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Date Posted: 27/07/06 4:35:03pm
Author: D9
Subject: I don't take well to riddles RB...........(Long)
In reply to:
RB
's message, "Curbing competitive spirit to the extent: SL 1st, Team 2nd is the key" on 27/07/06 1:27:31pm
If you have something to say, or problems with the competition or individuals in it, say so flat out, don't make unbacked up statements on what you THINK is going on.
Lets deal with these individually;
a) Draw changes mid season: For something to be implemented into this competition, it has to be voted upon, Maxwell with all good intentions made a draw that he thought was making in fair. To his own admission it didn't, and he tried to change it with not much luck. Now the truth of the matter is, Maxwell put this end fixture out for all to see in March. Cast your mind back to march, there was bearly the sounds of crickets in this place. Nothing was voted on by moderators, to bring in or not. So by the rules of the comp, it should of stayed as it was. No fault of Maxwells I might add, he just done what he thought was right for the comp. Where were you at that stage RB, telling Maxwell not to bring it in without the rigt process being undertaken. Instead, you wait until the draw is deemed inappropriate, then come out, and say NO CHANGES MIDYEAR.
Now I was pretty sure that those decisions could only be made by moderators collective decision, but you uncatergorically said it wasn't to happen. Now I don't know who gave you the sole responsibility of what went on in this comp.
Fielding unbalanced sides: Luke (Jacko) was around the other day, and seen on the news that Jason Akermanis was dropped by Brisbane, due to something he said, and he took a comparison to that and the Ottens situation that he did a couple of weeks ago. His words were "How come they can drop Aker, and I can't drop Ottens". I felt it was a valid point. Jacko dropped one sigular player as he is frustrated with his play. I traded Chris Tarrant away for what many thought was a lesser player. All because of frustration with a careless attitude by the player, frustrated me, to a point that lesser points was not of the utmost concern. Tarrant had to go. Ottens had to be dropped in Jacko's eyes. Who is anyone else to tell him otherwise, especially when he is playing hard for a top position in the comp. Kangas situation was a blatant tanking story so the two cannot be paralleled.
Dodgy Trading: Who are you pointing this toward???? Is that the Didak for Trotter and Tuck trade you elude to because I reckon the Fockers got a beauty there. Be very careful RB. Your making very unsubstantial accusasions there.
I reckon the King and Pick 3 for and McKee and Pick 7 pick was quiet dodgy, lets do something about that.
Trading between teams posting from the same ip address: Well Luke Dennis Djakovic is my best friend, he is hopelessly poor constantly, out of work lead singer of a band called One Hard Nut, he hasn't got money to buy a computer, he comes here exery Friday afternoon, and selects his side, and he does do the odd trade with me. It is all from my computer.
I asked the moderators to vote whether A) We kick Luke from the comp, or B) Make friends not be able to trade between one another. OR c) Same IP addresses not be able to trade between one another. That might be the go, the mrs just got a lap top, instead of doing the trade on one computer, he can fire that one up and we can do it then. Which reminds me, only one person announces the trade, so can I say "He was at home on his own computer when this took place". Joking, he aint got one.
dodgy team selection: ??????? I think we covered this have we not, unless something else has been eating at you I haven't picked up.
changing selection after the deadline: That has never been brought up before, perhaps you can go back through archives and bring such a thing to the attention of the moderators, as it should of been when it happened. Or are you talking about the time when I seeked clarification of an issue I vaguely remember? Then I may of mentioned how such an example was not really fair. Sorry, you'll have to be more specific.
Raiding the free agents list: I should of kept those players, just to really piss you off. Truth to that scenario is that the free agents idea was made up by one person once again. Rules to that idea were not discussed, and technically, they were all just as the titled describes, free. That exercise was a little tongue in cheek, as this competition is not something that someone can indiviudally implement anything, I thought this might of highlighted that fact, but obviously not. Since then there has been a number of single coached initiative put up, then put in without vote. It has to stop.
maintaining poorly balanced squads: C'mon Rb, this is what I mean, riddles are not my strong point, who and why.
