maybe already started it's own international payment system consisting of the Gold Dinar and Silver Durham.
The problem is they have to have enough "PHYSICAL" Gold/Silver in vaults to make other countries accept the Dinar system as a long term and ""SOUND"" monetary system......hence the "Dinar" world may be in the physical Gold accumulation phase and are trying to slowly drain the physical Gold out of the "Western" worlds vaults without causing a "PANIC".

The talks Mr. Sinclair mentioned in Southeast Asia might include plans for the biggest players that don't have tremendous international dollar debt(China/Japan) to talk over//implement a new method of settling some international payments???

We Watch and Wonder Together...........beesting.

[Edit]
Dr. Hwang say: -- volavka, 12:30:25 10/23/03 Thu

"Bush, why u punish china-mart by rounding up the herd.
U shoot self in foot."

[Edit]
Dr. Hwang say: -- volavka, 12:29:49 10/23/03 Thu

"Bush, why u punish china-mart by rounding up the herd.
U shoot self in foot."

[Edit]
'Hu Downunder' -- Netking, 11:44:44 10/23/03 Thu

New Zealand Police have told Chinese officials they will not try & shield visiting president Hu Jintao from any protests as they did with his predecessor...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?thesection=news&thesubsection=&storyID=3530487

Hmmm, could be one of the reasons why George didn't make the short hop over from Australia after he finished his visit there. Hu meanwhile, one of the new breed of PRC politicians...

[Edit]
@IH (&Flinter)..."speaking of which..." -- OmarD, 11:35:42 10/23/03 Thu

More "fun" with "fascism"........

Word History: It is fitting that the name of an authoritarian political movement like Fascism, founded in 1919 by Benito Mussolini, should come from the name of a symbol of authority. The Italian name of the movement, fascismo, is derived from fascio, "bundle, (political) group, "but also refers to the movement's emblem, the fasces, a bundle of rods bound around a projecting axe-head that was carried before an ancient Roman magistrate by an attendant as a symbol of authority and power. The name of Mussolini's group of revolutionaries was soon used for similar nationalistic movements in other countries that sought to gain power through violence and ruthlessness, such as National Socialism.


From Dictionary.com - "Fascism"


From Sam Smith -
http://prorev.com/fascist.htm

One of the reasons we have such difficulty perceiving our current conditions is our aversion to this single word: fascism. While there is no hesitation by politicians to draw parallels with the Holocaust to justify whatever foreign adventure appeals to them, or for the media to make similar analogies at the drop of swastika on a wall, we seem only able to understand -- or even mention -- the climax of fascism rather than its genesis. Why this reluctance? Perhaps it is because we are much closer to the latter than to the former.

In any case, it is one of the most dangerous forms of political myopia in which to indulge. Italians, who invented the term fascism, also called it the estato corporativo: the corporatist state. Orwell rightly described fascism as being an extension of capitalism. It is an economy in which the government serves the interests of oligopolies, a state in which large corporations have the powers that in a democracy devolve to the citizen. Today, it is no exaggeration to call our economy corporatist, which has been described by British academics R.E. Pahl and J. T. Winkler as a system in which the government guides privately owned businesses towards order, unity, nationalism and success."

"Let us not mince words, they said. "Corporatism is fascism with a human face." The Nazis had their own word for it: wehrwirtschaft, semantically linking wehr (for defense, bulwark, weapon) with wirtshaft (for housekeeping, domestic economy, husbandry) to describe an economy based on the assumption of warfare. The concept was not new, however. William Shirer points out in The Rise and the Fall of the Third Reich that 18th and 19th century Prussia devoted 70% of its revenue to the army and "that nation's whole economy was always regarded as primarily an instrument not of the people's welfare but of military policy." In Hitler's Germany even the pogroms were part of national economic planning, seizing Jewish shops and companies and replacing Jewish workers with the Ayrian unemployed.

Hitler argued that "private enterprise cannot be maintained in a democracy," and denounced "the freedom to starve," in a country which had known as many as six million without jobs. Wrote William Shirer, "In taking away that last freedom, Hitler assured himself of the support of the working class."

