A revelation....... -- The REAL Random Chaos Central

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Date Posted: 14:39:37 05/14/04 Fri
Author: Hierophant
Author Host/IP: adsl-66-142-57-217.dsl.kscymo.swbell.net / 66.142.57.217
Subject: A revelation.......

Ok, basically Shaun informed me that Robert emailed him wanting to put an end to the shit. Very cool. Thankyou Robert. However I believe there are some things that need clarification.

1)*I* created "the other SC"
2)*I* invited Shaun, Dor, Phil (msudude), and Jaymie (you don't know her)
3)*I* put the password in place

I never said any of these things because I was astounded how some of you immediatly jumped in Shaun, accusing him of creating the other SC and putting the password in place. I mean.....come on, the place looks JUST LIKE the other board *I* own with practically the same rules. Not to mention there were many posts throughout the board listing me as the owner. Ok. Ah well.

I created the other SC during the heat of the last conflict. It was a new board I figured Shaun, myself, and whoever else I felt to be friendly, per se, to get back to normal posting. I invited Dor only. It was a secret thingy I was going to let out after awhile but I enjoyed just having Shaun and myself mainly there. We know eachother very well and can bitch about personal shit without really any comments. Just a place to get something off your chest. Now how you guys found out about the board, I really don't care. I put the password in place just to fuck with you, lol.

Its not that I was running away or anything. Just wanted a place away from everyone. Sort of like my garage. Where I could go when I wanted to be left alone with only a single comment here or there. It was nice.

As you know, i'm pretty laid back about everything. I try to ignore things and let it go. But damn, you always assume I don't know the facts and my decisions are based upon conservative propoganda. Don't do that. I support bush, I support the war, I support most everything. Accept it. Its the way I feel. You always say how you should be open to other people's views and opinions. Well those are mine. Live with it. I know you all despise Bush and all that goes with it, but I don't. I take much pride in this country and when the country is insulted, I feel insulted, cause i'm proud to be here. Ok. enough.

I just figured I'd mention those things. I really feel no hard feelings toward anyone and I would hope the same goes for everyone else. Like I wrote in my post on Snout Central about how lucky we are to be such a diverse group. Its clear we will never agree on political stand points. I admit it. I promise not to mention anything political, or whatever, from here on out. Infact I haven't in some time. Basically, the bottom line, we should just enjoy our time here cause its all pity bullshit. None of us are in any position to do a damn thing about anything we do bitch about. When we are........then hell yeah let the brawls begin, *L*

So yeah. Go fuck yourself........or die a horrible death by train.

Not really but still. I've been wanting to say that all day, lol.

As for Shaun coming back..............I still need to talk to him about that. I think it'd be cool. So we'll see. Or not. Either way.

So yeah. This was my apology, ammends, or what have you. If you accept it....wonderful! Lets be stupid once more! If you don't accept it.......I have a lovely new shiny boot i'll shove up your ass.

*GRIN*

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Replies:

[> Hear hear! -- Serena, 16:20:43 05/14/04 Fri (0x50a40e0f.arcnxx17.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk/80.164.14.15)

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[> *Appluades* -- ^DL, 09:33:01 05/15/04 Sat (bzq-218-28-12.cablep.bezeqint.net/81.218.28.12)

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[> Well.... -- Robert, 08:41:56 05/16/04 Sun (host093025.phil.uni-erlangen.de/131.188.93.25)

I guess it's not that easy. I thought the stuff would work last time, but then came some debate about movies - Independence Day and whatever - and it collapsed again. I don't recall much of it because I wasn't interested in the stuff, but I guess the basic structure that worked out there - somewhat highlighted - was: 'America/the President rules' versus 'America/the President sucks'. It's two opposed positions, and each one is experienced by the respective opposite side as offensive. It's not only one position that is experienced as offensive, it's two of them. Question is, how to deal with it.

I guess you're aware that several of the posts at new SC - though not attacking anyone here - would be experienced as highly problematic when posted here, and would cause major trouble. They don't do at new SC, because the people there either agree, or don't care about it. That is, new SC is a place where you can post whatever you want without caring whether it might offend anyone. Actually that's not too different from old SC, except that there it was only banning stuff you and Shaun experienced as offensive. And as far as I know this was widely respected.

The concept of RRCC is different. It's not meant to be a partisan board. Maybe say it allows moderate offensive stuff - like you posting your tits - and by coming here people agree not to take offence, and not to take the stuff too serious. Serenas boobies were more serious, and to prevent major turmoil, they had to be taken to SC.
I don't think it's possible to keep every possibly sensitive topic out of here. I mean, it was BUT debating a movie that caused the trouble!

Look, I don't mind partisan posts at new SC, even without password I'd just leave them alone. It's your private sphere, and there your rules have to be respected, absolutely. Same as I don't mind your opinion and Shauns, that's your private matter.

RRCC however is public sphere. Different from private sphere, there limitations should be minimized. That's more difficult and it only works if people somewhat tolerate each other. A wee bit of fighting in between doesn't matter IMO, it rather prevents it from getting boring. RCC never was free of fights, sometimes pretty hard ones (if you don't believe me - I've partly saved the stuff and can mail it to you). Humans just aren't peaceful and fluffy all the time, not even Shaun. :)
Even if another password protected zone would be made up for the second party here to speak out freely, to balance the situation, this wouldn't solve the public space problem.

By removing everything that might be experienced as offensive, you'd finally end up with an empty board. So it's rather about how to deal with stuff. that might be experienced as offensive. Different from private space, by posting whatever parts of your opinion in public you agree to have it commented by people with different opinion - if not, just leave it. This should be done without hostility, respecting each other. May not always be easy, but it's possible.
You can't have diversity without tensions, at some point or other there will always be trouble, more or less serious. But don't forget, dispite of all this it's almost 5 years meanwhile! And I don't see unsolvable problems for continuing it, just requires to be somewhat more cautious.

