VoyForums
[ Show ]
Support VoyForums
[ Shrink ]
VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, 2, [3], 4 ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 19:29:23 10/28/02 Mon
Author: KatLurkin
Author Host/IP: pcp02303222pcs.manass01.va.comcast.net / 68.52.163.61
Subject: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX)


[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> Where to start??? -- Kaylorin, 10:29:57 10/29/02 Tue (pcp632159pcs.newhvn01.in.comcast.net/68.53.200.184)

Oh boy. I really have some problems with this story. The plot was... not so interesting if really there at all. I get that the point is to hook up B/X, and yay for Xan in the end, but I'm not sure I liked how it was gone about.

Note: I'm not really into reading POV, so if this is extra harsh, that could be part of the reason.

The writer touched on several emotional moments, without really bringing us to them. They just sort of popped up.

I thought Anya was well done. In Character. She was about the only one though.

Xander, as cool as he is, does not go out and kick vamp ass.. alone... ever. I mean, really. Having him do this alone seemed really off.

How can Buffy feel like such a slayer and be such a whimpering girly girl? I don't like when writers make her a slave to her feelings and thats kinda all she did here.

Props for not making Spike a terrible vampire just cuz it was a Xan fic.. so yay on that.

I did like Angel and Xander beign buds... and in all truth, we really don't know how they would react to eachother now.. so I'll just smile and nod.

I don't want to critique each character one by one, but several seemed off. Plus in a POV you really don't get much more than the person who's being POV'ed.

I did enjoy reading some of Xander's observations of Cordy and Angel. The writer did take time in making their characters who they are in season 2 AtS, so again.. props.

Overall though, I'm going to have to go lower than I'd like to. I had serious trouble trying to get into the story, something I had very littel trouble with last sessions BX.

74


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Chani, 13:13:42 10/29/02 Tue (curie.noos.net/212.198.0.93)

I did enjoy reading that story! I didn't force myself to read it at all. Besides, as i don't belive in a B/X pair, i think that only a new Buffy could fall in love with Xander. So with an amnesic Buffy, the love story can work IMO. This plot suited me. I also did like many dialogues, well written.

However, i have problems with the characterization. When I started to read this story, i found this Xander very cool and funny, but he wasn't the Xander i knew. I didn't recognize Xander's voice. He wasn't so far from "my" Xander, but he wasn't him.
Buffy wasn't the Buffy i knew either, but i guess i could deal with that since she wasn't supposed to be herself because of her amnesia. Xander knows that in the story when he talks about Buffy Before opposed to Buffy Now. There's something very interesting there. The author might have worked that deeperly.
Yet i am not convinced by the ending. It would have been more credible if Buffy had regained her memories later, and still had kept her feelings that way though...Finally the amnesia seems to be only a convenient tool to put Buffy and Xander together. That bothers me.
Sometimes the shippers are too much in a hurry :-)

Well as i have to give a grade...

80


[ Edit | View ]

[> And the B/Sers are first out of gates on reviews too.. -- ancientpeas, 14:56:44 10/29/02 Tue (CPE014370023562.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com/24.102.13.132)

Doesn't that indicate that they are the most impatient ones, Chani?

I wanted to like this one more than I did. I thought she did a good job making Xander very likeable and I did want him to win the girl. I liked that she didn't run down any of the other characters to get B/X together.
I didn't particularly care for Buffy in this one. Xander was so likeable and earnest and sweet.. but I didn't find Buffy to be strong like I like her to be.

But it wasn't bad..and I liked it more than the B/S one..which surprised me so I'll give it a

75


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> That's right Peas! Impatient is my name! -- Chani, 17:33:48 10/29/02 Tue (curie.noos.net/212.198.0.93)

But the next fic is a big one! I'm gonna start to read it...


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> I've finished it already.. -- ancientpeas, 17:02:40 10/30/02 Wed (CPE014370023562.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com/24.102.13.132)

now I'm waiting for Kat to spill on the W/T one..


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> Whaooouuu!!!!!!! -- Chani, 10:01:44 10/31/02 Thu (curie.noos.net/212.198.0.93)

I wish i could read that fast! But i have this little language handicap you know....


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> [> [> dear, if you go to the fanfiction web page -- KatLurkin, 11:40:44 11/02/02 Sat (pcp02303222pcs.manass01.va.comcast.net/68.52.163.61)

the W/T story is listed there :)

I just won't put it on the posting board until it is time to read :)


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Jade, 17:19:16 10/29/02 Tue (inktomi3-nth.server.ntl.com/62.253.32.6)

I did enjoy this more than the B/S one. It was well written and no spelling mistakes as far as I could see. I didn't think Xander, Buffy or Angel were in character though.

The scene with Dawn and Xander, could Dawn be any more selfish and whiny?

