[ Show ]
[ Shrink ]
Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor
of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users'
privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your
privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket
to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we
also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.
Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your
contribution is not tax-deductible.)
Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):
[ Next Thread |
Previous Thread |
Next Message |
Previous Message ]
Date Posted: 12:01:05 02/15/08 Fri
Subject: Are the Scoobies mentally ill?
In reply to:
's message, "Re: No Offense taken" on 10:27:53 02/15/08 Fri
So in your view are the Scooby members of the rebellion mentally ill during the rebellion?
Well I don't know if they qualify as mentally ill per se but they have experienced a horrendous shock – Xander’s horrible injury not to mention the death of Molly (who along with Vi were my favorite potentials). While I am not a big fan of Xander (how dare he do that to my Anya?), I give him a pass in this instance. He just lost an eye and I can only imagine how I would feel in that situation. It was, however, a stunning 180 from his "little bus to battle" speech just an episode before. I also think Willow was greatly affected by Xander’s loss. She might be gay and in love with Kennedy (or not) but Xander still holds a prominent position in her heart. Giles is a difficult one - he seems to be acting all wonky throughout most of season 7. I find his motivations most puzzling. I agree that the rebellion was wrong, especially kicking Buffy out of the house, but I do understand the reaction. When your team is not doing well, it is only natural to want to change the leader (see sports, business etc). As for the scoobs, I think are suffering from post traumatic stress syndrome so I guess in a way they are mentally ill.
I think Spike is acting toward Buffy the way he always acted toward his loves (and his mother): complete and total devotion. He was that way toward Dru and she was not nearly as deserving as Buffy. So why did Spike believe in Buffy? I think you can trace it back to Season 5. At the end of Intervention, Buffy, disguised as the Buffybot. tries to find out if Spike told Glory about Dawn. When she determines that he didn’t, she starts to leave then turns and says:
BUFFY: (interrupts) Don't! That thing... it wasn't even real. (long pause) What you did, for me & Dawn... that was real. I won't forget it.
In The Gift, when Spike and Buffy go to Buffy’s house to arm themselves, Buffy starts to walk up the stairs and Spike says:
SPIKE: I know you'll never love me. I know that I'm a monster. But you treat me like a man, and that's...
Closer to Showtime, I find two passages that indicate to me that Spike has every rational reason to believe in Buffy. In Sleeper, after Spike shows Buffy the cellar with the bodies:
PIKE: Will you... Help me. Can you help me?
BUFFY: I'll help you.
And a longer passage in Never Leave Me. Spike and Buffy are discussing his recent crimes:
SPIKE: Have you ever really asked yourself why you can't do it? Off me? After everything I've done to you, to people around you. It's not love. We both know that.
BUFFY: You fought by my side. You've saved lives. You've helped?
SPIKE: Don't do that. Don’t rationalize this into some noble act. We both know the truth of it. (pained) You like men who hurt you.
SPIKE: You need the pain we cause you. You need the hate. You need it to do your job, to be the slayer.
BUFFY: No. I don't hate like that. Not you, or myself. Not anymore. You think you have insight now because your soul's drenched in blood? You don't know me. You don't even know you. Was that you who killed those people in the cellar? Was that you who waited for those girls?
SPIKE: There's no one else.
BUFFY: That's not true. Listen to me. You're not alive because of hate or pain. You're alive because I saw you change. Because I saw your penance.
SPIKE: (lunges violently at her, but chains hold him back) Window dressing.
BUFFY: Be easier, wouldn't it, it if were an act, but it's not. You faced the monster inside of you and you fought back. You risked everything to be a better man.
BUFFY: And you can be. You are. You may not see it, but I do. I do. I believe in you, Spike.
All these passages convince me that Spike had every rational reason for believing in Buffy and trusting that she would come for him; she told him so and he had absolutely no reason to doubt her. The fact that I see it as rational and not religious in no way diminshes the power and importance of that belief - I absolutely love Bring On the Night and Showtime and only wish that I believed in someone (or that someone believed in me) the way Spike/Buffy believe in each other.
Next Thread |
Previous Thread |
Next Message |
Re: motivations -- Rich, 13:28:48 02/15/08 Fri
Google stock market futures prices -- Cady (Google stock market futures prices), 21:57:33 03/18/10 Thu
Forum timezone: GMT-8|
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.