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Subject: Lafayette & This League Author: Rumor [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: 22:34:04 01/18/06 Wed Not a ton of disrespect towards the Leopards intended....but they looked like a D3 school out there tonight trying to solve Bucknell's defense. This league is a joke. 5 of the 8 teams are aweful....repeat...AWEFUL. It will come down to Bucknell, Lehigh, and HC....quite frankly Lehigh hasn't done anything impressive either this year. As expected, it will be a two horse race to the end. Expect Bucknell to host HC in the PL championship game....and that game will decide it. What a joke. [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: BUFan [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 22:47:54 01/18/06 Wed Well, the big thing with Lafayette is that they need scholarships. Until they get them, they will slowly fall further and further below the rest of the teams in the league. Army and Navy may always have recruiting difficulties because of the service requirement, but Lafayette will still fall below them without scholarships. That being said, for whatever reason, BU has had Lafayette's number lately. Bucknell has historically struggled against teams like Colgate and Lehigh, while Lafayette does not get blown away by them. Still, I don't see a home game being decided by less than 15 the rest of the year (maybe with the exception of the PL championship if HC and BU make it and it is at BU). [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: jck45 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 22:53:43 01/18/06 Wed Reminded me a little too much of the Haverford game.... I too would like to see more depth in this league, but I just don't see it happening anytime soon. Franlky, our league might become Gonzaga-esque Bucknell dominated for some years to come (I don't want to hear any 'when McNaughton goes over run is over' nonsense - it's just not true). Scattered thoughts: We will not lose a PL game this year. HC no longer has a talent edge and they will be only fighting for second this year and for the foreseeable future. The only team we're definately playing three times this year is Army. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: BUFan [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 22:58:30 01/18/06 Wed Playing in Worcester will still be hard. At Lehigh will be no cake walk either. Regarding McNaughton, he was a non-factor tonight, and it was still a dominating BU win. Losing Badmus too will hurt, but BU will be fine. Vegotsky will have a great career, and it sounds like BU's recruiting class is the cream of the crop in the league. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: eric... [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 08:06:24 01/19/06 Thu im not even sure where to begin... there will be more depth in this league starting... next year. i really dont want to go through it all, but bucknell is losing more (in bettencourt and lee) than any other pl team. there is still NO reason to assume we are going to dominate the pl for years go come. were 4-0. wonderful. but we struggled against american last week, the same american that very nearly lost to army last night. we will lose our edge when mcnaughton is done. this isnt to say we cant keep winning the league. obviously, its too early to tell. but he is a huge advantage. drawing a double team almost every time he touches the ball occasionally opens up a shot, you know. will we lose a pl game this year? if a pl team is ever going to go undefeated, this is the season. so honestly, yes, i think they will go 14-0. but as was pointed out, weve still got two pretty good road tests on our schedule. holy cross has indeed lost some of its talent edge. but this is the same school that did much better than us in the patriot league last season. and if it werent for a complete lack of bench play, id be worried about them going 13-1 again. thomas-hamilton-simmons, when healthy, IS the best backcourt trio in the league. and unlike us, two thirds of theirs is returning. theyll be very good next year. you dont have to worry about that. will bucknell be fine? yes, i think we now have the momentum to compete for a patriot league title every year for the next several. our recruiting class is indeed looking very good. it probably has the most upside of any in the league. but both lehigh and holy cross are also bringing in excellent classes. depending on who you ask, hc's andrew keister or lehighs marquis hall is the top pl recruit. navy is also bringing in a solid class. armys is better, as well. right now our team is clearly the best in the league. thats wonderful. but lets actually win a regular season title... heck, maybe two or three in a row... before we start belittling our opponents in this way. even then, id hope we could win with a little more class. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: VoB [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 11:15:12 01/19/06 Thu One thing that must be noted.....Thomas-Hamilton-Simmons...may be the best STARTING backcourt.....although I think Lee-Bettencourt-Badmus....is at least as talented, but you can't give HC that title because they don't have the best backcourt in total. Who on HC matches Vegotsky and Griffen? At the end of the game this past Saturday...HC had nothing left in the tank...NOTHING...because they are forced to play with 3 starters. Their frontcourt is an embarassment and they have nobody off the bench. You can't win in the long run with 3 players. Bucknell has 8 or 9 kids who can all play quality minutes. That is easily what seperates them from anyone else in the league. