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| Subject: Re: MONEY, MONEY, MONEY! | |
Author: Tom | [ Next Thread |
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] Date Posted: 23:28:56 08/04/05 Thu In reply to: QUITTNER 's message, "Re: MONEY, MONEY, MONEY!" on 08:37:42 08/04/05 Thu Tithe means "tenth". Leviticus 27:30 "And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's. It is holy to the Lord." Leviticus 27:32 "And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the Lord." Malachi 3:8 "Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings." Malachi 3:10 "Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it." 2 Corinthians 9:7 "Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver." But, Quittner, if you do not hold the Bible as the literal, inerrant word of God, none of this will mean anything to you. Tom [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] |
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Author: QUITTNER [ Edit | View ] |
Date Posted: 08:53:33 08/05/05 Fri Tom, you wrote: >>> ... if you do not hold the Bible as the literal, inerrant word of God, none of this will mean anything to you. <<< ..... No, the bible is a collection of a number of books, arbitrarily selected by a committee for use in churches many years ago, representing only their writers, not God. God doesn't need writers to do any writings for him, nor are translations needed for any of God's communications. ..... The churches wanted 10% taxation, not God. |
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Author: Tom [ Edit | View ] |
Date Posted: 10:21:36 08/05/05 Fri "God doesn't need writers to do any writings for him..." This is a perfect example of humans trying to create their own image of God... a sinful practice. Every word of the Bible was divinely inspired by the Holy Spirit, written through the hands of men. What you read in the Bible IS written by the Lord, and that is how the Lord communicates with us. "...nor are translations needed for any of God's communications." You've got that right. There's no doubt in my mind that the Church used tithing in the worst ways. If fact, before Martin Luther, the Church taught tithing as a "ticket to heaven" of sorts. The common people didn't know how to read, and therefore could not study the Bible to read 2 Corinthians 9:7. I can only imagine the anger the Lord must have felt as this was going on. I don't doubt that there are some churches within various faiths that agressively push the tithing concept as a means of securing more than enough money. But when we read the Bible and come to understand God's word, we understand what God teaches about giving and generosity... Mark 12:41-44 "And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much. And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing. And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury: For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living." Yesterday, on a whim, I donated $10 to a children's hospital. This is how I give to the Lord. Although I live on a poverty level of income, I always find ways of giving to those less fortunate. I do not give ten percent of my income, because I am not as noble as the poor widow in the verse above. To give that much takes total, complete, unwavering faith in God's promise of blessings... and that is not an easy bridge to cross for anyone. I pray for strengthened faith so that someday I can cross that bridge. Oh, and about "arbitrarily" compiling the books of the Bible, I don't believe it was arbitraty to the Lord. I do not know why several of such boring books were included, but then I do not question the wisdom of my creator. Tom |
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Author: QUITTNER [ Edit | View ] |
Date Posted: 09:12:12 08/08/05 Mon Tom, the many libraries in all countries are full of all sorts of writings in all sorts of languages, and there are also those on the computers. Anyone can claim that their writings were inspired by God. But can they prove it? ..... And there are very many belief systems on this planet, with their own sales literature that they keep pushing, and their leaders may claim that it has been inspired by God. But can they prove it? ..... God communicates directly with people (no need for clergy) that are open to such commuications and have not ex-communicated themselves; others may read all sorts of out-of-date, obsolete writings instead; some people claim to speak for God, or even to represent God. But can they prove it? ..... If you give money to some cause, then you are partly credited with/held responsible for the good/bad things that are done by the recipient(s) with your money. God doesn't need your money, and you don't/didn't give it to God. |
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Author: Tom [ Edit | View ] |
Date Posted: 17:35:56 08/08/05 Mon >"Anyone can claim that their writings were inspired by God. But can they prove it?" Anyone can claim their writings are inspired by God, but God only claims the writings He inspired. God also states the horrible plague-like terror that anyone brazen enough to alter His written word would endure. I don't know of anyone throughout history who attempted to test God on that one. Sure, there are translations of every kind, but the inegrity of His message is 100% intact. The Dead Sea Scroll further proved this when they were compared to hundreds of years worth of translations. Aside from the translations themselves, God's word has not changed. People claim to be all sorts of things, but what matters is what you know YOU are. It's super easy to sit back and demand physical proof of this and that (like I used to do) and its even easier to assume and declare that God works in the ways that make the most sense to you (like I used to do.) But that kind of thinking isn't going to get you were you need to be. There is a lot of proof to God's creation of the earth and the heavens, and they may lead one on the path toward God as it did for me, but it was His word that finally led me to Him. Jesus said that blessed are those who have not seen, yet believe. What must you see before you believe? I have seen the greatness of God's handiwork in the heavens and I have experienced his glory manifested in the words and deeds of so many loving people. Those who experience God's love and believe in Him with all their heart do not not need the same physical proof you seek, because they already know their creator. I am not responsible for what a charity does with my donations, but I am responsible for the reasons behind my giving. I give because I am blessed with so much more than others have, and all that I have was given by God. Sometimes we say, "If only I had a thousandth of Bill Gate's income!" But there are some who may look at my poverty level of income who can say the same. If you give of your time and money because you truly care about those who need it more than yourself, then are you not giving to the Lord? Tom |
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Author: QUITTNER [ Edit | View ] |
Date Posted: 09:26:28 08/09/05 Tue Tom, thank you for your responses; my time is limited and I have to stop looking at, or even posting to this forum. All the best to you, keep well, health is more important than money! |
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Author: Tom [ Edit | View ] |
Date Posted: 22:04:22 08/09/05 Tue Quittner, I also wish you all the best. I enjoyed the conversations. Take care, Tom |
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