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Date Posted: 09:55:01 09/27/02 Fri
Author: Originally posted by Frank
Subject: Historically accurate - a question and test - Reposted

Date Posted: 08:04:05 09/27/02 Fri
Author: Frank
Subject: Historically accurate - a question and test

It's been almost a week since the schism (rhymes with jism) of the message board, and I've got a question and a test for all the readers/posters out there.

A co-worker of mine, to whom I had given some comps, told me he and his kids had a wonderful time at the faire. He mentioned that he was disappointed, however, that no one was speaking in dialect or using "thees" and "thous".

Now, before posts start declaring that everyone speaks in dialect, or that he was talking to a visiting rennie- not a cast member, or that this is all made up, that is not the point of this post.

An older post mentioned the electric piano at the "Royalty Sings and Dances" as incongruous to the period and should be covered as much as possible.

Now the real point of this all: KRF has been known as a "Fantasy Faire", rather than a "Renaissance Faire", by cast members themselves. This is not a negative. My opinion is that whether or not KRF is historically accurate or not is not as important as the fact that KRF is a place where you can indulge in the fantasy of being in "another place and another time".

So,
Question: Do you think KRF needs to be historically accurate or just as fun as possible, or a mix of both?

Test: Can this question be answered without resorting to the negativity which will cause this thread to be consigned to "The Negative Zone". (Which would make Stacy Ann Reed Richards, and the King of Hate would be Blastaar, for those who get the Fantastic Four reference).

There's your topic.
Discuss

Frank

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------------------------------------------------------------Replies:

[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Zaina, a patron, 08:26:42 09/27/02 Fri

I, for one, enjoy a mix of both. While it's fun and historically accurate to speak in dialect, there are some who may be uncomfortable with that or unsure, but enjoy the "dressing up" part. For that reason, I think it's great to just enjoy the faire and not have to worry about accents and such. Besides, when else (besides Hallowe'en) can adults get all costumed out and enjoy another place and time like we do at faire?!

--Zaina

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- aunti juju, 09:19:51 09/27/02 Fri

-He mentioned that he was disappointed, however, that no one was speaking in dialect or using "thees" and "thous".-

This may be a good thing!

Just a comment re: ye/you, thee/thou: Not hearing thee and thou may not be a bad thing. (Altho I am no expert, I do have a linguistics degree and seem to remember that addressing someone thee/thou would actually have been considered a condescension, so please find below a few comments from renspeak addresses on the web):

-"You" or "Ye" would be used on formal occasions, or when one is addressing one of higher social rank. Never call the Royals "Thee" or "thou".Thee" or "thou" are informal forms of address and would be used when speaking to a friend or one of equal or lower social standing.To choose between addressing someone as "you" or "thee/thou:"
Thee/Thou is the informal/friendly second person singular. Use it when speaking to a friend or someone of lower social status than yourself.
You is the formal, polite second person singular address. Use it when speaking to someone of higher status or to one who is not a close friend.
I have noticed many people at fest, such as shopkeepers, pull out what they believe is their most formal language when they are visited by the royalty. This often means they struggle along with "thee/thou" in addressing the King & Queen when they should properly be using "you" (the phrase "Thy Majesty" doesn't make sense, does it? It's "Your Majesty."). We don't criticize them-- they are putting forth an effort. But now you all know that its (grammatically!) easy to address the nobility--just use the modern "you" form."-

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[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Guy Todd, loves to goof around , BUT--, 08:27:19 09/27/02 Fri

...I for one would some day love to visit a real retentively-accurate recreation, where everyone is garbed as accurately as possible for the time period, kind of like Plymouth Plantation (hi Sybil!), speaking in dialect and not getting out of character. Just for the experience, mind you. I probably wouldn't want to work at such a place, but it would be fun to check out...

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Lady Fair, 08:34:33 09/27/02 Fri

I do not think a faire has to be historically accurate to be fun. Being able to declare that cell phones are magical devices and camera's have painting fairies inside them is a lot more patron friendly then accusing them of witchcraft and stoning them to death. There should, however be a consistancy. ie, If you are requiring a dialect at your faire, require it of everyone. If you are creating a fantasy village that isn't supposed to have electricty, hide the wires/speakers. etc.

There should also be truth in advertising. KRF is one of the few "Ren" Faires (Pastimes aside) I've heard of that does not use Renaissance in the name of the faire. I think that should give them some leniency as far as historical accuracy is concerned. Pastimes' KAF is a fantasy faire based on the Arthurian legends and you can tell that from the name. The Sterling Renaissance Faire does an historical faire with "real" historical characters and the name implies that. On the other hand, I've had some people who want to go to CTRF in garb ask me whether it's a renaissance faire or a medieval faire or a fantasy faire since it has renaissance in the title, but is doing a fantasy plot according to the website and has asked the actor to dress in medieval garb if they own it. (This is not anything against CTRF, who I love, it's just the easiest example at the moment)

So, I would say that - no faires don't have to be historical. But if they imply that they are historical, they should at least make an attempt at it.