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: bison137 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 12:47:47 01/19/06 Thu It is clear that HC has no bench. No question. However, don't forget that guard Pat Doherty was one of the top frosh in the league last year, at least at the Griffin level. As a matter of fact, there was a group on the HC board last year who argued that Doherty should be starting ahead of Torey Thomas, and he did start 9 games at the point while Thomas came off the bench. Unfortunately for HC, Doherty is out for the year with a foot injury and thus their backcourt depth is non-existent. As for frontcourt depth, they had two players, who may have been pretty good prospects, transfer out for varying personal reasons. I forget the names but I'm sure some HC fan knows them. I'm not sure how good they would have been, but it does help account for the big-time lack of depth. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: eric... [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 22:58:35 01/18/06 Wed remove bucknell and this league is about as strong at it was last year. if youll remember, we lost four games against those same 'aweful' opponents last season. were a much better team than lafayette, no doubt. but lets not let our heads get bigger than they ought to be. fourteen more games. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: bison137 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 11:05:48 01/19/06 Thu Random thoughts on the above: I agree 100% with Eric's post. Both Lehigh and HC have recruiting classes that could turn out to be better than ours for next year. I hope not, but only time will tell. BTW, Lehigh's Paul Bayer could turn out to be a steal, in addition to the others Eric mentioned. It is far from a lock that BU will go through the league undefeated. I would put the odds at about 30%. Road games at HC and Lehigh are both tough, and BU was lucky to win at Colgate last year, which for some reason is always a tough place to play. The Chones twins could make Colgate into a respectable team as they knock the rust off their game. Navy is definitely on the upswing with a good recruiter in Billy Lange and a team that is almost all frosh and sophs. And once Lafayette gets scholarships (which many think will be approved by their BOT in April), they will get into the upper echelon quickly since Fran is a very good coach. I agree 100% that BU will lose the most through graduation. We may will the league but it will be a very tough fight next year since most teams will have gotten better as we get a bit weaker. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: jck45 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 11:35:06 01/19/06 Thu Holy Cross is losing KHAM. Frankly, when you only have three guys that can put points on the board, you can't really afford to lose anybody. My point is we have such quality depth that I see us in such a better position than HC going forward. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: bison137 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 13:05:28 01/19/06 Thu Loss of KHam will be partially offset by the return of Pat Doherty, who is a good player. Thus HC loses KHam and Hyland and regains Doherty. Bucknell loses Lee, Bettencourt, and Viaer-McClymont and does not regain anyone unless Clark can come back. On a net basis, I think these roster changes favor HC. If Griffin and Brown move into the starting lineup, the Bison bench will be Vegotsky plus question marks (again assuming no Clark). For HC, Doherty and Clifford likely will move into the starting lineup, leaving Dixon and Cunningham as the first two off the bench. Here, HC may have a bit of an edge off the bench depending on the development of other players. More important for both teams will be how this year's frosh and next year's frosh develop. I think Dixon and Cunningham will help HC next year. The verdict is very much out on Linthicum and Castleberry. (We already know that Vander Baan and Vegotsky will each contribute.) As for next year's frosh, it is way too early to tell but it looks pretty even at this point. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: sader1970 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 14:50:09 01/19/06 Thu 137, the players whose names you couldn't remember were Josh Kramer and Joe Young. Either would have helped HC tremendously at the 4 position and given more depth in the front court. We are struggling at the 5, no doubt, but Tim Clifford played very well against BC and Craig Smith, Williams, Oates, etc. He showed flashes of the promise that he showed as a freshman. You have to remember, Tim is only a sophomore. The days are gone when we had Pat Whearty as a dominating center and in a pinch had to go with 6' 11" Nate Lufkin but also had Tim Szatko helping at forward. As for next year's freshman, who really knows how some high school kid is going to do at the D-I level? I agree with your posters that we shouldn't be reading incoming players press clippings. Rather, time will tell. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: Bison Kid [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 15:16:18 01/19/06 Thu Hey, Can someone point me to information on the Bison's incoming 2006-2007 recruiting class? We need a few big men to take the heat off of Griffen and Vegotsky. Also, it was nice to see Bettencourt deliver a strong performance last night. He's been in a slump. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: Dan [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 15:31:19 01/19/06 Thu this year's incoming class consists of the following: Name Pos Ht Wt Hometown Pat Behan SF 6-7 190 - Middleburg, VA Zach Evans SF 6-6 185 - West Hills, CA Stephen Tyree PG 6-3 185 - Houston, TX I you look at the other schools who recruited these guys, even to some degree, you'll see we've come along way since Bryan Bailey.....(whom Feinstein pointed out was a walk-on) [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: bison137 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 15:48:00 01/19/06 Thu Some scouting services have Behan as tall as 6'8" and for the Bison he may well be a PF, albeit one with long shooting range. Although the tallest of the three recruits he definitely is the best outside shooter of the three, although perhaps the least athletic. His Notre Dame team plays a pretty strong independent schedule in the Virginia area Tyree, although often playing PG for Strake Jesuit, could also play the 2 and the 3 for the Bison. He leads his team in rebounding and supposedly has long arms and is very athletic. If he could improve his shot a bit, he could be a Charles Lee type of small forward. Plays against good competition in the Houston area. Evans is supposedly a good rebounder and good defender - also a good athlete. Some question about his shooting touch at present. Plays against very strong competition in the Los Angeles area. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: bison137 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 15:42:08 01/19/06 Thu If you scroll down the page, you'll find a bunch of threads with info on Zach Evans and Stephen Tyree. As I've pointed out in several of those, the caliber of competition being played by the three recruits (especially Evans) is well above that played against by many recruits of the past. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: HC1843 [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 17:13:14 01/19/06 Thu Interesting points of view on both sides. I view next year as Bucknell and HC being a push talent-wise....and this could tilt in HC's favor if Tim Clifford builds on his BC performance to become the type of center we all hope he can become. Further, while Vegotsky promises to be a big contributor for the Bison going forward, AVB is gaining huge experience this year and both Colin Cunningham and Lawrence Dixon are similarly getting invaluable playing time that in other years would not happen at least until their sophomore year. KHam will undoubtedly be a huge loss, but assuming Doherty comes back at 100% and Simmons can cure his body cramping issues, then KHam's graduation is at least partially mitigated. As to the incoming class, God only knows how 2 or 3 stars will translate from a recruiting service into actual PL D-I contributions. That said, it seems that HC's incoming class is arguably a notch above our current frosh class. However, look for Bucknell to land an excellent class in next year's recruiting wars (wow, who ever thought that could seriously be said at the PL level, the times they are a changing). Long-story short, I see the familiar faces (HC, Bucknell, Lehigh and American) making next year's tourney run a very fun one. I do not agree with jck45's position that HC is still chasing Bucknell next year...as I think Bucknell's graduation and HC developing players make it a toss up. THE key question for Bucknell comes in 2 years, "Who replaces McNaughton?" Cheers. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: Hoop Time [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 19:01:13 01/19/06 Thu The interesting thing about this whole discussion is how nobody has mentioned Darren Mastropaolo once. By far the most underrated player in the league. The kid is a defensive stud and has shown flashes of impressive quickness around the hoop. He doesn't look to score because that is not his role, but he could easily project into a 10 ppg guy in the future. Does that mean BU will dominate the league. NO, for all the reasons listed above. But the Bison, like Holy Cross, will be a threat as long as they have their current coach. I expect those two teams to keep contending, not because of who comes back or any recruits-- and believe me, betting on incoming freshmen will make the bookie rich in a hurry -- but because of Flannery and Willard. If O'Hanlon had scholarships, I would put Lafayette in the same class. No knock on the other coaches in the league, but those are clearly the three best. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Lafayette & This League Author: Pards Rule [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 07:04:17 11/20/06 Mon Agreed BUFan. We need scholarships! Also we are focusing on football. Hey good season at 6-5! I miss playing at the Bucknell Golf Club! [ Post a Reply to This Message ]