Re: Veiled Homophobic Drivel -- The Joe Jackson Message Board

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Subject: Re: Veiled Homophobic Drivel

Author:
Ricard L. Befan

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Date Posted: 19:05:27 04/09/03 Wed
In reply to: John in NYC 's message, "Veiled Homophobic Drivel" on 19:29:01 04/08/03 Tue

>This is almost as insulting as the "who cares if he's
>gay?" or "I don't care if he sleeps with sheep" points
>of view. Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on
>how you look at it) a person's sexual orientation is
>quite relevant to how they are perceived by others,
>treated in the world, their outlook, etc. and
>therefore it affects their artistic vision like
>anything would. Without getting all preachy, it
>MATTERS!

It matters to some people. Personally I don't care if he likes men or women, or if this has an actual influence in his art. And I don't think that's an insulting point of view.

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Replies:

[> Subject: Re: Veiled Homophobic Drivel

Author:
Just an average Joe
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Date Posted: 14:15:55 04/19/03 Sat

See the problem is that we really can't escape the fact the vast majority of men are extremely uncomfortable with the possibility of another man attempting to have sex with them. The worst part is the "is he or is he not" ambiguity which turns all sorts of otherwise completely innocent interactions between men into possibly peverse situations. And those poor guys who for some reason or other have one of the stigmata of gayness, say a high voice... everyone thinks they're gay even if they're not. I can imagine the situation must suck for them in particular. Me, I confess that when I find myself being hit on by another guy, my first instinct is to kill him, to break his neck so he would no longer be able to even try. And I'm an average Joe, even more liberal in most respects than most perhaps.

We can be tolerant, yes, but lets not kid ourselves about the negative consequences of homosexuality for normal people.

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[> [> Subject: Re: Veiled Homophobic Drivel - Average Joe's response

Author:
Alec in Montreal
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Date Posted: 14:34:19 04/22/03 Tue

Woah... "Average Joe", I think your slip is showing, or maybe your show is slipping. Don't want to drag this away from J.J. but this stuff you write about "normal people" and "tolerance" and "negative consequences", I think maybe you should check out that mirror once in a while. You sound like one of J.J.'s ironic characters, You know, "I like your music, I like your style, I crack a joke so why don't you smile". Alright, that's about racism but I hope J. J. fans can deal with metaphor and simile and maybe pick up on the wider message. And that stuff about your first reaction to all those guys coming on to you be to want to kill them.... son, I think we've got a bit of a problem here... First of all, please relax, and sit down, and please put down that gun. (Yes maybe we should all put down those guns). But son, you are living in a weird headspace if you think gay men all want a piece of you. And I believe a simple "no" would probably get the message across.... no I think ther's more going on, in your head.

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[> [> Subject: Re: Veiled Homophobic Drivel

Author:
Brenda
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Date Posted: 22:55:44 04/27/03 Sun

What are you so scared of? I mean, you must be scared of something if a come-on makes you want to "kill" a guy! If you know what you like, what difference does it make when someone you aren't into propositions you? Women deal with that crap every damn day from age 5! There would be an awful lot of dead men laying around if women were that insecure!

Look, JJ may or may not be gay (however, I still say he's definitely queer-identified!). The main thing is that he speaks about issues that are important to all genders. Hopefully his fans are open-minded enough to accept that fact and maybe look at perspectives they normally wouldn't see.

And I wish the LGBT media would start paying more attention to JJ! I'd hate to see that the gay male community is as narrow as JJ portrays it in "Real Men" & "Fairy Dust".

Brenda

>See the problem is that we really can't escape the
>fact the vast majority of men are extremely
>uncomfortable with the possibility of another man
>attempting to have sex with them. The worst part is
>the "is he or is he not" ambiguity which turns all
>sorts of otherwise completely innocent interactions
>between men into possibly peverse situations. And
>those poor guys who for some reason or other have one
>of the stigmata of gayness, say a high voice...
>everyone thinks they're gay even if they're not. I can
>imagine the situation must suck for them in
>particular. Me, I confess that when I find myself
>being hit on by another guy, my first instinct is to
>kill him, to break his neck so he would no longer be
>able to even try. And I'm an average Joe, even more
>liberal in most respects than most perhaps.
>
>We can be tolerant, yes, but lets not kid ourselves
>about the negative consequences of homosexuality for
>normal people.

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