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Date Posted: 14:45:18 02/14/08 Thu
Author: Sunshine
Subject: No Offense taken
In reply to: manwitch 's message, "Some of my best friends are atheists" on 14:13:07 02/14/08 Thu

I make generalizations based on my observations. Does that make my generalizations "scientific?" I suspect not.
Well that is the fundamental essence of science. How did you think science was (and is) developed. Of course, your observations must be testable, falsefiable and reproducible but if they prove out, they go from hypothesis to theory but they still can be challenged and refuted. This is the basic difference (in my mind) between science and religion. But whether you wish to classify these observations as science, they are rational if they are based on a clear minded observation of the world. Again, fundamentally different than religion.

At any rate, we may be talking about different things. I'm talking about the belief Spike shows in Showtime. I would say that yes, at that point, its not a rational belief. It is pure faith
As far as Spike's "religious faith" in Buffy,I stick by the quote from Touched. I do not think that Spike had a religious belief in episode 11 which was transformed into an observational (scientific or rational) belief some 9 episodes later. I think his "I have seen the best of you and the worst of you" was developed over 6 seasons, not 9 episodes. Spike definitely had faith in Buffy but he had been fighting by her side more or less continuously for the last three seasons and had plenty of oppurtunity to make a rational judgement about how loyal she was to her friends. No need for any religious revelation (and Spike never struck me as the type to accept revealed truth anyway).

My original quibble was equating atheism with not believing in anything, not merely not believing in god. Maybe I am overly sensitive but here in the US, presidential candidates equate morality, freedom, mother, apple pie etc with religion and I get tired of suggestions that somehow I am immoral because I do not belive in god (not that I am in any way suggesting that is what you were saying).

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