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Date Posted: 12:15:47 04/19/02 Fri
Author: stored
Subject: R1

Religion I


The Philosopher's Corner, (and its varied forums) is for those wishing to debate ideas in an
environment relatively free of personal attacks. This does NOT mean that ideas are not to be
challenged and/or heavily debated. Bringing arguments from another forum to this forum or any
other PC forum totally distorts the original message made, gives a biased slant and is
inappropriate. Standing firm and making one's case on its own merits is the intelligent choice.
Attacking and/or challenging an opinion is fair game.. Attacking someone personally is not.
--Susan

Alternative R1 forum
Benefits: length of posts are basically unlimited, and if webforums break down we'll have a
backup forum. :)








MESSAGES IN THIS FORUM ARE PRESENTED AS NEWEST TO OLDEST.

`Ctaj
In Response To GerryB
Friday April 19, 2002 at 14:09

You can't teach the love of God without teaching the divine judgement which he has
promised to unbelievers.

You can teach the love of your fellow man without throwing in presumptions about virgin births
and resurrections.

`Ctaj
In Response To Connie
Friday April 19, 2002 at 14:07

That was about the time Lincoln became a politician, wasn't it?

Connie
In Response To Skeptics
Friday April 19, 2002 at 14:05

Historical Evidence about Jesus Christ

President Abraham Lincoln was an agnostic until he reached the age of forty. Then he read Dr.
James Smith's brilliant examination called The Christian's Defence, that established the
historical reality of the events in Christ's life. The evidence from this book convinced Lincoln of
the truth about Jesus, and he became a genuine Christian. "My doubts scattered to the
winds and my reason became convinced by the arguments in support of the inspired
and infallible authority of the Old and New Testaments." (Quoted in Sir Lionel Luckhoo's
book, Evidence Irrefutable Which Can Change Your Lives).

GerryB.
Friday April 19, 2002 at 14:01

Gotta run down and get the mail and spend a few minutes outside getting some fresh air.

BBL GLW.

GerryB.
In Response To CTAJ
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:55

The miracles which Jesus Christ did with the authority and through the power of God the
Father are a very important part of His divine message. You can't teach the love of God
without teaching the divine judgement which he has promised to unbelievers. If you do you are
only teaching half of the message.

GerryB.
In Response To RonB.
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:50

I visited your sites this morning. I like the way you have them set up. I will probably disagree
with much that you post there but I will visit anyway. I probably won't post because that would
just cause arguments. There is, IMHO, no more need for that. I went over to the snake pit and
the snakes are all riled up over there this morning. Thank you.

`Ctaj
In Response To GerryB
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:49

In short, Gerry, Jefferson considered himself to be "a follower of Jesus Christ and his
teachings," which fits your definition of a Christian. He did not, however, agree with the
teachings of the disciples, who he accused of corrupting the message of Jesus Christ. I concur.

`Ctaj
In Response To GerryB
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:45

"I separate, therefore, the gold from the dross; restore to Him the former, and leave the latter
to the stupidity of some, and roguery of others of His disciples. Of this band of dupes and
impostors, Paul was the great Coryphaeus, and first corruptor of the doctrines of Jesus. These
palpable interpolations and falsifications of His doctrines, led me to try to sift them apart. I
found the work obvious and easy, and that His past composed the most beautiful morsel of
morality which has been given to us by man. The syllabus is therefore of His doctrines, not all
of mine. I read them as I do those of other ancient and modern moralists, with a mixture of
approbation and dissent..." -- TJ

`Ctaj
In Response To GerryB
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:44

"It is the innocence of His character, the purity and sublimity of His moral precepts, the
eloquence of His inculcations, the beauty of the apologues in which He conveys them, that I so
much admire; sometimes, indeed, needing indulgence to eastern hyperbolism. My eulogies,
too, may be founded on a postulate which all may not be ready to grant. Among the sayings
and discourses imputed to Him by His biographers, I find many passages of fine imagination,
correct morality, and of the most lovely benevolence; and others, again, of so much ignorance,
so much absurdity, so much untruth, charlatanism and imposture, as to pronounce it impossible
that such contradictions should have proceeded from the same Being. [con't]

Murray
In Response To dori
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:43

Good, I'm glad we found a Scripture we agree on. And, although you mention missing
elements, it doesn't appear as though there are any worth mentioning. You are right, it really is
a wonderful thing when we agree with each other, Doris. *-)

Connie
In Response To Murray/Dori/Ron
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:42

Murray: Thank you. I bookmarked it and will read it a little later (in the middle of a project
right now and doing hit and run posting).

Dori: You and I differ on the "if" as you know. We've already been there in private
conversations..smile! Ron: Thanks! I'm glad but wanted to be sure! I noticed you have to have
a password to post but, as I'm sure you know, they are masters at using different handles and
needing a password wouldn't stop that.

`Ctaj
In Response To GerryB
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:41

The definition of a Christian is to be a follower of Jesus Christ and His teachings. What did
Cayce have to say about that. I would guess that kind of leaves old Thomas Jefferson out
too.

