VoyForums
[ Show ]
Support VoyForums
[ Shrink ]
VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: [1]2 ]
Subject: gay??


Author:
just me
[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]
Date Posted: 17:03:51 01/05/02 Sat

JJ is gay or what?? with graham??

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
John
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 14:15:54 01/08/02 Tue

No. Maybe bi. (Not that it matters.)

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Jim
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 06:34:13 05/28/02 Tue

>No. Maybe bi. (Not that it matters.)
JJ dated Graham's SISTER years ago.

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
moe
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 05:17:56 02/06/03 Thu

>>No. Maybe bi. (Not that it matters.)
>JJ dated Graham's SISTER years ago.
>he can sleep with sheep for all i care its the man the music

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Brenda
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 16:04:20 02/17/03 Mon

JJ may be gay, bi, or straight (all though how many straight men hang out with drag queens?). I'm not sure how much that really matters. However, he is definitely queer or "queer-friendly", meaning he is very conscious of the lives of LGBTQ (lesbian/gay/bisexual/transgender/queer) people, just as he is of any people who are considered "other" by the mainstream. I like his lyrics because he puts out his thoughts about the way world is and does is with intelligence & humor. And that's what is important to me!

BJ

>>>No. Maybe bi. (Not that it matters.)
>>JJ dated Graham's SISTER years ago.
>>he can sleep with sheep for all i care its the man
>the music

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Peter
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 23:49:32 03/27/03 Thu

I find this exchange confusing because I have heard that the entire album Night and Day is a coming out album. It really makes sense from the lyrics of Another World through Real Men and ending with A Slow Song. I thought that Real Men was a very clear coming out song - "don't call me a faggot, not unless you are a friend." Am I missing something? I know he's been married to women but what about now?

PETER

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
MoreFun101
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 07:41:22 03/29/03 Sat

Joe Jackson in his book A CURE FOR GRAVITY discusses his curiosity about his sexuality back in his younger days, however, he never explored homosexuality and is completely hetro. He is aware of the perceptions of him and is always amused, according to his autobiography, that people make that assumption based on his gangly and possibly effeminate appearance.





>I find this exchange confusing because I have heard
>that the entire album Night and Day is a coming out
>album. It really makes sense from the lyrics of
>Another World through Real Men and ending with A Slow
>Song. I thought that Real Men was a very clear coming
>out song - "don't call me a faggot, not unless you are
>a friend." Am I missing something? I know he's been
>married to women but what about now?
>
>PETER

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Jan
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 14:31:39 04/07/03 Mon

I think Peter's remark is interesting: I don't know about Joe's sexuality and agree with most contributors that it's not a very important issue. But on the other hand it is nevertheless interesting, because if you go beyond the music and start to really read the lyrics, it's obvious that at least half of them revolve around the way men and women can or can not live with each other (starting from "One more time" and ending as of now with "Bright grey"). So if we'd know about his sexuality, maybe we would start to see his songs in a slightly different light (neither "better" nor "worse", just different).

But is it really possible, that Night & Day is a coming out album?

The lyrics on Night & Day are very fascinating because some of them are rather complex, since they can be read in different ways, so that you have to interpret them your own. (I for one still think that "Chinatown" is a modern version of a certain Franz Kafka short story.) It never occured to me, that "Another World" could be a "coming-out"-song, but now that you mentioned it, it really seems to make some sense. At first, that is. I think, that if you look closer, you'll find, that this is not very probable. "I was so low, people almost made me give up trying, always said no ..." Now, where is the gay subtext? Or the "coming out"-subtext, for that matter? I admit, that the second part could be read as a coming-out-song. But to split the subject in two like that doesn't make much sense, does it? Especially if you consider that there are maybe hundreds of different ways to understand these words. Now Real Men is different, I agree, but again: To say that this song is really about "I am gay" - I don't know. To me, it's just a song about men and the strange ways in which they often behave. The part you quote - well, I guess you are really missing something and that is the "context". I think if you read the whole section you can hardly say, that it is about him at all. And "A slow song"? Now you lost me. I'm confused. Where is even the slightest bit of subtext in this one? "My friend"? "Slow song"? "Push right through"? Oh, come on ...

So to me, Night & Day doesn't seem much like a coming-out-album. If you want it to be (and you don't look to close), yes, then it might be. But then it could also be about - say - him becoming a reborn christian. Or a communist ("Don't you feel like trying something new?"). Come to think of it, Night & Day seems even more like an album about Joe becoming a communist than about him coming out. And let's not forget, he married about five years later - as far as I know a woman.

But what about now? I remember, when JJ won the grammy, some newapapers wrote that he was "openly" gay. Which I found disturbing, because I didn't know about him being gay and I listen to his music, even read his book and went to a lot of his concerts. I know, that most people concluded that he is gay because of his appearance as a drag queen on Night & Day II. But some men dress as women, some women dress as men - and yet are heterosexuell ... We all know, that Joe's other recurring theme is being a misfit. So I propose a different view of him posing as Dale de Vere (or whatever): He wrote one other song about misfits in New York, needed a drag queen, couldn't find one, that could sing it the way he wanted (as happened with "Happyland") and decided to sing it himself, dressed as drag queen. Seems to me as possible an explantion as a coming out at the age of fourtyfive.

