Subject:  Re: the lies of christians |
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Bible Thumper
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Date Posted: 01:35:49 06/25/05 Sat
In reply to:
mike and sandy
's message, "the lies of christians" on 16:36:00 05/02/05 Mon
>Believe in Love - When I say believe in love, I mean
>it in a different way than most Christians would
>interpret it. What I mean is that there is an
>imaginary struggle between the Christian and Christ or
>God, this struggle is for either Christ’s or the
>person’s subjectivity. Thus believing in Love
>essentially means killing Christ or nailing him to the
>cross in a metaphorical sense so that your
>subjectivity may flourish. He then becomes object and
>you become subject or master. He becomes your servant
>fulfilling his own admission, “I have not come here to
>be served but to serve.” One really then sees the
>necessity of Christ dying, so that one may live or
>become one’s own master. You believe that He Loves
>you and wants to be your servant. Let us also believe
>in the Love of his followers, they Love you and want
>to serve you, for they Love their enemies!
>
>True Christianity is against one’s best interest.
>True Christianity is essentially a feminine religion
>in a bad sense, a slave morality born from the Jews
>who were being oppressed by the Romans. It is exactly
>as Nietzsche says, imaginary attacks and efforts to
>stifle those who pose threats to them - for a slave or
>an oppressed person to feel more freedom. The
>individual says he or she values humility, and gets
>upset if another is not soft or humble, thereby
>leveling that person’s strength. If someone ignores
>the Christian’s objections and in turn oppresses the
>Christian by making fun of them or laughing at them,
>then the Christian thinks he or she is suffering for
>the Lord. I mean this point seems so obvious
>psychologically that one cannot see how a Christian
>could miss it. Imagine that a person is oppressed but
>needs to assert itself. It couldn’t assert itself
>with pride or confidence or brute strength or
>boldness, for the oppressor stands in its way, however
>what it could do is that it could assert itself in
>imaginary ways, it could claim that universal morals
>dictate that one be soft, or humble, and that one
>should serve, thereby freely asserting itself and
>attempting to avenge itself on the oppressor, trying
>to persuade it that true morals dictate that it be
>soft and humble and service-oriented toward it, and
>thereby attempting to make the oppressor feel guilty.
>“Repent, Repent, it says, become weak!” though as
>Nietzsche says, “it says become good!” Though one
>must note, that repent is only directed toward the
>unbeliever. Believers themselves oppress others in
>organized religion through subtleties and abstractions
>from the Bible itself.
>
>This fact really demonstrates the genius of the Bible,
>for the Bible gives force to the oppression in
>organized religion itself through the contrasts of the
>Old Testament and the New Testament. The oppressor
>defends itself by saying it has the spiritual gift of
>leadership or by quoting verses from the Old
>Testament, which show the people of God acting in a
>bold and strong manner. What they fail to see is that
>in both the Old Testament and the New Testament the
>individuals are merely asserting themselves in light
>of the possibilities allowed. The Old Testament
>contains morals that are normal. Seek power and
>achieve worldly success with the help of God through
>honoring God. It is not until the same people become
>oppressed that the values are inverted as in the New
>Testament when the Israelites are oppressed by the
>Romans that the Christians speak of the slave morals
>such as service, meekness, humility, and hating “the
>world.” Now that there is such diversity in statuses
>of born-again Christians, you can act whichever way
>you want, if you’re on the bottom, be meek and humble,
>and complain about those who are on the top and are
>being bold as not being those who are acting in
>accordance with Christianity. If you’re on the top,
>reading verses about such figures as Gideon and
>Samson, who the Lord gave strength to overcome their
>enemies and use that to ease your conscience when you
>oppress others in the name of the Lord. Essentially
>you can act however you want if you don’t participate
>in premarital or extramarital sex and you don’t become
>involved in “the world” or enjoy what “the world” does
>by not having a sense of humor (telling dirty or
>oppressive jokes), and live a life of contradiction by
>doing such paradoxical things as being boldly humble,
>or a Servant Leader or whatever other things such
>phony Christians do, the thing they get the “worldly
>people” angry without these worldly people even
>knowing what they are angry at. It is a visceral
>anger, evolved for the non-Christian’s benefit,
>because the non-Christian’s subconscious sees through
>the Christian’s lies and knows that its status or
>power is being threatened.
