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Date Posted: 19:16:42 12/21/01 Fri
Author: Michela Ecks
Author Host/IP: dialup-63.208.71.60.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net / 63.208.71.60
Subject: Sex Laws
In reply to: Slytherin Godess 's message, "Re: Slash does not = Porn" on 20:02:18 12/19/01 Wed

>porn = illegal sexual stimulation
>slash = relationship between to people of the same sex

And relationships in slash are purely non sexual?

But back to babbling on minors, slash and sex.

For the purpose of this, assume that I know that not all slash is porn, not all porn is slash, and not all slash that is also porn (or erotica) features children. I am only referring to the following sub set of stories which I feel, based on Warner Brother's comments, they are the most upset with: stories featuring two minor children of the same sex engaging in sexual activities.

This is a very narrow thing. Now, knowing that I've narrowed it down, please bare with this based on that.

There is some legal question, based on my interpretation of some of the laws I've read as to whether or not the aforementioned material (fictional minor characters engaging in text based sexual activities) is indeed legal. There are various overlapping juristictional issues that make this a very fuzzy issue and some of the terminology is open enough that you could, concievably make the case, that this material is illegal.

(a) describe, depict, express or otherwise deal with matters of sex, drug misuse or addiction, crime, cruelty, violence or revolting or abhorrent phenomena in such a way that they offend against the standards of morality, decency and propriety generally accepted by reasonable adults to the extent that they should not be classified; or
(b) describe or depict in a way that is likely to cause offence to a reasonable adult, a minor who is, or who appears to be, under 16 (whether the minor is engaged in sexual activity or not); or
(c) promote, incite or instruct in matters of crime or violence.

That is Australian National Classification Code's child pornography reference according to this site here.

Now, breaking down Australian law...

(a) describe, depict, express or otherwise deal

Could that describe the material in question? Yes as the fan fiction in question is writing and most writing describes.

with matters of sex, drug misuse or addiction, crime, cruelty, violence or revolting or abhorrent phenomena in such a way that they offend against the standards of morality, decency and propriety generally accepted by reasonable adults to the extent that they should not be classified; or

Would the featuring of minors having sex with other minors be viewed as abhorent? I'd say not all but I think a good case could be made (and I have no legal degree so refute me if you disagree.) that yeah, it is abhorent and WB's reaction pretty much proves that to me.

So yeah, I'd go with based on that definition, fan fiction featuring two fictional minors engaged in sexual activities could be construed as illegal.

But that's only all of Australia and I mentioned overlapping juristional problems? Let's look at Australian State of Victoria's definition of child pornography from the aforementioned link.

means a film, photograph, publication or computer game that describes or depicts a person who is, or who looks like, a minor under 16 engaging in sexual activity or depicted in an indecent manner or context. (Crimes Act, 67A)

See, the publication and describing would probably make this illegal too... We're not talking PICTURES of children engaged in sex. We're talking just descriptions. Fictional I would say might make fan fiction legal since it really isn't looking like a minor... but the fictional thing is about the only thing that I can see that would make fan fiction featuring two minors having sex from being possibly technically illegal. Once again, I'm not a lawyer so I might be interpretting this wrong. If you have more knowledge, let me know as I'd be interested to see if based on that law, you think it would be legal IN THAT JURISTICTION and where in the definition it would be.

Anyway, I could probably find a bunch more examples of laws where it is fuzzy. There are some juristictions where the law is really clear on what is and what is not child porn. The state of Illinois is pretty clear in that this material I've stated above would be legal. (At least to me.) State code says the following:

Sec. 11-20.1. Child pornography.
(a) A person commits the offense of child pornography
who:
(1) films, videotapes, photographs, or otherwise depicts or portrays by means of any similar visual medium or reproduction or depicts by computer any child whom he knows or reasonably should know to be under the age of 18 or any institutionalized severely or profoundly mentally retarded person where such child or institutionalized severely or profoundly mentally retarded person is:
and
(2) with the knowledge of the nature or content thereof, reproduces, disseminates, offers to disseminate, exhibits or possesses with intent to disseminate any film, videotape, photograph or other similar visual reproduction or depiction by computer of any child or institutionalized severely or profoundly mentally retarded person whom the person knows or reasonably should know to be under the age of 18 or to be an institutionalized severely or profoundly mentally retarded person, engaged in any activity described in subparagraphs (i) through (vii) of paragraph (1) of this subsection; or

Anyway, I'm not wanting people to be confused (hence, I should really edit that essay) that Writers University has problems with slash in general or porn in general. It's the narrow sub set of fan fiction featuring minors of the same sex engaged in sexual activity that are the ones where confusion is from. Bleh.

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Replies:

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Sex Laws -- Avocado, 00:58:01 03/25/02 Mon (dsl254-033-103.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net/216.254.33.103)

>Anyway, I'm not wanting people to be confused (hence,
>I should really edit that essay) that Writers
>University has problems with slash in general or porn
>in general. It's the narrow sub set of fan fiction
>featuring minors of the same sex engaged in sexual
>activity that are the ones where confusion is from.
>Bleh.

Actually, Michela, I think the problem may be the "same sex" appearing in the paragraph above. I think the same reasonable standard can be applied to minors of opposite sexes. I think that as long as your position is balanced across the board wrt het/slash pairings, I wouldn't have any problem with it.

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