Create a New Forum Admin Login Member Login Contribute to Voyager Search VoyForums Help Desk VoyForums Exchange VoyForums Directory/Categories VoyForums Homepage VoyForums News FAQ - Frequently Asked Questions

[ Show ]

Support VoyForums

[ Shrink ]

VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, [2] ]

Subject: Re: Here is his reply to me: A Damn good reply! 'O) Author: AB Randy Kemp [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: 03:34:11 01/09/04 Fri In reply to: MarkM 's message, "Here is his reply to me: A Damn good reply! 'O)" on 10:43:41 01/07/04 Wed Mark: OK. Let me give you a few words of advice. Your friend is playing the skeptic. And he will beat you every time – since you are on the defensive. Reverse this by asking him if he believes in an absolute or relative philosophical truth – especially where morals and ethics are concerned. Then keep questioning his position. Review the Christian discussion on relativism at http://www.carm.org/relativism.htm Randy [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Here is his reply to me: A Damn good reply! 'O) Author: AB Randy Kemp [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 10:02:03 01/09/04 Fri Hello Mark: Here's some other feedback I got from another Christian friend. Randy --------------------------------------------------------- Hello Randy, I'm not sure if I've ever commented on this subject here before but I think arguing with a sceptic or atheist is hopeless. Even when you point out to them that their position is in itself a leap of faith they will be either clueless or deny it outright. The sceptic could say there is no philosophical or moral truth. Period. The thoroughgoing sceptic could say that we create all meaning, that's it's all mind-dependent. Atheism is a complicated mind set. Atheists are usually dogmatists for a variety of reasons stemming from the problem of bad things happening to good people or the inability to see beyond appearances. Some people, either from environmental factors, family upbringing, or genetic predisposition, are unable to relate to anything metaphorical, allegorical, symbolic or transcendental. The atheist is often somewhere outside this range of this kind of awareness. Cf. the positivists of the early twentieth century. But for what I would call the artistic atheist, who seems to have some sense of the above, there is the dogmatic denial that some all-powerful, all-good, supreme being would allow such nasty things to happen to good people. Explanations of theodicy fall flat. There is a popular talk-show host in the Bay Area who is fond of saying, "The question of God is unimportant..." For him, the existence or non-existence of God makes no difference one way or the other; it doesn't change anything. This is probably the most disbelieving statement I've ever heard anyone make. You would think whatever would settle the question of ultimate truth or the meaning of life would be an important question - but not to this man. I have years of graduate study behind me and I simply am speechless in the face of such an attitude. Daniel [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Here is his reply to me: A Damn good reply! 'O) Author: AB Randy Kemp [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 10:06:11 01/09/04 Fri Mark: Matt Slick, who attended seminary and embraces protestant reformed theology, has a section on the christian response to atheism at http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Randy [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Here is his reply to me: A Damn good reply! 'O) Author: Rev. Darwin [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 23:00:38 01/18/04 Sun I think Randy hit it on the head,He is playing the poor sceptic,also Mark when anyone start with " to me" or " you say" is simply asking a warped question there is no answer.The whole question is flawd. See yah Darwin [ Post a Reply to This Message ]