The link between business and fascism was clear to German corporatists. Auschwitz was not just a way to get rid of Jews, it was also a major source of cheap labor. As Richard Rubenstein points out in The Cunning of History, "I.G. Farben's decision to locate at Auschwitz was based upon the very same criteria by which contemporary multinational corporations relocate their plants in utter indifference to the social consequences of such moves." I.G. Farben invested over a billion dollars in today's money at Auschwitz and, thanks to the endless supply of labor, adopted a policy of deliberately working the Jewish slaves to death. In such ways do economics and freedom become intertwined. Those who think it can't happen here should consider that four days before Mussolini became premier, he met with a group of industrialists and assured them that his aim "was to reestablish discipline within the factories and that no outlandish experiments .... would be carried out." In Friendly Fascism, Bertram Gross notes that Mussolini also won "the friendship, support or qualified approval" of the American ambassador, Cornelius Vanderbilt, Thomas Lamont, many newspapers and magazine publishers, the majority of business journals, and quite a sprinkling of liberals, including some associated with both the Nation and The New Republic. "

Orwell understood fascism. One of the characteristics of his inner party, the ten percent who controlled the rest, was that there was no sexual or racial discrimination. He understood that ethnic eradication, while characteristic of nazism, was not required for fascism. Even earlier, Aldous Huxley set up a similar non-discriminatory dystopia in Brave New World.

---------

"howling along..."

OmarD

[Edit]
Om, Flinter - The Anti-techno Manifesto -- IronHead, 11:15:50 10/23/03 Thu

Omsan, possibly more apropros to have said: "listen carefully, when the 'rabid' dogs are 'howling'."

"Much madness, divinest sense"....ne?

Thanks for the link to Ted K's Manifesto, and ole friend Gibran is always appreciated. Maybe good to recognize ALL sides of what the majority of the slime pool, can't bare to hear.

Me wonders, what the worldwide reactions might have been, if the propaganda speeches of Hitler and his ilk, through-out time, were disseminated and studied in depth, outside der people's homelands?

Have to agree with much of TK's social commentary; while believing his methodology merely played into the hands of those whom conspire to control. His final quote I have to agree with. -
"179. It would be better to dump the whole stinking system and take the consequences."

Sparks the imagination of any true 'zontal' thinker; with true balances, both monetarily as well as personally and socially, becoming the egalitarian dream based reality.

Flintersan - Those 25 million you mentioned in discussion, whom have 'fallen' off of any status keeping by the trols - un-employed, un-reported, un-monitored and un-attached, aren't they now helping to dismantle a sinking stinking system, which is being scrapped by defacto non participation?

Perhaps the quiet disembarkation by vast numbers of 'zontals' {however unreproted by festerspeak} is leading to the quiet revolution.

Revolution, of that which is unjust, abhorent, and basically kaput, is the battle which TK wanted to partake of, yet was too assimilated into 'the machine' to recognize the path to INDIVIDUAL and individual's freedom.

Flintersan - You're right, entropy is surely in place for many organ-izations, while complete un-organization is [un]structurally organizing the soul-full self of individual personal freedom. One side falls apart, while the other gains a mass of collective strength, that is the true death knell, of TK's feared machine.

Me thinks the key, is to align on the side opposite the automatons. Where lies that side? Easy, inside What-Is, found deeply with-in.

[un]align'n along,
I-Head

[Edit]
"Ramblings..." -- OmarD, 08:40:36 10/23/03 Thu

@Cor Tauri, IH, Flinter, et. al.

Has been my experience that great "insights" can be gained from the "ramblings" of "Madmen." Thank you much for posting the link to Osama's latest "diatribe." --- I had seen\heard on TV (Aljazeera) - in Arabic, which I could only get the gist of & only "selected snips" in our news media... was great to see in full context...

Have copied and set aside in my "collection" of "insights from the other side" - where it sits right next to that "Manifesto"...from years back...which clearly predicts where we were headed and where we now find ourselves...

While we may not agree with the "methods" of such...it is a big mistake to to "ignore" the "message" they are trying to present...in their unfortunately "desperate" way..."


