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Date Posted: 18:34:46 03/16/04 Tue
Author: PLS win...can't handle add'l PL-bashing
Subject: Go Lehigh!


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[> Re: FLA A &M=No wins against 1-200 RPI teams -- Don't Embarass PL, LU, 19:30:14 03/16/04 Tue

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[> Re: Go Lehigh! -- Chad, 20:46:21 03/16/04 Tue

Well, this blowout at the hands of a team that didn't even finish .500 sure won't help the PL get any respect. This is outright embarrassing -- HC was able to stay closer than this to Marquette, Kansas and Kentucky in the last three years.

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[> [> Re: Bye Lehigh! -- NTKHC64, 21:37:07 03/16/04 Tue

What did FAMU do at the start of their season...lose 10 in a row? Get killed by Florida, Georgia and Marquette? Lose twice to Coppin St. and then beat them to get the tournament and the play in game? The FAMU student-athletes but were just quicker and better. I felt that if they had a better shooting night which could have been expected, it would've been a rout. Rowland was shut down, a tribute to the defense and athleticism of FAMU and perhaps to the fact that his teammates didn't give the ball back to him. LU put up close to 30 3-pointers, more than they did in the PL season and if this was their game plan it didn't work.They had no inside game. I wouldn't put much stock in FAMU's under .500 record. They are just a better bunch of players, that has played better competition. They are certainly better than any PL team. As hchoops points out elsewhere and as I've said for weeks, the PL is where HC will be for the foreseeable future. So get used to the 50-60 point games. In fact if Taylor had controlled the pace. worked the ball in and cut down the 3s he might have had a chance. See you next season.

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[> [> [> Re: Lehigh Box Score -- NTKHC64, 21:46:21 03/16/04 Tue

Rowland 3-14; 2-9 from 3
Team 18-61 .295 3's 7-30 .233
Mgebroff 2-4 (The biggest player on the floor seen many times standing by the arc with his back to the hoop waiting for a pass.)
Neptune and Riah both 1-7 from the floor.

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[> [> [> Re: FAMU Competition -- KY Crusader '75, 22:02:13 03/16/04 Tue

NTK--Technically, you are correct, Florida A & M did play a tougher schedule than Lehigh did, but just barely. Per Ken Pomeroy's website, FAMU's strength of schedule was 310 versus Lehigh's 312. So, both teams played among the easiest schedules in Division I hoops. UK will murder FAMU on Friday.

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[> [> Re: Go Lehigh! -- bikeman, 21:49:53 03/16/04 Tue

The PL needs HC more than HC needs the PL. This league is a fraud. It claims to stand for something. Competetive division 1 athletics is not it that's for sure. Ralph, Dick, save us. Bring the program to the next level. Someway, somehow! The powers that be continue to sell HC short. HC can and would continue to attract high quality student athletes in a higher level. Can't a person who has faith in the people and what the school stands for see that? Why don't they trust that HC could do it right?

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[> Just like HC -- sader1970, 21:47:17 03/16/04 Tue

Well, I watched almost the entire game and Lehigh just couldn't handle the quickness and athleticsim of Florida A&M just like they couldn't handle HC at the Hart Center when they lost to the Crusaders 72-57.

There's no doubt in my mind that the Saders would have done a lot better than Lehigh against the Rattlers. But, we couldn't get it done when we needed to.

Lehigh had the height and bulk but were thoroughly outrebounded and out-quicked. The PL looked very weak against a Florida team that, no doubt, is better than their losing record but sure isn't a top team like we played the last 3 years.

I like what was posted from the Fordham board about incoming Clifford. Let's hope that he's as good as some people say and better than the doubters say. Not only for the sake of HC but for the pride of the PL, we need to have a solid team again next year. We absolutely need to use the quickness that was evident this year but we also need the size that Clifford can give us to complement Nate since Neil will be iffy again next year, I'm sure.

No more loses to Williams and no more games lost because no one knows how to shoot a free throw (except Tory and Keith).

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[> Lehigh -- Rick, 21:55:41 03/16/04 Tue

Obviously, I'm no fan of the PL but I honestly didn't expect this....and I suspect the Lehigh kids feel awful right now. Getting bounced out of the so-called 'play in' game by a team that in theory shouldn't be in the tourney ( losing record ) is pretty miserable.

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[> Re: Go Lehigh! -- MHMD, 22:11:05 03/16/04 Tue

The above statement says it all.. The PL needs Holy Cross much more then the school needs it- that was as bad a representation as I've ever seen. Horrible..

