Responses -- HarmyBoard Reviews

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Date Posted: 03:33:18 11/15/05 Tue
Author: all
Subject: Responses
In reply to: Araninda 's message, "Episode of the Week Discussion. . .Inside" on 03:09:15 11/15/05 Tue

Okay here goes, its a 4.5 for me, only wanted to see more Harm and what happened Christmas morning. 1)I agree, I think Mac was finally understanding that. I think her statement in Hail and Farewell made that clear. Other men came and went, but not Harm. 2)I think it was a real revalation for Mac to hear, and it made her cry because it was true, and she couldnt deny it anymore. She did choose to be alone, after Chris(ran to the Marines), after John(law school and a continent away) and after Mic (TAD assignment after broken engagement with Harm waiting in the wings to 'talk')Webb was a boyfriend who Mac had to know would never be there for her. She knew he was a 'spook'.Their conversation in Pas De Duex left no doubt she knew then he was a liar and couldnt be trusted. 3)I'm playing therapist tonight, but I think Christmas brings out the worst in a troubled person, all the issues that arent being dealt with come to the surface. Our hearts open at that time, whether we want them to or not. 4)I took it to mean that they were on the same wavelength, they had both survived terrible accidents(crashes) and they were there together. I loved the 'I'm still here'from Harm. It felt like the best Christmas present that I could ever have. 5)I would have preferred alot of the 4% scenes to be in the premiere. The last scene of that ep just made me sick. Harm had been so sweet and patient and he kept reaching out to her and she was so bitter and I dont know what to call it, kindly. The sweetness that existed between them on H and F I was nowhere to be seen. He wasnt responsible for the void in her life, but it continued to have to pay for it, big time. It was another incongruous episode with way too much Webb and none of the companionship I expected to exist between Harm and Mac. I hated tptb that night almost as much as I did the night of TILAM. I thought Harm walking down that beach at the end of the ep, alone, was another Screw you shippers!from tptb.(NT) -- mkim

I always had a hard time with this episode, especially since it was meant to be a Christmas one. For me, this episode was a big departure from the type of Xmas episode I had come to expect from JAG. Even when the episodes were serious they still had an underlying sense of comedy or lightness. I did not see this in 4%. For me, Mac's reactions were not really consistant with what we appeared to be expecting for the 2nd half of the season. We now know that TPTB had other surprises for us and not all good. I would have liked to have seen more of Harm and more of Mac/Harm interaction--similar to the porch scene during Lifeline. There were so many unresolved issues for Mac and for Harm also. Xmas is indeed a hard time for many but it seemed that Harm had matured because of Paraquay and its fallout and also because of Mattie. Mac was obviously suffering PTS but we never saw her really move on with it until some minor hints here.(NT) --Dorothy

1) Yes. Harm had been such a big part for so long. Add to that the fact she was in love with him and how could she not have a conversation without talking about him. 2) She tries to protect her self from being abandoned like she was as a kid so I don�t think she lets anyone too close to prevent this but this causes her to wind up alone even though she doesn�t want to be 3)Even though in better frame of mind after leaving the session she still thought Harm might be involved with Alicia, also one session isn�t going to erase all the insecurities she has. 3)Cont - I�m sure being alone at the holidays is what brought on the cynicism hard to watch everyone enjoy this time of year when you are all alone. Yes they should have pursued a relationship after Christmas but when there were numerous episodes where they didn�t even have a scene together hard to accomplish this and also because they got the crazy idea to try for a S11 instead of letting H/M move closer. 4) That they were both at the same place at the same time and together. 5) Glad it wasn�t the premier if we wouldn�t have gotten any progression in there relationship after that and also if we would have possibly had more Alicia couldn�t stand that. I thought it was a good time to have it. 6)I wish she would have heard better news. I thought it was so cruel in the first place to give her endo. Even if they would have kept those lines in don�t think anything would have changed story wise the 2nd half of the year. Might have given us more hope though after they got together. I give the episode a 5. CB was amazing and it touched on so many things. And I absolutely loved Dr. McCool. It was like a roll coaster with her going through so many emotions. And since she hadn�t slept in days understandable she was on edge. Only thing that would have been better is a little more flashback to H/M relationship through the years and some follow up on the last scene in the episodes following it.(NT) - Hope

Mkim, I could not have said it any better than you! I did not choose the 4% for EOTW - because I was disappointed in it. Gave it a 3.5 for the last few mintutes in the hospital room and the previously unseen scene on the porch at the Dining out. I had seen Harm's attempts in the first two episodes of season ten, and was seriously wondering if there would be any hope at all. TPTB kept throwing women at him so I was becoming very anxious.DEspite the words "we both are", I did not see enough of Mac's feelings for HARM showing through. I agree, she had many issues to deal with but Harm WAS THERE! She should have given him the benefit of the doubt, as McCool had said - How could she let this drag on another two months after the therapy session. I was becoming TOTALLY pissed off with being "jerked around" and was losing hope. Ouuuw I am getting angry again, thinking of it. BACK to season I!!!! Season Ten SUCKED! (NT) --can j - taking some deep breaths and a little Valium!!