"I am a Christian, in the only sense in which he wished anyone to be: sincerely attached to his
doctrines in preference to all others, ascribing to himself every human excellence, and believing
he never claimed any other."
--Thomas Jefferson

RonB
In Response To Connie
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:32

Wonder if Ron will allow them to post at his anti-venom forum or will it be "exclusively"
for those who agree with him as theirs is.

Hi Connie--

No, I definitely will not allow the SnakePit crew to post at AntiVenom -- the whole point is to
'out' their obsession with R1. I'm not giving them another platform for their rantings.

Nor will they gain access to the True Church Forum. It is, as the Welcome message states, a
place where sincere people can discuss and question Catholic Doctrine. Their biggoted attacks
would not be welcome.

dori
In Response To Murray
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:32

Very well written. I don't totally agree with it, but I do think that maybe you are missing some
key elements when you say "self-righteousness is ...any effort or practice performed by man in
his flesh to achieve the recognition of God or to invoke his acceptance or forgiveness."

This part of scripture backs both our beliefs of righteous living for salvation vs guaranteed
salvation...
if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast,

It provides the "if" that I speak of. We are guaranteed salvation IF we have faith and live
righteous lives.

RonB
In Response To GerryB
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:26

I bookmarked both of your new sites. I don't think that I'll post there but it should be
interesting reading, especially when Josiah and his bunch find them.

Hi Gerry--

Originally there was going to one site, but it turned out that I wanted the True Church Forum to
be much more positive -- my wife, Trisha, had quite a bit to do with that. As for AntiVenom
hopefully, eventually, it will help show how ridiculous this sniping from the sidelines is and
everyone will give it a rest (then its reason existence will go away). Meanwhile it is just a way
to have a little fun while blowing off some steam.

Murray
In Response To the girls
Friday April 19, 2002 at 13:06

OK, ladies, I put it up on the net. Here it is:

Self Righteousness Christianity vs. The Righteousness Of God

dori
In Response To Murray
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:41

Yes, I'd like to read it too. And on the topic of what this place has done for us, I must agree
that I have benefited from my association with people here. Read my post to Ron's wife at his
True Church forum if you get a chance.

Concerning Heresy
In Response To "The Pharisee"
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:37

I pray ye all aren't one of those that believes like the "Pharisee" teaches that Christians can
"live" and/or "walk" in habitual backslidden DARKNESS and still go to heaven ? That God
kills their flesh, but saves their souls ?
The Pharisee also preaches falsely that Christians don't have to ask God to forgive them of
their sins and trespasses because Christians can’t sin…LOL…He needs to be challenged
because this is a new religion, and a deviation from the doctrine of Christ. Read 1 John

Connie
In Response To Murray
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:25

I would love to read it too. Yes, I do understand the difference between self-righteous
Christianity and the Righteousness of God...big difference...sadly, too many practice the first
and then all are tarnished with the same brush. We've seen evidence of that here by the
comments of several posters who lump us all together.

Murray
In Response To Connie/dori
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:23

So, to sum up my previous, I really think that it had a lot to do with our own attitudes. A whole
lot. *-)

Murray
In Response To dori/Connie
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:20

Well, I've actually enjoyed posting here for the most part since coming back from an
approximate 5 month layoff. It has been a blessing in and of itself and also has been a catalyst
for other good things to happen. Posting here causes me to think harder and search the
Scriptures deeper. Partly as a result of all of this, I wrote a little thing called, "Self Righteous
Christianity vs. The Righteousness Of God." I sent it out all over the place and, quite
unexpectedly it got picked up as a daily devotional by Internet Pastors.com and will shortly be
sent out via email to several thousand people. Normally, they take their devotionals from such
places as Moody Bible Institute and Back To The Bible, but they chose my work over theirs
at least for that one day.

Connie
In Response To Dori
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:17

I share your sadness too...very much.

dori
In Response To Gerry
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:04

Nope, no bitterness. Only sadness.

Connie
In Response To Dori/Gerry/Murray
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:04

Good Morning folks! Hope you all have a great Friday.

Murray: I don't think Dori was referring to you but rather those who only come here to
denigrate believers. Many of us just got tired of being told we were ignoramuses with ossified
brains and know it's a waste of time trying to explain the unexplainable (spiritual vs physical)
because the "spirit" is alive only in believers and gives us understanding of the things of God
that they don't have.

dori
In Response To Murray and Connie
Friday April 19, 2002 at 12:03

Murray: Well, hon, I sure wasn't including you in with the dawgs. LOL! I'll let you surmise
who I consider to have dragged this place down to the point where it is almost as bad as it was
with the banned person here. In fact, it is worse because that person never was a friend. His
words rolled off my back. His agenda was easy to figure out, too. I can't quite figure out the
agenda of the current nay-sayers.

Connie: I think Ron is still testing the waters on whether to open it up. He hates for it to turn
into a place like Reagan's. If you want the password to post, just let him know and he'll give it
to you.

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