The goal -- Final End

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Date Posted: 07:00:12 06/16/02 Sun
Author: Neuminas
Subject: The goal
In reply to: PAUL. 's message, "Reread the last message," on 19:09:08 06/15/02 Sat

Here's where I see this debate got derailed:
Drummond is looking for anything which is not inherently perfect as evidence for the fact that God's goal was not perfection. (Or maybe it's evidence for the fact that Paul's position is inconsistent.)
Paul is only ready to allow something which has inherent imperection to count for this sort-of evidence.
Free-will occupies a middle ground, here. I think that what this debate might hinge on is whether God ends up baring responsibility for man's abuses of free will.

I think that God's goal was for man to perfect himself. God already had perfection for himself. But for "his" creations to attain perfection... that would be something novel and new.
And thus was the universe created, a play ground, or a spiritual gym, choose your metaphor. But the universe we observe seems to be much more closely aligned with a place that is meant to grow us out of being spoiled and self-indulgent, a place meant to challenge us into strength and wisdom.

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Replies:

I just think... -- Drummond, 00:04:26 06/18/02 Tue
- Nothing imperfect comes from God, -- PAUL., 16:02:54 06/18/02 Tue
  - The Bible says everything comes from God (NT) -- Drummond, 08:55:16 06/19/02 Wed