>
>What thing better reflects the born-again as being
>dishonest than Christian music? Done for the Lord,
>these Singers get rich and get the best-looking girls
>in their Christian cohort. Could they be the victims
>of the very evolution they claim not to believe in?
>
>The book, “The Moral Animal” has some incredible
>points that relate specifically to the dishonesty of
>Christians. It has a chapter on “deception.” It
>talks about how innocuous snakes for instance have
>evolved for its own protection to look like poisonous
>snakes. Could the opposite be true of the Christians?
> Could poisonous snakes have evolved to appear as
>innocuous snakes? Certainly some snakes are more
>poisonous than others. It also depends on the
>situation. Within organized Christianity, oppression
>is the most subtle and deceptive. Leaders preach
>about slave virtues as they assert themselves in a
>strong way. Christian musicians might even call
>themselves foolish in the eyes of the world as they
>woo women and are looked up to by their Christian
>peers. These are the poisonous snakes showing
>themselves as innocuous. For within this cohort, the
>leaders and musicians have high status as a result of
>their roles and are instinctively perceived by others
>as being virtuous as a result of their “humble”
>behavior. Humility for them actually improves their
>status. Now let us examine the humility of someone
>who is not a leader or musician, is lonely, perhaps
>not as attractive either. Does their same assertion
>of humility seem as glamorous? The correct answer of
>course is no. Others instinctively perceive their
>humility as a lack of confidence or basically as an
>example that they are “uncool”. What should we say,
>perhaps they are right?
>
>They may be right because of another lie that
>Christians try to throw at us – perhaps if only
>subconsciously believing this to be the case. For as
>“the moral animal” explains, ‘in order for deception
>to be effective, the person doing the deceiving must
>actually believe in the deception. They believe that
>there is a deeper world, a reality behind appearance.
>Thus people aren’t humble because they are humble,
>they are humble because they are righteous.
>
>If I look back at my own experience, I see that this
>is in fact what happened to me. In my mind, I
>believed I was being virtuous, being humble, treating
>others as better than myself, hanging out with those
>who were uncool, basically doing everything that the
>‘righteous leaders’ of Christianity don’t do. I was
>at the time, a freshman in high school. Needless to
>say, my peers didn’t see my deeper meaning, but
>interpreted my behavior as they saw it, and looking
>back, were probably right, that I was ‘uncool.’ At
>the time, however, I thought I was righteous.
>
>This happens very often to those who are converted but
>have not in fact grown up in the religion themselves.
>I would guess that those who have grown up in
>born-again Christianity probably chuckle a bit to
>themselves at the newly converted’s zeal. That they
>probably do laugh to themselves indicates to me how
>evil organized religion can be. For many of these new
>converts don’t understand hypocrisy, or the many
>subtleties that Christianity keeps silent about. They
>think to themselves, “If other people are really going
>to hell when they die, I should do something about
>it.” They evangelize recklessly, destroying
>relationships and isolating themselves from the very
>people who once gave them power and strength.
>Born-agains who have been in the game for a while
>however, evangelize when it poses no direct threat to
>their livelihood, and do it when they instinctively
>feel threatened and see instilling meekness in another
>to be to their advantage, especially if the person
>they see free from their control can become under
>their control if turned Christian. For instance, if
>they are a parent, a boss, a leader, or in any
>position where humility is a virtue for them and a
>vice to the newly converted.