Wow. See I thought the first of half of S10 was good. Sometimes letting the one person closest to us in is the hardest. I thought the time frame was somewhat realistic for all she had been through. She needed to come to terms with things. If she had just run to Harm and let him take away her pain then she wouldn�t have dealt with the underlying issues and things would have been more likely to not work out for them. I never got the feeling she didn�t care she was just trying to figure out how to deal with all the crap and be herself again. (NT) -- Hope - just think about the 7.5 mins can j, 22:23:56 10/07/05 Fri

I totally agree with you Hope. While I would have loved for Mac to fall into Harm's arms at the end of H&F2,I think, in terms of their relationship in the long run, it was best for Mac to sort things out herself before Harm and Mac entered a relationship. I think by the time of FWFS, both were so much stronger and both were in a position to make each other happy because they were each happy on their own. Also, I think both now know what it feels like to be shut out (Harm -- H&F2; Mac -- during Mattie's accident (and Mac admits this then)) and both understand why sometimes you just need to deal with things yourself and doing so doesn't mean you don't love the person who is offering help. As for why Mac seemed happy at the end of the therapy session, but at Christmas things had changed, I deduced (I could be wrong, I am a lot of times) that the therapy session occurred right before A Whole New Ballgame. Bud tells Mac that she looks a lot better and Mac states that she finally got a good nights sleep (as a result of the Dr. McCool talk??). So Mac probably had a whole new look on life, then BAM! finds out that Creswell(sp??) is going to be the new JAG. Her past is drug up AGAIN and she is living in fear AGAIN, so to me, the news re: Creswell probably put her back into the "my life stinks, everything turns out badly for me" mindframe.(NT) --Sammy

I liked this ep and give it a 4.5. I loved it that we finally got to see some of the behind the scenes scenes, so to speak. I'm coming in late with my opinion of Mac's changed attitude. I know I shouldn't bring the original scripts into this but something that TQ reported, made me see Mac's behaviour in a new light. In the script, the doctor at the end says to Mac that her ovulation is normal, and Mac was surprised. When she went to Dr. McCool, she was encouraged to look at the positive...the 4% possibility that she could have children. However, if by Christmas she believed she still wasn't able to conceive, she would have felt many distressing emotions, as well as feeling hopeless, angry, and cynical. Therepy would appear, like fate, to be mocking her attempts to be happy. Every month, the fears return. Then at the end, the doctor tells here she is ok, and the ep ends on a hugely hopeful note. She is alive and uninjured, and she has normal ovulation (though how they would know that, I'm not emtirely certain.) The point is, this would account for her change in attitude from the earlier part of the season, to that moment in the car when she hears the psychologist on the radio. (NT) --Cece....been through the whole, miserable, experience of infertility. Not recommended.

I love this episode---5 stars. Of course we want more Harm,and more Harm and Mac but to me CB had some legit acting chops again.It was comforting,firey and a revelation to see Mac.Our emotional payoff was on the way despite TPTB evilness but it arrived out of the blue and yet once we think about it,it all makes perfect sense.It tells us something fundamental about Mac and H&M and allows us to share something that none of us could possibly anticipate.Like a good poem,it blindsided us as make make that turn,it takes us right at the end. (NT) -- Yoly, 22:28:20 10/07/05 Fri

