Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some -- Mamusz' Restoration Forum

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Date Posted: 19:14:38 03/05/11 Sat
Author: George
Subject: Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some
In reply to: Lois 's message, "Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some" on 18:58:09 03/05/11 Sat

>>>I have several times commented that there are certain
>>>things that people consciously deny because they just
>>>don't want to believe it. That said, I will not cite
>>>any specific examples of such claimed disbelief.
>>>
>>>I'll just quote the passage from the Book of Mormon
>>>that illustrates this idea:
>>>
>>>But behold, I have all things as a testimony that
>>>these things are true; and ye also have all things as
>>>a testimony unto yoyu that they are true; and will ye
>>>deny them? Belioevest thou that these things are
>true?
>>>Behold, I knnow that thou believest, but thou art
>>>possessed with a lying spirit, and ye have put off
>the
>>>Spirit of God, that it may have no place in you; but
>>>the devil hath power over you, and he doth carry you
>>>about, working devices, that he may destroy the
>>>children of God.
>>>
>>>Alma 16:49-51 (LDS 30:41-42)
>>>
>>>Behavior or speech that is contradictory to what
>>>someone claims to be truth is a sure sign of an
>>>unconscious conviction that can't be consciously
>>>overthrown, regardless of what one chooses to say or
>>>do.
>>>
>>>George
>>
>>
>>Perhaps some of us can post examples of past, or
>>current philosphies or Christian doctrines whose
>>adherents have plainly demonstrated that they do not,
>>in fact, actually believe these philosophies or
>>doctrines in their heart of hearts, but merely shuffle
>>them around in conscious thought and speech to make
>>disobedience to the real truth bearable for them.
>>
>>George
>
>George,
>
>I don't know exactly what you are asking. I think you
>are asking for forms of hypocrisy. In other words,
>what are "Christians" publicly proclaiming, while in
>fact practicing the opposite.
>
>I think it is truly hypocritical to claim to be
>passionate about Jesus, and then not be able to answer
>a simple question about Him. Here is the question, "Do
>you believe that Jesus Christ is the Only way to
>salvation? Please answer "yes", "no" or "I don't know".
>
>This simple question has caused the most absurd verbal
>acrobatics from some people who claim to be passionate
>about Jesus Christ. I call that hypocrisy.
>
>Why the acrobatics? Because some worldly person,
>persons, or institution is listening to the answer
>that might be given.
>
>Here is another example. Some people claim that they
>believe in the scriptures, and also claim that, yes
>indeed, homosexual acts are a sin. But ask them to
>comment on an agenda in which it is about to be made
>an official part of the church. Suddenly they can't
>comment. Why? Because some worldly person, persons, or
>institution is listening to the answer that might be
>given.
>
>Oh, I almost forgot this one. "Thou shalt not judge."
>The very people who spout that one are the most
>judgmental people I have ever known. Just give an
>opinion contrary to theirs and see what names they
>will call you.
>
>Lois
>
> >href="http://www.cofchrist.org/news/2010/june/IntoTheFu
>ture-Veazey.pdf">http://www.cofchrist.org/news/2010/jun
>e/IntoTheFuture-Veazey.pdf
>Steve Veazey of the Community of Christ
>
>�I am receiving some correspondence and messages that
>state the recent action of the World
>Conference�..
>
>[Section 164 6b. I f the church more fully will
>understand and consistently apply these principles,
>questions arising about responsible human sexuality;
>gender identities, roles, and relationships; marriage;
>and other issues may be resolved according to God�s
>divine purposes. Be assured, nothing within these
>principles condones selfish, irresponsible,
>promiscuous,
>degrading, or abusive relationships]
>
> �..to approve the counsel I brought to the church is
>mainly what is depressing tithing. That may be so.
>However, I want to be clear that as long as I am in
>the role, I will bring to the church my clearest
>perceptions of the mind and will of God.
>A nonnegotiable for me is that I will not compromise
>vision, message, and the Spirit�s clear guidance in
>the face of threats from individuals that they will
>withdraw their financial support if they do not agree
>with church direction or certain decisions.�

Lois, I'm referring to the situation of the person who subconsciously knows that something is true, but denies it during his waking hours in order to rationalize his behavior. You recall the scripture "A double-minded man is unstable in all his ways." There are plenty of people who think that they are perfectly respectable and mentally healthy, but the split between what they know deep down inside to be true, and the ersatz truth they use during waking hours to rationalize their behavior makes them psychiatric cases.

For instance, anyone (particularly in the priesthood,) knows that if the Book of Mormon is not historically true, that Joseph Smith, Jr. was a liar. Orson Pratt himself pretty much said that if the BoM is true, no one can dismiss it and be saved. If it is not true, it is one of the most evil things ever concocted, and no one can be saved and subscribe to it. Members of all Restoration churches know this unconsciously, but the ones who want to become liberal and enlightened without giving up their family's faith have to find a way to endure this split between real deep-down knowledge and conscious rationalization.

From time to time I have had to make metal castings in the laboratory. When the casting is warped or has internal tension, it is very stressed and likely to break under pressure. People who try to live their lives with this split between what they know is the truth, and what they pretend is true, have that internal stress that causes all kinds of insane behavior. I think this difficult is the root cause of all the division inside the RLDS Church. Those who have internally converted to a belief that the BoM and the Restored Church is inherently false try to keep practicing the faith, and their efforts become so warped that all this craziness that we see going on nowadays results.

George

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Replies:

Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some -- Lois, 21:16:18 03/05/11 Sat
- Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some -- George, 23:16:51 03/05/11 Sat
Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some -- Mamusz, 11:40:57 03/07/11 Mon
- Re: Comment on Delusional Relgious Teachings --Name Some -- George, 19:57:28 03/07/11 Mon