So, StacyAnn, do we get to stay?

Michelle

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Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Frank, not being negative, 08:40:04 09/27/02 Fri

"Being able to declare that cell
phones are magical devices and camera's have painting fairies inside them is a lot more patron
friendly then accusing them of witchcraft and stoning them to death."

It may be more patron friendly, but I for one would find it much more fun. Sure, it would cut down on the photos, but who doesn't want to stone a cell-phone user to death?

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Just Browsing, 08:49:14 09/27/02 Fri

You mean like this
Historically Accurate ?<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.theonion.com/onion3119/renfair.html">http://www.theonion.com/onion3119/renfair.html</a>

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Gumby - adding to the Cell, 08:54:39 09/27/02 Fri

We could have some up and coming workaholic Yuppies who feel it's important to keep their cell phones on at a faire. Where they might have to take a call during a show when most people are out enjoying their lives outside of work.
I love it when people take their laptops, cell phone, pagers and blackberrys with them on vacation... Isn't vacation supposed to be when you get away from the office and work? Trust me, no one is that important in a company that it will fall apart if you're out for a little while.

But I digress a little.

I remember when we used to have a whole lecture on dialect and how to pepper our speech with it to help add to the magic and fantasy of the faire. and I remember the mantras we used to have to chant to purge the "Faire Speak" from our mundane lives.

Just my $.02

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Kriss, 08:51:22 09/27/02 Fri

Having worked at 8 other fairs and visiting many others, I find the fantasy of KRF so much more mystical and magical! Some of the faires that are so accurate are not that fun and seems to me that the performers themselves are not having as good a time as we do at KRF. I feel the fantasy far out weighs the historical crap. I mean where else could I get away with wearing a 2 foot flamingo on my head! Kriss

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Gumby, 08:58:18 09/27/02 Fri

"I mean where else could I get away with wearing a 2 foot flamingo on my head! Kriss"

2 foot flamingo?? 2 foot flamingo??

Is Arthurism catching on again? Did I miss something? Should be be scared? or is that scarred?

Inquiring minds want to know.

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------------------------------------------------------------[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Kriss the flamingo head, 09:22:40 09/27/02 Fri

Apparently Gumby you missed the faire in 95. I portrayed our wonderful Percy's sister who just came back from Brazil or somewhere like that. I was the renaissance version of Carmen Merranda! I was a vision. Of what we are not sure of. kriss

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Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- The Evil Duke, 09:01:39 09/27/02 Fri

And Nobody Wears a flamingo like you baby.
Nobody




except of course frank



but he does not wear it on his head





it would slide off from lack of things to grip






but i digress





just like gumby






but with a lot less text and many more returns





thats it








there is no more







why are you still rolling this down









stop it already









really i mean it








stop it








or i will have to have the annoying triplet move in over your garage











hah that stopped them

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------------------------------------------------------------Re: Historically accurate - a question and test -- Gumby- I'm sorry about this, 09:20:15 09/27/02 Fri

I'm sorry I have to inform you, but we will be unable to print your message as you did not file your last "text returns" and we will not accept this postings "text returns" until you do file the previous posting's "test returns"

ah hahahahah...
Get it?

Text Returns...Tax returns???

Ah hhahahahahahahaaaa.


Where do I get this stuff???




Do I steal if from Frank???






A lot of people seem to think that......






Aw Who cares?






It's all funny!!!!




Ah ahahahahahahahahaahaaaaa....

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Replies:

[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test - Reposted -- The Baron, 11:49:22 09/27/02 Fri

I've wondered about that myself. The Connecticut Renaissance Festival is doing a King Arthur theme which would put it in an earlier period. But, the renaissance and times after was the age of full suits of armor, which they will likely have. So which is it? It was so much easier when we had a castle to date the Faire. Circa Medieval works for me.

I like what we are doing down here in Carolona. It a renaissance faire that is not set in any one country or year. The character are free to be of many types, ethnicities and classes. We have a king and queen as well as a royal court and mayors court. There are over 300 members of the cast ensemble as well as variety and merchants. We were given dialect coaching, but I speak with a french accent so I don't know how it will fly, remains to be seen.

I like that format. I wouldn't call it "fantasy." We don't wear spiked leather, or have wings, rather everything has a flavor of renaissance europe.

Matt


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[> Re: Historically accurate - a question and test - Reposted -- merestelle, 21:06:41 09/28/02 Sat

I don't really think any of the faires are historically accurate. Some have a stronger leaning in that direction than others. I dislike the big production numbers, with the electronic music and big sound systems. I much prefer acoustic instruments and vocals. I prefer a play with strong dialog and character interaction to a broadway style musical. Taming of the shrew rather than Kiss me Kate. Historically accurate would be to limiting. I agree most of us are looking for another place and time. Perhaps, A wooded glade populated with fairies, elves,knights and gypsies. If we are going to have something more modern,I vote for plumbing.


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