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Date Posted: 03:23:23 03/20/03 Thu
Author: Ïðîõîæèé
Subject: Ôèëîñîôñêèå äåáðè: ÷òî äåëàòü?
In reply to: ßê 's message, "Re: Èñïðàâëåíèå êðèâèçíû" on 23:34:29 03/19/03 Wed

>Äåëî íå òîëüêî â "óðîâíå", íî è â ôîðìå. Ðîññèÿ è
>ðóññêèå ñëèøêîì áåñôîðìåííû. Ïðèðîäà áîãàòàÿ - à ôîðìû
>íåò.

×òî Âû ïîíèìàåòå ïîä "ôîðìîé" (î÷åâèäíî, ñîçíàíèÿ, ïîñêîëüêó ðå÷ü øëà î ñîçíàíèè), êàê Âû îïðåäåëÿåòå åå? À òî çäàåòñÿ ìíå, Âû ñûïëåòå íàóêîîáðàçíûìè íè÷åãî íå çíà÷àùèìè ôðàçàìè.

Ìîæåò ðàçúÿñíèòå, ÷òî òàêîå ôîðìà, åñëè è íå óêàçàâ íà åå ïðèçíàêè, îïðåäåëÿþùèå çíà÷åíèå ýòîé êàòåãîðèè è îòäåëÿþùèå åå îò äðóãèõ ïîíÿòèé, òî õîòÿ áû ïðîñòî ïðå÷èñëèâ òî, êàêèå åñòü ôîðìû?

Èç êóðñà ôèëîñîôèè ÿ ïîìíþ î ñóùåñòâîâàíèè íåñêîëêèõ ôîðì îáùåñòâåííîãî ñîçíàíèÿ: ðåëèãèîçíîå, ïîëèòè÷åñêîå, ïðàâîâîå è ò. ä. Åñëè, ãîâîðÿ î ôîðìå, âû èìåëè ââèäó èìåííî ýòè ôîðìû, óêàæèòå, ïîæàëóéñòà, êàêèå îòñóñòâèå êàêèõ èç íèõ äåëàåò ðóññêèõ áåñôîðìåííûìè.


> îòíîøåíèè ÷åëîâå÷åñêîãî õàðàêòåðà ñåðüåçíûõ
>ôîðìîîáðàçóþùèõ ôàêòîðîâ âñåãî íåñêîëüêî (åñëè
>îòáðîñèòü áèðþëüêè). Èõ ëåãêî ïåðå÷èñëèòü. Ýòî
>Öåðêîâü, ñåìüÿ, ñèñòåìà îáðàçîâàíèÿ è ïðàâîâàÿ
>ñèñòåìà. Ïîæàëóé, êðîìå ýòèõ ÷åòûðåõ, è íåòó íè÷åãî
>ñóùåñòâåííîãî.

Íó âîò Âû è ðåøèëè îñíîâíîé âîïðîñ ôèëîñîôèè î òîì áûòèå ëè îïðåäåëÿåò ñîçíàíèå èëè íàîáîðîò: îêàçûâàåòñÿ âñå îïðåäåëÿåòñÿ ñåìüåé, öåðêîâüþ, îáðàçîâàíèåì è ïðàâîì. À ôèëîñîôû-òî - äóðàêè, íàñîçäàâàëè øêîë, ïðîñïîðèëè îá ýòîì íå îäíî òûñÿ÷åëåòèå, à âñå îòêðîâåíèå ìîæíî áûëî âîò òàê ïðîñòî è ÿñíî âûëîæèòü íà ôîðóìå è ïîñòàâèòü æèðíóþ òî÷êó.

>È âñå ÷åòûðå íàõîäÿòñÿ ñåé÷àñ â
>ãëóáîêîì êðèçèñå.