"The Unabomber's Manifesto" - http://www.panix.com/~clays/Una/

"Full text of Usama Bin Ladin's message to US" - http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5008.htm


Wa Salaam,

OmarD



PS: @IH..."ME TO!!!" (re:"... Looking and listening.......vewy vewy carefully, when the big dogs are talking...") --- see: "Peace and War"



War

One night a feast was held in the palace, and there came a man and prostrated himself before the prince, and all the feasters looked upon him; and they saw that one of his eyes was out and that the empty socket bled. And the prince inquired of him, "What has befallen you?" And the man replied, "O prince, I am by profession a thief, and this night, because there was no moon, I went to rob the money-changer's shop, and as I climbed in through the window I made a mistake and entered the weaver's shop, and in the dark I ran into the weaver's loom and my eye was plucked out. And now, O prince, I ask for justice upon the weaver."

Then the prince sent for the weaver and he came, and it was decreed that one of his eyes should be plucked out.

"O prince," said the weaver, "the decree is just. It is right that one of my eyes be taken. And yet, alas! both are necessary to me in order that I may see the two sides of the cloth that I weave. But I have a neighbor, a cobbler, who has also two eyes, and in his trade both eyes are not necessary."

Then the prince sent for the cobbler. And he came. And they took out one of the cobbler's two eyes.

And justice was satisfied.

-Khalil Gibran

-("The Madman")/

http://www.4umi.com/gibran/




[Edit]
what china elites should do -- qwerty, 07:26:09 10/23/03 Thu

===
China has gorged itself on easy money. A new Beijing villa complex called "Champagne Town" is just one sign that the bubbles are rising. "I ask people if they know that China has a new national bird," says Prof Hu, pointing to a skyline abuzz with construction. "It is the crane. That is all you see in the sky."
===

the US national bird is the DODO J6P


===
Yet such a transition is under way. Beijing has been loosening Communist restrictions on where people can live and work; it is set to approve more private banks to compete with its own state-owned behemoths; it is planning to amend the constitution to elevate the status of private business. And slowly, it is trying to create a legal system that is independent enough to keep the rampant corruption of its own officials in check.
===

translated ... china's elites should officially transfer the wealth of the nation into their pockets and remove the "little guy" corruption to maintain their power base

[Edit]
Cowboys -- volavka, 06:51:03 10/23/03 Thu

5-1, dallas fed meeting, friedman shift with terminator/bush/greenspan.. something big gonna come out.

[Edit]
Cor Tauri -- auspec, 06:37:16 10/23/03 Thu

I guess it's a generational thing with these Bush's, eh? Once again, w a twist, we hear the message:

"It's the ECONOMY, stupid!"

[Edit]
Mkt cap of ALL AU STOCKS -- volavka, 06:26:19 10/23/03 Thu

50 billion. Now if the idiots of the world ever wake up you'll see some real movement.....

[Edit]
Colonics exchange -- volavka, 05:29:21 10/23/03 Thu

no overnite movement....

tshtf

patience...

[Edit]
flat lines on charts -- Cor Tauri, 05:29:19 10/23/03 Thu

Why do I often see flatlines on charts of the Euro, Yen, Dollar, Gold and Silver?
Right now for instance, all the charts have flattened out.
What is this? Does it mean that kitco and others suddenly lost their data feed during the time of the flat line? Does it indicate that all the markets are secretly suspened while little dwarves in black suits run about and prepare everything for the day? Is it like seeing a cat cross a doorway twice?
Has this been discussed? What was the consensus?
In gold for instance London, Hong Kong and NY access are supposedly open during this flat line time.