Lets get to the bottom of this, straight away, no secrete upset coaches with vendettas, straight straight out on the table, lets establish the moderators once again, and lets deal with these issues.
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streuth -- MG77B, 27/07/06 7:06:21pm [1]
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It was a personal opinion D9,No teams were mentioned -- RB, 27/07/06 8:36:22pm [1]
the gist of the post can be summed up by the heading:
"Curbing competitive spirit to the extent: SL 1st, Team 2nd is the key (to this comp)"
The point of post can be summed up as: A mandate of good sportsmanship overcomes the need for the countless rules in a comp like this.
Your reply indicates perhaps you missed the point completely so "no comment" is my response.
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That was the problem, and perhaps...... -- D9, 27/07/06 10:18:48pm [1]
you missed that point. You can't have a stab, and not be particular. What do you want RB, half the comp question ing their actions "just in case" the comments you made refered to them. I am all for you bringing up an issue that you feel has arisen, then we put it to the moderators to decide what is and isn't for the best of the comp. Is this a hard concept.
Why do you want to deal with issues like this. Ask me why I was playing the Kangaroos and not the Swans RB, ask me why Jacko is posting under my IP address, bring up a change after the dealine, bring up dodgies trading, bring up dodgy team maintenence, WHY WHY WHY do you choose to harbour these thoughts and then come out in riddle talk to half bring it up, not naming any names.
Do what you want RB, I will do the ladder if you don't want to do it any longer. I would never have someone do something that they don't wish to do. We all had individual jobs to do, we had a way of bringing issues up. Comment or don't comment, just let us know what you were doing, and what you don't want to do.
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Give it a rest,Just for clarifaction -- RB, 27/07/06 11:23:12pm [1]
the use of the word dodgy had nothing with the SL team Dodgies.
Once again you missed the point completely.
The End:
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That was a typo. Sorry Rizzo, RB..... -- D9, 28/07/06 10:50:09am [1]
Why don't you want to simply deal with the issues at hand. Why do I feel you were on the attack, then when I bit, you retreat into the darkeness with no clarification apart from "you missed the point". What was the point RB. You claim there is some serious goings on in our competition, and highlight 'what' is happening, but don't say 'who' is doing it. That suggests to me that you are having a direct dig at me, and the Magpies team dealings. If true, I can take that on board, we can get into the nitty gritty of it, and if you and/or other coaches think that my dealings have been less than 'Respect gaining' from my fellow coach, and you outline how, I will appologise. It leaves us in an awful predicament if you half accuse and then cease any clarification.
Whats wrong RB, come straight out and say what you think, and we can deal with it. Simple honest and open, for all to discuss.
Can you see the point in harbouring these thoughts? Can you see that this comp will be enjoyable for you if those thoughts are in your head? Issues you have, I want to deal with, I can't see that we have at this stage.
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IMO D9 you are over reacting to the post. -- Josh, 28/07/06 5:17:17pm [1]
IMO the gist of the post by RB is correct. We have a number of basic rules (ie naming your best team, trying to pick to position etc) and if everyone follows these the comp works better for it.
I am not sure if there is history in relation to your response, however on face value I certainly did not read it as an attack on any particular person or team.
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And I quote..... -- D9, 28/07/06 5:36:37pm [1]
"Unfortunately however sometimes white line fever kicks in. Draw changes mid season, fielding unbalanced teams, dodgy trading, trading between teams posting from the same ip address, dodgy team selection, changing selection after the deadline, raiding the free agents list, maintaining poorly balanced squads etc"
Now your right to say that he isn't directing these comments at a particular team, but Josh, are your sure that he doesn't think you have dodgy team selection, or is it you who has been changing your side after the deadline, or even maintaining a poorly balanced side. Don't worry about the IP address one and Raiding the free agents list, they're mine, and the changing fixtures mid season is Maxwell and mines combined effort.
See I see it from two way, one as a coach that has been accused of a few things that doesn't maintain the respect of my fellow coaches, and two as a SL moderator, worried that the correct procedures to bringing new rules in, and the debate of issues is being overlooked.