I also didn't like the S/D stuff. I don't think Spike would ever go for Dawn.

I can't really say much else, so I give it a 70.


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Leatrix, 02:20:11 10/30/02 Wed (httpproxy.clear.net.nz/203.97.2.243)

A busy week meant that I didn't give as much attention to this story as I should have. That said, my skim reading of it, gave me the impression that it was realtively well crafted by some things jarred.

I have to agree with Kaylorin here - POV fics are very hard (almost harder than having to read slash fics), to get involved in. Its even harder if the character isn't quite right. The allusion of Xander to being a "Han Solo" type character is particularly interesting. In fact I would put Spike more as "Han Solo", cos as much as he doesn't want to, he invariably ends up helping out.

Also the Dawn and Spike interactions were a bit off character-wise, as well as Xander's own interaction with Buffy. It didn't quite come across right, almost as if the author was trying too hard.

On the plus side, no bashing of other ships.

Overall score 75.


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- KatLurkin, 12:33:51 11/02/02 Sat (pcp02303222pcs.manass01.va.comcast.net/68.52.163.61)

I thought this story started quite slow, and was quite bored with it for the first page or so, but it did get more interestin and pull me in. I don't mind the POV story telling, can actually quite enjoy it on occasion. I liked this one after the story got me involved.

I really like anya being a vengence demon. But Ithought the actual end of the relation ship was a cop out for Xander. I would have like it more if they had explored more of him making a choice and admitting to partial responsibily to anya. Admitting that he had been waverine due to Buffy's reacton to him.

I also found the characterizations off. The characters didn't quite ring true. But despite that, I quite enjoyed reading this story after the first 2 pages or so.

When fan fiction has these flaw, it of course bring the score of the story down. But I thing the most important part of scoring for me. . . is can the story pull me in enough that I enjoy it despite the faults/flaw, this one did.

84


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Doe, 23:30:48 11/02/02 Sat (proxy.ia3.marketscore.com/66.119.33.135)

This was a nice little story but it had problems. I felt the characters weren't in character for much of the story. The author didn't manage make it believable that Buffy without memories would cling to Xander so much. I didn't believe that Willow wouldn't be mindful of Xander's feeling when she visited him at the construction site. There was just too much of this story that I couldn't buy for me to recommend it.

My score 70.


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Fantastic review, Scarlet Nicky. I agree with a great deal of what you said -- Ozmandayus, 12:03:41 11/03/02 Sun (cache-mtc-ac10.proxy.aol.com/64.12.96.79)


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- ScarletNicky, 10:08:03 11/03/02 Sun (cache-rk06.proxy.aol.com/152.163.189.70)

Although this is probably the toughest pairing for me to get into because at the moment I'm not feeling the love for either character on the show, I was surprised to find that I liked a lot of things about this story.

I did have some problems with it. I like a little more plot than we got here, and Xander is a tad idealized, although that is to be expected in a romantic fic. Also, I thought most of the characters were a bit off, and Angel is almost unrecognizable.

There were a lot of things I did like, though. Buffy's amnesia was a good choice, and made the B/X pairing more believable. I think one of the reasons Buffy has never considered Xander as a possible mate is that a part of her still sees him as the geek whose first line was "Can I have you?" The amnesia allows Buffy to see Xander as the man he has become without being prejudiced by memories of the boy he used to be.

Another thing I found interesting is how Bush calls attention to the fact that Buffy never apologizes for anything. I guess Spuffies and BXers have a little bit in common after all, which is one of the cool things this club helps us to realize.

One of the things I am tempted to criticize is the way the author allows Anya to pull a stupid stunt just as Xander is about to dump her, thereby getting him off the hook and making the breakup all her fault. Of course, anyone who watched "Selfless" the other night would have to admit that such a rash move would not be out of character for Anya, and in fact I think she is the character Bush wrote best.

So despite some problems with characterization, I think Lori Bush has crafted a well-written and convincing love story. I think she's a very talented writer and would definitely read something of hers again.

85


[ Edit | View ]

[> General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- morgain, 16:27:54 11/03/02 Sun (modemcable225.121-203-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca/24.203.121.225)

I wanted to start off my review with a revisitation to the mission of this club . . . to celebrate fan fiction writing.
Specifically the club is:
1- A place to share our favorite fan fiction with others
2- A place to learn about new fan fiction
3- A place to learn what attracts other people to their ships or lack of
4- A place to share what attracts people to their favorite ships
5- A way to send your opinions about fictions to the authors
[taken from the main page]

Points 3 and 4 were particularly important drawing principles for me, since I was interested in learning more about other people’s perspectives. And I am entering this review with this notion in mind. And I guess, I would like others to do the same, regardless of their ship preferences.

