Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your
contribution is not tax-deductible.)
PayPal Acct: 
Feedback: 
Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):
| [ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, [2], 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 ] |
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [>
I hope the entire Kopechne family finally has peace -- Jeannine, 21:03:21 08/26/09 Wed [1]
they deserve it.
I have a lot of thoughts about Ted, but I will keep them to myself for now.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [>
by the time we got to Woodstock we were half a million strong -- jayjay, 23:55:44 08/28/09 Fri [1]
happy belated birthday Katt's super extraordinary hero husband !!!
xoxox
wow.... time flies
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [>
I'm not shoveling anything -- DizzyDeb, 06:15:05 08/27/09 Thu [1]
And, yeah, I know that leaves me wide open for ridicule.
However, I said my prayers for Mary Jo's peace 40 years ago. Unless I'm mistaken, nobody else was in that car or a witness to the accident. I don't know exactly what happened or what state of mind Teddy was in. Was I disappointed in his actions? You bet!
But the work for the public good the Kennedy family has, and continues to do for the American people is extreme. Teddy's service in the US Senate is nearly unmatched and he will be missed. His dedication to trying to get basic health for all Americans is amazing and I hope that some kind of reform will be voted through in his memory.
As for "the Dems" being bothered by President Clinton's sins, I was. Just as I am by the Reps' sins. See: Foley, Mark; Sanford, Mark; Craig, Larry.
And, yes, I know that there are just as many Democrats with shady backgrounds. Please DO NOT take this as a challenge to see which party has the most idiots in it.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [>
Ted Kennedy was very polarizing -- Jeannine, 07:46:59 08/27/09 Thu [1]
and had just as many failings as successes. He was also the baby brother of Bobby and Jack - not an easy legacy to live with.
Personally, I do not think that health care should be pushed through because he is dead. We are very much in need of health care reform, but how do people think we will gain control over our health care by surrendering control to the government?
I am attaching what I consider to be a very good article by Susan Estridge, a Kennedy staffer about the late Senator.
http://www.creators.com/opinion/susan-estrich.html?columnsName=ses
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [>
Re: Ted Kennedy was very polarizing -- DizzyDeb, 08:05:12 08/27/09 Thu [1]
Thank you, Jeannine. That was a very good article. I certainly never meant to imply that health care reform should be rushed through simply because he is dead. Just that when it happens, it's in his honor. I attach a Newsweek article from July that was incredible. This man was as flawed - and possibly more so - than any person. But he also worked with his family and especially his brothers to bring civil rights legislation to the forefront and worked tirelessly to try to get some kind of health care reform enacted that would insure that everyone could get quality health care. I'm sad he did not accomplish that in his lifetime.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/207406
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [>
Isn't that amazing! -- DizzyDeb, 13:35:35 08/27/09 Thu [1]
Those are all things that are actually proposed in President Obama's plan as well. There are enough wild, fear-mongering rumors going around about the President's proposal that it amazes me that the plan you're suggesting is pretty much the same as the "Dems".
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [>
You've got to be kidding DD... -- muppetmel, 15:30:21 08/27/09 Thu [1]
They are proposing the GOVERNMENT be in charge of your health decisions.
They are advocating a single-payer system that will be massively expensive.
They want to cut eliminate your choice for health insurance and leave you with only one option -- the PUBLIC OPTION.
They had a government panel that would be arbitrating your end-of-life care and determining what services would be worth spending the money on for your poor old tired out body (not you specifically), but they were forced to pull that section.
You talk about scare mongering but did you read the legislative package? Did you compare them point for point with the GOP proposal?
Do you realize that by saying the GOP's is the same as Obamacare, you are advocating CONSERVATIVE IDEALS? Obama wants MORE government involved, not less. Conservatives want government OUT of the provision of health care, or at least leave the decisions in the hands of the State not the Feds. Obama wants to eliminate the insurer component and leave health decisions up to bean counters and bureaucrats, leaving you no option for your end of life care. Obama's plan will tell you how to eat and what to eat and will put you on programs to keep you within a certain standard so you don't cost the system for obesity-related diseases. You want this?
You won't get the insurance you want. You will get public national health care. How can your country afford that, especially Obama has put you into trillions of dollars of debt.
Deb, you guys are not learning from Canada's mistakes. You can't keep throwing money an inefficient costly system, without breaking the backs of the segemnt of society that actually pays taxes and without compromising quality of care.
