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Date Posted: 08:15:00 06/16/04 Wed
Author: colgate13
Subject: OK...
In reply to:
NTKHC64
's message, "New Jersey Reception" on 22:15:31 06/15/04 Tue
" He stated to a small group after the main presentation that the Holy Cross name draws far more recognition than other PL schools "
Far more? He really thinks that? And, more importantly, you're buying that?
I could argue all day long that Colgate, Fordham or Lehigh have more name recognition. I can't say that I'd be right, but I know I'd be wrong to say "far more". We're all small Northeastern schools with generally the same profile. To think that Holy Cross somehow stands head and shoulders above the rest of the PL is crap. Put down the crack pipe Gilmore. If you're saying it to stroke the egos of alums, you're starting off a relationships by blowing hot air up you know where and when you don't produce, look out.
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Re: Colgate13 -- HC1843, 08:34:23 06/16/04 Wed
In with the good, out with the bad...
serenity now...serenity now...
relax, Gilmore was talking to alum and did no wrong. There is also potentially the thought that at some level HC football is known better nationally b/c of how it ran the table in the 80's and early 90's, when it had scholarships.
Chill man...the world is still right.
Cheers.
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oh, I'm relaxed -- colgate13, 09:26:46 06/16/04 Wed
and I know he's stroking alums egos. However if your alums have a pulse they should see right through it. The only name recognition HC football would have right now isn't because of the past success but of the more recent futility. Your recruits (and all of the PL for that matter) aren't being sold on successes that were before many of them were born. I'll bow out of the conversation now, but I will close by saying I'd be wondering a little about my coach if I was supporting HC. Telling alums what they want to hear will only get you so far.
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You don't sound relaxed -- Zipp, 10:38:47 06/16/04 Wed
I guess its a little like Red Aurbach saying that the Celtics have better "recogition" than do, say the Dallas Mavericks. Is it true? I'd say yes. Is it based on past success? Definately. Is it a selling point? if you believe in tradition, then yes. Certainly doesn't mean that they're currently better.
Do you think the coaches at Notre Dame are selling their recruits a bill of goods when they tout ND's tradition? (which lately is based solely on past performances) Do you think the ND recruit or coach is short changed because they chose ND based on tradition instead of Miami or Ohio State because they've had winning years lately?
I guess it's a matter of perspective; and it's clear what your's is.
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Re: Biddle said much the same thing in '95... -- Go...'gate, 21:04:06 06/16/04 Wed
after Colgate went 0-11 and many believed the program would not be competitive again.
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Re: OK... -- hccg, 14:53:31 06/17/04 Thu
Coach Gilmore wasn't quoted correctly above. He was saying that HC's name ACADEMICALLY carries more weight nationally than the other schools in the PATRIOT League. He also said that a lot of people still remember the past success of football at HC. He has recruited in the Ivy / Patriot League for a long time. I don't think he was trying to stroke the alums. He was stating what he has observed over the years as well as his recent recruiting trips around the country, that's all. If that is how the high school coaches feel about HC, that's a good thing. You may not feel the same way but many people out there have a lot of respect for HC and they do remember the successful teams in the 80's and early 90's.
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HC academics,Gilmore is way off? -- Gate Raider, 23:51:03 06/18/04 Fri
Where the heck did he get that from. HC is not a heavy weight in academics in the PL. Check the figures for the last several years. Your trend in downward.
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Re: OK... -- Raider Redhead, 22:37:26 06/17/04 Thu
In comparison to other PL schools, and when considering all sports, I believe that HC does indeed have strong name recognition...not only in New England but also outside the friendly confines of the Northeast states.
Only Georgetown and Fordham might have more.
Outside the Northeast, I would venture to guess that BU, CU, LC, and LU are not household names to the average sports fan. At least that's my perception after living 30 years in the Midwest.
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Re: OK... -- dadominate, 00:54:37 06/18/04 Fri
as usual, raider readhead is right on the money. nice to see some objective commentary about this topic!
i would say that up until the HC/Kentucky NCAA tournament game, HC had very little name recognition here in Baltimore as well. that has changed, especially after the kansas game, and if i wear a holy cross shirt to the gym or to play ball in around here i'll generally get some kind of comment about it. it's amazing what a couple competitive games in the NCAA tournament will do for a school's notoriety with the general public.
based on that, in my eyes increasing the league's hoops standing is clearly the best way to make Colgate, Lehigh, Lafayette and Bucknell household names.
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Hoops definitely spreads the word -- Raider Redhead, 11:46:06 06/18/04 Fri
A long, long, long time ago during my college days, one of my roommates often said that the easiest way to elevate a school's athletic reputation is through basketball success.
He contended that it only takes a couple of real good hoops recruits to get a program off and running, and that the cost of landing those recruits is far less expensive than trying to develop a successful team and reputation in other sports (such as football).
Furthermore, when a small school with a good basketball program plays in the NCAA Tournament, gets paid for doing so, and receives terrific national television exposure, it can perpetuate continued success and even helps other sports.
With HC's rich basketball heritage and fairly recent successes, I can understand why many Saders would like to take the next step up in competition. But, it's unfortunate that such a move could mean HC abandons the PL.
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