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[> Re: Go Lehigh! -- MHMD, 22:11:28 03/16/04 Tue

The above statement says it all.. The PL needs Holy Cross much more then the school needs it- that was as bad a representation as I've ever seen. Horrible..

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[> Re: Go Lehigh! -- MHMD, 22:11:48 03/16/04 Tue

The above statement says it all.. The PL needs Holy Cross much more then the school needs it- that was as bad a representation as I've ever seen. Horrible..

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[> [> Re: Go Lehigh! -- MHMD, 09:15:41 03/17/04 Wed

I believe being in the PL puts terrific pressure to create a strong out of conference schedule. I personally think the success/non success of teams like St. Joes will play a role in smaller schools getting higher seeds in the future. If SJ and the Zags do well, the committee will be more inclined to look at smaller/successful schools. If they fall early, it will hurt. Here's hoping Willard plays anyone he can next year with the hopes that in two years, when this freshmen class is primed, they will come East and play. Either way, it's obvious that there needs to be an upgrade in the schedule.

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[> 1970 -- Rick, 22:43:37 03/16/04 Tue

" There's no doubt in my mind that the Saders would have done a lot better than Lehigh against the Rattlers. But, we couldn't get it done when we needed to. "

We're all probably guilty of knee-jerk reactions over this game....it certainly is sobering for sure.

As you know better than I, the PL was a mismash of evenly matched clubs and none of them did well in OOC games. HC wasn't anywhere near the team we were last season. I dunno if the result would have been any different tonight if it was us, Lafayette or American instead of Lehigh.

One thing is certain....this isn't gonna help overall recruiting throughout the Patriot or raise the level of play or draw alums/fans or get students more excited/involved in supporting their teams. Everyone gets a black eye as a result of this loss and it also is gonna be a heckeva lot harder to schedule attractive OOC teams next year - ANYWHERE - to overcome the lackluster league schedule.

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[> [> Re: 1970 -- Ray, 23:34:48 03/16/04 Tue

Rick,

Just playing devil's advocate, why is it going to be *harder* to schedule OOC games next year because of tonight's Lehigh performance? Our understanding all along has been that we have been unable to get quality OOC games because teams were afraid of losing to us and how it would affect their RPI. While the RPI concern obviously remains, I would think that with HC's 3-time tourney scares out of recent memory, teams would be less worried about losing to us, and maybe things actually open up a little?

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[> [> Rick -- sader1970, 05:36:44 03/17/04 Wed

Rick, having watched the game last night and Holy Cross all year long, HC is a much quicker and more athletic team than Lehigh and showed it the last time they played Lehigh. Those were exactly the reasons that Florida handled Lehigh. Hence, my comment that HC would have matched up better and "would have done a lot better" than Lehigh did. Would HC have won? I don't know but do think they would have. It sure would have been a more interesting game playing strength against strength.

I recognize my bias for the purple but I think I'm objective enough to truly believe HC would have won the game and my comments were not "knee-jerk." But, let me reiterate, we didn't deserve to even be in the game as we couldn't win either the PL regular or tournament championships.

My comments posted prior to the game on the Lehigh board was that the Mountain Hawks needed to not just win but overwhelmingly beat the Rattlers and then make a close game with Kentucky to maintain the momentum that HC had established in the first round of the NCAAs.

I'm afraid that HC can go undefeated next year and would be relegated to the play-in game thanks to the poor showing by Lehigh this year. Let's see how A&M does vs. Kentucky. Their coach in an interview was asked if his team could beat Kentucky and he said "no" but that his team "would not be intimidated."

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[> [> [> future ramifications? -- Ray, 08:49:56 03/17/04 Wed

"I'm afraid that HC can go undefeated next year and would be relegated to the play-in game"

Couldn't disagree more, sader1970. The PI slots are a function of RPI. It's my belief that the slotting is subjective only among the bottom 4-5 schools in the tourney. Lehigh had 10 losses, which is high for a tourney team. They had no quality wins, few quality opponents, and the 3rd-worst RPI in the tourney. They deserved the slot, but I don't think it has any bearing on next year's PL champ. They'll be evaluated on their own merits.

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[> [> [> [> Re: future ramifications? -- dadominate, 09:54:55 03/17/04 Wed

PL teams are consistently underseeded though ray. we as hc fans should know that there is not a direct rpi relationship with the seeding. if there was, we would have been seeded higher in each of the past three years (including the kansas game, as montana as a 15 seed had an rpi 10-15 spots lower than ours).

while i think we have at least earned the right not to be in the play-in game with our solid showings recently in the big dance, you can never be sure with the committee.