Quality of care is being compromised all over the place here and in Great Britain. It is a leaking dam and we're trying to plug the leaks here.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [>
No, I'm not -- DizzyDeb, 16:44:24 08/27/09 Thu [1]
And if people would stop trying to be so divisive, they might actually find they have a LOT more in common. And it shouldn't matter which party claims the reform - just as long as something gets done. You are repeating the same scare tactics that have gone on for too long.
Dear Friend,
This is probably one of the longest emails I’ve ever sent, but it could be the most important.
Across the country we are seeing vigorous debate about health insurance reform. Unfortunately, some of the old tactics we know so well are back — even the viral emails that fly unchecked and under the radar, spreading all sorts of lies and distortions.
As President Obama said at the town hall in New Hampshire, “where we do disagree, let's disagree over things that are real, not these wild misrepresentations that bear no resemblance to anything that's actually been proposed.”
So let’s start a chain email of our own. At the end of my email, you’ll find a lot of information about health insurance reform, distilled into 8 ways reform provides security and stability to those with or without coverage, 8 common myths about reform and 8 reasons we need health insurance reform now.
Right now, someone you know probably has a question about reform that could be answered by what’s below. So what are you waiting for? Forward this email.
Thanks,
David
David Axelrod
Senior Adviser to the President
P.S. We launched www.WhiteHouse.gov/realitycheck this week to knock down the rumors and lies that are floating around the internet. You can find the information below, and much more, there. For example, we've just added a video of Nancy-Ann DeParle from our Health Reform Office tackling a viral email head on. Check it out:
8 ways reform provides security and stability to those with or without coverage
Ends Discrimination for Pre-Existing Conditions: Insurance companies will be prohibited from refusing you coverage because of your medical history.
Ends Exorbitant Out-of-Pocket Expenses, Deductibles or Co-Pays: Insurance companies will have to abide by yearly caps on how much they can charge for out-of-pocket expenses.
Ends Cost-Sharing for Preventive Care: Insurance companies must fully cover, without charge, regular checkups and tests that help you prevent illness, such as mammograms or eye and foot exams for diabetics.
Ends Dropping of Coverage for Seriously Ill: Insurance companies will be prohibited from dropping or watering down insurance coverage for those who become seriously ill.
Ends Gender Discrimination: Insurance companies will be prohibited from charging you more because of your gender.
Ends Annual or Lifetime Caps on Coverage: Insurance companies will be prevented from placing annual or lifetime caps on the coverage you receive.
Extends Coverage for Young Adults: Children would continue to be eligible for family coverage through the age of 26.
Guarantees Insurance Renewal: Insurance companies will be required to renew any policy as long as the policyholder pays their premium in full. Insurance companies won't be allowed to refuse renewal because someone became sick.
Learn more and get details: http://www.WhiteHouse.gov/health-insurance-consumer-protections/
8 common myths about health insurance reform
Reform will stop "rationing" - not increase it: It’s a myth that reform will mean a "government takeover" of health care or lead to "rationing." To the contrary, reform will forbid many forms of rationing that are currently being used by insurance companies.
We can’t afford reform: It's the status quo we can't afford. It’s a myth that reform will bust the budget. To the contrary, the President has identified ways to pay for the vast majority of the up-front costs by cutting waste, fraud, and abuse within existing government health programs; ending big subsidies to insurance companies; and increasing efficiency with such steps as coordinating care and streamlining paperwork. In the long term, reform can help bring down costs that will otherwise lead to a fiscal crisis.
Reform would encourage "euthanasia": It does not. It’s a malicious myth that reform would encourage or even require euthanasia for seniors. For seniors who want to consult with their family and physicians about end-of life decisions, reform will help to cover these voluntary, private consultations for those who want help with these personal and difficult family decisions.
Vets' health care is safe and sound: It’s a myth that health insurance reform will affect veterans' access to the care they get now. To the contrary, the President's budget significantly expands coverage under the VA, extending care to 500,000 more veterans who were previously excluded. The VA Healthcare system will continue to be available for all eligible veterans.
Reform will benefit small business - not burden it: It’s a myth that health insurance reform will hurt small businesses. To the contrary, reform will ease the burdens on small businesses, provide tax credits to help them pay for employee coverage and help level the playing field with big firms who pay much less to cover their employees on average.
Your Medicare is safe, and stronger with reform: It’s myth that Health Insurance Reform would be financed by cutting Medicare benefits. To the contrary, reform will improve the long-term financial health of Medicare, ensure better coordination, eliminate waste and unnecessary subsidies to insurance companies, and help to close the Medicare "doughnut" hole to make prescription drugs more affordable for seniors.
