Re: manifest destiny -- Imperial Canada

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Date Posted: 10:40:48 02/11/02 Mon
Author: David Ryszard Rydygier
Subject: Re: manifest destiny
In reply to: shawn meades 's message, "Re: manifest destiny" on 17:53:37 12/27/01 Thu

Could it perhaps be destiny that Kalaalit Nunaat and Alaska eventually merge with Canada? I do not mean manifest destiny, but the natural outcome of a union of the Inuit peoples. The three geographic areas, the third being the north of Canada, are home to primarily one nation, and Canada is its closest neighbour. The United States and Denmark are a considerable distance from either of their dominions. Who better to help with transportation and shipping of goods than Canadians with their nearby airports and seaports? What about providing essential services? -- especially education and medical care. It would be of great advantage to the peoples of Nunavut and the west coast of Greenland to share medical specialists and hospitals. Imagine the savings if approximately 80,000 people could share facilities, and be airlifted to them when in need. Presently there are two entirely separate systems operating. Furthermore the people of Kalaalit Nunaat have no access to Canadian commercial facilities. They are forced to go to Denmark to shop, rather than have quick access to Halifax, St. John's or Montreal. No airline or shipping company connects our two countries now. A lot of lost revenue for Canadian retailers and higher prices for the people of Kalaalit Nunat.
As far as representation in Confederation goes, the number of seats in Parliament is important. Given the fact that PEI has four MP's since Confederation, while Toronto ridings of equal population have one, it would not be outrageous to offer Kalaalit Nunat two seats and Nunavut one -- or even three and two given the immense geography of the area (aprroximately 20% of the total land mass.) The fact is that PEI was bribed into Confederation with the offer of "estra" MP's so that they would not be swamped by the larger provinces.
Other than subsidies, and co-operation with their close neighbours, the great benefit to the people of Kalaalit Nunaat is that they would be able to learn English or French as a second language. This would be far more advantageous in the modern world expecially to finding a place commercially and economically. Presently the Danish-managed education system is teaching them Danish as a second to their own Greenlandic, and then English is taken on by very few as a third language. What is the advantage of Danish when you can barely speak with 10 million people (granting the fact than Norwegian is a dialect of Danish) in the entire world.
Alaska might take a bit longer, while Inuit nationalism and unity develops, but is now not the time to make the merger with Kalaalit Nunaat a political issue?
This would mean a start to discussions with Denmark on the desirability and feasability of a transfer of their responsibilities to the people of the island (the world's biggest).
The people of Kalaalit Nunat will benefit from:
1) The autonomy of a provincial government and greater political rights
2) Economic and commercial contacts, and access to vast new markets
3) Linguistic benefits (education in two of the world's major languages
4) Better co-ordination of subsidised transportation (distances will never allow the operation of independent transportation companies)
5) New medical, education, and retail sales facilities, much closer than Copenhagen (note the proximity of St. John's and Ottawa).
Is it too much to hope for that one of Canada's major political parties take up the cause. We all have a lot to gain, and it will be a great boost to Inuit pride. Presently it is difficult, because of the extremely small and thinly spread-out population, for the territory of Nunavut and the autonomous state of Kalaalit Nunat to forge their destinies separately. An interesting historic fact is that the Inuit of northern Kalaalit Nunat are Canadians from Nunavut who crossed over the frozen sea just over a hundred years ago.
Once the politicians of Canada can decide on the issue, the people of Kalaalit Nunaat can seriously assess the value of their continuing connections with Denmark. It's time for an eleventh province in order to consolidate our northern territories.
Canada and K.N., it's time to forge your common destiny!
-------------------------------------
>
>> Perhaps adding the new provinces mentioned in
>>previous postings would drown out Quebec's whining.
>>With more voices of people willing to be reasonable
>>suddenly in the picture, perhaps Quebec will have to
>>stop being such a thorn in Canada's collective side.
>
>Unfortunately, Qu�bec isn't just a tweenie upset they
>haven't reached puberty yet. It's FAR more
>complicated. It goes all the way back to the Plains
>of Abraham, it's existed since confederation, and a
>couple "add-ons" sadly won't fix it. Newfoundland
>voting to join confederation didn't do anything (It
>actually made things worse due to conflicts over the
>border of Labrador).
