[ Show ]
Support VoyForums
[ Shrink ]
VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 15:02:24 11/15/08 Sat
Author: Rodger Tutt (http://www.tentmaker.org)
Subject: The world's most evil belief & the most important issue

The world’s most evil beliefs, and the most important issue

The eternal torment theology of the Arminian Christian relies on so-called “free will” and luck.

The god that Arminian Christian eternal tormentors profess to love says to his fallen creatures

“Unless you are lucky enough to find out about my son during this lifetime, and even if you are that lucky, if you don’t have the good sense to cooperate with my son properly before you die, then I am going to raise you from the dead and I will sustain you alive in an inescapable state of eternal torment forever.”

The eternal torment theology of the Calvinist Christian relies on God alone, not “free will” at all. It is summed up by the word TULIP: Total depravity, Unconditional election, Limited atonement, Irresistible grace, and the Perseverance of the elect.

The god that Calvinistic Christian eternal tormentors profess to love says to his fallen creatures

"I created most of you for the purpose of torturing you forever. However, I am going to choose a few of you undeserving ones to go to heaven where you will be happy forever." John Calvin said there will be infants a span long in hell because they were not among the elect. (A span is the distance between the tip of the thumb to the tip of the little finger.)

And then both the Arminian and Calvinistic eternal tormentors say that the feelings that they have for this god of theirs is “love.”

Without God’s sustaining power everyone would cease to exist. So if anyone were to suffer forever, our all-powerful God (Who is Love in essence, not just loving) would be fully 100% responsible for it. We would have to conclude that any definition of the manifestation of “love-in-essence” includes eternally sustaining people alive in an inescapable state of suffering.

What a travesty; what a revolting definition of love it is that God, Who is love personified, would grant any creature a will so strong that they can choose themselves into an irreversible state of never ending suffering (Arminian) or deserve to suffer forever just by being born into the human race (Calvinist)!!

Thank God the Bible does not teach such insane ideas!
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.godfire.net/eby/saviour_of_the_world.html">http://www.godfire.net/eby/saviour_of_the_world.html</a>
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.sigler.org/slagle/absolute.htm">http://www.sigler.org/slagle/absolute.htm</a>
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm">http://richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm</a>

Copy and paste one of the following titles into Google

Anyone is welcome to believe anything they want to.

I'm just so glad I learned about the following information.
It enabled me to recover from a twelve year nervous breakdown 1966-78.
I'm 70 now.
I, and many others with whom I have become acquainted, simply could not successfully emotionally cope with the idea that God would let anyone suffer forever. Here is the testimony of one such person who went insane for the same reasons I did.
Copy and paste the following title into Google
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.tentmaker.org/books/Absolute-Assurance-in-Jesus-Christ.html">http://www.tentmaker.org/books/Absolute-Assurance-in-Jesus-Christ.html</a>
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.sigler.org/slagle/absolute.htm">http://www.sigler.org/slagle/absolute.htm</a>

Eternal Torment Calvinism, Eternal Torment Arminianism, Annihilation, or Christian Biblical Universalism.

Which one of the four is the truth?

This debate nearly always ends with the words, "My Greek scholars are more reliable
than your Greek scholars," and the result is a stalemate.

If readers think it glorifies God more to believe that He is going to let some of His
creatures suffer forever or annihilate them, then they should keep believing that.
But if they think it glorifies God more to eventually meet everyone on the level of their
greatest and deepest need, which is a change in their stubborn will, then I would like
them to know that that is exactly what the Bible teaches that God is like.


The findings of Greek scholar Louis Abbott and the other Greek scholars quoted in
chapters three and twelve of his online book IMHO renders all other arguments irrelevant.

IMHO these findings effectively close the case on the arguments that eternal tormentors try so hard to uphold. But of course one has to actually read them to see what I mean.

Just Google up AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS and enjoy, or click on
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.tentmaker.org/books/asw/index.html">http://www.tentmaker.org/books/asw/index.html</a>
The following chapter links in blue probably may be activated on this post.
• About the Author
• Dedication
• Forward
• Chapter1 - Definitions of Aion, Aionios
• Chapter2 - Usages of Aion
• Chapter3 - Opinion of the Scholars
• Chapter4 - Apparent Contradictions
• Chapter5 - "Forever and Ever" - A Poor Translation
• Chapter6 - What Saith The Translations?
• Chapter7 - Eonian Means What? - A Search For Truth
• Chapter8 - Greek Tools
• Chapter9 - Examples in Greek Literature
• Chapter10 - Bibles Without "Everlasting Punishment"
• Chapter11 - Verses "Proving" Punishment Will be Everlasting
• Chapter12 - Scholars Acknowledge Restitution of All
• Chapter13 - Punishment? Yes - Everlasting? No
• Chapter14 - A Long, But Not Eternal Visit To "Hell"
• Chapter15 - The "Chosen," Not "I have chosen"
• Chapter16 - Clearing Things Up
• Chapter17 - The Complete Revelation
• Appendix 1 - Commentary of Previous Presentation
• Appendix 2 - Do You Believe ALL in the Bible?
• Appendix 3 - Reconciliation Scriptures
• Appendix 4 - What Pleases the Father?
• Appendix 5 - What if we are Wrong?
• Christian Biblical Universalism versus Annihilation <a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.tentmaker.org/books/EternalDeath.html">http://www.tentmaker.org/books/EternalDeath.html</a>
• Bible Threatenings Explained <a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.tentmaker.org/books/BibleThreateningsExplained.html">http://www.tentmaker.org/books/BibleThreateningsExplained.html</a>
• Universal Salvation University <a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm">http://richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm</a>

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Post a message:
This forum requires an account to post.
[ Create Account ]
[ Login ]
[ Contact Forum Admin ]

Forum timezone: GMT-8
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.