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[> Re: Go Lehigh! -- bill, 23:44:06 03/16/04 Tue

SORRY TO SEE LEHIGH HAVE SUCH A BAD GAME, I DOUBT ANY TEAM IN THE PL WOULD HAVE DONE ANY BETTER THIS YEAR.
THE PL SCHOOLS WILL ALL BE GIVING SCHOLARSHIPS IN THE COMING YEARS SO HC WILL HAVE A MUCH HARDER TIME DOMINATING THE LEAGUE, LIKE THEY HAVE IN THE PAST.
RECRUITING, RECRUITING, RECRUITING, KEEP AN EYE ON ALL THE PREP SCHOOLS THAT THE KIDS ATTEND AFTER HIGH SCHOOL SO THEY CAN MAKE YOUR SI STANDARDS AND YOU SHOULD BE OK.

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[> [> Re: Four PL Teams Would Have Done Better -- NTKHC64, 09:07:51 03/17/04 Wed

Bill:

See the key marked "Caps Lock" on your keyboard? PRESS IT!

Your first sentence is so off base it's ridiculous! If you don't think Ralph, Jeff Jones, Fran Conlon or Pat Flannery could've shown up with a better plan, you don't know anything about coaching.

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[> [> [> Re: Words from the POY -- NTKHC64, 09:21:32 03/17/04 Wed

In the second half, it got rolling.

Woods came off a screen and hit a 3-pointer between two defenders, sparking a nine-point run that built the lead to 16 points midway through the half. Lehigh was only 2-of-15 from the field as Florida A&M pulled away.

"We knew we could get back in it if we played some defense, but Woods started making 3s," said Austen Rowland, the Patriot League's player of the year. "We had hands in his face, but he kept making shots."

Rowland was just 3-of-14 from the field for eight points.

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[> [> [> [> Re: Tallahassee Dem- Taylor "too many jump shots" -- NTKHC64, 09:33:07 03/17/04 Wed

Posted on Wed, Mar. 17, 2004



History made: FAMU wins play-in game
Rattlers get first tourney win; Kentucky up next
By Heath A. Smith
DEMOCRAT STAFF WRITER

DAYTON, Ohio - Midnight will have to wait, because the Florida A&M Rattlers aren't finished dancing.

The Rattlers continued their run through the postseason by defeating Patriot League champion Lehigh 72-57 Tuesday night in the play-in game of the NCAA tournament.

This was FAMU's first NCAA tournament victory in school history.

The Rattlers (15-16) continue to defy the odds, starting the regular season 1-10, then upsetting the Nos.4, 1 and 2 seeds in the MEAC Tournament last week.

"I'm just so proud of the team effort we gave today," FAMU men's basketball coach Mike Gillespie said. "I just thought it was a great team win."

Lehigh (20-11) from the outset of the game had trouble dealing with FAMU's offensive and defensive quickness.

FAMU's quickness was definitely evident in junior forward Michael Harper, who recorded his first career double-double, scoring 11 points and grabbing a game-high 12 rebounds against Lehigh.

"We got an outstanding performance from Michael Harper," Gillespie said. "He had his first double-double, and I hope someone filmed this game so we can put it in the archives because I don't know if he'll ever do it again. It's a game he'll remember for the rest of his life."

Harper's finesse game has been a liability at times for the Rattlers at the center position. But, against Lehigh center Jason Mgebroff, it was a clear advantage.

Harper scored seven of FAMU's first nine points by taking Mgebroff to the outside and nailing the jumper or beating him to the lane.

"Looking at the film, I knew No.3 (Mgebroff) was a little slow," Harper said. "I felt I would be able to take him outside."

Defensively, FAMU's mixture of pressing and trapping took the Mountain Hawks out of their offensive game plan, leading to 17 turnovers, 10 in the first half.

"We could never get into any kind offensive rhythm," Lehigh coach Billy Taylor said. "It was a struggle the entire game."

Lehigh shot 29.5 percent from the field in the game, 23.3 percent in the second half. Not helping was the seven of a season-high 30 attempts the Mountain Hawks made from the 3-point arc.

"It was just way too many jump shots," Taylor said. "That's not our style of basketball."

It is the Rattlers' style, however, and although they made just 6 of 20, they made all six count.