So in the end we have to agree, that we simply don't and cannot know. The man keeps his sexuality a secret. (He even said something like that a few years ago in an interview. He wouldn't want to be thought of as a "gay" or "straight" artist.) This probably disturbs a lot of people. But as always, I think, in the end we should all thank him for it: Because this way he challenges us once more, to think out of the box. And - being myself rather straight - I really kind of love him for that.

Jan

>I find this exchange confusing because I have heard
>that the entire album Night and Day is a coming out
>album. It really makes sense from the lyrics of
>Another World through Real Men and ending with A Slow
>Song. I thought that Real Men was a very clear coming
>out song - "don't call me a faggot, not unless you are
>a friend." Am I missing something? I know he's been
>married to women but what about now?
>
>PETER

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Teepsman
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 18:00:06 06/29/03 Sun

What I got from Joe's autobiography was that sexuality is an ambiguous thing, and that it is not easily defined. Confusion results when you attempt to put labels on people. I can understand why the GLBT community might want to claim Joe, but he made it pretty plain in his autobiography that the definition of sexuality is just not something that interests him.

I can understand how persons searching for "clues" might find a few in his music and art. But here are some points for your consideration:

1. Joe's music is really about alienation and miscommunication, and the GBLT themes are just one way to discuss alienation from genreal society. At least here in America, GBLT persons are still largely disenfranchised, and they therefore provide great material for writers who want to explore the fringes of society.

I think you can find plenty of non-homosexual references in his music that deal with the very same themes you've been discussing. For example, "My House" from "Laughter & Lust" is decidedly heterosexual, yet tackles the same themes of alienation, confusion and frustration as those "coming out" songs that were mentioned above.

Joe's music speaks to me as a mostly heterosexual male (after all, no one's 100%!) because it finds the "loner" in me and exploits it. I suspect that most dyed-in-the-wool fans also grew up as outsiders, strangers, or just plain "different" than their peers. Or maybe I'm just projecting?

2. Joe's a performer. I'm not so sure that each and every (or most, or even some) song he writes could be autobiographical. Instead, I can see how he might latch onto gay themes as a way of telling an interesting story or exploring a different theme. There are only so many "moon-june-spoon" songs that you can hear before you vomit. But if they are autobiographical, then more power to him.

3. Joe as a drag queen? I have no answer for that, other than it made for a pretty cool photo! And you have to wonder if the "punk" in Joe was having a bit of a laugh over that.

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Rita
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 19:16:07 08/10/03 Sun

Well, I'm a hot female and I tried to pick up Joe Jackson at a recent concert;but failed.Can't say that he didn't look at me though! He had made it out to be a joke with the band.

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Rita
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 19:26:52 08/18/03 Mon

Remember the song on the I'm the Man album,where he says "The playboy leaves me cold,but it ain't because I'm gay."?
I think that he mouthed the words,"I'm Gay",to me during a recent concert,because my eyes were coming on too strong.I was aiming to go to bed with him.
I believe that he started out with woman,but gave up on them.It sounded like he had some real losers,in his book.I can't believe that he wrote about his adult circumsion! Of all things....
With men,he doesn't have to commit or have children.Maybe he had a sex change operation??

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Claire
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 04:38:40 09/28/03 Sun

You're an idiot

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> [> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Kevin
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 23:28:15 10/11/03 Sat

You Are A Whore! Fuck off!

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
John In NYC
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 23:48:24 08/25/03 Mon

Joe Jackson, gay?!? (Not that it matters) How disgusting! (Not that it matters) Why would anyone suggest such a heinous thing? (Not that it matters) He's 100% ALL MAN!

Are children listening to his faggy records? He must be stopped!

How could I ever be expected to relate to a Joe Jackson record again if there's even the slightest possibility that he might be one of those homosexuals.

He's had sex with women, right? So, he must be straight.

Ah, I feel better now.

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Rena
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 15:28:13 09/17/03 Wed

Gay or Not? All I know is that when I went to his concert I could not get near the front because of all the guys there. If he did get married to a woman is he still? Does anyone know for sure. No matter how many interviews I read on him he never really goes into personal matters if they don't pertain to his music. I have always taken his words to be conflicts between men and women but if they aren't it doesn't matter. Aren't lyrics supposed to be personalized to whoever is listening to them? Don't we all just take what we want from a song?

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Bruno
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 10:06:44 09/27/03 Sat

Qu'il soit gay ou pas on s'en moque;en l'occurence il ne l'est pas!

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
[> Subject: Re: gay??


Author:
Rosemint
[ Edit | View ]

Date Posted: 12:54:27 10/01/04 Fri

Can't blame a girl for trying?

[ Post a Reply to This Message ]


Post a message:
This forum requires an account to post.
[ Create Account ]
[ Login ]
[ Contact Forum Admin ]


Forum timezone: GMT-5
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.