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Date Posted: 02:02:33 04/28/04 Wed
Author: sundarar - 3 Apr 2004
Subject: Re: the 3 steps on the (kriya) path
In reply to: Hendrik - 3 Apr 2004 's message, "Re: the 3 steps on the (kriya) path" on 02:01:52 04/28/04 Wed


Good post Hendrik. I have always liked your posts, particularly on this matter. The essential thing most agree on is to eliminate the ego or transcend the gunas. As to what you percieve after that I think it is similar but the way the devotee relates to it or describes it is unique to him. Yogananda said each romance with God is different, and I do appreciate Krishnamurti's and Shibendu's encouragement to forget the mind-mesh on a certain level.

Swami Ramdas and Aurobindo's way of describing blend it nicely. (I prefer Shankara, Ramana, Sivananda, but Yogananda blends them all and makes most sense to me.) However, could it all be semantics here that differ and might the essential experience be the same? When they say Bagavan comes after Brahman aren't they describing Yogananda's nirbikalpa samadhi? The romance with God only truly happens when you see Brahman everywhere and he wallks with you, talks with you, etc.

Ramdas criticizes Shankara and Buddha for stopping at Brahman or nirvana only. Ramdas says the next step is to have Bagavan and to be a servant. Aurobindo says we must contribute to evolution. Then Vivekananda was commissioned with a similar ideal to serve people from Ramakrishna. But he still stayed with the Sankara view as I understand it.

Yogananda in his gita says he personally likes the saint who is active in the world over the inactive ones in caves, BUT he says they are both equal. Anandamoy says that most masters that get full liberation do not stay in the body long, nor return to the body ever again. You have this choice. Gyanamata is said to have merged, whereas Rajarsi did not and is helping Paramahansaji. I think Ramakrishna talked of this--7 to 21 days usually and they are gone. They merge in Brahman. Who is anyone to say that is lesser. Sure, the world can use agents of divine working, but I don't see anything wrong with Shankara. Besides, Ramdas was a bakta, and though equal in realization with a Ramana, I would chant with the former and get explanations from the latter. I learned not to ask intricate questions of Baktananda of SRF for instance. With Anandamoy you can. Even if fully enlightened they have their body-mind to work through.

Srila Prabhupad and the Krishnas have a different goal all together it seems. They want to go to Brahma-Loka (said to be a part of Iswara) and worship God by keeping the sattvic ego. At the end of the kalpa (trillions of solar years from now) such beings are said to merge in Brahman. Seems many SRF devotee's want the same, and talk of the day when they will all get "there" with Master and rejoice, all together. To each his own. Thing is, Yogananda said until nirvikalpa, you can fall, and all the way down at that. Others may become devas or merged in nature for siddhis and the like. Daya Mata told a bunch of monks that without humility one could rise up to the highest levels, and then fall all the way down.

See, with my Christian Methodist background it is a constant temptation to me in my mind to settle for worshipping God and serving others while actualizing virtues as the ultimate goal. It hasn't given bliss to me in the past, whereas yoga has.

Lahiri said 'No-one is satan. The mind (manas)itself is the satan.' The mind here is not the buddhi, which I hope we are partially using when we make these posts. It is the manas that is in the crown chakra that via kama (desire)drops to the senses in the low 3 chakras he describes here. That was satan's fall of lightening as I understand it now.

Another thing: Are these posts worrthless banter? I don't thinks so--Yukteswar said in autobiography of a yogi: 'quotations there have been in abundance, but what unique testimony can you give through your own life and realization?' This posting is my main recreation right now because I am in seclusion a few months. Yukteswar used to go discuss kriya and yoga with Bagabati Ghosh 'hour after hour' once a week at 4 Garpar road in Calcutta. This is the kriya discussion board, not the kriya condemnation board. Few people really share on this board. I deeply appreciate the ones who do.

I think at this point to aspire to virtuous life, Brahma-loka, or Bagavan is a trick of the manas. That's my view, let other have their view. But if you are a yogi I think you have to have a general idea of what you want, or you can't set your determination (sankalpa) to accomplish it. Once you truly set this, the work is near done. For a serious yogi he can't be reminded of his lofty goal enough! That has been my experience in yoga. The problem starts when people are dishonest with themselves, what they want. I myself prefer Han Solo or a honest scoundrel or critic to almost everyone else! Be true to your experience and face fears. This seems the first step in yoga. Where Patanjali says in chapter 1:1 --"now an explanation of yoga". Be honest, self-reliant and fearless. Without psychological maturity yoga won't work well. If I am not honestly craving God union, I figured it would be better for me to take up TM for relaxation. I seriously considered this awhile back. This kriya path is indeed not for the faint of heart.

With humility I am also trying to open to whatever will happen. No sense of forcing anything or trying to be anyone else. It's an adventure. Its like a snake shedding it's skin. May each man have his own religion, thats Vivekananda's idea. This is the spice of life. May each follow his Bliss.

best wishes

Sundarar

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