Supporters always overrate their own.
Grundy, Moore, Fasolo and Reid as first tier? Dreamin'. Not close. Maybe one day. Maybe not.
Both lists have players with "potential". Means jack shit. Who's coming through at Tigerland? Rioli, CEllis (not BEllis), Lennon, Markov - some may make it, some won't.
You can have Vickery, by the way.
Honestly, Richmond and collingwood are where they should be on the ladder based on talent available. Both have players injured and horribly out of form. The coaching may be a factor, but that suggests you rate Buckley substantially lower than Hardwick? Hardwick a supercoach? Is that what you're suggesting?
Prime real estate - possibly - but being the worst house on a good street doesn't necessarily translate to guaranteed market increase in the short term. Not without bulldozing shit or a major reno.
I'm extremely disappointed with how Richmond is traveling this year. But it is still much the same list as the one that has made the eight three years in a row (and failed horribly in finals). That shit is psychology, not ability.