I thought this was a wonderful episode, although it certainly had its painful moments. I give it a 5. Luckily, Harm was wise enough to understand what Mac needed from him�maybe because she'd been ready in the past and he'd been the one that wasn't. Not being ready was, for neither of them, ever the same as not loving each other. And I think this was the same song from their long, checkered past--just a different verse. I think Dr. McCool's words about Harm being the one she always intended to be with was true for both of them. Harm makes it clear in 'What if' that he always thought there would be a time for them--and had determined to be patient and understanding while she worked through her stuff about Webb and the endo and Sadik. That's love at its best. Mac on the other hand, even at the end of the session, still gives herself only a 4% chance that Harm hasn�t moved on without her�and the fact that she wasn�t angry at him for it showed that she didn�t think what he�d been offering at the Dining Out was romantic love�but more duty and friendship, and loyalty, so if he�d moved on with Alicia- a smart woman who could probably give him children-she wasn�t going to blame him for making that choice. She needs to find peace within herself before she�s worth anything to another person. But Harm was the one she always intended to be with-in her secret heart of hearts-- even though she�d given up on that dream when things got too painful. She ran from the pain of believing that he�d never love her the way that she loved him�.and then, when the chance finally presented itself�when he said he was tired of looking in on her life�that he wanted to be a part of it, it happened at the worst possible time�when she�s broken, feeling unwhole and not in control of her life�sort of like Harm felt after Russia. He didn�t know who was driving the bus anymore and so though Mac had made it clear through her actions and hinted at it with her words how she felt about him�he was in no emotional condition to start a relationship with her�so he takes up with Jordan while Mac stood on the sidelines. This time Harm was willing to stand on the sidelines while she worked through the emotional mess that her life had become�and yes, we can point at things and say�she should have known how he felt because of this�but we can do the same in reverse. They were cowards when it came to risking their hearts with each other and each settled for less than true love and true happiness until it was almost too late.(NT)--manette

4% by itself was a eye opening ep. I did enjoy it, (I know I sound like I'm contradicting myself here.) But when I got to the question about whether I'd like to have seen more of this in the premiere(Hail and Farewell II) I have to stick with it. It would have helped me see a better side to Mac, alot sooner.I have to wonder if the change of the episode might have been about the fact that it was leaked that Webb was alive.(At least thats what I remember at the time. I dont want to be negative about Mac, I guess I'm still venting frustration from the last two seasons. Writing about her helps alot, it helps you put yourself in her place, and reconcile what you didnt see on the small screen. Yes...I am my own therapist. LOL! (NT)--mkim

But since she had just discovered Webb was alive and it had only been a few weeks since she found out about the endo, I think it would have been to soon for her going to see Dr. McCool. Now maybe about midway through the season it might have been better. Maybe to have saw it when it was suppose to happen. (NT) -- Hope, 00:01:38 10/08/05 Sat

I'm going to disagree about it being too soon after H&F for Mac to go see Dr. McCool. Many people seek outside help after a run of bad news like Mac had in H&F1. It would have made plenty of sense to me. (NT) -- Ann, 11:16:46 10/08/05 Sat

That is true but Harm and Mac are very private people and not likely to seek out help. Also I was thinking more of having to see the session in H&F II. I was glad to see the session after she knew Webb was alive instead of before. I think if it had been before she knew he was alive it would have been much more focused on the Mac/Webb relationship. Maybe they could have just reversed them and made Going After Webb the first episode and H&F II the 2nd episode. (NT) -- Hope, 12:57:25 10/08/05 Sat

I also think that our reaction to what happens to the characters we care about is emotional--but then we turn around and try to apply logic to how we think they 'should' have reacted even though they were caught up in the middle of extremely emotional situations. Logic and emotion rarely go hand in hand without help or the passing of time. In a way it's a testament to how well these characters were created that we can't separate ourselves from their pain. (NT) -- manette, 13:40:55 10/08/05 Sat

I gave it a 3. Mostly because I wanted more Harm. What little we got seemed to be a precursor of what we got the rest of the season. I just prefer watching Harm. This ep didn't seem very Christmasy to me. Seemed to me that Harm should have told Mac he could go tot he Wall the next day, instead of making it sound like he wasn't going to go at all. (NT) -- nancyeddy, 23:29:54 10/07/05 Fri

I had a hard time with this episode, for much the same reasons as mkim and canj - to be more specific, 2) I feel that Mac always did choose to be alone � not only in the examples mkim gives, but in not getting more help for her problems, which leads me to 3) I think Mac needed more than just the one session with Dr. McCool, who she only went to see in the first place to get a prescription for sleeping pills. She was very cynical in her attitude toward therapy, which Dr. McCool called her on, and which indicated to me how much she needed it. She apparently didn�t get any more after that one session and by Christmas ended up just as cynical as she was at the beginning. I think that�s why she didn�t pursue a relationship with Harm - she still needed help sorting out her issues. I don�t know why she didn�t pursue a relationship after the crash, when she seemed to have a better understanding of herself and could see how much Harm still cared. I can only blame it on tptb, which I know we�re not supposed to do.(NT)--Tina