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Re: I don't take well to riddles RB...........(Long) -- Russian, 28/07/06 11:10:14pm [1]
The only difference with what the Roos did was he admitted it was tanking which is against the rules. Like I said at the time, before that there was nothing wrong with it, and there is nothing wrong now with Jacko not picking Ottens, Shabby not picking Carr, D9 trading Tarrant, or me dropping/trading Lonie - although I probably won't drop him because I know he scores even if I do hope he gets run over by a truck.
Re the rest, I have noticed a bit of dodgyness between D9/Jacko and Max/Libba in the past but I've seen similar things in every comp I've been in and they haven't all been cheating, so I'm not sure there's any in this comp either.
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About time, someone comes out and says what they think... -- D9, 29/07/06 12:06:27am [1]
Just on tanking, can I ask why a team within a shot of the finals tank??
Dodgyness between Magpies and Cats
Trade history since Jacko has been coach;
Headland for Tarrant. Perhaps Cats will win, but I thought Tarrant was on his way down bigtime. Headland is a high pick in his draft.
Brent Hall for Tristan Cartledge, I wanted a Bomber and Cats wanted a Pie. Both duds who will probably fail to make anyone happy.
Fosdike for Selwood, Magpies wanted to get the brothers together, thought Selwood was a good prospect as a young kid, Cats thought Fosdike was a safe player.
Lee for Lynch, make Magpies look a bit silly now, but Lynch was getting nothing, and I thought he would blow out not thin up. I was wrong, Cats win. Lee was a young up and comer, but I traded him again for Laidlaw who I found a bette prospect for a midfielder.
Lloyd, Haynes for Tivendale and C.Jones, since I am a personal friend of Tivendale I wanted him, Cats were after a fullforward at the time but wasn't going to get Lloyd as a straight swap. I hate Lloyd but I'm not that silly, had to have a sweetener, so Jones was thrown in. Haynes was just a throw away Cat that Jacko thought may come good, having one eye and all. Lloyd eventually got Jacko Ling, which because of Lloyds injury has been a win for everyone except whoever got Lloyd.
Makepiece for Holland, Makepiece was getting regular 100's back in 2004 season, and Holland was coming up. Holland since has improved, Makepiece fallen away. I have since traded Holland for who I thought was a budding gun CHF in Hanson, I maybe wrong on current form, but I'll stick this one out.
No dodgyness, I can't see any obvious one way trades.
I know your not accusing Russian, just thought I would go through them.
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Bit of dodgyness..................... -- Maxwell, 29/07/06 7:59:50am [1]
Please explain in regards to Dawk/Swans.
We have never traded.
Libba always makes final decision about any trade or his team every week.
I was not happy with him picking up Davis, but it was what he wanted.
I do help him when it comes to picking up players from the Free agents list, because players who have not played in the AFL he would know nothing about. I do not know much either, just what I learn form Bigfooty.
I do not think anyone would object to that.
Maxwell
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Re: Bit of dodgyness..................... -- Russian, 29/07/06 3:12:04pm [1]
If I could remember I would, but I can't. I just remember seeing something that looked strange from one of you, and whatever it was somehow affected the other team. Probably was nothing and if I hadn't known you were related I would've just thought it was strange like many decisions in these games
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Well D9 -- RB, 29/07/06 11:07:56am [1]
Why did you feel the need to take the 1st post personally
Why did you feel the need to attack me on a personal level in it
Your reaction to my initial post tells me all i need to know.(oh no a riddle,to the batcave!)
What did i really think of the content in your MEGA reply ?
Skimming through it,thought it was a BIG load of defensive bollocks taken totally out of context for reasons best known to yourself.
As a result dont bother replying to this post as i am not willing to waste my team reading it.
Enough of the bullshit.
On to the real stuff.
The only thing i could decipher from your replies was that you seem to harbour some sort of angst with my level of participation in this comp.
No probs,its YOUR superleague after all.
Therefore as a result my level of particiption is reduced to as of now to:
Coaching the Fockers & maintaining the teamsheets.