Terrence Woods, who was questionable coming into the game with a deep thigh bruise to his left leg, led the way as he has all season with 5-for-10 shooting from behind the arc, finishing with a game-high 21 points.

"My leg really didn't bother me as much as I thought it would," Woods said. "My endurance was the main problem for me. At one point my back tightened up and I had to go back in the locker room and get it loosened up at halftime.

"In the second half, it felt much better and I was able to get my shot off. I was a little winded on a couple shots I missed, but my legs felt fine."

Woods' shooting helped open the game up for the Rattlers in the second half. Lehigh trailed by just six points at halftime and was down by nine when Woods hit the first of his three second-half treys.

By the time he hit his third, the Rattlers were up 66-49 with 4:31 left in the game. By contrast, Lehigh made just two field goals after Woods' last trey.

Kevin Tempest led Lehigh off the bench with 13 points. The Rattlers held Austen Rowland, the Patriot League Player of the Year, to just eight points on 3-of-14 shooting from the field.

"We just wanted to not let them get into a rhythm," Gillespie said. "We wanted to be the aggressor."

Tuesday's win earned the Rattlers a trip up the road to Columbus, Ohio, to play the No.1 seed Kentucky Wildcats Friday night in the first round of the NCAA tournament.

Gillespie is realistic about his chances of upsetting the Wildcats, but for now the Rattlers are still dancing.

"This is the first round for us and we're honored to be here," Gillespie said. "For those people who don't think we belong here, we've earned our way into this thing and hopefully we'll do the best job we possibly can on Friday."


FG FT Reb
LEHIGH Min M-A M-A O-T A PF PTS
Monserez 17 0-4 0-0 3-5 0 1 0
Nurse 23 2-3 3-4 3-7 1 2 7
Mgebroff 28 2-4 3-5 1-4 1 2 7
Rowland 33 3-14 0-0 2-5 4 2 8
Olivero 15 2-8 0-0 0-3 1 3 6
Neptune 14 1-7 0-0 1-2 1 4 2
Tiah 19 1-1 2-2 1-1 2 4 4
Gilfillan 5 0-0 1-2 0-0 1 0 1
Callahan 1 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 1 0
Tempest 18 3-7 4-4 1-1 0 0 13
Mickelson 15 2-4 0-0 2-3 1 0 4
Fishman 12 2-2 1-2 4-7 0 1 5
Totals 200 18-54 14-19 18-38 12 20 57
Percentages: FG .333, FT .737.

3-Point Goals: 7-30, .233 (Tempest 3-5, Olivero 2-6, Rowland 2-9, Gilfillan 0-1, Monserez 0-3, Neptune 0-3, Tiah 0-3).

Team Rebounds: 4. Team Turnovers: 17 (7 PTS).

Blocked Shots: 3 (Fishman, Mickelson, Tempest).

Turnovers: 17 (Nurse 5, Rowland 4, Mgebroff 3, Olivero 2, Gilfillan, Neptune, Tiah).

Steals: 7 (Rowland 3, Neptune, Nurse, Tempest, Tiah).

Technical Fouls: None.


FG FT Reb
FLORIDAA&M Min M-A M-A O-T A PF PTS
Ayodele 24 2-6 0-0 3-4 0 2 4
Harper 24 4-8 3-4 4-12 0 4 11
Wilkins 36 5-12 1-2 0-7 4 1 12
Tate 25 1-8 7-9 4-6 4 1 9
Woods 29 7-16 2-2 1-4 2 2 21
White 13 0-2 0-0 0-1 1 2 0
Henderson 1 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0
Kelly 19 3-7 2-4 4-6 0 2 8
Zamore 14 1-1 1-2 1-1 0 0 3
Sams 1 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0
Russell 14 2-3 0-0 1-2 0 1 4
Totals 200 25-63 16-23 18-43 11 15 72
Percentages: FG .397, FT .696.

3-Point Goals: 6-20, .300 (Woods 5-10, Wilkins 1-4, Ayodele 0-3, Tate 0-3).

Team Rebounds: 1. Team Turnovers: 12 (19 PTS).

Blocked Shots: 2 (Kelly, Wilkins).

Turnovers: 12 (Wilkins 4, Tate 3, Harper 2, White 2, Ayodele).

Steals: 8 (Wilkins 3, Zamore 2, Russell, Tate, White).

Technical Fouls: None.


Lehigh 33 24 -57
FloridaA&M 39 33 -72
A-7,808

Officials-Eugene Crawford, Robert Adams, John Hughes.

Florida A&M 72, Lehigh 57

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