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Date Posted: 18/02/03 1:17:08 GMT+10
Author: The Scarlet Scorpion
Subject: Re: Mini-Con origins
In reply to: Goktimus Prime 's message, "Mini-Con origins" on 16/12/02 23:40:45 GMT+10

>You've raised an interesting point, SofaMan.
>


I agree (see other post).


>It is not clear as to how or why the Mini-Cons became
>a segregated faction, but what is clear is that they
>are a separate faction that seem to be of little
>concern to the other more dominant factions.
>


My guess, or rather, theory, is because they are without a past. In the Armada cartoon, I believe they said they appeared on Cybertron virtually overnight, and comments/press releases from Hasbro have referred to the MCs as "mysterious". They didn't know how they got there, but they do know the other Transformers didn't like them much, most likely because they were simply different from all they others. As with all outcasts, they eventually banded togeather and formed their own little settlements and villages, which were eventually laid to waste by the B.I.-,... I mean the Na-, er... the Ser-,... um, the Decepticons (more on these comparisons later), who conducted ghoulish experiments on them. These eventually led to a macabre twist on the old binary-bonding process, only here you couldn't just take off your exo-suit or slam your Masterforce bracelets togeather and take a rest afterwards... this was perminant.


>In either case, we can see forms of marginalisation
>and discrimination against the Mini-Cons. The
>Decepticons clearly view them with contempt and
>initially took steps to enslave them, and the other
>Transformers at best are just apathetic towards them.
>When the non-allied Transformers at Cyber City were
>attacked by Decepticons, the Autobots rushed to the
>rescue. When the Mini-Cons' villages were
>systematically attacked and their entire race enslaved
>by Decepticons, the Autobots didn't mobilise until it
>was too late. One could argue that the Autobots were
>not aware of the attacks and abductions until it was
>very late in the game, but the fact that the Autobots
>clearly had no prior interest in monitoring or
>defending the Mini-Cons illustrates that they did not
>hold Mini-Con welfare in high regard.
>


I believe the late Martin Niemoeller, a pastor for the German Evangelical (Lutheran) Church, said it best:

"In Germany, the Nazis first came for the Communists, and I did not speak up, because I was not a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak up, because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak up, because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I did not speak up, because I was not a Catholic. Then they came for me... and by that time, there was no one to speak up for anyone."

E tu, Cybertron?


>Now, Transformers is a story that is, ultimately,
>aimed at children. So what I ask is this: is this
>portrayal of marginalisation and discrimation
>justified? Is it a good or bad thing for kids to be
>exposed to this? Does it encourage or discourage
>prejudice in general?
>


In the comics, I believe that Dreamwave is going for intellectual overtones in much the same manner as Marv Wolfman, Bob Skir, and Marty Isenberg did with "Beast Machines", whereas BMach delt with the concepts of fanatacism, facism, and eco-terrorism, the Armada comic book deals with the concepts of isolationism, apathy, and segregation. Both, however, deal with genocide and what it's like to be a reffugy, watching as your friends and loved one dissapear all around you (Nightscream in BMach, the Mini-cons in ARM).

On a side note, just what is it that makes people hate Nightscream so much? I mean, if you saw you family get slaughtered right in front of your face, wouldn't you be more than a bit angsty? If you don't believe me, one of my friends from school is from Bosnia; his father was killed there, his brother was nearly blown up by a landmine, and he himself has a large, jagged scar running across his left cheek. He's certainly not that fond of his childhood memoies of the Old Country, no sir. Anyhoo, back to the original topic...

The Armada cartoon, on the other hand, isn't just crap for all the obvious reasons (poor dub job, low-budget animation, continuity gaffs, etc.), but because it shows the Autobots as self-rightious hypocrites. Optimus has shown that he doesn't consider the Mini-Cons to be overly intelligent (remember how surprised he was when they used his trailer's weapons in one episode?), and "protects" them in a manner similar to the U.S. protecting Kuwait in the Gulf War, i.e. he'll help them out only because they're of use to him, and look good doing it (I am in no way saying I like Saddam Hussein, I'm just saying the U.S. wouldn't have thought twice about it if Kuwait wasn't a member of OPEC). Whether or not Optimus will go back into a state of apathy after the end of the war with the Decepticons, I do not know.


