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Date Posted: 06:53:03 08/18/02 Sun
Author: Anonymous
Subject: this is it

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[ Post a Reply to This Message ]
PAGEANT NEWS LOL -- Anonymous, 12:47:21 08/06/02 Tue

Re: Re: Re: (Reply to this comment)
by freelancer3
Please read the article at this address - this reporter also used names and apparently they were not already posted on a website (i.e. Message Boards)
<a rel=nofollow target=_blank href="http://www.minorcon.org/pageants.html">http://www.minorcon.org/pageants.html</a> Aug 05 '02
3:51 am PST

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Re: WHAT A LAUGH .,. This is so FAKE ! (Reply to this comment)
by freelancer3
The replies to my opinion confirm the problem in pageantry today. Hatefulness is rampant. As anyone can see from the opinions posted in response to mine, the pageant community is rife with ignorance. Their replies are accusatory (as one can see from the posts I copied and pasted from the message boards) as well as the accusations made by pageant supporters replying to my opinion. To state that pageantry is fraught with intimidation and contempt is an understatement. My report exposing the dark side of the pageant community has once again prompted the beast in pageantry to rear its ugly head. All one has to do is opine on the dark side of pageantry and this dysfunctional community is compelled to put down, accuse, and, in general, show their immature and quite disturbing behavior. My conclusion is that my report has indeed exposed pageant supporters for what they are. My opinion remains the same since compiling the information I used in my report. Pageants are inappropriate, unacceptable, and a danger to little children. Pageants teach our little girls all the wrong things: that beauty is the only thing you have to make you whole; that you are treated much better when you are beautiful and win; that you will be rewarded for being beautiful and sexy; that it is acceptable to be hateful and mean-spirited; and that logic and common sense have nothing to do with pageants. While their attack is offensive it is also very telling. As I stated in my report, accusations are the mainstay of this community, with no regard to the truth. In closing, I will reiterate once again that all information I utilized was available on the internet, on message boards, and posted by the pageant community. One last thing, my name is not Lisa and I am not a pageant Mom. Aug 01 '02
10:26 am PST

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Re: Re: My question for you.... (Reply to this comment)
by freelancer3
All of the information I reported was taken directly from the message boards. I explained this in my first opinion. I further explained that the names copied and pasted here were on the board postings. I chose to monitor two of the 249 pageant related boards on voy. These two were boards that were known to be hostile. I did not make up the posts that were copied and pasted as an example and made part of my report. Rather, this hostile environment was solely the responsibility of the posters on those boards. I will tell you that there were many more hateful and inappropriate posts that I chose not to use in my example (the few I chose seemed bad enough). You have taken the time to post on many message boards your rude opinion of my report over the past few days. Now you are here sharing your opinion. Professionally, I would have to assume that you are having a real problem with facing the negativity that is rampant within today's pageant community. I will not take any responsibility for the conduct of pageant families. In closing, I will reiterate that ALL THE INFORMATION I GATHERED CAME FROM THE PAGEANT COMMUNITY - as you can see if you re-read the entire opinion. You should note while reading that there are many people cited in this report - taken from the message boards. An internet Message Board reaches a vast number of people, even outside of the US. Once the post is made it is viewable by anyone, and available to be printed, copied, and pasted. I chose to do my research gathering using the Message Boards to garner information. My apologies that you are consumed with this report. Perhaps you should look to another sport or activity if you have children, as it appears that pageants are not an appropriate vehicle to subject children too. Pageants today cannot be defended when these types of posts on Message Boards are rampant. Jul 31 '02
8:47 pm PST

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Re: Re: :) (Reply to this comment)
by freelancer3
This is not a BOARD and these are not POSTS. You have been in the Message Board realm for too long. What we have here is research done accessing the numerous Message Boards available on the internet. The names cited in my writings originated on the Message Boards. To condemn my research and opinion shows a lack of understanding on the part of the community you obviously are associated with. My reports in no way endanger the children involved in pageantry. On the contrary, the guilty parties here are parents, directors, and peripheral actors involved who contribute to these problems with pageants. It is commonly known that the majority sees pageants involving babies, toddlers, and young school girls and boys today as a detriment to a healthy and well rounded lifestyle. I did not post the hateful messages on these posts, I merely reported what had already been posted by steadfast members of the pageant community. I might suggest you delve further into this activity with your child(ren)in lieu of transferring your anger toward this reporter. It could enlighten you. Jul 30 '02
3:52 pm PST