>
>>
>> Our proposal for Kalaalit Nunaat is to amalgamate it
>>with Nunavut. This way, the two together would qualify
>>to be a province. That being the case, it is in their
>>interest to join Canada. Even though currently
>>Kalaalit Nunaat is a 'self governing' territory of
>>Denmark, it is a very limited self government, nowhere
>>near the level of self government of a Canadian
>>province. They would profit greatly with Imperial
>>Canada's proposal. Being admitted as a full province,
>>they would not have to fear being neglected or
>ignored.
>
>That's rather naive, I think. Personally, I think
>that's even worse. Alone, Kalaalit Nunaat would
>qualify for at the most, two seats in the House of
>Commons (more likely just one), and either one, or two
>in the Senate- no more. The population of most
>Toronto ridings is over 100 000. The population of
>Nunavut currently is (elections Canada stats) 24 730,
>while the population of Kalaalit Nunaat (July 2001
>est.) is 56 352. Together, they would have a
>population of aproximately 81 082. That would mean
>that at the ABSOLUTE most, they would have
>collectively 3 seats in the HoC (possibly even just
>one), and most likely 2 in the Senate (again, possibly
>even just one, when you consider that Newfoundland has
>5 seats, and a population of around 500000). Also,
>currently, Kalaalit Nunaat has 2 seats in the Danish
>Folketing out of 179, whereas they would probably have
>two seats in the House of Commons (or maybe even just
>one) out of 301 (302-303 after they join)- that is a
>drastic decrease in representation.
>
>> It would not have to be done on a national level.
>>Inuit is spoken in Nunavut and government there
>>provides services in Inuit there. It is a regional
>>language, not used on a national level. The same could
>>be the case with Icelandic.
>
>True, but Nunavut was not independent before it came
>into being in 1999- It was part of the Northwest
>Territories. Nunavut also has a population of 24 000.
> The citizens of Kalaalit Nunaat and Iceland should
>have access to the documents of their federal
>governments in their own languages. Anyway, I don't
>think this is a very big issue since all that's needed
>is staff to translate hansard and other documents into
>Icelandic, and Inuktitut (and other Inuit languages).
>It wouldn't be necesary to make the languages official
>to the degree that French is since French is found in
>every corner of the country, whereas Icelandic and
>Inuktitut are not.
>>>
>
>> You are correct with Alaska. As was said in a
>>previous message, their delegation to Parliament in
>>Ottawa would be seven times as many people as they
>>send to Washington, DC. However, I can't agree with
>>your statement about Kalaalit Nunaat, quite the
>>contrary, they stand to gain quite a bit. They have
>>only two people representing them in Copenhagen.
>>Amalgamated with Nunavut, they would have four people
>>representinig their new province in Ottawa
>
>No, they would have at the most 3- 1 of which would be
>Nunavut, so really they'd have at the most 2. Who
>knows, they might even have to SHARE ONE seat with
>Nunavut!!!! And this is out of 301, as opposed to the
>Danish 179. Again, this is a drastic decrease in
>representation.
>
>. Plus they
>>would also be eligable to have Senators as well. Right
>>off hand, I don't know how many, but they would have
>>some Senators for sure.
>
>One or two- no more. And that doesn't mean more
>representation since Denmark has no upper house of
>parliament.
>>
>>
>> Sovereignty association would not be necessary, I am
>>sure the new provinces would be quite happy with being
>>normal provinces. I disagree about your fear of things
>>being made more complicated with Quebec. I belive that
>>Quebec would have to get the message and, quit their
>>whining!
>
>I think you're kidding yourself. Qu�bec didn't "shut
>up" when Newfoundland joined confederation- nor when
>BC, PEI, Red River Colony, or the North West
>Territories (Now Nunavut, NWT, Yukon, Alberta, Sask.,
>and much of present day BC abd Ontario) jopined
>confederation. It's been done, and it didn't stop, or
>slow down anything.