A ladder spreadsheet will be sent as requested to a coach via email.
The Free Agents List is now history & no longer exists.It was not approved after all & also seemed to cause you some angst.
As a result the SL web page is no longer required & will be wound up this weekend.
I need only to pop on to this site a couple of times a week now to take care of my teams business.Sweet.
I have no desire to be any part of a SL mod squad now or in the future.Why would i waste my time thinking of any ideas or implementing new additions to this comp if the price to be paid is attacks of a personal nature splayed across the board sometime down the track.
I repeat no further replies will be posted.My decision is final & nothing you can say or do will change it.
Will this cause a problem down the track,shit no,i am over it all ready.I will however gain a extra pleasure when the Fockers defeat the Magpies (a feeling i am sure will be mutual) in future games.
That is all.
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Its a shame -- MG77B, 29/07/06 12:19:38pm [1]
that it has to come to this. Remember gents this is a fun game. We are not betting on these games. For me its a chance to know the Afl better. Keep tabs on up and coming players of all teams.
RBs contribution has been fantastic. I remember when he kept a spreadsheet for all teams with all stats. With Champion data coming online we don't need that, but I can tell you he has put as much (as long with D9), if not more into this comp than anyone.
Its great to have a website where we can see previous trades and the current ladder. I would hate to loose this and think if we do this comp will never be the same.
I think D9 has over-reacted and I think he should apologise to RB.
Lets bury the hatchet boys and enjoy what this comp is all about - fun
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well said mg77b -- gothedons, 29/07/06 4:10:07pm [1]
all this doesnt do the comp any good, we need to go back to basics and let the comp run... i have been here for 2 years now, and everyone seems to contribute well and get along well, lets not let such small trivial things get in the way of an awesome competition!
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Agree entirely. -- Maxwell/Libba, 29/07/06 4:44:35pm [1]
Agree with MG77b and GotheDons
The Comp has been great.
Would hate any changes.
Please leave as is.
We all need the information that is available.
Take anything away and it would be less enjoyable.
Max/Libba
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RB please read -- D9, 29/07/06 4:59:11pm [1]
I felt the need to take the first post personally, because I felt you were having ago at my integrity, and questioning my dealings in the SL. (Cheating)
I don't understand, you accuse me of basically cheating, then when I justify myself, and question ways in which you should of, and didn't deal with certain issues, that is personal. What would you do if I was eluding to that you were cheating?
A riddle to me, is saying something but not saying it. The way I felt is that you wanted to come out with a straight out attack on me, for the way I was doing things, but decided against it, and put it in a non direct way, but was still saying the same thing.
Angst against your participation, not at all. It stemmed from you changing a result which followed the fixture person (Maxwells) schedule. I question it, you basically told me bad luck, I will do it my way, I had a go at that, you bring up these accusations, I strongly defended my case. Thats the way it appeared to me.
It is not my Superleague, it is the coaches Superleague, everyone of them.
The Free agents list is good idea, but no rules were put in place to deal with them until someone started to deal with them.
For the sake of all coaches, I ask that you leave the website up for longer than you are planning, so we can get relevent details off it, so we can start another website. It basically is transfered information from Colebergs site, and we need that info. If it is lost to us, then great action will have to be undertaken, I am sure you can see our delima. Totally up to you, but I would suggest, hate me all you want, but I am sure that all coaches would appriciate continuance of duties until seasons end. We have the last round, then finals. Then quit. If you don't I understand, but its not long to go.
I am pleased to see you didn't quit all together, and I am sorry we had this disagreement. Last year we got along well, this year, you seen my actions as Failing to have: "respect of my fellow competitors". Then again I seemed to be jumping the gun, over reacting. But if I was, why wouldn't you say, D9, that wasn't a dig at you. You said nothing as if I was right on the money as to what you were eluding.
Iwould like to chat with you on msn, to see if we can get to understand each others stand easier, as on this forum, it is hard to ask question and get answers. Perhaps the forum is misleading, and I would love to ask questions.
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