Transforming this board into a place for just pulling jokes or exposing boobies would make me leave because of boredom, more or less - no offence towards Serena intended, but after all RL boobies are slightly more intriguing, sort of, not to mention the adjacent parts.

A major focus of mine is understanding. Understanding Americans was essential part from the very beginning. Well, and to be confronted with almost opposite opinions on stuff is a highly interesting matter. You don't increase understanding by ignoring differences.
Personally I don't have much problems to deal with Shaun about different opinions - even political ones. The fighting about it was laid to rest already last time. It's just counterproductive. I'd like to continue talking about the stuff. Maybe it's possible to handle it in a more peaceful and fluffy way, we'll see.

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[> [> Yes I see -- Hierophant, 09:16:54 05/16/04 Sun (adsl-66-142-238-28.dsl.kscymo.swbell.net/66.142.238.28)

I think the main problem for myself was the fact that you and Larry, and Joe I guess too, seem to be so hell bent on Anti-Bush material. I never felt, nor do I feel, that you will never like anything he does and will never agree with anything. I'm a Bush supporter, yet theres still things I dissagree with. It feels unfair that I can sit here, read about something like his immigration policies with Mexico and be like "Yeah Bush is stupid for that" , yet you all NEVER post anything that he or the administration has done well and if you don't think hes done anything well....then damn.

I feel very safe with Bush as President. He is a bullheaded man. The thing that I understand and that I feel many Americans don't understand is that terrorism is not going to go away with appeasement and it MUST be confronted on all fronts. Bush is willing to do so. I don't believe Kerry is. Kerry's long line of weak on defense votes just scares me. Our country needs to keep its defenses raised very high until terrorism vanishes, which it won't for a long time yet. Bush does add a sense of security for me. Its just hard to keep putting up with so many Anti-Bush posts when I think he's doing a great job at keeping my country, family, and friends safe.

Ok. I don't really want to keep going with this. I do believe politics are a topic of VERY interesting discussion because its a world-wide matter. Its something everyone has opinions on. I just think at the current time and with our diverse group, they shouldn't be apart of many disussions yet.

Shit. Damn phone keeps ringing and I'm losing my thoughts, lol.

I'm done with bickering. No more for me. I think we need more of a "Agree to dissagree" attitude here. Its clear we're never going to change eachothers opinions.

Ok. What did I just say? I have no clue if this post makes any sense anymore. Odd.

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[> [> [> As for me, it's not as if I was bringing any of this stuff up, myself - but if someone posted something about bush that I disagreed with, I posted my opinion. It's like I said earlier - if you don't want to hear negative opinions about stuff you're sensitive about, don't bring it up... I think that's a solution we can use to all get along. -- Lethal Larry, 09:54:34 05/16/04 Sun (px3wh.vc.shawcable.net/24.69.255.204)

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[> [> [> [> That's correct..... -- Robert, 12:00:20 05/16/04 Sun (host093025.phil.uni-erlangen.de/131.188.93.25)

It's either me, or Joe - or Shaun. *L*

IIRC on SC he's the only one to bring such issues up.

Guess it's just that some people are more into talking about what's going on than others. Larry and AJ would never have troubles with political issues and stuff without us. *L*

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[> [> [> [> [> Well I like to talk about whats going on politically, but its not the most important thing to me -- Hierophant, 16:56:43 05/16/04 Sun (adsl-66-142-57-130.dsl.kscymo.swbell.net/66.142.57.130)

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[> [> [> [> [> [> Well, it's not about 'most imortant'..... -- Robert, 11:55:28 05/17/04 Mon (host093025.phil.uni-erlangen.de/131.188.93.25)

else I'd be governor of Missouri - at least! :)

It's just a matter of more or less interest, like people are interested in sports or whatever

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[> [> [> I agree.... -- Robert, 10:43:13 05/16/04 Sun (host093025.phil.uni-erlangen.de/131.188.93.25)

doesn't make much sense to me either. *L*

You have your position, that's ok - others have theirs, that's ok too. No reason to worry about it, or to feel offended by others because of - for example liking/don't liking Bush.

Anyway, such stuff wasn't a frequent topic here the past time, I guess the frequency rate is about the same as on new SC.

Shaun wrote, the reason he left was to prevent the movie debate from escalating. Well, easiest way to deal with it is not to escalate such stuff anymore.

When different opinions should show up - I guess it's impossible to prevent it - it's best just to accept them. And though I oppose to ban whatever may be political, it's better to handle it more cautious.

At least for some time, until the piled grudge on both sides - seems there's quite a bit - is gone.

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[> [> You've made a lot of excellent points there, Robert. -- Lethal Larry, 10:00:53 05/16/04 Sun (px3wh.vc.shawcable.net/24.69.255.204)

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[> [> [> I ALWAYS make excellent points! -- Flattered Robert, 10:44:36 05/16/04 Sun (host093025.phil.uni-erlangen.de/131.188.93.25)

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[> [> [> [> Diane always brings up two excellent points, whenever she's cold. I like looking at them. Two big, wonderful points. -- Lethal Boob Freak, 13:25:03 05/16/04 Sun (px3wh.vc.shawcable.net/24.69.255.204)

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[> [> [> [> [> Beats me - getting cold only my nose turns red. -- Robert, 11:45:25 05/17/04 Mon (host093025.phil.uni-erlangen.de/131.188.93.25)

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