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Re: Re: :) (Reply to this comment)
by freelancer3
The postings on message boards used peoples names including children and their ages. To say this is a one sided view negates the obvious - that this view was garnered from postings on Message Boards, by the pageant community. This is the ugly side of pageantry that the pageant community itself has presented. Interviews that were conducted with sources confirmed the serious problems affecting pageants today. Especially in this day and age when children are being kidnapped, raped and murdered almost weekly we should all be concerned with the information made available on the internet. There were numerous postings showing the ugly side of pageantry; the choice was to utilize a distinct few to show how the pageant community reacts and what their agenda is. This research was not fabricated - the pageant community offered the information. Jul 30 '02
8:12 am PST

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Re: :) (Reply to this comment)
by ucme
You are looking at this one sided. First of all I would like to know where the additional research is regarding the charities? What about Queen for a day that helps terminally ill children in hospitals? What about the money raised for the small child who was paralyzed due to an accident? What about he fun set up for the child with cancer. These happened because of pageants and pageant children.
I am shocked and amazed that someone would commit such a vengeful act and put these poor people's names on this board. This puts these families and children in danger.
Pageants are unusual and people won't get them unless they go. Believe it or not there are some children who love this. In the HBO documentary who will the media flock to? A normal pageant mom who adores her child and would never dream of making them do something they didn't want to do or the crazy mom who works her child from sun up to sundown? Doesn't take to much common sense to figure that one out. In addition, you find crazy and mean spirited parents in any sports. Look at the TX Cheerleader case. Look at the soccer dad and the coach case. They are everywhere. If you are doing it for fun then you are in it for the right reason. Looks like several of the moms above where pleading for people to stop and act their age. Next time you post freelancer think of the families you are hurting. Think of the children you are endangering. Think of the people you will scare to death for putting their poor child's name on a board like this. Think of those who will now have to tell their child who loves pageants so much they have to quit forever. Jul 29 '02
7:56 pm PST

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Re: ONLINE PAGEANT MESSAGE BOARDS AND ANONYMITY (Reply to this comment)
by jjr2000
Hello. My daughter is 2 years old and she competes in pageants. She loves it. We have put her in the glitzy Cover Miss pageant-and it was wonderful. Everyone was really nice and sweet and we have put her in Cinderella. Needless to say we will NEVER do Cinderella Texas State Pageant ever again, but we do it for fun. We had a bad experience with Cinderella State this year, but you learn to separate the good ones, from the bad one, that is just life in pageantry. Pageants are what you make of them. They have definately helped my daughter to come out of her shell in the past year. And if and when that day comes and she does not want ot compete anymore, I will support her. But for now, she will continue to do them, she loves putting on her princess dresses for the audience. People, what happened to the little Ramsey girl is really sad, and my prayers go out to their family, but don't let what happened to that little girl give pageants a bad name. they are really what you make of them. We go to have fun and with that we usually do good. god bless everyone and good luck to all still having state and national pageants!! Jun 18 '02
3:22 pm PST

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Re: ONLINE PAGEANT MESSAGE BOARDS AND ANONYMITY (Reply to this comment)
by goerzen
I have read this article pertaining to the message boards and do agree that some of the people posting to these boards are quite inappropriate. As far as the boards go I do not go to message boards which promote bashing. However, I would like to respond to the comments made by your journalist about Ms. Gosney. First of all I feel that your article was quite one-sided in regards to Ms. Gosney. My daughter is one of her students and she has NEVER forced me to purchase clothing, shoes, or anything else from her. She also has NEVER forced us to do any particular pageant. I do not know who your sources were for this article but it could not have been anyone who has known Ms. Gosney for any length of time. Sounds to me like your sources were some of the people who already have it out for Ms. Gosney. She is a very caring person and loves each one of her "pageant kids" the same. She never has an unkind word to say about anyone. She does not solicit students for coaching- all of her referrals are word of mouth. If she were half of the things you printed in your article she wouldn't have any students. I am saddened by the hateful things you printed in this article and know that had you done your research well these things would never have been printed. Maybe in the future when you do an article you will get opinions from all sides instead of one-sided opinions like you have printed in this particular article. Thank you.
Sincerely,
Laura L. Goerzen
KS May 28 '02
11:57 am PST

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ONLINE PAGEANT MESSAGE BOARDS AND ANONYMITY (Reply to this comment)
by freelancer3
I have been researching Children¡¦s Beauty Pageants, particularly in the South, over the past few months. During the course of my research I interviewed Pageant Mom¡¦s to gain insight into the Pageant systems. My research took me to the Main Source for information -MESSAGE BOARDS- on the internet. This has proven to be an invaluable source of inside information pertaining to Texas pageantry. Likewise, it has exposed the ¡§dark side¡¨ of Pageantry; hatred, jealousy, racial prejudice, and terror.

