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Date Posted: Tue, Apr 20 2004, 1:10:16
Author: Mad Katharine (AKA Raptor Red)
Subject: Re: self insert =/= mary sue
In reply to: Sol 1056 's message, "self insert =/= mary sue" on Sat, Apr 17 2004, 18:46:48

>I've done a few self-inserts, here and there, where I
>needed to flesh out a character and picked a trait
>familiar to me. Photography, gardening, mechanics - I
>know these, so I find the character take on my
>characteristics when they're dealing with them. So,
>mild self-insert.
>
>A self-insert isn't necessarily bad, in the hands of a
>good writer. Joss Whedon's been pretty upfront that
>Xander is his version of a self-insert; Xander is
>Joss' interpretation of what he was like in high
>school...and it's not the most complimentary portrait,
>either!

That's a good point. Everyone has heard at least one writing teacher say "write what you know". I had one who went a few steps further- watch people and learn from them, because they too can be fodder for filling in the persona and backgrounds of fictional characters. Putting a little of ourselves into our characters is self-insertion, yes, but who's to know if the character is crafted so well that it fits seamlessly into the story without battering down what made the original universe so interesting to begin with?

What makes Mary Sue so different is that no matter how well crafted she may seem, no matter how many attributes or faults she may have, the one fatal flaw that makes her stand out with all the subltety of a Budweiser neon beer light is that she is a leech. She sucks the life out of the original characters, overriding them and the stories in whatever series they're in by becoming the Center of their Universe. All the original characters seem to wither on the vine when Mary Sue enters the story, becoming ancillary to her.

>A Mary Sue - self-insert or not - is *idealized*.
>That's the bottom line of a Mary Sue, whether or not
>s/he is based on the author. The two are not mutually
>exclusive, however, as it's possible to idealize one's
>pixel form, moving from basic self-insert to Mary Sue
>in nothing flat.

Heh, that's another good one. One of the reasons why a good writer should always bug their beta/editor to make sure any "idealized character" doesn't cross that line.

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