>
>Personally, when I went to Qu�bec, I actually came
>back sympathetic to the sovereigntists/separatists-
>it's a feeling you can't explain- But if I were
>presently in Qu�bec, I would sooner vote Bloc
>Qu�becois then I would for our current oligarchic
>government (Liberals)- or their blue photocopies in
>opposition, the Progressive conservatives. I find it
>deeply offensive that you would equate the concerns of
>Qu�becers with "whining"- Have you ever been to
>Qu�bec? Do you speak French?
>
>Also, Iceland elects its head of state- would they
>REALLY be willing to give that up to become a province
>of a country that while it would have its own head of
>state, it would still be a king/Queen? And Iceland
>would lose A LOT of sovereignty if it joined Canada-
>National defence, foreign affairs and international
>trade, banking system, criminal law, marriage and
>divorce, postal services, plus distribution of wealth,
>and due to recent federal power grabs, much of health
>and other services. Iceland being an island, all
>offshore resources would be owned by the federal
>government- would they REALLY want to become a
>province? Sovereignty association would probably be
>the only way to convince Iceland to join confederation.
>>
>>
>> As for Saint Pierre and Miquelon, that is a problem
>>that will solve itself. The section of the French
>>constitution to which you are referring speaks only of
>>France itself. That same constitution also proivides
>>the option of independence for extra-territorial
>>French possessions. If a French territory can be given
>>independence, surely it can be sold to another
>>country, can it not? France got the message when the
>>World Court ruled in Canada's favour in the fishing
>>dispute over the Gulf of Saint Lawrence, thus
>>rendering Saint Pierre and Miquelon economically
>>worthless to France. France dosen't even want them
>>anymore. As for France making them an overseas
>>department, they were for a while, but when that
>>proved to be way to expensive for France to handle,
>>they redesignated them as a 'territorial collective'
>>whatever that is supposed to mean. I am sure that for
>>the right amount of money, France would gladly sell
>>them to Canada. If any islanders didn't want to stay,
>>I suppose Canada could agre to also pay for their
>>relocation expenses as part of the deal. Since there
>>are only 6,500 islanders there, that would not be too
>>expensive. A small price to pay really, when you
>>consider that they would be out of our faces for good.
>>No more drunken Frenchmen sailing around in Canadian
>>waters to give hte Canadian Coast Guard any
>headaches.
>
>Asides from the comment about "drunken Frenchmen" (
>>:( which has actually never been a problem, BTW),
>okay. But in light of recent oil and gas exploration
>in the region, I don't think France will be quite as
>ready to cash out just when the jackpot starts to
>grow. Also, SP&M has its own assembly (Conseil
>G�n�ral- 19 seats), and their small population would
>prevent them from even having one seat (in general) in
>the House of Commons and Senate. I'm not sure they'd
>want to give that up.
>>
>> We dont propose to impose our will on anybody, so no
>>need to take offense.
>>
>> Many thanks for your enlightening comments. We hope
>>to see more postings from you soon,
>> Ronald Dykeman
>> Founder of the Imperial Canada Association
>
>Okay, that's nice to know :) To tidy up my
>suggestions a bit, I'll sum everything up:
>
>Even though I think the only regions that would ever
>join Canada out of those listed would be Angle Inlet,
>I have a few suggestions for the rest;
>
>-You should suggest sovereignty association for
>Iceland.
>-Guaranteed provincehood for Kalaalit Nunaat (outside
>of Nunavut).
>-St. Pierre & Miquelon should become a territory. If
>not, it should become part of Qu�bec with a guaranteed
>seat in L'Assembl� Nationale. They should also have a
>guaranteed seat in the House of Commons and Senate.
>-Angle Inlet should become party of Manitoba (It just
>makes more sense, despite making the border "squigly").
>-Alaska should have guaranteed provincehood.
>-You should promise to reform the Senate, and change
>the electoral process by which the House of Commons is
>chosen.
>
>I think all these suggestions would sweeten the pot
>for those land which you would like to see join
>Canada- Though I'm just a bit cynical, as ever ;)
>
>Your site is very interesting, keep it up :)

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Re: manifest destiny -- AHMET SEZER, 10:07:31 12/31/04 Fri

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