I think Hal loves his brother and doesn't want to know. Went long, come inside>>>>> -- LJG Discussion board

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Date Posted: 20:52:18 09/13/07 Thu
Author: KathleenM
Subject: I think Hal loves his brother and doesn't want to know. Went long, come inside>>>>>
In reply to: CatherineM. 's message, "Fascinating observation about the family -- LJ didn't know about Hal's first wife's seduction by Twelvetrees. About what Hal knew or didn't know: how did you lasses read the bit when Hal asked about someone LJ might or might not have known, and LJ jokes that he couldn't swear he hadn't anonymously shared a bed with him in an inn somewhere? I thought that was a pretty dangerous jest if Hal was suspicious . . . and Hal does lose his temper at this point. I'm not sure what to make of it . . . ." on 17:51:24 09/13/07 Thu

If he suspects it could be true that John prefers men, which is likely, the prospect is too dangerous to confront openly. What could he say in reply? Better to not go down that road at all. Not only would Hal have the sensibilities and prejudice of the 18th C (think how open Jamie is about many matters but not this one and for more than just what BJR did to him) but Hal would also recognize the extraordinary danger John would face if exposed and the additional shame his family would endure. And if he is repulsed by homosexuality or the notion of sodomy, he would have difficulty reconciling his love for John with the imagery presented in his head. Remember Jamie telling Claire that it's different to hear that a man has been flogged than to actually see the wounds? The Greys have suffered enough scandal and I believe the Duke would just as soon not think about what his brother does in private but would prefer to trust him to keep private matters just so. There are many things men don't routinely discuss amongst themselves and a serious discussion about their sex lives is one of them. Bawdy jokes and ribald comments are fine, but serious conversations? No. I think it was true then and still is.

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All the points Kathleen M makes about Hal strike me as very valid. But I wonder if there isn't another factor involved also. I'm not sure why, but I'm thinking Hal is quite a bit older than John. Maybe I'm just projecting my own life, but I'm 9 years older than my baby sis, I left home when she was not quite 8. We do not share confidences, I think because we have never lived together long enough to become close friends. Maybe Hal has some trouble in seeing John as a capable adult, rather than a little brother who needs protection? (NT) -- Carol P, 11:17:42 09/14/07 Fri
- Carol, you make a good point, too--my oldest brother left home when I was 13 and still treats me like a kid at times--even though I'm married with 4 kids and just turned 50. Old habits die hard, I think. The protection offered to John as a young man, sending him to Aberdeen, is understandable yet he resents it. He fights against having that sort of coddling now, is surprised when he finds out about the bet at White's and angry when Hal continually attempts to keep him in the dark. Now that John's own investigations have really resulted in the restoration of the family title, I wonder if Hal will begin to see things differently. Benedicta seems to have. (NT) -- KathleenM, 05:28:52 09/15/07 Sat

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