You can keep your own insurance: It’s myth that reform will force you out of your current insurance plan or force you to change doctors. To the contrary, reform will expand your choices, not eliminate them.
No, government will not do anything with your bank account: It is an absurd myth that government will be in charge of your bank accounts. Health insurance reform will simplify administration, making it easier and more convenient for you to pay bills in a method that you choose. Just like paying a phone bill or a utility bill, you can pay by traditional check, or by a direct electronic payment. And forms will be standardized so they will be easier to understand. The choice is up to you – and the same rules of privacy will apply as they do for all other electronic payments that people make.
Learn more and get details:
http://www.WhiteHouse.gov/realitycheck
http://www.WhiteHouse.gov/realitycheck/faq
8 Reasons We Need Health Insurance Reform Now
Coverage Denied to Millions: A recent national survey estimated that 12.6 million non-elderly adults – 36 percent of those who tried to purchase health insurance directly from an insurance company in the individual insurance market – were in fact discriminated against because of a pre-existing condition in the previous three years or dropped from coverage when they became seriously ill. Learn more:http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/denied_coverage/index.html
Less Care for More Costs: With each passing year, Americans are paying more for health care coverage. Employer-sponsored health insurance premiums have nearly doubled since 2000, a rate three times faster than wages. In 2008, the average premium for a family plan purchased through an employer was $12,680, nearly the annual earnings of a full-time minimum wage job. Americans pay more than ever for health insurance, but get less coverage. Learn more: http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/hiddencosts/index.html
Roadblocks to Care for Women: Women’s reproductive health requires more regular contact with health care providers, including yearly pap smears, mammograms, and obstetric care. Women are also more likely to report fair or poor health than men (9.5% versus 9.0%). While rates of chronic conditions such as diabetes and high blood pressure are similar to men, women are twice as likely to suffer from headaches and are more likely to experience joint, back or neck pain. These chronic conditions often require regular and frequent treatment and follow-up care. Learn more:http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/women/index.html
Hard Times in the Heartland: Throughout rural America, there are nearly 50 million people who face challenges in accessing health care. The past several decades have consistently shown higher rates of poverty, mortality, uninsurance, and limited access to a primary health care provider in rural areas. With the recent economic downturn, there is potential for an increase in many of the health disparities and access concerns that are already elevated in rural communities. Learn more: http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/hardtimes
Small Businesses Struggle to Provide Health Coverage: Nearly one-third of the uninsured – 13 million people – are employees of firms with less than 100 workers. From 2000 to 2007, the proportion of non-elderly Americans covered by employer-based health insurance fell from 66% to 61%. Much of this decline stems from small business. The percentage of small businesses offering coverage dropped from 68% to 59%, while large firms held stable at 99%. About a third of such workers in firms with fewer than 50 employees obtain insurance through a spouse. Learn more:http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/helpbottomline
The Tragedies are Personal: Half of all personal bankruptcies are at least partly the result of medical expenses. The typical elderly couple may have to save nearly $300,000 to pay for health costs not covered by Medicare alone. Learn more:http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/inaction
Diminishing Access to Care: From 2000 to 2007, the proportion of non-elderly Americans covered by employer-based health insurance fell from 66% to 61%. An estimated 87 million people - one in every three Americans under the age of 65 - were uninsured at some point in 2007 and 2008. More than 80% of the uninsured are in working families. Learn more:http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/inaction/diminishing/index.html
The Trends are Troubling: Without reform, health care costs will continue to skyrocket unabated, putting unbearable strain on families, businesses, and state and federal government budgets. Perhaps the most visible sign of the need for health care reform is the 46 million Americans currently without health insurance - projections suggest that this number will rise to about 72 million in 2040 in the absence of reform. Learn more:http://www.WhiteHouse.gov/assets/documents/CEA_Health_Care_Report.pdf
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [>
And just one more point... -- DizzyDeb, 16:51:09 08/27/09 Thu [1]
If you don't think my health decisions are NOT in the hands of bean-counters & bureaucrats right now, you've got a surprise coming! There have been several tests & procedures I have had recommended BY MY DOCTOR that my insurance company turned down. Because THEY didn't think it was necessary. There are currently "death panels" in force - they are the insurance companies who have to look after their bottom line.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [>
Okay. Good luck to you. -- muppetmel, 17:23:49 08/27/09 Thu [1]
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [>
Mupps, I'm not trying to start a war.... -- DizzyDeb, 17:44:42 08/27/09 Thu [1]
And I honestly do value your viewpoints.