>Personally I think that the comic treats the issue
>well -- it shows the Mini-Cons as being a sentient and
>rational race of Transformers who were more or less
>peace-loving and soon became innocent victims of the
>war between the Autobots and Decepticons. As we all
>know, war creates many innocent victims. In our world,
>80% of them are women and children. In the world of
>the Transformers, they are the Mini-Cons. As innocent
>victims of war, they are exploited and displaced,
>forced to flee their beloved homeland to seek asylum
>elsewhere. As a moral tale, we have the heroic and
>evil factions involved in the war. The Decepticons are
>evil as they are the source of the conflict. They are
>also the ones who have enslaved and displaced the
>Mini-Cons, much like certain warlords in places like
>Africa who displace people through their struggle for
>power. The heroic Autobots are the freedom fighters,
>struggling to push back the Decepticon horde. By #3 of
>Armada, we see that most of Cybertron has been
>conquered by the Decepticons and the Autobots have
>been forced underground as a resistance movement.
>Again, we have had examples of this in real life too,
>such as the Ishin rebellion who toppled the Tokugawa
>Dynasty, and the early stages of the American Civil
>War.
>


Uh, what was the Inshin Rebellion (this is why I'm taking a course on "China and the Pacific Rim" next year at high school)? I assume it happened in Japan, but that's all I know.


>Consequently I think the comics serves as a reasonably
>good statement of certain political and moral issues,
>which is what all good scifi should do in order to
>force us to reflect upon our own humanity.
>


I'm glad I'm not the only one who likes Sci-Fi allegories (I remember reading in magazine put out by the Doctor Who Appreciation Society from about fifteen years ago where someone was saying about how they didn't like the sociological undertones of the Seventh Doctor stories, but then, the D.W.A.S. never seemed to like much of anything...).


>But what about the cartoon? Does it also deliver the
>same moral? The main difference with the cartoon
>include:
>
>* Unlike the comic, it's not clear as to who really
>started the war nor who were the first to begin
>enslaving or exploiting the Mini-Cons. Optimus Prime
>argues that the Mini-Cons allied with the Autobots
>have done so willingly, but at the same time he admits
>that the Mini-Cons have been used as pawns -- so he
>clearly makes no pretense that the Autobots are
>ultimately exploiting the Mini-Cons. Not a very
>"heroic" notion.
>
>* Just how rational are these Mini-Cons? They do
>display sentience and some level of reasoning
>capability... but at what level? They seem to have no
>real complex language -- merely the ability to express
>feelings and intentions through a series of bleeps.
>They haven't demonstrated autonomous social structures
>or civilisation, whereas the Mini-Cons of the DW
>comics had clearly established their own segregated
>society living in villages with their own form of
>architecture etc. They demonstrate high-level
>intelligence such as the Air Defence Team's base and
>rocket pack, as well as the construction of the
>"Armada" escape ship. Sure, the thing fell apart in
>orbit, but the fact that they were able to construct
>an interstellar ship in the first place clearly shows
>that they are fully rational agents with high mental
>functions. What about the cartoon Mini-Cons? As far as
>we know, they were all captured/collected by the
>Autobots and Decepticons and used as weapons of war --
>much like how humans use various animals as beasts of
>war (e.g.: dogs, horses etc.). The question of the
>Mini-Cons' rationality is an important one, as that
>would establish the fundamental notion as to whether
>or not they are entitled to be treated as equals with
>other rational beings (e.g.: Autobots, Decepticons,
>humans etc.) or if they are merely very intelligent
>animals. After all, a well trained dog or horse can
>very easily convey emotions and intentions to its
>human master.
>Until the cartoon Mini-Cons can demonstrate that they
>are fully rational agents, then one could argue that
>this discussion is not even relevant to the cartoon
>series.


Personally, I believe the cartoon MCs are rational (in the normal Cybertronian sense), for even though they are a horrendously passive race, they can and will defend themselves (well, if others can't do it for them, at least...). Also, just because something doesn't communicate in a typical human fashion does not make it any less sentient (dolphins, octopus, etc.).

Just my proverbial two cents on the subject.

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