I love this episode too sure I want more but then with Jag and with Harm and Mac in most eps we always want more and Jag ended with us wanting more.LOLOL! Mac is human. Period. As old wisdom always says "you can only to love others when you learn to love yourself first" this is how I saw the episode.My shipper faith kept on burning. (NT) -- shipper, 23:45:31 10/07/05 Fri

I think another thing to remember is she hadn�t slept for 3 days. Now I don�t know about others but when I am sleep deprived I don�t act rational and can become quite cynical or fly off the handle pretty quick. I thought her responses seemed very real when you take that into account. (NT) -- Hope - Tina your are very welcome, 23:46:39 10/07/05 Fri

To comment on #4: That line was perhaps what gave me the most hope for the rest of the season. Just because it meant SO much. It wasn't only Mac being thankful that she was alive, or Harm being thankful that she was alive, but it was that they both acknowledged life was more meaningful and worth looking forward to as long as they were together. I don't even mean together in a romantic sense, really - they had spent so much time apart from each other, taking each other for granted prior to this...with Mac saying it was better because they were both alive, I thought it signified a kind of, 'hey, you're here, I'm here, we have this moment, but we also have all the moments that come after this, and that's what makes it so great'. JMO, of course. And yes, the handholding did wonders for my shipper spirit too, hehe. :o)(NT)--Nid

Most of this ep was a big ARGGG for me...Harm *finally* says very directly, clearly with no misinterpretation possible that he wants to share a life and family with Mac and she says "I can't"!?! Pillows were throw and teeth were gnashed. But, here's a question (don't know if I'm doing a brain fade here or not), what vehicle was Mac driving? Wasn't her vette. Why was Harm driving a vette rather than his SUV? Have I completely lost track of who's driving what when? (NT) -- clr, 00:10:12 10/08/05 Sat

I think someone a while back said she was driving a navy issue sedan. (NT) -- JAG Junkie--I'll have to read all this & post my comments tomorrow. I'm way too tired & it's way too late., 00:25:53 10/08/05 Sat

4% a 4 from me and its another yoyo hope from the powers of darkness of Jag but I love then and I still love it now because it strikes a responsive chord for us and very telling for me how this two love each other and cant live without the other. (NT) -- Rachel, 00:42:17 10/08/05 Sat

She have to talk about Harm because with him she is no alone. I think she chose to be alone but she never figured out of this. One person can be alone still surrender but hundred of people. I see her like a big person has an affair with herself and an a shadow ( the man of the moment: Chris, Falcon, Dalton , MIc, don't care) and she is alone with all of them because only one person touch her soul:. Harm (NT) -- Gra, 01:26:37 10/08/05 Sat

I give this episode a 5; best episode in 2 years easily. CB was awesome and showed such a range of emotion. 1) Totally. The is no way to talk about her life without talking about Harm; he is integral to he existence. without him she doesn't function at her best. 2)It is true now, but it wasn't always that way. From the flashbacks we know that Harm told her he would always be there fro her, and through what we saw early in Season 10 he was trying to prove that. She was pushing he away, she wanted to be with him, more than anything, but she wouldn't let herself do it. 3)That didn't make a lot of sense. the only thing I can think of is that her trust was utterly destroyed by what Webb did, and that she could not believe that another man, even harm, would be true to his word. What he said in the hospital room changed her feelings on that, but DPB was an ass and didn't go anywhere logical with it. Go figure. 4)I think she meant that finally everything was in the right place for them to move forward. He was at JAG again, they were both single, and ready. Leave it to Donny to squander that opportunity. 5)I think they worked better where they were, though I would have liked it more if 4% came earlier in the season. 6)That change would have been nice, but if it had happened a relationship would have been the only place they could have gone, and AGAIN that wasn't what Donnny wanted. I really felt he was totally out of touch with JAG and what the fans wanted. When he went to NCIS he should have given someone like Dana complete control of the show and kept his hands off if he wasn't willing to spend full time working on it. He admitted in an interview in season 9 that he only spent about 5% of his time working n JAG and it showed. (NT)--David