Internet Message Boards are websites that encourage and promote ANONYMITY when posting messages. This anonymity allows posters to say ANYTHING they want protected by the mask they wear. Many of these messages and replies are mean-spirited and hateful. Some could be construed as terrorist and threatening, yet FEW, if any, are deleted by the Board Owner, or Forum Administrator, of the message board. The Board Owner is an unknown entity. Anyone can sign up and moderate a board. While there is an email contact through Voy.com, the Board Owners identity is never divulged. In fact, it is implied that it would be criminal to divulge the name of the Board Owner! This prompts the question WHY? What motivation could someone have to be the Moderator of a Message Board on the internet that spews hatefulness and jealousy, even encourages it? In researching this subject, I believe I found the answer.

The message boards I monitored were THE TEXAS PAGEANT BOARD, voy.com/13909/ and THE PMS BOARD, voy.com/79872/, (these boards were deleted for violation of Voy policy; 2 imposter boards were born to replace 13909 and voy.com/79872/!) and are rife with jealousy and hatred, despite what proponents of pageants argue. Banners are photos of the child containing congratulatory announcements. These photos are deceiving to the eye as it may be a 4 year old child dressed as an adult in full make-up and astounding hair do¡¦s complete with falls (full length hair pieces). Many of these photos are disturbing. Many of the older girls, ranging from 6 years old to 10 years old, have photos taken during their Pro Am routine, a modeling and dance combination where the child uses seductive moves and removes pieces of clothing! Part of the routine includes little girls bending over and smacking their behinds! It is difficult to determine the age of the child as their appearance is SO deceiving, though generally these are young girls, ages 7-9! These photo banners are posted on the World Wide Web where anyone, including pedophiles and sex offenders, can pull up that child's photo. Additionally, the childs name, age, and what pageant they will be at NEXT is posted on the board. I shudder to think what harm could come of this if an offender sought that child out! One can only imagine what thoughts these banner photos conjure up to an unsavory visitor!

As I scrolled through the many banners of WINNERS of pageants and read the replies, I was astounded that the simple act of posting a banner of your little child dressed as an adult was applauded by friends and family! Should anyone miss posting a congratulatory message they are bashed from California to New York! Friends and family post a reply under the childs banner. Consequently, the replies posted are redundant and smack of insincerity. At the same time, the banner wars moved into full gear! There is an ongoing war instigated by one particular group, the Gosney Girls (named after their coach, Susan Gosney) to get their banners to the top as fast and as often as possible, in spite of everyone elses viewing enjoyment! This particular group, known as the GGs, seem particularly vindictive and hateful when it comes to people outside their group. This group consists of a number of little girls and some boys coached by a former Pageant Mom with no expertise. This tight group of pageant Moms are willing to go the extra mile to insure that THEIR child, (a GG) is always on top! Their posts and replies are most often sarcastic and intimidating. In an effort to keep their group in the forefront, they Bash everyone not associated with them. This Bashing is done with the full approval of the coach. While Message Boards generally contain a cautionary statement at the top of the page discouraging and prohibiting BASHING, this is prevalent regardless. (*NOTE: The names referenced here have already been posted on the Internet on the NEW TEXAS PAGEANT BOARD and the New PMS Message Board as well as on deleted boards. See excerpts from those boards below)

The GG group has a website, a message board, and a WHOO HOO Board of their own all owned by a Pageant Mom near Dallas, (yes, her daughters are GGs!) yet seldom do they post their banners and messages there. They prefer to take over a popular board, as they did with THE TEXAS PAGEANT BOARD, and control it. Obviously there are more visitors to the TEXAS PAGEANT BOARD than the GOSNEY GIRLS MESSAGE BOARD. This would ensure a much larger audience. Their motivation seems to be to push their group down everyone¡¦s throat in spite of the fact that this group is generally despised for the actions and comments. The Mom¡¦s of these GG¡¦s are relentless and accusatory. General opinion is that the GGs are akin to a cult.