[Edit]
Current POG, POS, POP & U$D Live Price -- CHARTs, 23:24:07 10/22/03 Wed

US$/POG: from www.kitco.comUS$/POS: from www.kitco.comEURO/POG: from www.kitco.com[Most Recent USD from www.kitco.com]




LbS/POG: from www.kitco.com London Fix: from www.kitco.com LbS/POS: from www.kitco.com



US$/POP: from www.kitco.com
US$/POP: from www.kitco.com


[Edit]
Usama bin Muhammad bin Ladin to the American people -- Cor Tauri, 23:05:33 10/22/03 Wed

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5008.htm

[Edit]
@auspec -- Goldustorm, 21:30:48 10/22/03 Wed

Re: "Why would he go to Asia with our 'interests at heart'?"
and "Distributed amongst some particular players?"
To answer the second question- yes, as many have been saying for years now.
As for going to Asia, I recall his invitation to speak at an official Muslim and Malaysian gathering on the gold Dinar in one of the Arab countries a few months back. He was going to attend but had to opt out due to the Patriot Act and fear of being imprisoned indefinately upon return to the states. I had almost forgot about that until your post.
Also, around that time, he expressed a desire to meet with some friends or associates in Asia, perhaps China, India or Hong Kong to dicover what was going on, similar to today!
Regards

[Edit]
auspec -- qwerty, 21:30:37 10/22/03 Wed

my perception of prechter is that he is working with the cartel manipulators

he knows what is going on

he keeps his mouth shut about the cartel

his mission seems to be to keep the general public out of gold for as long as possible

he purports to not see the gold bull

the gold bull is obvious to us here ... too obvious

he does add a qualifier like a little gold is not bad but that is just a "cover your ass" strategy for him

from what i can see, prechter is screwing over his subscribers and general public

when i read his call of the low 400's then he will conclude that gold is in a bear market

your post olus prechter's remarks mean they want to buy time ... can't imagine they think they will stop it especially when all those gold equity funds amd china demand come on line in big ways

blow up in gold short derivatives ... monetarization seems like it will be the solution ... they have been promised behind the scenes that they will be bailed out by the federal reserve ... also juicy iraq contracts as another payoff ... probably why jpm hasn't exploded ... the interest rate derivatives are the bigger monster

[Edit]
Batten down the hatches? -- Goldus, 21:16:26 10/22/03 Wed

Nikkei down 442 at 12AM EST and several hours to go. Make that days, no weeks, er... forget it- who can say what's going on?

[Edit]
Sinclair Hints @ Powerful Gold Currents -- auspec, 20:31:25 10/22/03 Wed

From http://www.jsmineset.com

fair use as education

Accumulation leads to mark-up in all markets. The Asian/Islamic accumulation spanned 1996 to the present. The mark-up phase has begun. This is the Big One! Yes, after mark-up comes distribution but this time it might NOT be into any market. Remember what I just told you because this is all I can reveal at this time.



As most of you already know, this phase is not dependent upon the state of the US dollar even though the onset of a serious bearish reaction to the long equity rally and the dollar weakness has put some added fire under this up move.

Gold’s rise has nothing to do with the old gang in the Gold Community. And in fact there is really nothing the Gold Cartel or the Exchange Stabilization Fund (ESF) can do to outsize the underlying demand for gold that has the $430 level clearly in its sights. I may have to visit Asia in November but if I do please understand it’s in your best interest.

There is a reason behind the timing of this move in gold that will escape most Western observers. It is a hard one for me to explain because I’m walking on egg shells on this issue.

You may notice that there is a complete media blackout - except for a small quotation that fits Western PR interests - on the recently authenticated Osama bin Laden tape released by the Qatar-based satellite station Al-Jazeera, the Arab version of CNN.

The reason why gold is rising and the dollar is falling into new low territory is contained in that tape. That again is all I can really say as an American in light of our new constitution, Patriot 2.

All the Gold Community needs to do to support gold is absolutely nothing. Sales into strength never hurt a situation including gold. Isn’t it crystal clear now that you buy anything gold on weakness TA correct and you sell anything gold TA correct? By doing that, you will simply build profit after profit!

END

Question: What's in the tape? I can only guess. Accumulation is over for those that intend to use gold as an economic weapon/empowerment.......time to spring the trap shut? Anyone seen the tape or have a link?

Why would he go to Asia w our interests at heart? Keeping gold free?

There are some powerful words above listed by JS........he's a man of great means, experience & connections. I don't think he's BSing, something really big is up. Tis not the "old gang" but apparently new players...........?

How does distribution take place but "NOT be into any market"? Distributed amongst some particular players?

Anyone up for parsing these JS statements? We could be real close here to a breakaway move & serious fireworks. Absolutely astounding, even though I did say I wouldn't be surprised, that gold bounced back so readily after the Oct 3rd bashing.