>
>Another lie that Christians believe in is this
>dichotomy of the insanely wicked and the righteous
>born agains. They believe for instance, if they
>weren’t Christians that that would mean that they get
>drunk everyday, do drugs, or have crazy orgies
>everyday of their lives. They in turn create for
>themselves an unhealthy anxiety. They fail to see the
>fact that many people who are not born-agains live
>morally a much better life than themselves precisely
>because they don’t take life so seriously. They go to
>work, try to give it their best. They have friends
>they really like because of their friends’ qualities.
>They in fact live a better life because there is no
>dishonesty or contradictions. The strong are strong
>because they are strong, the physically beautiful are
>beautiful because they are physically beautiful, they
>drink a beer because they enjoy having a few, and not
>because they’re plunging to the dark-side and must
>drink a case if they don’t have Jesus on their side.
>In short, most non-Christians are amoral but end up
>living better moral lives if only by virtue of their
>honesty.
>
>The born-agains however think that they have some sort
>of monopoly on morals and moral living - that if
>you’re not like them that you are somehow lost and
>living with some sort of ineffable guilt that is
>continuously oppressing you. One lie that they love
>to say is that if you don’t have God or more
>specifically, their version of God, you can’t live a
>purposeful life. Maybe the purpose in life actually
>deals with what you can see and experience. For
>instance life itself, maybe it’s not so deep. Could
>life consist of doing a good job at work, enjoying
>people’s company who are close to you, and
>occasionally doing things that are fun on the side.
>In a word, could the purpose of life be life itself?
"If we are to understand how to answer the fool, if we are to be able to demonstrate that God has made the pseudo-wisdom of the world foolish, then we must first study the biblical conception of the fool and his foolishness. In scriptural perspective the fool is not basically a shallow-minded or illiterate ignoramus; he can be quite educated and sophisticated in social reckoning. However, he is a fool because he has forsaken the source of true wisdom in God in order to rely on his own (allegedly), self-sufficient, intellectual powers. He is unteachable (Prov. 10:8 ) and despises instruction (Prov. 15:5); whereas the wise man heeds council given to him,'The way of a fool is right in his own eyes' (Prov. 12:15). The fool has utter self-confidence and imagines himself to be intellectually autonomous. 'He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool' (Prov. 28:26). A fool cannot think of himself as mistaken (Prov. 17:10). He judges matters according to his own pre-established standards of truth and right, and thus his own thoughts always turn out in the long run to be correct. The fool is sure that he can rely on his own rational authority and intellectual scrutiny. 'The fool beareth himself insolently and is confident' (Prov. 14:16), and therefore he utters his own mind (Prov. 29:11). In actuality, this autonomous man is dull, stubborn, boorish, obstinate and stupid. He professes himself to be wise, but from the opening of his mouth it is clear that he is (in the biblical sense) 'a fool' - his only wisdom would consist in keeping silent (Prov. 17:28 ). 'The heart of fools proclaimeth foolishness' (Prov. 12:23), and the fool flaunts his folly (Prov. 13:16). He eats up folly unreflectingly (Prov. 15:14), pours it out (Prov. 15:2), and returns to it like a dog to his vomit (Prov. 26:11). He is so in love with his folly and so dedicated to its preservation that 'It is better for a man to meet a bear robbed of her whelps, than a fool is his folly' (Prov. 17:12). The fool does not want to find the truth; he only wants to be self-justified in his own imaginations. While he may feign objectivity, 'A fool hath no delight in understanding, but only that his heart may reveal itself' (Prov. 18:2). He is committed to his own presuppositions and wishes to guard his autonomy. Thus he will not depart from evil (Prov. 13:19), and thus all his knowledgeable talk reveals nothing but perverse and lying lips (Prov. 10:18; 19:1). He may talk proudly, but "A fool's mouth is his destruction, and his lips are a snare of his soul' (Prov. 18:7). He shall not endure the judgment of God (Ps. 5:5)." (Greg Bahnsen, Always Ready, pp. 55-56)"
According to the Bible you are a fool.
Psalm 14:1 "The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.'"
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