In interviews with Mom¡¦s whose child WAS a GG, and a few whose child is currently a GG but they are trying to get out, the opinions expressed were FEAR of retaliation should they leave the group; FEAR of attacks by the group; and FEAR of being ostracized by the group. The total fear the Mom¡¦s have of this retaliation from the GG group and coach was more than evident during the interviews. Clandestine phone conversations reminiscent of Watergate became the mainstay of my information gathering. Suspicion is equally as prevalent. Emails were discouraged by those interviewed as they believed that they could be traced and tracked through an email and feared being bashed on the boards! As a writer, I was astounded that a Pageant group could instill such terror in otherwise normal people. I gained a clearer understanding and appreciation of their fear once I had monitored the Message Boards for a few days!

During my interviews I learned that the coach of the GGs forces the Mom¡¦s to purchase her own brand of Pageant dresses at prices upwards of $1200! She further demands that her GGs NOT compete in certain pageants. Directors have stated that this woman uses extortion to dictate that her group WIN at pageants, even going as far as PAYING some directors for the win and entering a large number of contestants. Directors of long standing Pageant systems have been ruined by this one group. Some have discontinued their Pageants, others are pulling out slowly. She is also paid for doing their HAIR AND MAKE-UP (albeit she is not a licensed cosmetologist!) In addition, the shoes, etc. that the GG child MUST wear are purchased directly from the coach. She charges them for ProAm lessons, even travels different states and accepts fees for training. The fact that she has NO EXPERIENCE or CREDENTIALS is not a concern! This GG coach has her students compete in the Glitz pageants; full regalia of Hair, Make-up, and Dresses. The message board is an excellent source for the GGs to discourage competition and guarantee another win for their group. This one woman has dramatically changed Pageantry in just the past couple of years she has brought it to the lowest level.

Innocent visitors to the message boards are bashed unmercifully for any reason. Full names are posted for the entire world to see! Accusations without any evidence or proof are made daily against those not a part of the GG cult. Understandably, reputations have been ruined through the bashing of innocent people on these boards. Pageant Mom¡¦s that LEAVE the Gosney group are accused and bashed on the message boards. Their FULL NAMES and email addresses are posted and they have been labeled BASHERS. Defenders of the victims are further bashed. Threats of posting the bashers ISP and IP information are real to these innocent victims and viewers. Threats are posted that tracing and tracking software can divulge personal information about a visitor who posts a message and that personal information will be posted as a means to exposing and revealing the basher! One young pageant Mom received an instant message threatening her! Defenders of the GG group use language inappropriate for children and most adults, yet the Board Owner does nothing to delete or remedy this problem. The BASHING of Pageant systems is quite prevalent on the boards. No one is safe from the wrath of this dysfunctional group.

One extremely hateful board recently was shut down by Voy.com. Immediately, NEW boards were popping up and this group was migrating in droves to them to continue their bash fest of innocent people! Ironically, within a just a few days, the naughty deleted board was BACK UP! The posts and replies were exuberant! Yippee, I¡¦m doing the happy dance! Our board is Back! Summarily, the bashing and hatefulness continued without missing a beat!

Pageant systems in Texas used to be a wholesome, natural and normal event despite the overwhelming consensus that pageants are bad for children. Parents were encouraged to enter their child in the hopes of teaching poise, responsibility, stage presence, self-esteem, and confidence. The FULL GLITZ pageant complete with ridiculously expense dresses, atrocious hair do¡¦s with falls, and way too much make-up has replaced the former natural, Sunday best, casual sportswear pageant of years ago. Before the internet and anonymous postings were available, Pageants were a healthy activity for many, much the same as any sport or group children join. I have learned that Pageants in Texas have been dramatically altered to exclude everyday competition. This particular group terrorizes contestants into not entering, then show up at the door on the day of the pageant, enter, and WIN! They have no competition and have stacked the deck with their own! Some Directors have been forced to SELL OUT to this ransom demand in an effort to garner enough entries to make their pageant financially viable. This one group has changed the standard of pageantry to suit themselves and guarantee wins for themselves. What this has accomplished is yet ANOTHER WIN for this Group at the expense of many of the long standing Pageant Systems; i.e. Cinderella, Gingerbread, Stars Over the USA, Halo Productions, All Star Pageants, to name just a few of the better pageant systems. Directors will tell that they have cut back on their pageants, some even have quit, due to the fact that they cannot garner contestants to go up against the Gosney Group. One long standing Director was forced out of the business by this group.

My sojourn into the Message Boards on the Internet has divulged an entirely clear though extremely disturbing picture of the dark side of pageantry in Texas. Following are some excerpts copied and pasted from these boards:
¡P Haven't heard from Tamsyn in a while... Is she planning on doing anymore pageants? -- Has any of her royalty heard from her? Just curious..., 10:09:06 04/16/02 Tue

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