Íó, óæ, íå âñå. Öåðêîâü ÷óâñòâóåò ñåáÿ íàìíîãî ñâîáîäíåå, ÷åì â ïåðèîä ìåæäó 1917 è 1985, â îáëàñòè ïðàâà âîîáùå âñå î÷åíü õîðîøî ðàçèâàåòñÿ (åñòü ïðîáëåìû ñ ïðàâîïðèìåíåíèåì, íî óæå ñîâñåì íå òå, ÷òî áûëè, ñêàæåì ëåò ïÿòü íàçàä), îáðàçîâàíèå â ïîñëåäíèå ãîäû, äóìàþ, íå ñòàëî õóæå, ïðàâäà, ñòàëî ìåíåå äîñòóïíûì, î êðèçèñå òóò ãîâîðèòü ïîêà, äóìàþ íå ïðèõîäèòñÿ. Õóæå âñåãî ñ ñåìüåé, íî è òî, ýòî â îñíîâíîì êàñàåòñÿ ðîæäàåìîñòè è âíåáðà÷íîé ðîæäàåìîñòè.

>Èíîãäà äàæå ñòðàøíî ñòàíîâèòñÿ.
>×èòàåøü êàêîé-íèáóäü Ñåðàôèìîâñêèé ìàíèôåñò

Óâû, íå ÷èòàë. ×òî ýòî çà äîêóìåíò?

>- âðîäå
>âñå ïðàâèëüíî ëþäè ãîâîðÿò, íî òàêîå âïå÷àòëåíèå, ÷òî
>îíè íå âïîëíå ïðåäñòàâëÿþò ñåáå êà÷åñòâî ÷åëîâå÷åñêîãî
>ìàòåðèàëà, ñ êîòîðûì ïðèçûâàþò èäòè â áóäóùåå, è
>ñëèøêîì ïîëàãàþòñÿ íà ïëîñêî-ýêîíîìè÷åñêèå ôàêòîðû.

Âîò ÿ Âàì áûëî ïûòàëñÿ óêàçàòü íà êà÷åñòâî ìàòåðèàëà, à Âû ìåíÿ òóò æå îáâèíèëè â ïðîñëàâëåíèè ïîðîêà.

>Â îáùåì, ðåöåïòîâ ÿ íå çíàþ. "Çíàë áû ïðèêóï - æèë áû â
>Ñî÷è".

Ïîëó÷àåòñÿ, ÷òî ñïûñûâàíèåì ñî ñ÷åòîâ ðóññêîãî íàðîäà, îáúÿâëÿÿ åãî áåñôîðìåííûì, íå âïîëíå êà÷åñòâåííûì ìàòåðèàëîì äëÿ òîãî, ÷òîáû èäòè ñ íèì â áóäóùåå, Âû îïðàâäûâàåòå ñâîå íåçíàíèå òîãî, ÷òî äåëàòü (èëè âäîáàâîê ê òîìó ñîïóòñâóþùåå åìó íåæåëàíèå óçíàòü, ÷òî äåëàòü, ïîñêîëüêó äåëàòü íè÷åãî íå âîçìîæíî, òàê êàê ìàòåðèàë âñå-ðàâíî ïëîõîé).

Íå î÷åíü, çàìå÷ó, êîíñòðóêòèâíàÿ ïîçèçèÿ.

Íå çíàþ, âîçìîæíî Âû ñêåïòè÷åñêè îòíåñåòåñü ê ìîåìó ñîâåòó, ìîæåò áûòü äàæå îáúÿâèòå åãî áàíàëüíîñòüþ, íî, ïî-ìîåìó, íàäî ðàáîòàòü ñ òåì ìàòåðèàëîì, êàêîé åñòü. À äëÿ ýòîãî ñëåäóåò äëÿ íà÷àëà ïîëþáèòü ìàòåðèàë è íå çàíèìàòüñÿ âûèñêèâàíèåì â íåì îáúåêòîâ äëÿ êðèòèêè (êðèòèêîâ, ïîâåðüòå ìíå, è òàê íàéäåòñÿ ïðåäîñòàòî÷íî), à ïîèñêîì òîãî ïîëîæèòåëüíîãî â ìàòåðèàëå, ðàçâèòèå ÷åãî ïîçâîëèò åìó ñòàòü ëó÷øå.

Èíà÷å íóæíî ìåíÿòü ìàòåðèàë: ìåíÿòü Ðîäèíó è ãðàæäàíñòâî.

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