My main point was that Senator Kennedy did great work trying to get affordable health care for all Americans. And several Republican Senators have said that if Teddy had been healthy and active in the last few months, there might actually be a health care reform bill to present. There are so many points on which both sides agree, but there is also a lot of misinformation out there. I'm sorry your health care in Canada is not to your liking, but rest assured that the majority of US citizens are not happy with theirs either. The high cost, the bureacracy of the insurance companies, etc. There are a lot of our countrymen who buy their prescriptions from Canada because, although they come from the same manufacturers, are a lot less expensive in Canada.
What I would like to see happen is a US Congress run by the people who we elected and not by the powerful lobbyists who really hold all the cards.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [>
I can't so much agree on Senator Kennedy because ... -- muppetmel, 18:18:15 08/27/09 Thu [1]
.. I've seen a mixed bag of material on him, but on the rest of your post I heartily agree.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [>
Re: GOP solutions for health care -- niki, 17:11:18 08/27/09 Thu [1]
Most of this says what it will do, not much says HOW they are going to do it.
1. Make quality health care coverage affordable and accessible for every American, regardless of pre-existing health conditions. But HOW are they planning to make the coverage accessible and affordable?
2. Protect Americans from being forced into a new government-run health care plan that would: a) eliminate the health care coverage that more than 100 million Americans currently receive through their job; b) limit your choice of doctors and medical treatment options; and c) result in the federal government taking control of your health care.
This isn't really a health care reform at all, it is just a list of what they DON'T want.
3. Let Americans who like their health care coverage keep it, and give all Americans the freedom to choose the health plan that best meets their needs. The current proposal allows for this as well. And by the plan that best meets their needs I assume they mean the best based on what you can pay for?
4. Ensure that medical decisions are made by patients and their doctors, not government bureaucrats. Right now they are being made by insurance companies, how do they plan to change that?
5. Improve Americans’ lives through effective prevention, wellness, and disease management programs, while developing new treatments and cures for life-threatening diseases. Their plan includes cures for diseases? Wow, its kind of hard to suggest that is a bad idea, but once again how? Right now I have insurance but I still have to pay for any and all preventative care out of pocket as my deductable will only be met if I get hit by a bus and declare bankruptcy. This kind of sounds like: "plan will tell you how to eat and what to eat and will put you on programs to keep you within a certain standard so you don't cost the system for obesity-related diseases" or that they will charge you an arm and a leg if you do not meet their standard.
Brings greater fairness to the tax code by extending tax savings to those who currently do not have employer-provided insurance but purchase health insurance on their own. This provision would provide an “above the line” deduction that is equal to the cost of an individual’s or family’s insurance premiums. So I pay out of pocket now and get it back later? What if I cannot afford it now? What if I do not pay in enough taxes to cover what my insurance costs?
Creates incentives to save now for future and long-term health care needs by improving health savings accounts and flexible spending arrangements as well as creating new tax benefits to offset the cost of long-term care premiums. Once again, and if you do not have money you can set aside for this, what good does it do you?
Strengthens employer-provided health coverage by helping the 10 million uninsured Americans who are eligible, but not enrolled in, an employer-sponsored plan get health care coverage. The plan does this by encouraging employers to move to opt-out, rather than opt-in rules. So 10 million people could have insurance but just don't know how to opt-in? Seriously? I suspect they don't opt-in because they cannot afford the part of the coverage that they have to pay for.
It’s no secret that patients in other countries are often denied care or die waiting to get access to the top treatments. That happens here also. Insurance denies the treatment, by the time it is straightened out, it is no longer an option.
Rewards high-quality care, instead of encouraging health care providers to order more and unnecessary services. This sounds like rewarding doctors for guessing and saving money rather than running the tests to know what is going on. This is common in vet med- "ole' Doc always just gave 'em a shot of steriods and he'd perk right up!" Yeah, until he developed diabetes from years of steroid injections.
There are some good ideas in this proposal as well, but not enough detail as to how they plan to do any of it.
[ Edit | View ]
[> [> [> [> [> [> [>
You raise good points Niki, and ... -- muppetmel, 17:41:29 08/27/09 Thu [1]
... I think tabling the health care bill and taking their time with it is a very wise move. Likely there is something in both proposals than can be made workable. What I never understood was the rush to pass it, when most of the legislators hadn't even read it. And I think the pivotal questions that remain unanswered include will you really get to keep the plan you have if you like it, and also, how will it be paid for?
|
Forum timezone: GMT-8 VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB: Before posting please read our privacy policy. VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems. Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved. |