I liked the plot point about coming back “tabla rasa”. It allowed certain unstated emotional and psychological dynamics to appear [Giles’ fatherly attitude, for example]; but I wonder about using it as a device to pair up Buffy and Xander. In some ways, I find this insulting to the character of Xander-- Buffy will only see his value if her memory is erased? I am not a B/Xer, and like the strong friendship they have; however, if a writer would attempt to pair them up, I would like to see it done in a way that builds on the character’s strengths. For me, this was the Buffy of BBB, the one Xander would not take advantage of.... the one who Xander would want to come to him because she wanted to, not at the urging of a spell. However, the author seemed to “get” this about Xander by having Buffy get pieces of her memory back.

I found the intimation of Spike’s interest in Dawn totally unfounded in canon, the foundation to expand canon poorly created, and quite ooky. Yes, I am a fan of this character; however, I recognize that other fans and writers are not, and may see him in ways I find unfathomable. But given how the series has dealt with Spike and Dawn’s relationship in Blood Ties and Forever [ignoring S6 and Bargaining I and II, which had not happened yet at the writing of this story], as well as his reaction to Buffy’s death in The Gift, this pederastic portrayal [more Anne Rice-like that JW] seemed like a back-handed bash to the character and against the flow of the path that Joss has set this character on. But to remember things while speaking to Angel, but not remember the great love of her life seemed illogical to me.

I also INCREDIBLY disliked the plot twist of Anya / Anyanka wanting Buffy dead as a way to keep Xander. Not only did it not fit with the character, all she needed to do was to “make a wish” while feeling the revenge against her. It left the characterization of Xander off the hook, giving him the “moral high ground” when it was unjustified.

Characterization was the aspect that I found most troublesome. Really, none of the characters seem believable to me. I like the characters’ flaws; they make them more like me and the people I know and care about. This was an idealized Xander [really, the scene at the construction site] who has never spoken with such a vocabulary. I found the same true for practically every character, maybe with the exception of Cordelia.

It bothered me that it seemed as if Xander’s proposal of marriage was like a “pity proposal”, as if he had to grab Anya because no one else would want him. I cannot imagine Xander using someone like that. I think the author minimizes Xander’s love of Anya in favour of his love for Buffy. I personally would have found it more interesting to explore the situation of loving two people at the same time; it may not happen often [I think it does] but it does happen. It would have made an interesting tension, that, I think, is reflected in the characters as they appear on TV. Instead, I thought the author chose simplicity over human complexity.

This point is one based purely on personal taste, but affects my enjoyment of fanfic. I tend to tire of fiction written in the first person unless there is a compelling plot, a real thorny dilemma the character is wrestling with, or a series of situations that demand deep reflection on the part of the character. Otherwise, it is like, for me, an “overdose” on a character, and I often feel trapped in their head. Some authors do it well in short pieces [Jessie is one], but I found that this author was not able to avoid this pitfall for me for a longer story. There was really no theme to the story, except as an effort to get a couple together, making the story quite thin.

It wasn’t bad, just not very interesting for me. This is not a fic that could convince me of the compelling attraction of this ‘ship.

I rate it a 70.


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Muttley, 17:08:09 11/03/02 Sun (inktomi1-swa.server.ntl.com/213.105.224.4)

Well, I started off finding this story quite difficult to get into. The lack of action in the first chapter combined with the POV narrative and some overly involved sentence construction left me cold.However, perseverance did pay off and I did gradually get more involved with the story.

I liked some of the exchanges between Xander & Angel, and Xander & Spike, but found the low-key presence of Willow somewhat strange given that they're supposed to be best friends. Also the characterisation of Buffy didn't sit well with me at all and the plot device of making Anya return to being a Vengance Demon before Xander had his talk seemed a bit of a cop-out.

All in all, I enjoyed it more than I originally thought I would, so going to give it 83.


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Bri, 01:54:00 11/04/02 Mon (cpe-66-1-253-227.co.sprintbbd.net/66.1.253.227)

I really don't know what to say about this story, which is in itself a problem. If I can't say I loved it or hated it, to me, it's not very interesting. I don't know, I liked it, somewhat. It's just that it wasn't captivating.

I haven't read stuff at fanfiction.net before, so I wasn't aware of the way they set chapters up. The first time around I read the first chapter, thought that was the entire story. Mildly interested, but more relatively bored. It wasn't until I started reading everyone else's reviews that I realized I'd missed some stuff, so I went back and figured it out, read the whole thing. And I'm having difficulty coming up with something to say about it other than, "Eh. It was a B/X story."

