Re: Time Monks -- The PM Refugees' Forum

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Date Posted: 20:12:30 09/27/08 Sat
Author: Michael
Subject: Re: Time Monks
In reply to: iteo 's message, "Re: Time Monks" on 22:06:45 09/26/08 Fri

You misunderstand my point. How can you claim to 'know' its the 'end times' yet also question my confidence about my practice on the basis that I cant be so certain unless Im enlightened? You cant have it both ways.

I still maintain that if you spread this stuff around you are promoting it, and you will take on the responsibility. If I post an article on bomb making on the web, because i think its interesting, even if I disapprove of bombmaking, if someone reads it then makes a bomb, can I say I have no responsibility?

You post this stuff, presumably in the hope that others may read it and be interested.

In my humble opinion you are encouraging people to get further and further involved in fake 'spirituality'. I would (and do) say the same to people who peddle the other rubbish about horoscopes, fortune telling and communicating with the dead etc

As to the 'end times' you believe in it - fine. You do NOT 'know' you merely believe that you 'know'. I beleive you had some spiritual experience and oyu would be wise to discuss it with a real enlightened master who would explain it to you and put it in the correct context.

>When I say that you're not enlightened, I didn't mean
>that as a judgement as if I am better than you. You
>have stated in previous posts that you are on the
>spiritual path and a seeker - meaning that you are not
>enlightened. Also I don't think I negated your path, I
>merely suggested that maybe other paths (even ones
>that seem daft) are just as valid as yours.
>
>Also, no, I never said I was enlightened - I said I
>had an enlightenment experience. There's a difference.
>
>At the time I didn't even recognize it for what it was
>- it was only later after reading jack kornfield's
>book "After the Ecstasy, the Laundry" that I realized
>that it was an enlightenment experience. Many have had
>these types of experiences but in all cases - the
>effects wear off and become nothing more than a "fond
>memory".
>
>I am now as trapped in samsara as anyone else - but
>the experience I had was real - even though I realize
>there's no reason anyone should believe me.
>
>But you say I am taking on the responsibility for
>others? I disagree. IMHO, everyone's path and
>experiences are their own responsibility. As to what
>is false or true - the only thing I know for certain
>is that these are the end times.
>
>Everything else I preface with the notion that just
>because I find these ideas interesting, I still always
>refrain from believing in any of them. I write what I
>write with the hope that my story and my sincerity
>will cause some to merely wonder and maybe start
>seeking themselves.
>
>Everyone is in for an awakening, but for those who are
>not interested in seeking, it will likely be a rude
>awakening.
>
>
>>You tell me that as Im not enlightened then I cannot
>>be sure of my practice, then you state that what you
>>state isnt a beleif, but you "know" - are you
>>enlightened?
>>
>>By all means 'seek' every daft 'spiritual' idea.
>>There's loads of them, it will give you something to
>>do until the 'end'.
>>
>>As to encouraging, albeit passively, others to 'seek'
>>all this stuff, all I can say to that is you are
>>taking on the responsibility for their spiritual
>>development or retardation. If what you put in front
>>of them turns out to be false, you must take the blame
>>and responsibility.
>>
>>>
>>>>So, go ahead and believe what you believe - just
>>don't
>>>>let it consume you and eat away at you.
>>>
>>>Thanks Paul - I do respect that advice but I can say
>>>that from my epiphany, I don't simply "believe" - I
>>>truly know and as a result it does consume me to a
>>>degree (as it would for most people if they truly
>>>*knew*).
>>>
>>>That said, I still live life as I always did. I work,
>>>earn money to put food on the table. I also have
>other
>>>interests, raise my little girls in a loving fashion
>-
>>>they know nothing of these ideas. I am not a
>>>survivalist or anything - personally I don't think
>>>anyone can fully prepare themselves for these times
>>>and ultimately there's little point in trying to
>>>"survive".
>>>
>>>The Hopi indians do say that we should welcome these
>>>end times - as they portend great things (their
>>>prophecies are what triggered my epiphany), but as
>the
>>>saying goes, it's always darkest before the dawn.
>>>
>>>They also say that many will suffer, mainly those who
>>>don't know what's going on and those who cling to
>life
>>>as we know it. That's the main reason I keep harping
>>>on these ideas, to help those I know and care about
>>>prepare psychologically for coming events. You may
>not
>>>believe me now, but the seed is planted anyway.

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Replies:

Re: Time Monks -- iteo, 09:09:08 09/28/08 Sun
- Re: Time Monks -- Michael, 01:11:59 09/29/08 Mon
  - Re: Time Monks -- Organ Morgan (The Infidel), 05:01:20 09/29/08 Mon
  - Re: Time Monks -- iteo, 09:12:14 09/29/08 Mon
    - Re: Time Monks -- Organ Morgan, 11:40:54 09/29/08 Mon
      - Re: Time Monks -- iteo, 12:12:37 09/29/08 Mon
        Re: Time Monks -- michael, 16:21:02 09/29/08 Mon
        Re: Time Monks -- iteo, 19:11:20 09/29/08 Mon
        Re: Time Monks -- Michael, 01:16:25 09/30/08 Tue