A definite 5! I had so much hope after this episode. I thought it was a prelude to a wonderful second half of the season (little did I know!). Of course Mac couldn't talk about her life without talking about Harm. Their lives were so intertwined that they couldn't possibly ignore each other's influence and involvement in their lives. Harm was a major part of her life and if she had tried to not talk about him, Dr. McCool would have quickly seen all the holes. 2) I don't think Mac intended to choose to be alone, but her decisions had that result regardless. Given all her issues, insecurities, lack of trust, low self-esteem in relationships, etc., she was afraid to let people get too close. She seemed to prefer "safe" relationships where she could remain guarded. Harm wasn't the only one who built walls around himself. Mac was just as guilty of that as he was. 3) I'm not sure why she didn't do anything in the 2 months between her session with Dr. McCool and Christmas. It seemed that she had a lot of hope at the end of her session but she apparently didn't act on it. Maybe once she got back into the daily grind of life all those doubts and fears started to rise up again. And Sammy's point about Gen. Cresswell coming probably had something to do with it as well. 4) I think Mac meant that she was happy that they still had a chance. They were both still there for each other and still willing to work on something. Or, I could say, on a much deeper standpoint, that for the first time in a long time, she felt alive within herself. I think her relationship with Webb had caused her to feel dead inside. The fact that she had now dealt with some of her issues was helping her to feel whole again. And the fact that she hadn't lost Harm in the process (he said he was still here) was the best news she had gotten in a long time. So, in a way, they were both alive again and ready to move forward together. I'll not comment on why that didn't come to fruition in the months afterward, because then I'll just get mad again about a certain 500 lb. gorilla named Don! 5) I don't think I would have wanted to see all this in the premiere. Hearing Mac say "I can't" to Harm broke my heart. I wouldn't have wanted to start off the season with that. However, her attitude in the beach scene was heart-breaking too. The difference is that at the beach she had just found out that Webb was alive--she didn't know that at the Dining Out. I guess I saw the door still open at the end of H & F 2. But in 4%, her "I can't" hurt almost as much as her saying "never". I needed something encouraging after that to counter it. The ending of 4% served that purpose for me. That being said, I would have liked to have seen all of the therapy session in October when it actually happened. That goes for the Dining Out flashbacks as well--I would have included them during the therapy. It was confusing to see all this 2 months later at Christmas. And then to have flashbacks within the flashbacks was even more confusing! If this had aired in October, then Sammy's point about the timing with Cresswell would have made more sense and we would have understood why she didn't act on Dr. McCool's advice after she left the session. THEN they could have still had the car accident at Christmas and flashed back to a few of the highlights of the session in order to show us what she was thinking about in the ambulance. And, if they had done it that way (splitting the whole thing into 2 eps-one in Oct and one at Christmas), there would have been time to follow up on the scene at the end, i.e. the next morning. AND there would have been more time to add some things to make it more like a real Christmas ep. Maybe they could have shown everyone at Bud and Harriet's worrying about why Harm and Mac weren't there, Harm calling them to explain about the accident, etc. 6) I definitely think that the part about her ovulating normally should have been left in. It would have been such a nice Christmas gift for us. No woman wants to be told she is infertile (whether she wants to actually have children or not) and I thought it was unnecessarily cruel to have left her condition that way and never resolved it.(NT) -- JAG Junkie

It is a very emotional episode. I give it a 5 because of the following:It is not the best timing but after all these years, Harm finally told Mac how he feels about her and that he wants to be part of her life. He understood Mac�s pain of finding out about her fertility problem but he let her know that for him to become a father, it does not matter how it happens, it only matters if it happens between the two of them. He is willing to give Mac space and to wait for her to be ready. His statement about missing the way Mac looked when she talked about Webb and his acknowledgement that Webb made Mac felt good still brought tears to my eyes. IMO, his unconditional love means as much as or even more than the three little words that Mac wants to hear so much. (BTW, after what had happened, he still saw Webb as his friend. How can we not love this character?) - I love the Mac�s session with Dr. McCool. Great performance from CB. Dr. McCool is really cool. Mac�s response �I can�t� to Harm was heartbreaking (did you see the disappointment in Harm�s eyes?) but it delighted my heart to have the confirmation that to Mac, Harm is her closest friend. In crisis, Mac always went to Harm, she believed that he wont� abandon her, and Harm is always the one she intended to be with. Mac wants be have a child but she only wants to have a child with the right guy and of course, Harm is the guy. Her facial expression softens when she talks about Harm and her relationship.
- I�m glad to find out Mac�s feelings towards Webb. She was only working on to love him before his fake death. I love her comments about �wanted his actual death� and � little spooks mumbling into sneaker phones� � haha! I understand why Mac is not ready between H&F II and this episode but I wish she would give some hope to Harm for waiting. I�m glad that she apologized for pushing him away. The episode soothed my shipper heart to a certain degree. It raised my hope but also made the rest of the season a much more disappointment until the last 7.5 minutes.(NT) --Sunset

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