There were some good things about it. I liked the concept of Buffy coming back without her memories. Sometimes a fresh start, without preconceptions, is a good way to look at things. I also liked Anya, and I believed that her reunion with D'Hoffryn wasn't based out of malice but out of hope and confusion. To me, her and Cordy's characterizations were the ones that rang the truest. I also liked Spike, although it was hard for me to see him and Xander being all chummy, but Lori explained it well.

There were really glaringly obvious problems as well. Aside from the fact that I like the idea of a clean slate for Buffy, I have to agree with someone else's review (and I apologize for not knowing whose-there are lots of pieces of reviews that I agreed with that I may mention but I can't remember who wrote what), that it's not cool that Buffy could only love Xander if she didn't remember him. And that Xander would tolerate it... That's just wrong. He's come a long way from being the guy who would accept being degraded like that. Not only that, but he's never been the type to take advantage, again as someone else pointed out, as exemplified in BBB.

I disliked Spike and Angel being all eager to hand Buffy over to Xander, both having found their peace/happiness with another female. Granted, both Spike and Dawn and Angel and Cordy have canonical relationships of a sort, but I don't think either vampire would be all happy to see Buffy throwing herself at Xander. Spike especially wouldn't give up so easy-Angel's had his time to move on, but the last we saw of Spike and Buffy, he was still putting the idea of their relationship on a pedestal and nothing and no one could talk him into abandoning it. A summer of her being dead and all of a sudden he's moving on to little sis and perfectly blase about her feelings for someone else? Not likely.

That said, I do like the way she progressed. She started out being weak and simple and girly, and she finally got to the point of being the Buffy we know, knowing what she wanted and fighting for it. A lot of people mentioned that, as well as Xander being an idealized, "perfect" version, and I was expecting to agree, but I didn't see it *so* much. I disliked how he went high and mighty on Anya, even knowing that he was partially at fault for her decision and also after listening to her explanation and apology. However, there was a lot of internal exposition that revealed to us that he *knew* he was being a jerk, and he was trying to do the right thing, but he wasn't always, and there was a lot of confusion in his head and he didn't know what to do. That's life. I think Lori did a good job with him. I like POV fics for that reason-we get a clearer view of a character's thoughts and motivations. In a long fic like this, however, sometimes it's not the best way to go.

Okay, so I didn't think I knew what to say, and it turns out I had too much to say. LOL Overall, I think the problem for me is that although there were lots of elements to dissect, some of which I really liked and some of which I intensely disliked, as a whole the story was just surface skimming. Nothing went deep enough to satisfy my curiosity. "What made Buffy come back without her memories? How did she start developing them again? What was Willow's motivation? Why were all the characters so eager to get Buffy and Xander together?" I read the story with only slight interest, and once I came to the end, I didn't feel an overwhelming sense of *anything*. I wasn't excited, or happy, or bothered, or irritated, or anything else. It was kind of like the mental equivalent of a shrug. As one of my friends would say, it made me go, "Meh. Done now. What next?"

So I guess although there were good spots here and there, the lack of involvement will take my rating down much lower than it would be otherwise. I give it a 73.


[ Edit | View ]

[> [> Re: Missing chapters -- Muttley, 18:25:38 11/05/02 Tue (inktomi1-swa.server.ntl.com/213.105.224.4)

Bri

Glad to know i wasn't only me who only read the first chapter and thought "huh?". As you say, it was only reading other reviews that made me think "am i missing something here". Nice to know i'm not the only one. Thanks


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Girl Guide jones, 18:36:50 11/06/02 Wed (dhcp024-210-034-173.columbus.rr.com/24.210.34.173)

Hmmm. I'm afraid I have to say that I was very bored while reading this story.

A story needs to have some sort of a plot to hook the viewer, or to be an interesting window into a character if it's a POV, as this one is supposed to be. This story was neither of these things.

Buffy was a wimp. Why would Xander -or anyone else, for that matter- want this needy excuse for a girl we are shown? Ugh.

Xander's characterization was so far off that it discolored any other perceptions in the story. The bit with Anya was clearly a device used to make Xander a shining knight whose every decision was justified. Why? This is not the Xander we've been shown on BtVS.

And there was no reason established for why a mind-wiped Buffy would love Xander any more than a Buffy who just moved to Sunnydale and didn't know him from Adam then, either.

Nothing rang true here. In fact, it clanged with discord. I give it a 65.

~GGj


[ Edit | View ]

[> Re: General Review & Discussion: Tabula Rasa By Lori Bush (BX) -- Dawny, 02:11:30 11/09/02 Sat (216-229-82-50-dialup-mo.fidnet.com/216.229.82.50)

I too thought the majority of the characterization was way off. They just didn't seem to meld together. The story itself seemed unreal.

I just couldn't stay interested.

78


[ Edit | View ]


[ Contact Forum Admin ]

Forum timezone: GMT-5
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.