ANOTHER guess..............Oil being priced out of dollars, maybe even into gold? Would that be a earth shaker?

COT faithful about to be scorched? We're talking bombshell here, no? The article later mentions a $150 loss for the gold shorts, which is $100 more than they currently hold.

Hang on........this could get real interesting, and do so QUICKLY.

[Edit]
nuggets -- number six, 19:28:18 10/22/03 Wed

nugget

The Hun -

Mark Dunn 18 Oct

"RUMOURS that the world's third-largest gold nugget has been found in Dunolly's sewerage system have spread through Victoria's goldfields like wildfire.

Several prospectors have told of a 500-ounce specimen -- worth an estimated $370,000 -- being uncovered last week during excavation works for the tiny town's sewerage system.

Dunolly is smack in the middle of Victoria's golden triangle, said to be the world's richest deposit of alluvial gold.

If reports of the find are true, it would be the third largest intact piece behind the 845-ounce Hand of Faith, found 25km away at Kingower in 1980, and Western Australia's 819-ounce Normandy Nugget, found in the 1990s

[Edit]
Bush was just addressing Australian parliament -- number six, 19:10:55 10/22/03 Wed

Oh well, at least a couple of Senators had the balls to heckle him and get bounced. I guess they won't be there to dis Hu of China tomorrow.

[Edit]
? -- number six, 18:27:55 10/22/03 Wed

I hope a chimp walks out instead.

[Edit]
It's About Squirm Time -- auspec, 18:09:42 10/22/03 Wed

A few Midas snippets:

{John Brimlow}
Simple chart reading places dramatic emphasis on breaking out of the ’93-’96 top, not exceeded for 16 years. Above $380, pressure builds enormously on Elliot Wave theorist Bob Prechter to capitulate on his famous long standing bearishness – Prechter is currently moving the goal posts to $400+, but is running out of room. See

http://cbs.marketwatch.com/news/story.asp?guid=%7B34B3BA16%2DEFD7%2D4ED6%2D9C82%2D93C768CE1DA4%7D&siteid=mktw




John Brimelow quoted a well-known bullion dealer bear who warns:

"watch out if $400 moves onto the radar."

This could be extremely important. I have heard the same thing from another highly regarded source. GATA thought the Gold Derivatives Neutron Bomb could go off when gold took out $330. While it did not go off, gold did rally almost straight up to $388 before new Treasury Secretary Snow entered the picture.

From what I am hearing, the plan of The Gold Cartel and other mega gold shorts was to keep gold from going through $400. Derivatives programs were structured with the notion gold was not going through $400. In essence, many of these gold derivatives structured plans were rejiggered from a $330 stop out point to $400.

If this is correct, gold could really go bonkers if it takes out $400. This fits in perfectly with what The Café’s man in the gold option pits has told us - meaning the option premiums are valued with the rationale gold could not get through $400 to $425. Because of the lackadaisical business approach of the option writers to this possibility, our options man says there will be a derivatives nightmare if gold takes out $425.

This bears serious watching.

On the same line of thinking, I just received some feedback from the bullion dealer world there are rumblings of some hedge book problems – maybe even a blow-up coming. Of note, the big hedgers acted very poorly today. AngloGold closed down 44 cents to $39.03. Barrick could only manage a penny gain to $19.41. Newcrest of Australia at $8.10, Daughters of Gwalia at $12.65, and Placer Doom at $14.80 all closed unchanged. Not a banner day considering gold closed $5 higher.

Could a Gold Derivatives Banking Crisis be right around the corner? Smoke is beginning to billow. My guess is one is not far off!

END

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Comments: It just goes to show that this is a dynamic market. $325 was supposed to "bury" the shorts as was $354. Maybe they would have at a particulat time and place, but these blokes keep finding wiggle room. Will $425 do the trick? Quite possibly but these derivatives can be monetized in a New York minute {smile}.

Prechter.........?? He's in a box and has somehow chosen a similar point to what the banksters are defending. Imagine that.

A panic short covering rally? Participation is optional for the connected.

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